Southern RRG (Road Alliance) funded initiative covering Professional Engineering Services – Practitioner, Employer, Professional Development and Risk Perspective

1. Industry Workshop for Professional Engineers
Funded by Southern Regional Road Group of The Road and Transport Alliance

2. Industry Workshop for PE
Concept, research and led by
Logan City Council (Ashish Shah)
Funded and supported by Southern Regional
Roads Group
– Road Alliance (Transport and Main Roads and
LGAQ)
– Logan City Council
– Redland City Council
– Gold Coast City Council
2

3. Industry Workshop I for PE
11:00am –
11:30am
"What is unsatisfactory professional conduct for a Registered
Professional Engineer of Queensland" Julie Mitchell
11:30am –
12:00pm
"Do Professional Engineers need to clarify obligations and
improve recognition of their profession?" Ashish Shah and
Chris Lenz
12:00pm -
12:45pm
RPEQ Panel Discussion: Facilitator Ashish Shah
"Professional Engineering Services – Practitioner, Employer,
Professional Development and Risk Perspective"
1st of the series funded by Road Alliance Southern Regional Roads Technical Group.
Panel : Chris Lenz, Murray Erbs, Aneurin Hughes, Julie Mitchell,
Kamal Ranaweera
3

4. 11:00am – 11:30am
"What is unsatisfactory
professional conduct for a
Registered Professional
Engineer of Queensland"
by Julie Mitchell
4

5. 11:30am – 12:00pm
"Do Professional Engineers need
to clarify obligations and
improve recognition of their
profession?"
by Ashish Shah &
Chris Lenz
5

6. Do Professional Engineers need to clarify obligations and
improve recognition of their profession?
By Ashish Shah, Chris Lenz

7. Audience Poll
Do Professional Engineers need to
clarify obligations
and
improve recognition of their profession?
Context: Public Sector
7

8. 8
Why and How?
• I and fellow PEs
• My journey so far
• Capability Development Fund
– Self research, peer knowledge share
– Experts input
– Workshop/Panel discussion
– Webinar, group discussion, LinkedIn pulse
– Surveys
– BPEQ resource pack, discussion paper, submissions

9. 9
Curiosity on
• Comparing PE Act, Public Sector Act and W H &
S Act
– Have public safety and ethics
– Varied obligation sharing with Employer vs Individual
Professional
– How are they designed, treated and implemented/ funded
• Comparing Professional Engineer’s system to
Medical and Legal system of registration,
obligations and recognition
• Comparing PE systems overseas

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Let’s put fines & who is liable under the PE Act in context.
Work Health and Safety Act 2011 (QLD)
1. Primary duty of care on those conducting a business [s19]
2. Duties also imposed on persons conducting businesses or managing workplaces that construct, manufacture, design,
importing etc. [s20 to 26]
3. Duty of officer conducting the business [s27], BUT NOTE
4. Duty of worker [s28]
5. Duty of other persons at a workplace [s29]
BASICALLY EVERYONE IS CAUGHT BY THE ACT AND THE STATE CAN BE CIVILLY LIABLE [s10]
1. Range of offences or penalties [Part 2 Division 5]
a. Reckless conduct – category 1 is a crime and penalty:
i. – individual conductor of business - 6000 penalty units (over $660,000) or 5 years imprisonment
ii. Body corporate 30,000 penalty units (over $3,3million)
2. Incident notification [Part 3] and Act is very strong on investigation
3. Duty to consult [Part 5 Division 1]
THIS IS A BIG STICK TO ANYONE – PARTICULARLY THE BOSS!
So, Chris Lenz

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A Professional’s
obligations
http://www.mvy.com/play-here/lighthouses.aspx

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Lenz Moreton 2015 12
In order to put being an RPEQ in context and get
some clarity about an RPEQ’s obligations
Let’s briefly look at Professional obligations:
a. the 5 original professions & their legislation;
b. Professional engineering in the USA
Improved recognition of RPEQ’s
• Understand how professional recognition can be
improved
Professional Obligations

