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ALA SPECIAL TOPICS: RECORDING METHODS AND
TRANSCRIPTION GUIDELINES
JULY 15, 2019
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>> Try disconnecting and reconnecting and
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everybody.
>> This is an audio check. We do these
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our welcome slide, which is a slide with a red
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methods and transcription guidelines. What I
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So yeah, we are going to pause and do another
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test test.
>> Hi everybody, Dan Freeman with ALA
publishing. Doing another audio check. It seems
as though we solved our issue where some of you
were not able to see the slides, so I apologize
for that. We did a small step that we had no
idea would fix it, but apparently it is fixing it
we have got about two minutes until we begin. We
are here to answer your technical.
>> Let us know who you are , test test test
test.
>> It is noon, Eastern Time. So we are
going to get started, welcome to the first
session in our RDA3R orientation series, the
special topic series. This is recording methods
and transcription guidelines with Bill Walker.
Really glad to have you here today. We have
people from all over the world, which is really
cool. I'm going to go very briefly through a few
quick technical points. The first thing I want
to point out is the chat space should be in the
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rather than the full audience. We will be having
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Just type your question into the chat space when
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If you're having problems with the audio
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I want to introduce Bill Walker, he served as the
imaging field services officer and as cataloging
and metadata -- cataloging and RDA prior to
joining -- music cataloger at Southern Methodist
university. I'm going to turn things over to
Bill and he will get started.
>> Thank you. And thanks for the
introduction and good morning or afternoon to all
of you, or evening if you're on the other side of
the world. I would like to get started here.
All righty. Here we go.
Just want to make sure my slide functionality
is working here. So today what I want to cover
is define the four RDA recording methods,
understand the role of each recording method,
apply unstructured descriptions to creating
manifestation statements and distinguish between
basic and normalized transcription.
We are going to talk a little bit about the
or begins about the recording methods. We are
going to carefully define each recording method
and then provide examples of those. And then we
are going to talk about how these recording
statements in the RDA elements pages work, so
whenever you go to an RDA elements page, they
will basically say which one of the four RDA
recording methods or all of them or some of them
apply to that particular element. And then we
are going to talk a little bit about
manifestation statements, we are going to talk
about basic transcriptions, normalized
transcriptions. And then we are going to briefly
cover the manifestation elements and then I also
want to kind of make a distinction between the
manifestation statement elements and the elements
for recording structured statements, which really
is what you are used to if you have been doing
cataloging before this version of RDA.
So this is the graphic that ALA has put out
regard the RDA steering committee talking about
the four recording methods. So this is basically
four ways to capture data when you're cataloging.
And as I said, all of these are included in every
element chapter. And as we'll see, sometimes for
a particular element, all four of them will
apply, and sometimes some of them won't apply.
You can use more than one if you wish to. If
they're applicable and desired. For example, if
you wanted to transcribe the publisher in, say,
just using MARC and the 264 field but also wanted
to provide an access point for the publisher then
you could use more than one recording method
there.
So one of the things that the new RDA tries
to do is it tries to make things more explicit
than the current RDA. One of the bases for the
recording methods comes from 171 in the
alternative where it talks about accepting data
without modification. So traditionally in
cataloging basically what we do, I'm going to --
transcribe everything except for capitalization
and punctuation. We've always followed certain
rules about transcribing things. This says you
can accept data without modification. So if I'm
using a description created by another agency,
that doesn't really apply here, but B, using data
derived from a technical -- download processes or
by harvesting embedded metadata. And then the
library of Congress wills policy statement for
this, I'm leaving out the PCC to save words.
Basically they say in this particular one, that
you can accept data from other sources and that
it's okay to just transcribe things as they are.
So also, down in chapter 27 of the current
RDA in 27.1.3. We have some examples where they
show you, so there we have an example of
unstructured description of a related
manifestation and there you have a note, and then
you have a structured description of a related
manifestation, again you have a note but you can
see it's put in an ISBD syntax so that makes it a
structured description. And then we have an
example of an identifier, so we have a note with
an ISBN number in there. Then we have from
chapter 17 an example of URI, which is basically
what an IRI is.
So now let's go into depth about how these
work. So the first thing we'll talk about is
unstructured description. This is the definition
from the RDA glossary and this says it's a
recording method that's a human readable string
that's an uncontrolled -- uncontrolled term
describing an aspect of an entity. This can
include a note, transcription, name or title as
it appears in a source of information and an
uncontrolled term. All of those are examples of
what you might see in an unstructured
description. So to kind of put this more in the
beta RDA terminology, this is basically a nomen.
It's a text strip. This is also transcribed
data. So we take this off the item and as
catalogers serious to doing this, you transcribe
a title or label of an audio recording and/or you
transcribe the place of publication, the name of
the publisher and the date of publication.
This is useful for non-standard metadata from
non-professional sources that are lacking
provenance. So the access for this is keyword
searching and indexing. This type of description
does not go into fields that contain controlled
terms or controlled access points or anything
like that.
This only supports the user test of
identification.
Here we have some examples. So we have JRR
Tolkien, found on a title page, there we have a
transcribed title proper from a title page, there
we have by JRR Tolkien. Next we have the name of
publication, the publisher and finally a note.
These are all examples of unstructured
descriptions. A structured description is a
string that is a full or partial description of
an entity and these words are really important,
based on syntax and stream encoding stream or
controlled term describing an aspect of an
entity. This can include an access point or
control term taken from a vocabulary encoding
scheme.
So again, these are text strings and they're
nomens, and this data is recorded in standard
structure formats for human users. So we do
this, now we utilize data from authority files,
we use data from vocabulary and coding schemes,
knowledge organization schemes, such as subject,
and we'll be using this in a big way in the new
RDA with all the vocabulary coding schemes that
they've established.
This can include authorized and variant
access points and other controlled terms and so
the access for this is collocation and indexing.
So these are terms that will enable a user to
find something by a particular subject, by a
particular name, and this allows people to be
able to find things by these access points, to
identify things, and also to explore.
So here we have an authorized access point
for a person. Dickens, Charles, and then we have
the dates there 1812, to 1870. Here we have
Dickens, Charles, 170 -- this is an access point
for the work. Then we have the next three
examples are basically terms from different RDA
vocabulary and coding schemes. We have one from
a media type, a mediated, one from a content
type, performed music, and one from the color
content vocabulary encoding scheme.
Now, the last one there is a note, but
because it's constructed using ISBD syntax, this
is actually structured data as opposed to a note
that would not be constructed in ISBD syntax or
some other syntax.
Okay. An identifier is a recording method
that is a machine readable string assigned to an
entity in order to differentiate the entity from
other entities within a local domain or location
for a term from a controlled vocabulary that is
assigned to an aspect of the entity. This can
also be an identifier or notation that is taken
from a vocabulary encoding scheme.
