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O Sister, Where Art Thou? introduction
1. O Sister, Where Art Thou?
Women in the
Ancient Church
Part One
Introduction
2. D. L. Moody and the Early Moody Bible Institute
3. D. L. Moody and the Early Moody Bible Institute
4. D. L. Moody and the Early Moody Bible Institute
âMBI women openly served as
pastors, evangelists, pulpit supply
preachers, Bible teachers and even
in the ordained ministry.â
âConsequently, the early MBI
stands as an appropriate
educational symbol of
âfundamentalist feminismâ.â
Janette Hassey
9. Christian Denominations on the Ordination of Women
YES
Episcopal Church
Presbyterian Church (USA)
Evangelical Lutheran Church in America
Many Pentecostal Churches
United Methodist Church
Society of Friends (Quakers)
Willow Creek Church & Many Evangelicals
NO
Roman Catholic
Eastern Orthodox Churches
Presbyterian Church in America
Lutheran Church-Missouri Synod
Southern Baptist Convention
Fundamentalist & Many Evangelicals
11. What do the Christian Leaders have to Say?
F.F. Bruce- YES
âIf he (Holy Spirit) manifestly withheld the gifts of teaching or
leadership from Christian women, then we should accept that as
evidence of his will (1 Cor. 12:11). But experience shows that he
bestows these and other gifts, with âundistinguishing regardâ, on
men and women alikeânot on all women, of
course, nor yet on all men. That being so, it is
unsatisfactory to rest with a halfway house in
this issue of womenâs ministry, where they are
allowed to pray and prophesy, but not to teach
or lead.â
12. What do the Christian Leaders have to Say?
J. I. Packer- NO
âIs there not a better way of benefiting from womenâs ministry
than by ordaining them?â
13. What do the Christian Leaders have to Say?
YES
N.T. Wright
Walter Kaiser Jr.
NO
Wayne A. Grudem
John Piper
15. Council on Biblical Manhood and
Womanhood (CBMW)
Council for Biblical Equality
(CBE)
16. Council on Biblical Manhood and
Womanhood (CBMW)
Council for Biblical Equality
(CBE)
BOTH
Identify as Evangelical
Teach Christ as Central
Hold Scripture as Authoritative
17. Council for Biblical Equality
(CBE)
Rebecca Groothuis
Ronald Pierce
Linda Belleville
19. Council for Biblical Equality
(CBE)
https://www.cbeinternational.org
Mission Statement
âCBE exists to promote biblical justice and community by
educating Christians that the Bible calls women and men to share
authority equally in service and leadership in the home, church,
and world.â
20. Council for Biblical Equality
(CBE)
Core Values
1. Scripture is our authoritative guide for faith, life, and practice.
2. Patriarchy (male dominance) is not a biblical ideal but a result
of sin.
3. Patriarchy is an abuse of power, taking from females what
God has given them: their dignity, and freedom, their leadership,
and often their very lives.
4. While the Bible reflects patriarchal culture, the Bible does not
teach patriarchy in human relationships.
21. Council for Biblical Equality
(CBE)
Core Values
5. Christâs redemptive work frees all people from patriarchy,
calling women and men to share authority equally in service and
leadership.
6. Godâs design for relationships includes faithful marriage
between a man and a woman, celibate singleness and mutual
submission in Christian community.
7. The unrestricted use of womenâs gifts is integral to the work
of the Holy Spirit and essential for the advancement of the
gospel in the world.
22. Council for Biblical Equality
(CBE)
Core Values
8. Followers of Christ are to oppose injustice and patriarchal
teachings and practices that marginalize and abuse females and
males.
9. The Bible âteaches gender equality in church, home and
society.â
23. Council for Biblical Equality
(CBE)
âThe essential message of biblical equality is simple and
straightforward: Gender, in and of itself, neither privileges nor
curtails oneâs ability to be used to advance the kingdom or to
glorify God in any dimension of ministry, mission, or family.â
âBiblical equality, therefore, denies that there is any created or
otherwise God-ordained hierarchy based solely on gender.â
24. Council for Biblical Equality
(CBE)
In the Beginning: Male and female were equal.
Due to the Fall: There is a divide and patriarchal hierarchy.
Christ: Heals and restores equality.
New Creation: Equality fully restored.
