Episode 231 Snippets: Harry McIntire of SPORTFIVE

@njh287; www.dsmsports.net
On episode 231 of the Digital and Social Media Sports Podcast, Neil chatted
with Harry McIntire, Director of Digital at SPORTFIVE (agency helping the
world’s biggest and most recognizable sports teams and brands drive fan
engagement globally, activate and sell sponsorships, and more).
What follows is a collection of snippets from the podcast. To hear the full
interview and more, check out the podcast on all podcast platforms and at
www.dsmsports.net.
Best Of The Digital and
Social Media Sports Podcast
Episode 231: Harry McIntire

Harry’s Career Path
“Well, I could make into a longwinded answer there. But the short
version is I am a soccer fan. For me, sports is such an interesting vehicle
to kind of change the world or have an impact on the world and soccer, I
think is the one unique sport that can do that for anyone, given that all
you need is yourself, because you could turn anything into a ball, you
could turn anything into the goal post, you could find just a rock and
another pair of them that you could make as the frame and you can use
that and play with that by yourself, with a tennis ball, whatever it may
be.

“So that idea of being able to bring a sport to others that can help them
find the safe space or impact their world on a day-to-day through
something fun and entertaining — that definitely inspires me. And
bringing that to the US market is always the exciting thing as an
American. So everything I've done up to now has pretty much been
through that frame of reference and I will try to continue to do that as I
go further in my career. I'm sure when we talk about different stops,
whether going to a specific graduate school to being at Gilt Edge Soccer
Marketing to Sportfive now or wherever else it was before all those
places, everything was shaped to that perspective.”

“I was supposed to go to college to play soccer because it's always been part of my
life. When it was a couple of months before it wasl time to graduate high school and
make the transition to college, I actually got hurt and it ended my playing career.
But in that next year to two-year period, I was trying to kind of figure out myself
more and what it meant when you weren't having training every single day or a
game multiple days a week.
“What I found was this passion to stay connected to the sport and impact the world
around it. And that meant eventually diving headfirst into getting as many
opportunities as I could. So that started with my university, Duquesne University
and their athletics department, running the marketing for the men's and women's
soccer teams there, and it kind of grew from there. That spiraled then into Learfield
and from there into Relevent Sports into grad school with this vision to supporting
Columbus Crew FC to then Gilt Edge and now Sportfive.”

About what Harry did with the Columbus Crew while in school
“So I wasn't a full-time employee of the organization, but when I was at grad school at Ohio
University, we were trying to find different opportunities that we could get professional experience
in. With my close friend and now colleague/boss Karim Fathi we really uncovered this chance to try
and help the Crew grow within southeast Ohio where the university is based.
“So we created a partnership with the soccer club and then created this entire street marketing
grassroots organization that was built around trying to connect with potential fans all throughout
southeastern Ohio. That meant we were driving from Athens, Ohio where we were to going on a local
television station to talk about the team, to driving to [run a] table at a small town festival and bring
the Crew to them a bit. It was a really interesting and exciting experience, and one that I think I can
speak for myself and I would say Karim too, as well as others, that it was a really interesting learning
experience for us. You were interacting on a one-on-one basis most often directly with someone right
in front of you, so you got to see what was piquing the interest of potential fans, what was piquing
interest to current fans, and what might excite them to try and go to a game or follow a team on
social media, you name it.”

On marketing a team locally vs. globally
“I think there's probably a nuanced difference between A and B and whatever it might be in life.
There's definitely a ton [of differences], but there's a lot of similarities also that may not have
seemed obvious. So when I was working on the Premier League — and Premier League fandom in
the US is so centralized around the bar experience, coming together in a local atmosphere and
where you've got someone walking five minutes from their apartment, but you also might have
someone drive an hour and a half so they could be a part of that bar experience with them. It really
helped shape and understand when you're trying to drive community around a physical location,
and how it all comes together. So on the Premier League side, I was working very heavily on the
digital aspects, running their social channels, producing and directing different video series for
them and trying to keep that frame of mind of what inspires that fan when, yeah, you can see it on
Twitter, but they're a different type of personality [on Twitter]
“So I think it did help frame that and I do try and keep that in mind of what is the behavior that
people have, yes online, but also physically, and how can we then merge those together to create a
more accurate fan profile for someone when they're trying to create what that future or next level
fan really looks like.”