So again, this is a text string and these are
coded labels that are intended for machine
identification. We use these all the time. If
you're a book cataloger, they use ISBD items. We
use publisher's numbers and the big thing about
an identifier is that it's unique within a local
scheme.
So this can be something that can be within a
particular database or it can just be within a
particular standard of formatting numbers, even
ISBN, even though it's national, the local scheme
being the assessments for in the case numbers for
books. This includes authority control numbers,
standard identifier schemes, terminology
locations. So the access is indexing and
relational database application.
So here we have some examples. We have IRI,
we have ISSN, publishers' number from a polygram
recording of some kind, gram phone RT or
something like that, library of Congress control
numbers are also identifiers. UPCs are
identifiers. And then there we have a number
from a VIA effort to international authority
file.
The last recording method is a IRI
internationalized resource identifier. So this
is a recording method that is a string that is
assigned to an entity in machine readable form.
The big difference between IRI and the previous
three recording methods is that the identifier is
both for machines and also be used by humans.
And then of course the unstructured and the
structured recording method are all purely for
human beings. They're just basic text school
strings that human beings can use and enter into
a database to at least identify something.
But the IRI is basically mostly for machine
readable stuff. So this is enables a machine to
differentiate one entity from other entities or
one aspect of an entity from another aspect of an
entity within the global domain of the semantic
web and open data. This is basically the world.
Each one of thesis IRIs is -- another thing about
IRI is you'll notice it's not a nomen. It's a
thing. The term is it basically represents a
real world object. What do I mean by a real
world object?
For example, if the IRI is associated with an
authority record, the real world object is
whatever the authority record's representing. If
we are talking about a personal name or corporate
body, that personal name or corporate body is a
real world object. So again, like I said, it's
unique within the global domains. Whereas you
might have to go into a particular system, like
somebody's catalog or authority file or something
like that, to use the other types of recording
methods, this one you just basically go on the
web and get to the thing that the IRI represents.
This is data for smart machine applications.
Because they're URIs, not easily interpretable by
humans, and the access is the semantic web and --
you open the browser and put the IRI in the
search window and boom it takes you to the
particular record that represents that real world
object. Because of this, this is a new type of
recording method.
So here we have some examples here. The
first one is from the RDA registry, and this is
for a particular carrier type of audio real. And
then the other two, basically come from authority
records. And so you basically type that in or
copy and paste that into a browser and that will
take you directly to that authority record
representing the author. One is for the library
of Congress main authority file, a record in the
library of Congress named authority file and the
other one is for BIAN.
One of the things you need to remember is
that not all methods are applicable to all
elements. So for example, if I am dealing with
an authorized access point for a person, that's a
structured description, its very nature is the
structured description. The unstructured
description is not applicable to the particular
element in RDA. And for that matter, neither is
the identifier or IRI.
So one of the things that you will find as
you work in the new RDA is that you're basically
going to be taking unstructured descriptions and
you're basically going to be building structured
descriptions from those.
So for example, here we have our access point
for JRR Tolkien, if you take a look at the
components of this, we look on the title page,
let's say we're starting from scratch and trying
to formulate an authorized access point. You'll
notice that the material that we have to work
with comes from a title page. So there we have
JRR Tolkien, that's from a title page or frame
from a movie or some kind of other preferred
source. And then we find out that JRR stands for
John Ronald Reuel. We basically take these and
the dates are kind of interesting because we
could have just taken the dates from like a
reference source, but the way that the dates are
structured is that they are in what we would call
a structured description for a time span using
the syntax and coding scheme. We take these two
chunks of unstructured description and then we
take the structured description and we basically
combine them in order to create this structured
description which is an authorized access point.
As I said, the recording methods are found in
every case that contains either an entity or an
element. So here we are, we're looking at the
entity person, and so you can see we have the
preliminary parts of the page and the definition
and scope, the prerecording area, and then
depending on what you are dealing with, you might
have some instructions in there. Then as you go
down further, you can see here we have the four
recording methods represented.
So there we have recording unstructured
description, so record an unstructured
description is person, name of person. And then
if you click on the second link, that will take
you into the guidelines for recording an
unstructured description. And then if you record
a structured description, then that would be to
record a structured description as person access
point for person. Then you have another link
there underneath structured description that
basically gives you general guidelines on
recording a structured description. So then
under identifier, you basically have record an
identifier's person, identifier per person, so
you record the identifier, and there's guidelines
for that. And then recording the there IRI, and
you basically see the recording methods. In that
case, for the entity person, all of the recording
methods are applicable. If we go into access
point for person, you can see that the page for
this element is pretty much structured in the
same way and then you'll notice down in recording
it says record this element as a value of a nomen
entity. And then you go down here and you'll
notice that it says recording an unstructured
description, this recording method is not
applicable to this element.
And then you go down to structured
description and they provide all sorts of
instructions there. And I've just kind of
briefly put that. There's more instructions here
but I didn't put those in there. Then we go down
to recording an identifier, and it says the
recording method is not applicable to this
element. And then recording an IRI, record an
IRI, so the recording the IRI is applicable for
this element. So record the IRI for the nomen
entity as a real world object.
So taking the slide which I borrowed, stole
from Kathie Glen inhere, this is an example of
all the recording methods and how it would apply
to one particular name here. So here we have
manifestation for the City of Montreal. So there
we have the manifestation so we see on a title
page that the place of publication is in Montreal
so we basically transcribe that or record that.
And so we put in unstructured Montreal. So
then the structured is basically we have Montreal
Tibet, so you'll notice in the access point we've
added the diacritics, and put in the -- we've
established that as a structured description, an
authorized access point. So then in one
thesaurus, the Getty Thesaurus of geographic
names we have an identifier there. We have the
identifier within the Getty Thesaurus geographic
name. The identifier is only for the Getty
Thesaurus of geographic names. So this
identifier is a local type of identifier, which
all identifiers are.
Then we have the LC neighboring el authority
identifier there, and that's the identifier that
applies to the library of Congress. Then we have
two examples of IRI. We have one from the PDF
URI which basically if you get into any browser
in the world and you copy and paste that into
your browser and search that, that will take you,
or if it's a link, you can click on that and it
will take you from that record to any browser
anywhere in the world and the same thing with the
geonames URI.
So let's talk a little bit about
manifestation statements. I'm going to talk a
little bit about manifestation statements but
more will be covered in another presentation.
So a manifestation statement is a statement
appearing in a manifestation and deemed to be
significant for users to understand how the
manifestation represents itself. That's from the
RDA glossary.
So a manifestation may carry information that
describes the manifestation itself. So basically
what that means is you look at the manifestation
and it has certain information on there that
helps you to understand what this thing is that
you are looking at. This information is recorded
to follow the principle of representation.