27. Council on Biblical Manhood and
Womanhood (CBMW)
https://cbmw.org/
Mission
âThe mission of The Council on Biblical Manhood and
Womanhood is to set forth the teachings of the Bible about the
complementary differences between men and women, created
equally in the image of God, because these teachings are essential
for obedience to Scripture and for the health of the family and the
church.â
29. Council on Biblical Manhood and
Womanhood (CBMW)
The Danvers Statement
Based on our understanding of Biblical teachings, we affirm the
following:
Both Adam and Eve were created in God's image, equal before
God as persons and distinct in their manhood and womanhood
30. Council on Biblical Manhood and
Womanhood (CBMW)
The Danvers Statement
Adam's headship in marriage was established by God before the
Fall, and was not a result of sin.
The Fall introduced distortions into the relationships between
men and women.
31. Council on Biblical Manhood and
Womanhood (CBMW)
The Danvers Statement
Both Old and New Testaments also affirm the principle of male
headship in the family and in the covenant community.
Redemption in Christ aims at removing the distortions introduced
by the curse.
32. Council on Biblical Manhood and
Womanhood (CBMW)
The Danvers Statement
In the home, the husband's loving, humble headship tends to be
replaced by domination or passivity; the wife's intelligent, willing
submission tends to be replaced by usurpation or servility.
In the church, sin inclines men toward a worldly love of power or
an abdication of spiritual responsibility, and inclines women to
resist limitations on their roles or to neglect the use of their gifts
in appropriate ministries.
33. Council on Biblical Manhood and
Womanhood (CBMW)
The Danvers Statement
In the church, redemption in Christ gives men and women an
equal share in the blessings of salvation; nevertheless, some
governing and teaching roles within the church are restricted to
men.
34. Council on Biblical Manhood and
Womanhood (CBMW)
Men and women equally share in the image of God,
but not their roles in life and ministry.
35. Council on Biblical Manhood and
Womanhood (CBMW)
In the Beginning: Male and female have different roles.
Women were subordinate.
Due to the Fall: Distorts relationships.
Christ: Heals the broken relationships.
New Creation: Original order restored (Patriarchy )
36. Council on Biblical Manhood and
Womanhood (CBMW)
Council for Biblical Equality
(CBE)
BOTH
Identify as Evangelical
Teach Christ as Central
Hold Scripture as Authoritative
37. Council on Biblical Manhood and
Womanhood (CBMW)
Council for Biblical Equality
(CBE)
Egalitarian Hierarchical
38. Council on Biblical Manhood and
Womanhood (CBMW)
Council for Biblical Equality
(CBE)
Egalitarian
Patriarchy is result of sin
Hierarchical
Patriarchy is Godâs idea
39. Council on Biblical Manhood and
Womanhood (CBMW)
Council for Biblical Equality
(CBE)
Egalitarian
Patriarchy is result of sin
Leadership is based on gifts
Hierarchical
Patriarchy is Godâs idea
Leadership is based on gifts
and gender
40. Council on Biblical Manhood and
Womanhood (CBMW)
Council for Biblical Equality
(CBE)
Egalitarian
Patriarchy is result of sin
Leadership is based on gifts
Hermeneutics focused on
historical context
Hierarchical
Patriarchy is Godâs idea
Leadership is based on gifts
and gender
Hermeneutics focused on the
universal
44. Complementarianism
The complementarian view of Hildegard of Bingen (1098-1179)
Background: Middle Ages
Two Views
Aristotleâs
Male and female are opposites.
Jeromeâs (Plato)
The soul is sexless, male and female are
potentially equal.
45. Complementarianism
Hildegard
Held to an equality of male and female
together with significant observed and
documented differences.
The complementarian view of Hildegard of Bingen (1098-1179)
47. What would John Chrysostom say?
In the Beginning:
Male and female were created equal.
Due to the Fall:
Women became subordinate.
Christ:
Begins to heal the broken
relationships, but the curse is still in
effect.
New Creation:
Equality restored.
49. O Sister, Where Art Thou?
Christian Women:
Past, Present, &
Future
Editor's Notes
D. L. Moody (1837-1899) and Moody Bible Institute (opened in 1889)
Shoe salesman turned evangelist.
D. L. Moody had no problem with women in ministry or church leadership roles.
Hassey (PhD U of Chicago, Missionary to Philippines) asks, âWhy do evangelical groups that once welcomed women as pastors and preachers now prohibit or discourage such ministry?â (DBE p. 39)
She continues, âI found that fundamentalism a century ago was neither exclusively male dominated nor inherently antifeminist.â (DBE p. 40)Â
Suggested Reasons: Interdenominational Bible conferences, Women speaking on social needs, PremillenialismâŚ
Historically?
Presently?
Hindi women are expected to throw themselves on their husbandâs funeral fire.
