1. Transcript from July 11/12, 2011
Debate! Product Management vs. Scrum Product Ownership
Global Product Management Talk with Lance Knight
http://www.prodmgmttalk Subscribe: http://bit.ly/ouZN8J FB: http://on.fb.me/ncKUD8
ProdMgmtTalk Never participated in a twitter chat? FAQs - http://bit.ly/i88OuC Join us!
How to participate in Global Prod Mgmt Talk http://bit.ly/i3f5Q7
ProdMgmtTalk Get ready! Join us at http://tweetchat.com/room/prodmgmttalk automatically appends hashtag
#prodmgmttalk
ProdMgmtTalk Discussion questions from each talk http://on.fb.me/fFRi7b Today’s questions:
http://on.fb.me/qxBWAi
ProdMgmtTalk Please introduce yourself & where you're from when you come in!
Cindyfsolomon This is Cindy, your co-host, tweeting from across the bay from San Francisco
NOTE: Today our speaker @lancedknight is tweeting as @prodmgmttalk today to guarantee visibility!
cindyfsolomon Please follow @lancedknight & @prodmgmttalk to participate in debate
at http://tweetchat.com/room/prodmgmttalk -3:44 PM Jul 11th, 2011
nickcoster Join me for an interesting discussion about the roles of product owner vs product managers
at: http://bit.ly/rkbDJs #prodmgmttalk -3:55 PM Jul 11th, 2011
cindyfsolomon See a list of all the twitter chats: 456 and growing! Twitter Chat
Schedule http://bit.ly/dJVfHk #prodmgmttalk -3:59 PM Jul 11th, 2011
accept360 @lancedknight - go ahead and rock the #prodmgmttalk house! -3:59 PM Jul 11th, 2011
MacMyDay Greetings @brainmates @ProdMgmtTalk @cindyfsolomon @nickcoster@accept360 &
everyone else #prodmgmttalk -4:01 PM Jul 11th, 2011
StacyLeidwinger This is Stacy PM for Vivisimo from Pittsburgh PA, looking forward to 2day's
chat! #prodmgmttalk -4:01 PM Jul 11th, 2011
brainmates Adrienne, Product Strategy consultant from Sydney ready to debate Product Management
vs Product Owner #prodmgmttalk -4:01 PM Jul 11th, 2011
cindyfsolomon Intro speaker @lancedknight: Lance is Senior Director of Global Solutions Engineering at
Accept Corporation #prodmgmttalk -4:02 PM Jul 11th, 2011
VFigatelix @ProdMgmtTalk hello glad to be back!
brainmates @MacMyDay @stacyleidwinger - thanks for joining #prodmgmttalk -4:02 PM Jul 11th, 2011
cindyfsolomon Intro speaker @lancedknight: Lance Knight is Certified Scrum Master as well as Certified
Scrum Professional #prodmgmttalk -4:02 PM Jul 11th, 2011
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2. Transcript from July 11/12, 2011
Debate! Product Management vs. Scrum Product Ownership
Global Product Management Talk with Lance Knight
http://www.prodmgmttalk Subscribe: http://bit.ly/ouZN8J FB: http://on.fb.me/ncKUD8
cindyfsolomon Today's questions are at http://on.fb.me/qxBWAi#prodmgmttalk -4:02 PM Jul 11th, 2011
ProdMgmtTalk Q1 What is the product management role in scrum? #prodmgmttalk -4:03 PM Jul 11th, 2011
cindyfsolomon Intro speaker @lancedknight (as @prodmgmttalk today): started three companies and
brought their products/services to market. #prodmgmttalk-4:03 PM Jul 11th, 2011
ErikaLAndersen This is Erika Andersen from Salt Lake City checking into today's#prodmgmttalk -4:04 PM
Jul 11th, 2011
nickcoster A1) The product manager is trying to create value through the products features. The
interface for this into scrum is the PO #prodmgmttalk -4:04 PM Jul 11th,
cindyfsolomon Hi @ErikaLAndersen ! #prodmgmttalk -4:04 PM Jul 11th, 2011
ProdMgmtTalk A1, Acc to Lance -Role of Prod Management in Scrum - manage upper level features of
the story - interfacing with the customer #prodmgmttalk -4:04 PM Jul 11th, 2011
StacyLeidwinger Hi Erika @ErikaLAndersen #prodmgmttalk -4:05 PM Jul 11th, 2011