So we'll talk more about that later. Then
the manifestation statement supports the user
task identify. So basically what this does is if
we're looking at this stuff record in a
bibliographic -- we say okay this particular
manifestation statement matches this --
Okay. So to do manifestation statements,
there's basically two transcription methods. So
one is called basic transcription and the other
one is called normalized transcription. So the
way you do basic transcription -- as they appear
on the manifestation. What you are doing is
you're just recording things as they appear on
the manifestation. The one exception to this is
that you omit symbols or other images that are
intended to be interpreted as text if they are
not available in the character set used by the
agent who creates the transcription.
So under guideline, under manifestation
statements, you'll find these particular
instructions here. These basically tell you to
transcribe the components of the manifestation
statement in the order that they appear in the
manifestation. They tell you to use the two back
slashes to deliver the components of the
statement, use the mark of omission to indicate
the omission of text. You can also use the mark
of omission to indicate that the omission of text
at the beginning and ended of the statement.
They collapse white space. Deduplicate
contiguous delimiters and deduplicate
manifestation strings. So the normalized
transcription deals with the transcribing
elements following the more traditional
cataloging practice. You remember in 1.7 in the
current RDA, they basically give you guidelines
on dealing with the language and script, dealing
with the diacritics, capitalization, punctuation,
spacing of the initials and acronyms,
abbreviations and symbols and numbers.
So basically what the normalized
transcription does is it basically transcribes
the elements of the manifestation, but it
transcribes them following the guidelines that
are in the manifestation statement for a
normalized transcription.
Here we have a manifestation statement and
this is a basic transcription. We have City of
Time and it's illustrated by Jones Bell and the
publisher is Wendy Lamb Books. I took everything
as it applied to the title page and I transcribed
them and tried to reproduce those as closely as I
could. All of the stuff in all caps has been
transcribed as all caps. You'll notice that in
the title "of" is basically upper case but
smaller font so I reproduced that. And then the
illustrated by Joan diBell is with each word
capitalized except for the by and Wendy is
transcribed in all caps.
So here we have a normalized transcription.
Here you can see I've just basically taken the
everything in the order that it appears on the
source of information, but I followed the
guidelines, the RDA guidelines for punctuation
and capitalization. So there you can see only
the the first letter of the authors' names are
capitalized, I've transcribed the title and cap
capitalized the first word. This is basically
the way that a normalized transcription would
look. In terms of keyword searching, in terms of
the implications of which one is preferential,
that's totally up to you. Most don't worry about
case and punctuation so either way is fine.
Now, this is kind of more what we're used to
as catalogers. Here we have -- this is a
structured description, but the structured
description is assembled by unstructured
recordings of the different parts of the thing.
We're basically using the RDA guidelines for
punctuation and actually the RDA guidelines for
capitalization, and we've also ended a string and
coding string, the ISBD screen and coding screen,
which means we've separated parts of the ISBD
description with certain parts of punctuation. I
didn't put in the full stop space-space in
between each item, although I could have, but I
just basically kept them there. I got the first
edition of the title page. You can see following
the RDA instructions for a publication date that
is not an explicit publication date, a supplied
publication date, so I put that in square
brackets, and then I added the copyright date.
This in its entirety is a structured description
because I'm following the RDA streaming coding
stream, adding the RDA punctuation and I'm also
following the RDA application profile by
supplying the 8 areas of the bibliographic
description.
So here we have elements for recording
manifestation statements. So we have, and these
are all elements listed in the RDA toolkit. So
you'll notice that we have the entire elements
start with manifestation. We have the
manifestation copyright statement and so forth.
Basically all of these are elements for recording
manifestation statements.
Now, what we're used to as catalogers and
dealing with the current version of RDA is we go
into chapter two and we look up the instructions
for dealing with different aspects of a
manifestation. And so these are basically
structured statements. And so these are treated
differently than if we were just doing a
manifestation statement. We have the copyright
statement, the manifestation distribution
statement and so forth. And there's more
elements here. I just added these as examples.
But I wanted to distinguish between what
we're dealing with when we're doing manifestation
statements versus recording structured elements.
So for example, this basically follows that
first slide and this follows that first slide,
but this follows that second slide where you have
the manifestation and the little -- greater than
sign, whatever that is.
The difference is that manifestation
statement elements are always unstructured
descriptions. Some of the other manifestation
elements, the ones that I showed examples of on
the previous slide, can be expressed with more
than one recording method. So for example, if I
wanted to express the publisher in the
publication statement, that would be an
unstructured description. If I'm recording that
off a source of information.
If I wanted to add an access point for the
publisher, like we do in video recordings
sometimes, then I would add that as an access
point and that would be a structured description.
So that's pretty much the difference between
manifestation statements and more structured
description statements.
So manifestation statements might be a quick
way to make backlog materials available. So you
might be able to scan a title page of books that
you have in backlogs, OCR those, put them into
some kind of a machine readable record, add them
to a database and make them accessible with
keyword searching. And as I said before, most
keyword algorithms -- basically normalized won't
affect retrieval in most cases. This is a quick
way to make digitized materials available. Since
you've already scanned the page, all you need to
do is OCR it and then you can add that into some
kind of machine readable system and make that
quickly accessible. This is also helpful in the
description of where materials where you really
want to provide a more accurate description of
what's on the item using basic transcription
where you record the way things are capitalized,
the way things are punctuated and things like
that.
So that's pretty much all I have right now.
I apologize for brevity, but I'll be happy to
take questions now.
>> All right. Thanks, Bill. Yeah, we are
way ahead of schedule. To our audience, anything
you want to ask, this is our chance. The first
question, and let me just preface my questions by
saying I don't have any RDA or cataloging subject
matter expertise, so if I come off like I don't
know what I'm talking about in one of these
questions, I don't. I'm just reading what's in
the chat space. The first question, in a
manifestation statement wouldn't we keep on
writing instead of starting a new line?
I'm also not clear when to use these
delimiters.
>> The delimiters, for example, if I had a
publication statement and I want to make sure
that somebody can distinguish the place of
publication from the publisher or date or
something like that, I would add those delimiters
within each statement. So if I'm dealing with a
publication statement, I could use those
delimiters to -- of the publication statement.
I guess I think that the purpose of the
manifestation statement, I think, is to
transcribe, to record the title page or the other
source of information the way that it appears on
the item. So what I did is I recorded, so like
in my example, the author was on one line, the
title was on another line, and then the publisher
was on a third line. So that's basically the
reason why I did that. So you're basically
trying to make it look as much like the source as
possible. That's one of the purposes of a
manifestation statement.
>> Okay. Next question. Do we know if and
how we will record manifestation statements in
mark 21 records?
>> I really don't think -- mark 21 and that
whole environment I think is really more of a
structured description environment. And so I
really don't know or really don't think that -- I
guess you could record them that way, but you
wouldn't be -- yeah, I suppose you could record
them that way, but it would kind of take away the
whole point of doing the manifestation statement
because part of the manifestation statement is to
basically show the person how the information was
presented on the item.