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Engineering is 1 of the 5
original professions
“The five traditional professions are:
architecture, clergy, engineering, law and medicine.
The usual reason for classifying the five traditional professions is on the
traditional 'definition' of a profession having (1) a specialised and
institutionalised training or education, (2) a statutory qualification, (3) formal
apprenticeship, (4) code of ethics, (5) regulatory oversight by the government
(or self-regulating), and (6) the person be a member of a professional body in
order to practice his occupation. In short, the profession has "corporate
solidarity.“”
http://www.quora.com/What-are-the-professions?
Professional Obligations

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Taking the profession definition of quora which is a good one:
(1)a specialised and institutionalised training or education
(2)a statutory qualification
(3)formal apprenticeship
THESE GET YOU THROUGH THE GATE, AND THEN IN PRACTICE:
(1)code of ethics,
(2)regulatory oversight by the government (or self-regulating), and
(3)the person be a member of a professional body in order to practice his
occupation.
This theme applies throughout the 5 professions identified below, and in my
opinion the key to being a professional [of whatever profession] is to:
1. abide by the Code of Conduct; and
2. maintain your skills through appropriate selection of your CPD
Professional Obligations

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Legislation for those Professions
1. Architects – Architects Act 2002 (QLD) - almost identical to PE Act – word for
word - 167 Sections and 100 pages – part of National Legislation
2. Clergy –No Australian legislation as it is prohibited by s116 of the Constitution
3. Engineering – Professional Engineers Act 2002 (“PE Act”) - 171 sections and
121 pages QLD ONLY
4. Law – Legal Profession Act 2007 –780 sections and 582 pages! – moving
towards National Legislation
5. Medicine – Health Practitioner Regulation National Law Act 2009 (QLD) – 305
sections and 345 pages [part of the National Legislation]
RPEQ IS QUEENSLAND ONLY
Similar to the USA, where each State licenses professional engineers
Professional Obligations

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Medicine
1. Health Practitioner Regulation National Law Act 2009 (QLD)
2. Registered by the Medical Board of Australia as a “medical practitioner” or
“medical specialist” NB. “Doctor” is not a protected title
3. The National Board has a board in each State in Australia
4. They have a Code of Conduct – s39 of the Act
5. Practice means any role, whether remunerated or not, in which the individual uses their skills and
knowledge as a health practitioner in their profession. For the purposes of this registration standard, practice
is not restricted to the provision of direct clinical care. It also includes using professional knowledge in a
direct nonclinical relationship with clients, working in management, administration, education, research,
advisory, regulatory or policy development roles, and any other roles that impact on safe, effective delivery
of services in the profession.
6. Continuing professional development is the means by which members of the profession maintain,
improve and broaden their knowledge, expertise and competence, and develop the personal qualities
required in their professional lives.
7. Medical practitioners do minimum of 50 hours CPD per year
Professional Obligations

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Lenz Moreton 2015
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Law [Very heavily regulated profession]
1. Legal Profession Act 2007 and Legal Profession Regulation 2007
2. s34 - Apply for the Supreme Court for admission
3. s35 - Supreme Court admits you as a lawyer to the legal profession
4. Code of Ethics of the Law Society (solicitors) and barristers conduct rules
5. Solicitors 10 Hours CPD a year which must include at least:
a. 1 hour of practical legal ethics
b. 1 hour of practice management and business skills
c. 1 hour of professional skills, which comprise:
i. Communication and interpersonal skills
ii. Client interviewing
iii. Plain English drafting
iv. Negotiation and mediation skills
v. Career and personal development
vi. Advocacy
vii. Legal research
6. Therefore not at all prescriptive about maintaining actual knowledge of the law
Professional Obligations

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Lenz Moreton 2015 18
Engineers
Professional Engineers in the USA
1. Engineers must complete several steps to demonstrate competency.
a. Earn a four-year degree in engineering
b. Pass the Fundamentals of Engineering (FE) exam
c. Complete four years of progressive engineering experience under a
PE
d. Pass the Principles and Practice of Engineering (PE) exam
2. You register for a licence in each State where you practice
3. No CPD in 6 States of USA – Others range from 15 to 60, average 30
hours per year with some requiring minimum hours in each area of practice
http://www.nspe.org/resources/licensure/what-pe
IN THE US, THE HURDLE IS QUALIFYING FOR YOUR PE STATUS
Professional Obligations