On building fan communities around the sport or league vs. teams
“So two things come to mind when you say that — one, it's so interesting
over here and especially trying to explain it to European colleagues or
European friends, what soccer fans are like in America is because it's so
different than what the rest of the world experiences. And it's different
because over here everything is so siloed. Liga MX fandom is totally
siloed from MLS, from Premier League and La Liga. Yes, there are
definitely overlapping segments that go into each one, but just because
you are a fan of soccer doesn't mean you have a team in every league.
That would be a logistical nightmare to support all of your teams.

“So there are these nuanced differences in how you support your
different teams in specific leagues because of the time zones that they're
occurring in. If you're an MLS and you're not getting up at six in the
morning to go and watch Liverpool play because you're not a Premier
League fan potentially. So your idea of setting an alarm clock on a
Friday night to wake up earlier than you might for work and then go and
brush your teeth, shower and drive to a bar or just sit on your couch is a
totally different experience than, say, getting ready at 4:00 PM to drive
over to Red Bull Arena and watch your team play.

“So there's definitely these silos of differences and you can find
conversation points of commonality. But also there are very distinct
areas where it's hard to find that because it's totally different how a
college basketball fan of Kentucky may not be able to do that with a
diehard fan of the Memphis Grizzlies, even though their teams are
realistically not that far apart geographically in the country.

“But at the same time where it's interesting and there is this natural commonality and this
bond of being a fan of the sport or the league in particular. I think the perfect
representation of what this is in America is the Premier League Fan Fest. They actually
just had one in Philadelphia this past weekend [in mid-October], and it looks stunning. I
was lucky enough to work on, I think, the first five or six of these that ever came to market
over here, which is where NBC just brings that College GameDay atmosphere into a
specific city. They've got the broadcast team there onsite, tons of different activations, and
a really stunning, aesthetically pretty backdrop in one of the biggest cities in the country.
You'll have 15,000 fans come through a very small area like a bar plus its surrounding
street area to just the shadow of Fenway Park or wherever it might have been, and come
together just to experience the Premier League together. They're gonna get in line; gates
won't open until 6:30 AM on Saturday morning, but the people will be in line by midnight
the night before so they can do the first ones in, and they're just sitting there talking about
how excited they are just to consume the Premier League with so many other fans.

“So there is this interesting bond that forms as a soccer fan because you're a fan
of the same sport that is a bit niche still, and you can have this kind of a natural
commonality of having to search hard to find all the best information on your
favorite team or see what all the transfer rumors are because you're not getting
it on SportsCenter, you're not getting it on ESPN, you're not getting it on all
these traditional outlets in the same way you're getting after the NFL, NBA,
MLB, NHL and so on…
“For me, I think that makes it really exciting because you've got this natural
inroad with someone, but also in a way, you have this area where maybe you
can kind of grow together through educating each other by not necessarily
knowing everything right off the bat about every single league or team that
exists.”

About creating that sense of community while also putting the players
and clubs out front for fans, too
“The fan experience in my mind is not one that can only be developed
through the physical environment or just solely through the digital one, it
all has to come together and work in a collaborative way and for
everyone's favorite marketing buzzword — through synergy, through
synergistic effort. And when we are trying to do different activations on a
day-to-day in digital, we are always thinking about, okay, how can we
grow the relationship this fan has with a club, with a league, with a brand,
you name it, and being able to understand the root of that relationship
allows us to connect with them and push them up the fandom escalator.

“But there's only so far it can go. You need to have that physical
compliment. I think an interesting example is BVB, so Borussia
Dortmund, the second-biggest team in Germany. They are a top 15
biggest club in the world in global soccer, home to many iconic
American soccer players, and what the club wants to do over here in the
United States is really connect to them on day-to-day basis, which we
can go ahead and do on BlackYellow, the English language, social
channels, which we run here at Sportfive and have done so for a few
years now.

“And while [social] is an amazing place to create everyday touchpoints
with them, we also need to have that physical compliment. So a very real
example is just a couple of weeks ago, I think September 11th in Times
Square in Manhattan, we put on a popup event with Street Soccer USA,
[an] amazing organization that was looking to give back to the
community through soccer. It was this amazingly powerful event that
had some of the key stakeholders in the New York Metro market come
in, play soccer for a good cause and create an unbelievable atmosphere
for fans of the club to come together and watch this tournament while
also being able to go ahead and support the club they love.

“This is just such an interesting touchpoint for someone who has only
experienced the club in a digital format, and flying over to Germany may
seem like such an incomprehendable idea that being able to have this
kind of middle ground allows them to develop that inroad, but maybe
also take that stuff to one day, be inspired to [say] ‘You know what? I'm
gonna go get that passport. I'm gonna go book those flights and I'm
gonna find myself a Signal Iduna Park with the yellow wall because how
could I not because I've had everything brought back to this point and I
need it in my life?’”