So I'm not really sure that you would even do
this in MARC. We don't know anything about --
sorry. Kathy says no, we don't know anything
about MARC 21 develops -- working group will be
starting work in September. It's possible that
instead of putting like everything in separate
fields, which would be more like a structured
description, you might just have -- I'm just
speculating here, this is Bill's wild speculation
so don't take it as gospel. It might be that you
have a MARC manifestation field and you plop
everything in there. I don't know.
>> MODERATOR: All right. How would -- this
is a similar question. How would a manifestation
statement look in MARC, current practice seems to
favor a structured description and the 26X field
reflects this issue, the structured.
>> As I said, we really don't know what
that's going to look like, as Kathy said. That's
kind of, like I said, I've kind of speculated. I
really don't know how that's going to look.
>> MODERATOR: All right. Could you talk a
little more about nomen?
It sounds like it's a text string. Is that
accurate?
>> A nomen, in the LRM is basically the name
of something. So the nomen for this book here,
that I'm looking at on this slide is City of
Time. This particular nomen is a title proper
but it's a nomen. Nomen in Latin just means
name. And RDA -- so every type of recording
statement, except for the IRI are all nomens and
nomens are named for something. If I had the
book in my hand and looked at the ISBN number,
that would be a nomen for this book. It's a name
given for the book. I'm a male human being and
my nomen is Bill Walker.
>> MODERATOR: Okay. Does the new RDA assume
the data will be an XML-based relational
database?
>> I don't think RDA makes any assumptions
about how the data will be formatted. The new
RDA is basically going to -- has a lot of
features that basically encourage the
organization of data in resource description
framework, which gets to linked data, which gets
to the IRI recording method. But in terms of how
individual people put their records in whatever
format, MARC, XML, whatever, RDA makes no
assumptions about that.
>> MODERATOR: All right. In the City of
Time example, was it necessary to make "of" a
different sized font?
If so, why was the manifestation statement
not italicized?
>> Good question. I think -- to tell you
the truth, I don't know. I didn't have any think
about that. The reason why I did the small case
of City of Time in the basic transcription
example is because that appeared that way.
You're absolutely right. I probably -- I might
have been able to do that. I'm not sure that in
the real world application of manifestation
statements that we would go into that detail, and
it might be that we would just do did all in
upper case and leave it at that.
>> MODERATOR: All right. We're at the end
of our question list, but officially, we have got
40 minutes left. So maybe we should do sort of a
pause here and give people time for some more
questions to flow in. I also want to thank
everybody, especially Kathy. Kathy's been
handling some of the questions in the chat space
so we haven't had to relay some of these to Bill.
Here is another question.
By the way, in this example, I assume it's
still referring to the City of Time example, why
did Bill put spaces between City of And "Time" ?
There aren't any. I put that, to me, it
looked like there were spaces there. I guess
it's just a matter of perception. But I think
that you would probably want to make this -- I
mean, if I were dealing with a database of
manifestation statements, a user would probably
want to have the spaces in there, because they
are not going to know that assuming that you're
correct, that that City of Time are separated by
spaces.
Is using the basic description compulsory or
is it an option?
This is absolutely an option. This is not
something that is intended to replace traditional
cataloging, to my knowledge. Basically you are
free to implement RDA any way you want to. So
basically, if you want to -- excuse me. I'm
going the wrong way.
If you are going to just do traditional
cataloging, you're basically going to forget
about all this stuff right here. You're
basically going to be using what these elements
represent.
So then there will be a separate -- there are
instructions, both for doing manifestation
statements and instructions for doing the
element, as we've traditionally done the
elements. That's totally up to you. One of the
things that you are going to notice about the new
RDA is it's going to be much, much much less
pre-scripted about what it tells the cataloger to
do. I've heard the steering committee talk about
this and Kathy, you can chime in, but basically
what the steering committee learned from the
current RDA is that everybody in the world does
things differently. So they wanted to make it as
little prescriptive as possible. For example,
there's no core elements anymore. And oftentimes
you'll run into an instruction that will say
here's the situation, here's one option, another
option, another option, another option, choose.
We have a question. Okay, to make sure I'm
getting there. You use a manifestation statement
when you really want to convey the detail of how
a particular manifestation appears and this is
essentially unstructured. Structured access
points are --
>> Yeah. I could see that happening. So
there's two reasons to use a manifestation
statement. One may be that you really want to
show people exactly how the -- let me there's two
reasons. One is that you want to show how the
information is laid out in a source of
information. Another one is that it's just to be
kind of quick and dirty here, is you just want to
use a quick and dirty way of recording
information. So like I said, one of the things
you could do is just scan a title page, do OCR
and then maybe what the user sees is an image of
the title they could basically search for that
object. Maybe what they would see is not one
bibliographic effort. I could see that
happening.
>> MODERATOR: Okay. Once again I think we
are at the end of the questions. So we'll open
it back up to our audience. Anything else?
And Bill, do you have any closing thoughts
before we wrap?
>> My closing thoughts would be a lot of
this stuff is formed in cream of mushroom soup
rather than concrete. RDA has put out a lot of
stuff that we basically don't know how it's going
to work out.
The RDA working group, how are they going to
make manifestation statements expressed in MARC?
We don't know that yet because the RDA MARC
working group hasn't really started yet, as far
as I can tell.
And somebody asked a question down here, how
is this going to work in current ILS systems?
It may be that it doesn't work in current ILS
systems. It might work in some other kind of
thing like an image management system or
something like that.
There are a lot of questions about how is
this going to work, what are the applications.
RDA has some applications for manifestation
statements, but then the library community is
basically going to come up with some other
applications of manifestation statements. But a
lot of people will continue to cataloging the way
they have been so they will use the other parts
of RDA how it applies to cataloging. You can
look at manifestation statements as another way
of doing something to achieve another purpose.
Whereas if your goal is to just do cataloging and
to put stuff in your IL S-system, you're probably
going to do traditional cataloging and follow
those parts of RDA that pertain to traditional
cataloging.
>> MODERATOR: All right. I think we are
going to wrap up. Thanks to everybody for
joining us. I'll be keeping an eye on the chat
space to see if any other questions come in.
Bill, we want to thank you for the wonderful
presentation. This is part one in a five part
series. I know most of you in the audience are
signed up for the full series. If that is the
case for you, we will look forward to seeing you
next week. Again, we are recording this event.
If you missed anything you're going to get an
email in the next 24 hours giving you full access
to the recording. With that, I think we will
wrap. Bill, we want to thank you. To our
audience, you were fantastic. And with that, we
will close and hopefully we will see most of you
next week. Have a wonderful day, everybody, or
evening or morning, depending where you are in
the world.