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Essentially, the PE Act relies upon:
1. One of the assessment entities for technical competence assessment [s10] and
then;
2. Focusses on fitness to practice including having no convictions, not affected by
bankruptcy or insolvency and being mentally and physically fit [s11];
THIS GETS YOU REGISTERED
and thereafter the PE Act relies upon your declaration that:
1. You have adhered to the CPD requirements of one of the assessment entities [s16];
and
2. You are fit to practice.
YOUR FOCUS SHOULD THEN BE ON:
1. HOW TO MAINTAIN YOUR RPEQ STATUS; AND
2. WHAT YOU SHOULD BE DOING
PE act

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Lenz Moreton 2015
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In order to comply with the PE Act Julie’s last 2 slides are excellent visual aids to
assist you to avoid professional difficulties, and assist your lawyer to help you –
just in case! Therefore:
1. Focus on the Code of Practice for your conduct (“COP”)
[https://www.bpeq.qld.gov.au/iMIS15/BPEQ/]; and the
2. PPIR protocol for your professional obligations [COP3.1]
[https://www.ppir.com.au]
3. However, it is really important for you to focus on doing the right thing.
4. In your CPD therefore, even though you can satisfy the minimum requirement
with a wide range of offerings, you can only practice in your area of
competence [COP 3.5], so you should include CPD in these area/s
5. Principle 1 on the COP raises a possible ethical dilemma you may face is
when your obligations to the community [COP1.3] conflicts with your
obligation to the client and/or employer [COP1.1]
IN THAT EVENT, I SUGGEST LOOKING AT THE ENGINEER’S CREED FOR
GUIDANCE
RPEQ Obligations

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As a Professional Engineer, I dedicate my professional knowledge and skill to the
advancement and betterment of human welfare.
I pledge:
 To give the utmost of performance;
 To participate in none but honest enterprise;
 To live and work according to the laws of man and the highest standards of
professional conduct;
 To place service before profit, the honour and standing of the profession before
personal advantage, and the public welfare above all other considerations.
In humility and with need for Divine Guidance, I make this pledge.
Adopted by National Society of Professional Engineers (USA), June 1954
A Roman aqueduct [built circa 19
BC] near Pont du Gard, France
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Civil_engi
neering
Don’t you think this
Roman engineer
followed the creed?
Engineers' Creed

22. 9/23/2015
Lenz Moreton 2015 22
Improved recognition

23. Lenz Moreton 2015
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Lenz Moreton
Engineering & Construction Lawyers
IMPROVED PROFESSIONAL RECOGNITION
What is a professional engineer?
The US National Society of Professional Engineers
• To a client, it means you've got the credentials to earn
their trust.
• To an employer, it signals your ability to take on a higher
level of responsibility.
• Among your colleagues, it demands respect.
• To yourself, it's a symbol pride and measure of your own
hard-won achievement. (My underlining)
http://www.nspe.org/resources/licensure/what-pe

24. Lenz Moreton 2015
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IMPROVED PROFESSIONAL RECOGNITION
1. If you have passed through the gate to registration; AND
THEN
2. Adhere to the Code of ethics; and
3. Sensibly select your CPD to maintain and enhance
technical skills, doing more than the minimum;
4. You will have the self confidence and can take pride in
being an engineer in a Local or State Government who
are the front-line deliverers of engineering solutions for
the benefit of their local community
http://www.mvy.com/play-here/lighthouses.aspx
Please practice
ethically & safely
Lenz Moreton
Engineering & Construction Lawyers

25. 25
Last from Ashish
before Q & A to Chris
IMPROVED PROFESSIONAL RECOGNITION
Someone asked an engineer,
Why you feel proud of being an engineer?
He smiled and told that
A lawyer's income increases with increase in crime and litigation (and also
some weirdly drafted laws!!).
A doctor's income increases with increase in diseases / illness.
But an engineer's income increases with increase in prosperity of people
and nation (and hopefully also via improved recognition through some well
drafted laws!!). .
Feel proud to be an "Engineer“ and further raise the awareness of Engineer’s
contributions!!!!