About what it means to localize a club’s fan development for fans abroad
“It's a really good point because fandom in Germany versus fandom in
the US for BVB — there are definite differences in the way that people
consume the sport or the way that they consume the club, really. And for
us, when we try and think about, okay, how can we try and tailor the
strategy to be a localized one instead of just a generic one, it all starts
every single time with becoming a product expert. That's the only way
we try and think about it. So every single thing we do, whoever is
working on — whether it's a team or a brand, a league, you name it —
they have to know everything there is to ever know about this.

“So the folks who work on BVB on a day-to-day basis, I mean they could
be the club historian. When they join our team, it's probably a hilarious
experience for them of what onboarding is like because of the kind of
wringer that we put them through and the level of depth that they have
to know, because to be able to appreciate the greatness of Marco Reus
right now, or even know how to tailor how much content should be
about Gio Reyna in the US market, you need to appreciate the striked
partnerships in the sixties that formed the fandom that has the older
generation still entrenched with the club and are still loving the current
crop. So they need to know every single thing that there is possible to
know.

“Another client of ours is Flamengo, for example, the biggest team in
South America…When we onboarded with them, if we didn't go to this
depth, we would’ve quickly (had a) problem. Because in social media
and sports, one of the most common things you'll see across every single
feed is a team dropping a fire emoji. That seems inconsequential, like, of
course. Why wouldn't I do that? [But] the case of Flamengo was about
10-15 years ago in their academy, there was a fire and lives were lost. If
we didn't know that and understand how important in the club's history
this fire was, we would've gone and used that. But we know now to never
even think twice about using that [emoji] because it would be insensitive
to fans. It wouldn't feel right to do that. It wouldn't be as if we
appreciated their club in the same way they did.

“So us becoming these product experts, which in the sense is the club
itself and everything that's ever happened with it is for us the most
paramount thing and we use that for the basis of all things that we
consider success. Then that can allow us to be able to tailor strategies
because we know how a fan will think because we've studied so much;
we are as big a fan as they are, if not even more than some fans, just
because of the level of passion that we've committed to become a part of
the history of the club.”

On the varying nature of fandom in different locations
“There are always gonna be similarities that are gonna take up maybe the
majority of what fandom is across different cultures. That's what makes
the world beautiful is that every single location really around the planet
has its own uniqueness to it. And because of that, the fandom is then
defined in a unique way in every single market. Even an East coast fan in
the US is gonna have a different cultural perspective of how they
consume it ever so slightly than say, someone on the West coast. You
wanna watch BVB and a 9:30am kick on the East coast, that’s 6:30am on
the West coast. That's a totally different way of how you're approaching
your weekend the way consuming it and what you're doing after…

“It goes beyond that of American culture is so inherently different than
Chinese culture, German culture, English culture, you name it that is
gonna create these little different intricacies that localized marketing will
always be able, when done right, be able to tap into and make a fan feel
appreciated, which is always the goal. Because people wanna be heard.
We're not here selling pharmaceuticals, trying to drive the bottom line
every single little which way; of course, these are our businesses and they
are big businesses, but they're cultural representations of the local
identity and certain areas. So being able to speak to someone, having
them feel heard, having them feel appreciated is such an important thing
because that's what's gonna turn someone from a casual into a hardcore
[fan], or from someone who is interested into a casual and so on.”

About players being the primary entry point and basis of fandom vs. club
“There probably is a ceiling [to one’s athlete-based team fandom] in
some capacity, but it doesn't mean you can't kinda push through it; it's
one that you can definitely break through. When we think about players,
it's a no-brainer to try and tap into [them] because look at the social
following of players compared to teams and they'll always dominate
engagement and total follower count. So we would be missing the boat if
we weren't trying to tap into the personalities of these players, the
background of these players and trying to use them as brand extensions
for the club. Even if they're gonna leave at some point in the future, that's
okay. They still have their shared history with the entity.

“Of course, there's always gonna be a fine balance with how the player is
performing with, how the relationship is with the club, their relationship
with the fans, et cetera, but that's always something to tap into. For us, the
one thing we always try to keep in mind too is fans are smart. They do
research on their own because they're just excited and interested in the club.
If we were marketing to the US market by just putting Gio Reyna in every
single place possible, we'd be missing the boat because there are people who
became fans of the club because of Gio or because of Christian [Pulisic]. But
at the same time, they're now BVB fans. They love Marco Reus, the guy who
joined the academy at such a young age and has become the face of the club
and is one of the best players on the planet at his peak form. And being able
to tempt into that and the greater narratives is where it all leads to.