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Special Topics: Recording Methods and Transcription Guidelines--Transcript (July 2019)

  • 1. ROUGH EDITED COPY ALA SPECIAL TOPICS: RECORDING METHODS AND TRANSCRIPTION GUIDELINES JULY 15, 2019 CART CAPTIONING PROVIDED BY: ALTERNATIVE COMMUNICATION SERVICES, LLC www.CaptionFamily.com * * * * * This is being provided in a rough-draft format. Communication Access Realtime Translation (CART) is provided in order to facilitate communication accessibility and may not be a totally verbatim record of the proceedings * * * * * >> Try disconnecting and reconnecting and hopefully that will solve the issue. Thanks, everybody. >> This is an audio check. We do these checks every couple minutes so when people join to assure that everything is working properly. I understand that a few of you are having an issue where you don't see the slides. You should see our welcome slide, which is a slide with a red background with special topics and recording methods and transcription guidelines. What I would recommend is a troubleshooting step is possibly minimizing and maximizing your window. Then you may see the slides. Another thing you can do is close out of WebEx and reconnect. Hopefully most of you are able to see the slides. Again, we are here to offer technical support and
  • 2. we are recording the presentation, so if you miss anything for any reason due to a technical issue, you will be able to see it again. So yeah, we are going to pause and do another sound check in a couple of minutes and we are here to help you with your technical support in the meantime. Thanks. test test. >> Hi everybody, Dan Freeman with ALA publishing. Doing another audio check. It seems as though we solved our issue where some of you were not able to see the slides, so I apologize for that. We did a small step that we had no idea would fix it, but apparently it is fixing it we have got about two minutes until we begin. We are here to answer your technical. >> Let us know who you are , test test test test. >> It is noon, Eastern Time. So we are going to get started, welcome to the first session in our RDA3R orientation series, the special topic series. This is recording methods and transcription guidelines with Bill Walker. Really glad to have you here today. We have people from all over the world, which is really cool. I'm going to go very briefly through a few quick technical points. The first thing I want to point out is the chat space should be in the lower right-hand corner of your screen. If you don't see the chat window, mouse over the bottom center of your screen and you should see a bunch of icons. If you chat on the chat bubble, that's the chat box. We are offering live captions. You can show our hide the captioning in the media viewer in the lower right of your screen. If you see instructions to go to an external site, click that. If you need had, please click on the two pull down windows underneath the chat space and private chat user host. Our host is here, webinar support, to answer any and all of your technical questions. We do have over 100 people here today so bear with us. If you have technical questions, you can chat them there,
  • 3. rather than the full audience. We will be having Q&A at the end, however you do not have to wait. Just type your question into the chat space when you have it and we'll relay it to Bill. Make sure your question is set to all participants. If you're having problems with the audio broadcast, you have a few options. The first thing you should do is click communicate at the top of your screen and audio connection. Most of you are probably going through -- if you are in the United States or Canada, you can call in and you will get a toll free number. By clicking communicate, audio, and then I will call in. If you hear an echo, it's probably because you have two broadcast windows open simultaneously. You can close one. That should resolve the problem right away. If your audio is cutting in and out, disconnecting and reconnect is can address that issue. Extremely important, we are recording today's event. If you miss anything for a technical reason, because you have to leave early, any other reason. You will receive access to the recording and slide within the next 24 hours. If you want additional e-learning opportunities for RDA and any other topic related to library science, check out ALAstore.ALA.org. I want to introduce Bill Walker, he served as the imaging field services officer and as cataloging and metadata -- cataloging and RDA prior to joining -- music cataloger at Southern Methodist university. I'm going to turn things over to Bill and he will get started. >> Thank you. And thanks for the introduction and good morning or afternoon to all of you, or evening if you're on the other side of the world. I would like to get started here. All righty. Here we go. Just want to make sure my slide functionality is working here. So today what I want to cover is define the four RDA recording methods, understand the role of each recording method, apply unstructured descriptions to creating manifestation statements and distinguish between
  • 4. basic and normalized transcription. We are going to talk a little bit about the or begins about the recording methods. We are going to carefully define each recording method and then provide examples of those. And then we are going to talk about how these recording statements in the RDA elements pages work, so whenever you go to an RDA elements page, they will basically say which one of the four RDA recording methods or all of them or some of them apply to that particular element. And then we are going to talk a little bit about manifestation statements, we are going to talk about basic transcriptions, normalized transcriptions. And then we are going to briefly cover the manifestation elements and then I also want to kind of make a distinction between the manifestation statement elements and the elements for recording structured statements, which really is what you are used to if you have been doing cataloging before this version of RDA. So this is the graphic that ALA has put out regard the RDA steering committee talking about the four recording methods. So this is basically four ways to capture data when you're cataloging. And as I said, all of these are included in every element chapter. And as we'll see, sometimes for a particular element, all four of them will apply, and sometimes some of them won't apply. You can use more than one if you wish to. If they're applicable and desired. For example, if you wanted to transcribe the publisher in, say, just using MARC and the 264 field but also wanted to provide an access point for the publisher then you could use more than one recording method there. So one of the things that the new RDA tries to do is it tries to make things more explicit than the current RDA. One of the bases for the recording methods comes from 171 in the alternative where it talks about accepting data without modification. So traditionally in cataloging basically what we do, I'm going to --
  • 5. transcribe everything except for capitalization and punctuation. We've always followed certain rules about transcribing things. This says you can accept data without modification. So if I'm using a description created by another agency, that doesn't really apply here, but B, using data derived from a technical -- download processes or by harvesting embedded metadata. And then the library of Congress wills policy statement for this, I'm leaving out the PCC to save words. Basically they say in this particular one, that you can accept data from other sources and that it's okay to just transcribe things as they are. So also, down in chapter 27 of the current RDA in 27.1.3. We have some examples where they show you, so there we have an example of unstructured description of a related manifestation and there you have a note, and then you have a structured description of a related manifestation, again you have a note but you can see it's put in an ISBD syntax so that makes it a structured description. And then we have an example of an identifier, so we have a note with an ISBN number in there. Then we have from chapter 17 an example of URI, which is basically what an IRI is. So now let's go into depth about how these work. So the first thing we'll talk about is unstructured description. This is the definition from the RDA glossary and this says it's a recording method that's a human readable string that's an uncontrolled -- uncontrolled term describing an aspect of an entity. This can include a note, transcription, name or title as it appears in a source of information and an uncontrolled term. All of those are examples of what you might see in an unstructured description. So to kind of put this more in the beta RDA terminology, this is basically a nomen. It's a text strip. This is also transcribed data. So we take this off the item and as catalogers serious to doing this, you transcribe a title or label of an audio recording and/or you
  • 6. transcribe the place of publication, the name of the publisher and the date of publication. This is useful for non-standard metadata from non-professional sources that are lacking provenance. So the access for this is keyword searching and indexing. This type of description does not go into fields that contain controlled terms or controlled access points or anything like that. This only supports the user test of identification. Here we have some examples. So we have JRR Tolkien, found on a title page, there we have a transcribed title proper from a title page, there we have by JRR Tolkien. Next we have the name of publication, the publisher and finally a note. These are all examples of unstructured descriptions. A structured description is a string that is a full or partial description of an entity and these words are really important, based on syntax and stream encoding stream or controlled term describing an aspect of an entity. This can include an access point or control term taken from a vocabulary encoding scheme. So again, these are text strings and they're nomens, and this data is recorded in standard structure formats for human users. So we do this, now we utilize data from authority files, we use data from vocabulary and coding schemes, knowledge organization schemes, such as subject, and we'll be using this in a big way in the new RDA with all the vocabulary coding schemes that they've established. This can include authorized and variant access points and other controlled terms and so the access for this is collocation and indexing. So these are terms that will enable a user to find something by a particular subject, by a particular name, and this allows people to be able to find things by these access points, to identify things, and also to explore. So here we have an authorized access point