Many Muslim women are not allowed to leave the house w/o their husbandâs permission.
Many societies (religious and not) limit womenâs education and jobs.
âGiving a woman an education is like giving a goat a fluteâ (ancient Greek)
This is a global issue.
Should women be ordained?
Should they serve as pastors?
Should they serve as teachers?
Seh-Nid
Bruce (1910-1990) Rylands Professor of Biblical Criticism and Exegesis at the University of Manchester.
From âWomen in the Church: A Biblical Survey,â Christian Brethren Review 33 (1982), 7-14, 11-12.
If women are gifted by the Holy Spirit then let them use their gifts.
See article; Letâs Stop Making Women Presbyters,
Regent collage in Vancouver Canada.
Knowing God
Wright: New Testament scholar, Anglican Bishop of Durham
Kaiser: Gordon-Conwell college. OT Scholar.
Grudem: Research Professor of Bible and Theology, Phoenix Seminary AZ.
Piper: Pastor, author, trained at Wheaton and Fuller.
âPriestesses in the Church?â (see God in the Docks)
Written from an Anglican perspective.
Not as priests (a mediator position), but yes for prayer and prophesying (preaching).
Both groups were formed in 1987.
So whatâs the difference?
Groothuis: Freelance writer and editor
Belleville: PhD, University of Toronto, is adjunct professor of New Testament at Grand Rapids Theological Seminary.
Pierce: PhD from Fuller Theological Seminary. He has taught biblical studies and theology at Biola University since 1976,
and currently teaches in the undergraduate program of the Talbot School of Theology
Sometimes referred to asâŚ
Biblical Feminism
Biblical Egalitarianism
Beginning: Equality
Fall: The damage is done. Patriarchy is introduced.
Christ: In Christ there is no male or female⌠Equality now!
New: Equal again.
Grudem: Research Professor of Theology and Biblical Studies at Phoenix Seminary in Phoenix, Arizona
Piper: Piper served as Pastor for Preaching and Vision of Bethlehem Baptist Church in Minneapolis, Minnesota.
This sounds similar, but there are some differences.
December, 1987, Danvers, Massachusetts,
Not the entirety of the statement.
Interesting Note:
The female members of the CBMW list âhomemakerâ and âpastorâs wifeâ as their first accreditation.
This is a balancing act.
Beginning: God created women to be submissive.
Fall: Distorts relationships. Men domineering, women usurping.
Christ: Restores the ordained hierarchy.
Creation: Women are eternally subordinate.
God made men to be leaders and women to be followers.
So whatâs the difference?
CBE: They do not deny hierarchical relationships, but do not accept it in gender.
CBMW: Everything is hierarchical. Not only the cosmos, but eternally within God as well.
Chrysostom would consider Wayneâs conclusions as absurd. I was shocked by how much of a ruling concept it is in his theology.
The Great Chain of Being vs the Circle of Life.
Even though Grudem does not like this word, he clearly is patristic.
Some have referred to his view as a âlove patriarchyâ.
The two groups could not work together on a joint statement on domestic violence,
probably due to the idea (CBE) that patriarchy is a form of abuse.
CBE: Women gifted by God should be able to teach and lead.
CBMW: No they shouldnât.
They approach Scripture differently.
One personâs medicine is anotherâs poison. Donât take other peopleâs medication.
Jesus and the rich young ruler, were his instructions for us as well?
But there is a universal message, otherwise, why are we bothering to read the gospels?
Disgruntled relationships!
We have differences, but those differences complement each other.
Complementarianism is a word that can fit almost any circumstance, even slavery.
Feudal System: The nobleman on the hill and his priestin the Church both tell you this is where God has placed you, so be happy!
It needs clear definition. Grudemâs use of it is in the context of a strong patriarchal view of life.
Both CBE and CBMW use this word. (Even Muslims use it.)
Mary Malone, p. 118.
Mary Malone, p. 118
Aristotle: Long gone but his influence is strong in Middle Ages.
Jerome: Male and female are identical when sexuality is renounced.
Plato: An idealist that speculated in egalitarianism in The Republic. The soul is sexless and thus men and women are potentially equal in nature, though men are stronger physically.
Mary Malone, p. 118
Point: Complementarianism is an important term in modern dialogue, but it needs context.
Which side would he endorse? CBE or CBMW?
Beginning: Equality is continuously emphasized by John (with possible distinctions).
Fall: This is a mercy as you cannot have two equals leading.
Christ: As long as we are in our corruptible flesh men rule.
New: Equality, âas the angelsâ