“So yes, the player might be a vehicle at the beginning to try and get someone excited
about a club, but it's not the end goal. The end goal is how you turn into a fan of the club
itself. I think a good example is it's not even just the players, it's the people who represent
the club publicly. And when I say that, I mean notable public fans. So when we help the
New York Jets internationalize to the UK market, as they were one of the winners of the
[NFL’s international marketing rights for the UK], one of the first things we tried to do
was work with Christian [Pulisic]. It was a no-brainer. They were going to play in London
right after winning this [and] Christian, the biggest male soccer name for the United
States on the planet plays for one of the biggest teams on the planet in London and the
team was going there — like, Okay, what are we doing? How are we getting Christian to
this game knowing he's such a big Jets fan, even though he's from Hershey, Pennsylvania
and you’d be shocked to know that, but knowing the little detail put us in such a great
spot because now we can work with him to try and communicate the message of the NFL
game of what the Jets are in that market and have this soft entry into potential fans.

“So then trying to collaborate with Chelsea or other Premier League
clubs in the back of it, it all extends…You find those organic touchpoints,
you find the two brothers on the Jets, they are from Birmingham,
Alabama; well, there's Birmingham City, and Peaky Blinders, how do we
try and bridge that gap into something that's more formal between
Birmingham City or between Peaky Blinders because of that natural
connection? So even if it's a very obvious and famous person like
Christian, there's also those kind of more nuanced, less obvious ones
that become those organic touchpoints that can become long term
connection spots that you can then play into and develop as those
extensions of the club.”

On international fans understanding the rules and minutiae of the sport
“If you come across the easy answer to that, please let me know. Because it's not black and
white. It's one of those things that's kind of hard to understand or hard to just wrap your
head around on how youre try to break down a potential answer to it. So when I think
about American sports leagues, not even just the NFL expanding overseas, it's really an
interesting proposition. I mean, what is it, two, three decades ago at this point, NFL
Europe attempted to try and get early inroads over there and it ended up not working out
as well, but then you've got London games going on, you've got other sports leagues doing
similar [initiatives]. But it's interesting to see how it's progressed and I think it would be
incorrect to assume that you can get someone who's willing to open up the rulebook, take a
test, and prove that they have NFL knowledge or NBA knowledge just because they want to
be able to consume the sport better. You have to go step by step by step. You need to get
them on the escalator to fandom and then move them up one at a time.

“So having an engaged social digital feed is going to be the lowest barrier
to entry to get someone to be like, Oh, that's fun. You might come across
maybe that witty meme that you thought was funny, so, okay let me
throw a follow on this account. Now you're paying attention a bit and
because you're not just pandering to the lowest common denominator,
but you're authentically telling the history of the club and then you're
authentically trying to connect through education where you're able to
then help people who are starting earlier in their fan journey to move
up.

“It all cycles together in a way. And when you've got the London game, etc., it just pushes it.
When I think about social, it's like that daily grind, that pebble, if you will, that's just
building up and you just gotta keep doing it day after day after day. You know, you're
looking six months from now, you're gonna be so impressed that you built a mountain of
pebbles, but you shouldn't forget they can have those tentpole moments where you can
build a mountain purely by doing something amazing and massive. And that's what those
NFL London equivalents get to be and you get to see everyone coming out.
“But if you ever go to an NFL game, it's an interesting experience. It's almost like going to
an international summer soccer friendly over here in the States. You go to the game and you
see a jersey of every team. It's a hilarious thing to think of someone who, if you're going to
say a Chargers game or a Giants game, you would never be caught dead wearing a Kansas
City Chiefs or Tampa Bay Bucs one, but because those teams are great, you're gonna see as
many of those jerseys in the stands because for them this is the one touch point that they
have to be able to consume the sport in person.

“So just creating those kinds of tentpole moments that can collaborate
with those pebble ones, so pebbles vs. boulders in a way, it allows it all to
synchronize together. And I know an amazing [example] is the Chicago
Bulls, also a client [of Sportfive]. Our French digital team at Sportfive
recently launch Le Chicago Bulls, which is a French Instagram account
for the organization and it's in an effort to help the club take that kind of
pebble approach day by day by day, build those inroads, develop fans
organically so that way by the time the Paris game comes around next
year, there’ll be this engaged community around the Bulls that will just
be clamoring for this opportunity to finally see them play. And I think it'll
be a really unique experience, and I think it's very clever by the Bulls to
try and create this type of [desire] for them, and it's just the beginning.