  • 7. for a person. Dickens, Charles, and then we have the dates there 1812, to 1870. Here we have Dickens, Charles, 170 -- this is an access point for the work. Then we have the next three examples are basically terms from different RDA vocabulary and coding schemes. We have one from a media type, a mediated, one from a content type, performed music, and one from the color content vocabulary encoding scheme. Now, the last one there is a note, but because it's constructed using ISBD syntax, this is actually structured data as opposed to a note that would not be constructed in ISBD syntax or some other syntax. Okay. An identifier is a recording method that is a machine readable string assigned to an entity in order to differentiate the entity from other entities within a local domain or location for a term from a controlled vocabulary that is assigned to an aspect of the entity. This can also be an identifier or notation that is taken from a vocabulary encoding scheme. So again, this is a text string and these are coded labels that are intended for machine identification. We use these all the time. If you're a book cataloger, they use ISBD items. We use publisher's numbers and the big thing about an identifier is that it's unique within a local scheme. So this can be something that can be within a particular database or it can just be within a particular standard of formatting numbers, even ISBN, even though it's national, the local scheme being the assessments for in the case numbers for books. This includes authority control numbers, standard identifier schemes, terminology locations. So the access is indexing and relational database application. So here we have some examples. We have IRI, we have ISSN, publishers' number from a polygram recording of some kind, gram phone RT or something like that, library of Congress control numbers are also identifiers. UPCs are
  • 8. identifiers. And then there we have a number from a VIA effort to international authority file. The last recording method is a IRI internationalized resource identifier. So this is a recording method that is a string that is assigned to an entity in machine readable form. The big difference between IRI and the previous three recording methods is that the identifier is both for machines and also be used by humans. And then of course the unstructured and the structured recording method are all purely for human beings. They're just basic text school strings that human beings can use and enter into a database to at least identify something. But the IRI is basically mostly for machine readable stuff. So this is enables a machine to differentiate one entity from other entities or one aspect of an entity from another aspect of an entity within the global domain of the semantic web and open data. This is basically the world. Each one of thesis IRIs is -- another thing about IRI is you'll notice it's not a nomen. It's a thing. The term is it basically represents a real world object. What do I mean by a real world object? For example, if the IRI is associated with an authority record, the real world object is whatever the authority record's representing. If we are talking about a personal name or corporate body, that personal name or corporate body is a real world object. So again, like I said, it's unique within the global domains. Whereas you might have to go into a particular system, like somebody's catalog or authority file or something like that, to use the other types of recording methods, this one you just basically go on the web and get to the thing that the IRI represents. This is data for smart machine applications. Because they're URIs, not easily interpretable by humans, and the access is the semantic web and -- you open the browser and put the IRI in the search window and boom it takes you to the
  • 9. particular record that represents that real world object. Because of this, this is a new type of recording method. So here we have some examples here. The first one is from the RDA registry, and this is for a particular carrier type of audio real. And then the other two, basically come from authority records. And so you basically type that in or copy and paste that into a browser and that will take you directly to that authority record representing the author. One is for the library of Congress main authority file, a record in the library of Congress named authority file and the other one is for BIAN. One of the things you need to remember is that not all methods are applicable to all elements. So for example, if I am dealing with an authorized access point for a person, that's a structured description, its very nature is the structured description. The unstructured description is not applicable to the particular element in RDA. And for that matter, neither is the identifier or IRI. So one of the things that you will find as you work in the new RDA is that you're basically going to be taking unstructured descriptions and you're basically going to be building structured descriptions from those. So for example, here we have our access point for JRR Tolkien, if you take a look at the components of this, we look on the title page, let's say we're starting from scratch and trying to formulate an authorized access point. You'll notice that the material that we have to work with comes from a title page. So there we have JRR Tolkien, that's from a title page or frame from a movie or some kind of other preferred source. And then we find out that JRR stands for John Ronald Reuel. We basically take these and the dates are kind of interesting because we could have just taken the dates from like a reference source, but the way that the dates are structured is that they are in what we would call
  • 10. a structured description for a time span using the syntax and coding scheme. We take these two chunks of unstructured description and then we take the structured description and we basically combine them in order to create this structured description which is an authorized access point. As I said, the recording methods are found in every case that contains either an entity or an element. So here we are, we're looking at the entity person, and so you can see we have the preliminary parts of the page and the definition and scope, the prerecording area, and then depending on what you are dealing with, you might have some instructions in there. Then as you go down further, you can see here we have the four recording methods represented. So there we have recording unstructured description, so record an unstructured description is person, name of person. And then if you click on the second link, that will take you into the guidelines for recording an unstructured description. And then if you record a structured description, then that would be to record a structured description as person access point for person. Then you have another link there underneath structured description that basically gives you general guidelines on recording a structured description. So then under identifier, you basically have record an identifier's person, identifier per person, so you record the identifier, and there's guidelines for that. And then recording the there IRI, and you basically see the recording methods. In that case, for the entity person, all of the recording methods are applicable. If we go into access point for person, you can see that the page for this element is pretty much structured in the same way and then you'll notice down in recording it says record this element as a value of a nomen entity. And then you go down here and you'll notice that it says recording an unstructured description, this recording method is not applicable to this element.
  • 11. And then you go down to structured description and they provide all sorts of instructions there. And I've just kind of briefly put that. There's more instructions here but I didn't put those in there. Then we go down to recording an identifier, and it says the recording method is not applicable to this element. And then recording an IRI, record an IRI, so the recording the IRI is applicable for this element. So record the IRI for the nomen entity as a real world object. So taking the slide which I borrowed, stole from Kathie Glen inhere, this is an example of all the recording methods and how it would apply to one particular name here. So here we have manifestation for the City of Montreal. So there we have the manifestation so we see on a title page that the place of publication is in Montreal so we basically transcribe that or record that. And so we put in unstructured Montreal. So then the structured is basically we have Montreal Tibet, so you'll notice in the access point we've added the diacritics, and put in the -- we've established that as a structured description, an authorized access point. So then in one thesaurus, the Getty Thesaurus of geographic names we have an identifier there. We have the identifier within the Getty Thesaurus geographic name. The identifier is only for the Getty Thesaurus of geographic names. So this identifier is a local type of identifier, which all identifiers are. Then we have the LC neighboring el authority identifier there, and that's the identifier that applies to the library of Congress. Then we have two examples of IRI. We have one from the PDF URI which basically if you get into any browser in the world and you copy and paste that into your browser and search that, that will take you, or if it's a link, you can click on that and it will take you from that record to any browser anywhere in the world and the same thing with the geonames URI.