26. 26
Ask Questions but be prepared with Lawyer’s answers
(it depends type!!! oops)
Please do ask he is your fellow Registered
Professional Engineer of QLD too!!!
Questions to Chris Lenz
Lenz Moreton
Engineering & Construction Lawyers

27. 12:00 – 12:45
RPEQ Panel Discussion: Facilitator Ashish Shah
"Professional Engineering Services – Practitioner,
Employer, Professional Development and Risk
Perspective"
1st of the series funded by Road Alliance Southern Regional Roads
Technical Group.
Panel : Chris Lenz, Murray Erbs, Aneurin Hughes,
Julie Mitchell, Kamal Ranaweera
27

28. Group discussion
• 12.00 PM or 12.00 AM session?
• Sun rises and sets or Earth rotates @ sun daily
– and Sun is almost static from earth’s daily rotational perspective
• Professional Engineering Services (yes/ no/ may be)
– Infrastructure Planning
– Asset Management
– Asset Valuations
28

29. Panel and Facilitator
Aneurin Hughes
| Senior Principal & Discipline Leader |
Cardno
Ashish Shah
| Road Asset Management Program
Leader | Logan City Council
Chris Lenz
| Principal | Lenz Moreton Engineering
and Construction Lawyers
Julie Mitchell
| Chief Engineer | Department of
Transport and Main Roads
Kamal Ranaweera
| Manager Road Infrastructure
Planning | Logan City Council
Murray Erbs
| Group Manager City Infrastructure |
Redland City Council
29

30. Panel and Facilitator
Aneurin Hughes - Consultant RPEQ
perspective
| Senior Principal & Discipline Leader |
Cardno
Ashish Shah - Facilitator
| Road Asset Management Program Leader |
Logan City Council
Chris Lenz - Lawyer RPEQ perspective
| Principal | Lenz Moreton Engineering and
Construction Lawyers
Julie Mitchell - State Gov RPEQ perspective
| Chief Engineer | Department of Transport
and Main Roads
Kamal Ranaweera - LG RPEQ and Manager
perspective
| Manager Road Infrastructure Planning |
Logan City Council
Murray Erbs - Interstate RPEQ perspective
| Group Manager City Infrastructure |
Redland City Council
30

31. Opening questions
Q1: What motivated you to accept the nomination
to be on the panel?
Q2: How would you describe your pride being
Professional Engineer in one sentence or two?
Q3: In your own words, what qualities makes a
better professional engineer?
31

32. Q4: What Professional Development activities
(informal rather than formal conference/ training)
would you suggest to your peer RPEQs?
Q5: What Professional Development would
undertake if there was no time/ resource constraint
to become improved RPEQ?
32

33. Q6: What formal professional development you
undertook or supported your staff in last 2 years?
Q7: Having experiencing budget constraints
becoming more challenging than ever, what advise
you would provide to your peers in achieving or
exceeding continuous professional development?
33

34. Q8: How can supervised (by an RPEQ) non-RPEQ
technical staff provide perceived engineering
advice directly to people (for example in an email
directly to an enquirer)
Q9: How would you motivate your RPEQ or to be
RPEQ staff to achieve or exceed continuous
professional development?
34

35. 35
Targeted outcomes
• Enhanced clarity and hence RPEQ delivers his/her
obligations better (by individuals / employers /senior
managements)
• How to encourage innovation within PE act constraints
• Communication with HR/Procurement
• Risk of not inventing in Professional Engineers
• LGs and SGs are
frontline professional engineering service provider
• Why not Employer RPEQ obligations, why it changed
from Employer to individual?

36. 36
Targeted outcomes
• Improving quality management systems
(improved record keeping)
• Understanding risk and communication
• Career development pathways
• What’s in for a practitioner to be an RPEQ
• Asset Management aspects (not design and
construction only)
• A Specific Webinar session on executive/senior
management

37. What Next
37
• Another workshop/ panel discussion at Logan
City Council on 6th August (in conjunction with
Regional Asset Management Group workshop,
our SEQ Collaborative professional group)
• I would love to talk to each of you who have any
curiosity / question or confusion
– If I can’t , I will try to direct u to the person who may
help
• Webinar series
• Further next, support and funding to be sought

38. What next?
38
• This would be a continuous improvement journey
• But immediate next is
Lunch and Networking Break
(Many thanks to our Half Day Participants for
joining as they r leaving us after Lunch)
• Please come n see us in our display area to talk more/
leave your questions/ comments or suggestions