“For people who may be wondering, Well, does this actually pan out, like it’s
kind of hard to see the results of this, you only [need to] look at the soccer
organizations from Europe that have spent and invested the most money in the
American market over the past 10 to 15 years — there is a direct correlation
with the most popular clubs over here. Yes, of course you can’t pull out every
single little detail so you know 100% truly it's because of the marketing
investment, because of course Liverpool has done amazing in the past couple of
years so of course they're gonna have more fans, but at the same time when you
see that true commitment to the market over a long time horizon, you're able to
see the results pop up. And when you can get in before other people are in there
and sweep up the market before others have a chance to saturate it, you're
gonna be positioned for the long term. There's no other time than really when
it's a blue ocean compared to a red ocean for market acquisition.”

On balancing a social and content strategy to reach and engage new fans vs. serving
existing fans and increasing avidity
“That diversity and content mix is so essential, so it's great you brought it up. For us, it
goes back to the point I made before — it all starts with education. You have to know
every little thing there yourself, possibly know more about the club you work for, the
league you work for the brand, you work for, whoever it may be — and this will put you
in a position so you can understand how you should be communicating to, yes, your
hardcore fans, but also the wider mass market where if something pops off through
virality by getting pickup on the ‘For You’ page [or] by people just logging on Twitter
and smashing retweet there's that ability to understand, okay, this is gonna go over
with both demographics. Or you can play into that nuance of like, okay, I know how the
hardcore fans are gonna react to this and they're gonna react positively, but I also know
that new fans or potential new fans will be curious by it and want to engage more.

“So it's all about being able to understand to an insane person's level of
knowledge your client so much that you can then tailor that content mix,
what your content pillars are gonna be, how much you double down on
one versus the other on a certain day of the week based on the
performance, based on players and what they're doing on the field, etc.
So it's a huge map of millions of little pieces moving together,
sometimes not in the way you like, but moving together and you have to
kind of see how this is reacting in real-time and plug and play them as
you need.”

On the end game and revenue goals for international fans
“So if you asked this today versus 10 years from now, five years from now, I
guarantee these answers will be a bit different. But at the moment I would say it's
interesting. You're gonna have different product offerings that you're gonna have
to try and monetize yourself in an international market versus one in person
because you can't, like you said, rely on the default of ticket sales and you can't
then create a different type of ticket package to get people to go to more games or
upgrade to better seats and so on. So you have to get a bit more creative. So I
think merch is a very obvious one where people kinda lean into it; like, if we build
more fans, we can sell more jerseys at a higher margin and connect with people
on an ongoing basis, because then they also have that very physical
representation of the club with them, literally touching them when they wear it.

“So merch is a very obvious one, but it goes further. It goes into the idea
of yes, being able to actually get fans to fly over, whether it be in groups
or on their own and so on. It goes back to you drive more fans, you are
able to get more people to watch. So it's like a Trojan horse a bit — more
people watching means more broadcasters want it, more broadcasters
wanna pay more for it, and the leagues are able to sell their rights for
more money to trickle down to the different clubs. There's a very cyclical
effect to that, so that's another key one I would say, when you're trying
to make these investments in different markets and that it funnels into.

“The one that's interesting that we'll see how it kind of plays out in the next 5,
10, 15, 20 years is everything blockchain-related. Blockchain technology and
what's based on there is going to be very interesting on how it develops,
changes the way that people interact online or in online environments because
you are going into a world where you can have proof of ownership, whether it
may be, I don't think the future version is a simple JPEG that is on blockchain,
but that idea of being able to now own something and you can more clearly
represent your digital personality that can follow you anywhere you go just like
you can do in the physical world, will be a really interesting development in
how it's monetized and grows and is going to be something I cannot predict,
I'm far too dumb to be able to see that. But I think I've understood enough from
being deep in the space for about two years now it's happening whether or not
people like it and just the way it's gonna manifest itself is a bit TBD.”