  • 12. So let's talk a little bit about manifestation statements. I'm going to talk a little bit about manifestation statements but more will be covered in another presentation. So a manifestation statement is a statement appearing in a manifestation and deemed to be significant for users to understand how the manifestation represents itself. That's from the RDA glossary. So a manifestation may carry information that describes the manifestation itself. So basically what that means is you look at the manifestation and it has certain information on there that helps you to understand what this thing is that you are looking at. This information is recorded to follow the principle of representation. So we'll talk more about that later. Then the manifestation statement supports the user task identify. So basically what this does is if we're looking at this stuff record in a bibliographic -- we say okay this particular manifestation statement matches this -- Okay. So to do manifestation statements, there's basically two transcription methods. So one is called basic transcription and the other one is called normalized transcription. So the way you do basic transcription -- as they appear on the manifestation. What you are doing is you're just recording things as they appear on the manifestation. The one exception to this is that you omit symbols or other images that are intended to be interpreted as text if they are not available in the character set used by the agent who creates the transcription. So under guideline, under manifestation statements, you'll find these particular instructions here. These basically tell you to transcribe the components of the manifestation statement in the order that they appear in the manifestation. They tell you to use the two back slashes to deliver the components of the statement, use the mark of omission to indicate the omission of text. You can also use the mark
  • 13. of omission to indicate that the omission of text at the beginning and ended of the statement. They collapse white space. Deduplicate contiguous delimiters and deduplicate manifestation strings. So the normalized transcription deals with the transcribing elements following the more traditional cataloging practice. You remember in 1.7 in the current RDA, they basically give you guidelines on dealing with the language and script, dealing with the diacritics, capitalization, punctuation, spacing of the initials and acronyms, abbreviations and symbols and numbers. So basically what the normalized transcription does is it basically transcribes the elements of the manifestation, but it transcribes them following the guidelines that are in the manifestation statement for a normalized transcription. Here we have a manifestation statement and this is a basic transcription. We have City of Time and it's illustrated by Jones Bell and the publisher is Wendy Lamb Books. I took everything as it applied to the title page and I transcribed them and tried to reproduce those as closely as I could. All of the stuff in all caps has been transcribed as all caps. You'll notice that in the title "of" is basically upper case but smaller font so I reproduced that. And then the illustrated by Joan diBell is with each word capitalized except for the by and Wendy is transcribed in all caps. So here we have a normalized transcription. Here you can see I've just basically taken the everything in the order that it appears on the source of information, but I followed the guidelines, the RDA guidelines for punctuation and capitalization. So there you can see only the the first letter of the authors' names are capitalized, I've transcribed the title and cap capitalized the first word. This is basically the way that a normalized transcription would look. In terms of keyword searching, in terms of
  • 14. the implications of which one is preferential, that's totally up to you. Most don't worry about case and punctuation so either way is fine. Now, this is kind of more what we're used to as catalogers. Here we have -- this is a structured description, but the structured description is assembled by unstructured recordings of the different parts of the thing. We're basically using the RDA guidelines for punctuation and actually the RDA guidelines for capitalization, and we've also ended a string and coding string, the ISBD screen and coding screen, which means we've separated parts of the ISBD description with certain parts of punctuation. I didn't put in the full stop space-space in between each item, although I could have, but I just basically kept them there. I got the first edition of the title page. You can see following the RDA instructions for a publication date that is not an explicit publication date, a supplied publication date, so I put that in square brackets, and then I added the copyright date. This in its entirety is a structured description because I'm following the RDA streaming coding stream, adding the RDA punctuation and I'm also following the RDA application profile by supplying the 8 areas of the bibliographic description. So here we have elements for recording manifestation statements. So we have, and these are all elements listed in the RDA toolkit. So you'll notice that we have the entire elements start with manifestation. We have the manifestation copyright statement and so forth. Basically all of these are elements for recording manifestation statements. Now, what we're used to as catalogers and dealing with the current version of RDA is we go into chapter two and we look up the instructions for dealing with different aspects of a manifestation. And so these are basically structured statements. And so these are treated differently than if we were just doing a
  • 15. manifestation statement. We have the copyright statement, the manifestation distribution statement and so forth. And there's more elements here. I just added these as examples. But I wanted to distinguish between what we're dealing with when we're doing manifestation statements versus recording structured elements. So for example, this basically follows that first slide and this follows that first slide, but this follows that second slide where you have the manifestation and the little -- greater than sign, whatever that is. The difference is that manifestation statement elements are always unstructured descriptions. Some of the other manifestation elements, the ones that I showed examples of on the previous slide, can be expressed with more than one recording method. So for example, if I wanted to express the publisher in the publication statement, that would be an unstructured description. If I'm recording that off a source of information. If I wanted to add an access point for the publisher, like we do in video recordings sometimes, then I would add that as an access point and that would be a structured description. So that's pretty much the difference between manifestation statements and more structured description statements. So manifestation statements might be a quick way to make backlog materials available. So you might be able to scan a title page of books that you have in backlogs, OCR those, put them into some kind of a machine readable record, add them to a database and make them accessible with keyword searching. And as I said before, most keyword algorithms -- basically normalized won't affect retrieval in most cases. This is a quick way to make digitized materials available. Since you've already scanned the page, all you need to do is OCR it and then you can add that into some kind of machine readable system and make that quickly accessible. This is also helpful in the
  • 16. description of where materials where you really want to provide a more accurate description of what's on the item using basic transcription where you record the way things are capitalized, the way things are punctuated and things like that. So that's pretty much all I have right now. I apologize for brevity, but I'll be happy to take questions now. >> All right. Thanks, Bill. Yeah, we are way ahead of schedule. To our audience, anything you want to ask, this is our chance. The first question, and let me just preface my questions by saying I don't have any RDA or cataloging subject matter expertise, so if I come off like I don't know what I'm talking about in one of these questions, I don't. I'm just reading what's in the chat space. The first question, in a manifestation statement wouldn't we keep on writing instead of starting a new line? I'm also not clear when to use these delimiters. >> The delimiters, for example, if I had a publication statement and I want to make sure that somebody can distinguish the place of publication from the publisher or date or something like that, I would add those delimiters within each statement. So if I'm dealing with a publication statement, I could use those delimiters to -- of the publication statement. I guess I think that the purpose of the manifestation statement, I think, is to transcribe, to record the title page or the other source of information the way that it appears on the item. So what I did is I recorded, so like in my example, the author was on one line, the title was on another line, and then the publisher was on a third line. So that's basically the reason why I did that. So you're basically trying to make it look as much like the source as possible. That's one of the purposes of a manifestation statement. >> Okay. Next question. Do we know if and