Harry’s favorite memory of working with Duquesne soccer
“So this is not a part of the normal day-to-day responsibilities I would've
had but of course in sports, you wear a lot of hats. There was a day when
our PA announcer called in sick like 30 minutes or an hour before the
game and that left only a couple individuals who could announce the
game that day. So I quickly volunteered because when else would I have
this chance to do it? And I got to announce a game in my junior year of
college, and I went a little aggressive and gave the full-length goal calls
whenever there were goals, which was not the normal thing to do, and
everyone was a little bit confused in the stands, but I had fun and I think
everyone else enjoyed it at least.”

The lesson[s] Harry learned from working at Avis Car Rental during his
undergrad in college
“Working at a rental car company, I would say first and foremost, next
time you rent a car, just be actually nice to them because I can promise
you they're having a tough day back there. I worked at Avis to make
some cash when in I was in college given that I had two other
internships in sports and both were unpaid. I did it just for money, but I
learned a lot during that time. There were some amazing, hilarious
stories, which I can tell you another time, but the biggest learnings I
had, I would say it's probably two.

“One is the very simple and obvious thing of just be nice to people. Like, it's not that
hard to be nice to someone. The amount of times where someone would come and
they would have a series of demands — because renting a car requires a lot of
information about someone and doesn't always pass the tests that a car company
needs, so it leaves a very serious, uncomfortable moment for some people. And
when it becomes aggressive trying to attack someone, yes, there are definitely
moments where people try to grab things out of your hand or shout at you, scream
at you, curse at you — just in those moments, remember that when people are nice
to you, reward them because they are being a good human. And that's what life is
about, caring for others, being there for them, and appreciating them. So it
definitely helped to keep that in mind. And whenever now I'm at a car place or any
customer service interaction, that is always in the back of my head because it's so
important. Because I know the call before that was such a tough one, that someone
did not give them the time, desire, did not give them the appreciation they deserved.

“But the other [lesson] is I guess in a Mr. Miyagi-type sense and that's that you
always dry the car from the top down. So like wax on, wax off a bit. But it's an
idea of work with gravity, and I think it's like a metaphor for life in a way to
work with the tide, work with the way things are flowing where if you try and
dry that car, which I did many times at the beginning, from the bottom up
because you're already crouching at that point — all you have to do is go and do
it again then because by the time you get higher up and you get around the car,
the water from the top of the vehicle has now dripped down and you gotta go do
it all over again.
“So taking the time to dry it from the top down instead of bottom up was
literally a life-changing moment for becoming a car washer and in a way, and
yeah, I think it has interesting parallels to life.”

The MLS team besides the Crew whose marketing or digital strategy Harry most
admires and why
“So I think there are a few teams that do a really good job. I think if I were to go
holistic across the board, the one that stands out for me and what I appreciate most
and how they're kinda hitting on every single pillar of the marketing mix is LAFC.
They have such a clear and defined brand, it's beautiful. And like you see that black
and gold you know what you're looking at and you see it come through in every asset
they have. It doesn't have to be so overt that it feels like a brick hit you in the head,
but that subtle nuance with the way they kinda edit their photos in light and the way
they might color grade a video, the way they might focus on a certain shot panning
in a certain way so it has a bit more black in it instead of bright lights of the whites
that’s not as authentic to the brand — all those little intricacies I think are so
interesting and peels over into every little aspect of LAFC material that that exists.

“But I think there are a few others that do cool stuff like that. [Ones that]
come to mind talking out loud, because I definitely have scrolled far too
many MLS feed aggressively over the years, I think of the Galaxy crushing it
in different clever moments. Like, a couple years ago when Cameo was
starting to pop off, the Galaxy hired [then Galaxy player] Mark-Anthony
Kaye and [LAFC commentator] Max Bretos on Cameo to give a shout out to a
player who just won their big soccer game. And the big soccer game person
they were shouting out was like players on the Galaxy. So the Galaxy tweeted
that at full time of a player saying, ‘Congratulations, Zlatan on his big game,’
and they didn't know that because it was through Cameo. It was such a clever
little dig that played into the rivalry and so much, I was floored. It was just
like, sometimes you gotta stand up and applaud such brilliant marketing.

“But the other one I think is interesting too, before I go too far on a
tangent, is Angel City FC. They're like the same boat as LAFC — the way
they've defined a brand and leaned into a clear identity that is not just
color-wise, but also kind of a lifestyle, like believing in equal rights and
female empowerment and championing women has been staggering. It's
almost like, oh, there must be men leading every other team out there as
to why no NWSL team has leaned in so heavy over the years. But how
they've been able to do it has just been so impressive…They should be so
proud. I know they are, but from the outside looking in, I think the rest
of the marketing world within soccer is just like kudos to them because
they've done such a phenomenal job to build a fanbase and excitement,
too.”

On international club accounts activating and expressing values
“Yeah, I think it's really important, but it comes down to, a bit of theme from my ramblings today, is
it’s all about education, you gotta know your history of your club. It would be really off if the club
has had a history of racism issues amongst fans, and then they try and take out of nowhere a stance
on a sensitive topic that's -related to race. It would feel so inauthentic. In that case you need to do
deeper inroads and you're not talking about it [and] earning the right to talk about it in a way, to try
and make systematic and structural changes in society, then you can. But for an organization who
has from day one been committed to those kinds of things — like Borussa Dortmund and through
their Borussia Dortmund campaigns and really tried to own being supportive of everyone in their
community, no matter who they are, what background they're from, no matter what it is. Then
leading that conversation and not just reacting to something is important because in that case,
waiting for it to happen is not doing the right thing. You need to be out there proactively in the
market trying to make changes and instead of just waiting for that reactive chance. So you need to
know everything there is to know so you can know how to make a clean and concise plan. But when
that comes, it'll depend on what the history is and what kind of data is in front of you to make a
decision .”

Harry’s number one general guiding principle or tip for teams seeking to
develop fans globally, in countries outside of their own
“Know your product inside and out. You have to become that product expert.
I don't care if you work in sports; you wanna market Kleenex? I wanna know
every little detail there is to know about a Kleenex tissue. I wanna know why
society at one point started calling tissues in general Kleenexes, like where
did that come from? What led to that moment happening? Like, why is your
tissue softer than Cottonelle or whoever else makes tissues? You need to
know all this stuff so then you can be able to market effectively and speak to
the relevant target markets. And I think that goes for teams. I've said it too
many times today, but it's truly what I believe.”

Besides Facebook, Instagram, TikTok and Twitter, which social platform is Harry
highest on?
“I would consider it mainstream, but you didn't mention it, so I'm gonna use it as
my answer — YouTube. I say YouTube because YouTube, that platform took so
long to get to this point in my mind. But I grew up with YouTube just being a
dominant place where you watch shoes as a kid to Charlie bit my finger to FIFA
YouTubers these days or whatever it may be, and we just go there to consumer
video. We never like think so strategically about to understand what it is. But the
reason Google acquired it so many years ago is because it is a search engine at its
heart. It's the same thing as Google, except instead of producing links, it produces
videos and that type of way to kind of gamify SEO or the ability to connect with
fans in such an organic way where they're not even realizing it is so invaluable.

“And then if you take it to the next level of, like, you can go on Twitter all day, tweet
all day, get tons of engagement, but you know what? It's hard to monetize. You
know what YouTube is? It's easy to monetize. So when you're in Q4 and all the big
Fortune 500 companies wanna spend oodles of money on CPMs, when you have a
YouTube channel that's monetized where you're talking large revenue streams, that
can come in on a daily basis when you've got an engaged fanbase there.
“I don't think actually a lot of organizations have found a way to use YouTube
effectively on a day-to-day basis. There are a few things that we're actually trying to
creatively explore on how to split ad revenue and create content with third party
outlets. But for me, I think this is the one people kind of forget that there is just this
unbelievable behemoth that can be monetized and drive clear effect on the bottom
line, just sitting there waiting to be appreciated. But it's not because it just takes a
lot, so it's kinda just gone by the wayside a little bit.”

Harry’s favorite social media content piece or campaign from his time at
Sportfive so far
“It’s the Hisense campaign we're working on. So they're an official World Cup
sponsor; there are maybe like eight of them that exist because it's such a big
ordeal to be able to take on that opportunity. And for us to be able to work on
the official World Cup campaign for one of the coolest brands that exists out
there and one of the most tech-forward ones, it's just like a dream come true. I
mean, this is gonna sound overly dramatic, but that idea of, like, I've had the
chance to work on my dream book of clients that I was hoping to maybe
accomplish by the time I retired and by the age of 29 I've already had the
chance to do it, it's something that I could try and still pinch myself about on a
day-to-day basis.

“It's not a cherry on top, it’s like a whole other sundae with the cherry on
top be to do it for the World Cup in front of bright lights with everyone.
We have people who will be on site in Qatar working this activation like,
I just didn't think the day would come outside of maybe like, someone
just appeasing me when the World Cup eventually comes to the US and
is like, fine, here you go, you can hang out in your corner and work on
this. But like, to get to do it already and under such magnitude, I’m just
forever grateful for that.”