  • 17. how we will record manifestation statements in mark 21 records? >> I really don't think -- mark 21 and that whole environment I think is really more of a structured description environment. And so I really don't know or really don't think that -- I guess you could record them that way, but you wouldn't be -- yeah, I suppose you could record them that way, but it would kind of take away the whole point of doing the manifestation statement because part of the manifestation statement is to basically show the person how the information was presented on the item. So I'm not really sure that you would even do this in MARC. We don't know anything about -- sorry. Kathy says no, we don't know anything about MARC 21 develops -- working group will be starting work in September. It's possible that instead of putting like everything in separate fields, which would be more like a structured description, you might just have -- I'm just speculating here, this is Bill's wild speculation so don't take it as gospel. It might be that you have a MARC manifestation field and you plop everything in there. I don't know. >> MODERATOR: All right. How would -- this is a similar question. How would a manifestation statement look in MARC, current practice seems to favor a structured description and the 26X field reflects this issue, the structured. >> As I said, we really don't know what that's going to look like, as Kathy said. That's kind of, like I said, I've kind of speculated. I really don't know how that's going to look. >> MODERATOR: All right. Could you talk a little more about nomen? It sounds like it's a text string. Is that accurate? >> A nomen, in the LRM is basically the name of something. So the nomen for this book here, that I'm looking at on this slide is City of Time. This particular nomen is a title proper but it's a nomen. Nomen in Latin just means
  • 18. name. And RDA -- so every type of recording statement, except for the IRI are all nomens and nomens are named for something. If I had the book in my hand and looked at the ISBN number, that would be a nomen for this book. It's a name given for the book. I'm a male human being and my nomen is Bill Walker. >> MODERATOR: Okay. Does the new RDA assume the data will be an XML-based relational database? >> I don't think RDA makes any assumptions about how the data will be formatted. The new RDA is basically going to -- has a lot of features that basically encourage the organization of data in resource description framework, which gets to linked data, which gets to the IRI recording method. But in terms of how individual people put their records in whatever format, MARC, XML, whatever, RDA makes no assumptions about that. >> MODERATOR: All right. In the City of Time example, was it necessary to make "of" a different sized font? If so, why was the manifestation statement not italicized? >> Good question. I think -- to tell you the truth, I don't know. I didn't have any think about that. The reason why I did the small case of City of Time in the basic transcription example is because that appeared that way. You're absolutely right. I probably -- I might have been able to do that. I'm not sure that in the real world application of manifestation statements that we would go into that detail, and it might be that we would just do did all in upper case and leave it at that. >> MODERATOR: All right. We're at the end of our question list, but officially, we have got 40 minutes left. So maybe we should do sort of a pause here and give people time for some more questions to flow in. I also want to thank everybody, especially Kathy. Kathy's been handling some of the questions in the chat space
  • 19. so we haven't had to relay some of these to Bill. Here is another question. By the way, in this example, I assume it's still referring to the City of Time example, why did Bill put spaces between City of And "Time" ? There aren't any. I put that, to me, it looked like there were spaces there. I guess it's just a matter of perception. But I think that you would probably want to make this -- I mean, if I were dealing with a database of manifestation statements, a user would probably want to have the spaces in there, because they are not going to know that assuming that you're correct, that that City of Time are separated by spaces. Is using the basic description compulsory or is it an option? This is absolutely an option. This is not something that is intended to replace traditional cataloging, to my knowledge. Basically you are free to implement RDA any way you want to. So basically, if you want to -- excuse me. I'm going the wrong way. If you are going to just do traditional cataloging, you're basically going to forget about all this stuff right here. You're basically going to be using what these elements represent. So then there will be a separate -- there are instructions, both for doing manifestation statements and instructions for doing the element, as we've traditionally done the elements. That's totally up to you. One of the things that you are going to notice about the new RDA is it's going to be much, much much less pre-scripted about what it tells the cataloger to do. I've heard the steering committee talk about this and Kathy, you can chime in, but basically what the steering committee learned from the current RDA is that everybody in the world does things differently. So they wanted to make it as little prescriptive as possible. For example, there's no core elements anymore. And oftentimes
  • 20. you'll run into an instruction that will say here's the situation, here's one option, another option, another option, another option, choose. We have a question. Okay, to make sure I'm getting there. You use a manifestation statement when you really want to convey the detail of how a particular manifestation appears and this is essentially unstructured. Structured access points are -- >> Yeah. I could see that happening. So there's two reasons to use a manifestation statement. One may be that you really want to show people exactly how the -- let me there's two reasons. One is that you want to show how the information is laid out in a source of information. Another one is that it's just to be kind of quick and dirty here, is you just want to use a quick and dirty way of recording information. So like I said, one of the things you could do is just scan a title page, do OCR and then maybe what the user sees is an image of the title they could basically search for that object. Maybe what they would see is not one bibliographic effort. I could see that happening. >> MODERATOR: Okay. Once again I think we are at the end of the questions. So we'll open it back up to our audience. Anything else? And Bill, do you have any closing thoughts before we wrap? >> My closing thoughts would be a lot of this stuff is formed in cream of mushroom soup rather than concrete. RDA has put out a lot of stuff that we basically don't know how it's going to work out. The RDA working group, how are they going to make manifestation statements expressed in MARC? We don't know that yet because the RDA MARC working group hasn't really started yet, as far as I can tell. And somebody asked a question down here, how is this going to work in current ILS systems? It may be that it doesn't work in current ILS
  • 21. systems. It might work in some other kind of thing like an image management system or something like that. There are a lot of questions about how is this going to work, what are the applications. RDA has some applications for manifestation statements, but then the library community is basically going to come up with some other applications of manifestation statements. But a lot of people will continue to cataloging the way they have been so they will use the other parts of RDA how it applies to cataloging. You can look at manifestation statements as another way of doing something to achieve another purpose. Whereas if your goal is to just do cataloging and to put stuff in your IL S-system, you're probably going to do traditional cataloging and follow those parts of RDA that pertain to traditional cataloging. >> MODERATOR: All right. I think we are going to wrap up. Thanks to everybody for joining us. I'll be keeping an eye on the chat space to see if any other questions come in. Bill, we want to thank you for the wonderful presentation. This is part one in a five part series. I know most of you in the audience are signed up for the full series. If that is the case for you, we will look forward to seeing you next week. Again, we are recording this event. If you missed anything you're going to get an email in the next 24 hours giving you full access to the recording. With that, I think we will wrap. Bill, we want to thank you. To our audience, you were fantastic. And with that, we will close and hopefully we will see most of you next week. Have a wonderful day, everybody, or evening or morning, depending where you are in the world.