The best meal to get in New York and where to get it
“As someone who grew up in the New York, New Jersey,
metro area, and bagels coursed through my veins at this
point, I would default to Brooklyn Bagel. That's in
Chelsea and Manhattan. I like their everything bagel
toasted with egg and cream cheese is just like, and of
course you gotta get scallions cream cheese, it is to die
for. But if you want a proper meal, so say it's a little bit
later in the day or you wanna sit down instead of scarfing
down while we walk, or sit at a table on the street. I
would say [sic], also in Chelsea…that just opened; like a
Michelin star chef opened a pizza joint that like has this
open-air fire, brick oven pizza. I mean, I left 10 pounds
heavier and I was never more grateful to be able to say
that.”

Harry’s favorite or most memorable thing he learned from his education
at Ohio University’s sports business program
“So, like everyone who went to Ohio, I love that place. I mean a lot. I
definitely am not in the, the shoes I am right now without that place.
And I think in particular, Jim Kahler, who was the director of the
program when I was there; I mean, he did so much for every single
person there. I just will be forever grateful. But the thing I learned,
which, I don't think I went in thinking that — I thought this is the
number one ranked program in the world for sports business. Not
Harvard, not Columbia, not any other Ivy League, but it's Ohio
University in Athens, like, what is going on?

“So I thought I was gonna be some incredible statistician, I would learn through some MBA class or
something else in the textbook, if you will. But I walked away understanding how important people
are around you and good people are around you. It was such an amazing atmosphere to be there and
be around 20 other individuals in my class who were all driven to want to build an impressive career
in sports and change the way the industry is for the better.
“I left there and I must talk to every single person, I think, still, on a regular basis. I'm currently in
Chicago traveling to go to a wedding for a classmate of mine who I lived with in Ohio and when I first
moved to Chicago, when I lived here a few years ago, I lived with her as well. Like to be able to go to
her wedding now and now see a bunch of my old classmates is so staggering. And as a side note to all
that, why people are so important and why it's so important in life to be nice to other people and
appreciate them and care for them is my first job in the industry that was my first real full-time job I
got because there was a woman in a class above me at Ohio who had taken a job in the industry. Her
boss also went to Ohio and his old classmate at Ohio worked at a soccer-specific marketing agency
and was looking to hire someone. So when he told his old classmate, who then told the woman on his
team who was in the class above me, she was like, ‘Oh, well I know the perfect person for you.

“And so through three separate connections at Ohio University that I
had, I'd only talked to one of them before, [I had] an opportunity and
found my way and I was able to take that. And now my next role in the
industry was the same thing — someone I was literally roommates with
in grad school is now my boss. He is one of my closest friends in the
world, and I moved immediately across the country when the
opportunity came to work with him. And it was like, just like being
around the great people who inspire you and motivate you is just like
such a priceless thing.”

Who will win this year’s MLS Cup and Premier League title?
“Both my answers are gonna make me feel terrible on the inside as a
[New York] Red Bulls fan and as a Liverpool fan, I hate to say it, but I
think that [Manchester] City is gonna walk away with the title this year
in the PL. And then for MLS, the Philly Union, I just think they're too
good. Both those teams are just so good.”

Harry’s Social Media All-Star to Follow
“Maybe a different answer than a normal one here, so I'm not gonna shout out, say,
someone who's entrenched in the industry, but rather a creator, someone by the
name of Pablo Rochat (@pablorochat). He must be one of the most creative people
to follow on a platform. He just innovates the way that content is done. It's hard to
kinda say. The things that you forget because you become unconscious about it
when you're posting or creating content, he's paying attention and is taking this
perspective, flipping outside and dissecting it and creating content.
“You're like [it’s] just hilarious because you forget that it's a part of how your
content creation process is. Or the way he breaks it down. It's just like he
understands the human form so well andit's an entertaining style as well as one
that’s definitely inspiring for the next content piece that people look for.”

Where to find Harry and Sportfive on social/digital media
Find Sportfive on Twitter and Instagram @sportfiveagency and on
LinkedIn
Find Harry @HarryMcIntire on Instagram and I think
@MacIntyre_Harry on Twitter.

@njh287; www.dsmsports.net
Thanks again to Harry for being so generous with his time to share his
knowledge, experience, and expertise with me!
For more content and episodes, subscribe to the podcast, follow me
on LinkedIn and on Twitter @njh287, and visit www.dsmsports.net.

Episode 231 Snippets: Harry McIntire of SPORTFIVE

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