ProdMgmtTalk A1: Prod manager is really the customer in the scrum process #agile#prodmgmttalk -
4:05 PM Jul 11th, 2011
brainmates RT @ProdMgmtTalk: A1: Prod manager is really the customer in the scrum
process #agile #prodmgmttalk -4:06 PM Jul 11th, 2011
cindyfsolomon RT @ProdMgmtTalk: Q1 What is the product management role in
scrum? #prodmgmttalk -4:06 PM Jul 11th, 2011
ErikaLAndersen Happy to announce #PCampUtah on Sept 10,
2011 http://pcamputah.org#prodmgmt #prodmktg #prodmgmttalk -4:06 PM Jul 11th, 2011
StacyLeidwinger A1: PM is the VoC - focused on setting priorities & identifying product
need #prodmgmttalk -4:06 PM Jul 11th, 2011
wapolanco Very much so RT @ProdMgmtTalk: A1: Prod manager is really the customer in the scrum
process #agile #prodmgmttalk -4:07 PM Jul 11th, 2011
imusicmash Al from Allegiance.com checking in for #prodmgmttalk , from my shiny new HP Touchpad
:) -4:07 PM Jul 11th, 2011
accept360 RT @ProdMgmtTalk: A1: Prod manager is really the customer in the scrum
process #agile #prodmgmttalk -4:07 PM Jul 11th, 2011
ProdMgmtTalk @imusicmash Welcome! Thanks for joining #prodmgmttalk -4:07 PM Jul 11th, 2011
nickcoster A1) (Thinking of google+ circles these days) The ProdOwner exists in both the PM circle and
the Scrum circle #prodmgmttalk -4:07 PM Jul 11th, 2011
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3. Transcript from July 11/12, 2011
Debate! Product Management vs. Scrum Product Ownership
Global Product Management Talk with Lance Knight
cindyf
http://www.prodmgmttalk Subscribe: http://bit.ly/ouZN8J FB: http://on.fb.me/ncKUD8 solom
on (No
te to Cindy: specify appropriate time for promotions is beginning at 4:55...., unless sponsoring
talk) #prodmgmttalk -4:07 PM Jul 11th, 2011
GnosisArts RT @cindyfsolomon: If you're not showing up in twitter search, follow these
instructions http://bit.ly/kn5C0e #prodmgmttalk -4:08 PM Jul 11th, 2011
brainmates RT @wapolanco: Very much so RT @ProdMgmtTalk: A1: Prod manager is really the
customer in the scrum process #agile #prodmgmttalk -4:08 PM Jul 11th, 2011
MacMyDay A1 PM facilitates discussions & decisions between technical stakeholders & the business
stakeholders #prodmgmttalk -4:08 PM Jul 11th, 2011
ProdMgmtTalk Absolutely (acc to Lance) RT @StacyLeidwinger: A1: PM is the VoC - focused on setting
priorities & identifying product need #prodmgmttalk -4:09 PM Jul 11th, 2011
wapolanco A1: PM is the customer in scrum. Very much a "pig" with dual purpose: ensure req are clear
& remove biz impediments #prodmgmttalk -4:09 PM Jul 11th, 2011
cindyfsolomon Great @nickcoster! A1)In Google+ - ProdOwner exists in both PM circle & Scrum circle
not impossible to do both simultaneously #prodmgmttalk -4:09 PM Jul 11th, 2011
ErikaLAndersen RT @wapolanco: A1: PM is customer in scrum. Very much a "pig" with dual purpose:
ensure req are clear & remove biz impediments #prodmgmttalk -4:09 PM Jul 11th, 2011
rcauvin A1: #prodmgmt role, #agile or not, is to lead the process of making informed strategic product
decisions. #prodmgmttalk -4:10 PM Jul 11th, 2011
cindyfsolomon We're representing traditional product management view, but not the scrum product
owner perspective #prodmgmttalk -4:10 PM Jul 11th, 2011
ProdMgmtTalk All replies so far have been good - These are traditional product manager roles not
product owner roles #prodmgmttalk -4:10 PM Jul 11th, 2011
ProdMgmtTalk RT @rcauvin: A1: #prodmgmt role, #agile or not, is to lead the process of making
informed strategic product decisions. #prodmgmttalk -4:10 PM Jul 11th, 2011
Ycnt_ibdonlyjen Phone charged, on train n ready for #prodmgmttalk. Hi guys! -4:11 PM Jul 11th, 2011
nickcoster A1) I think the ProdOwner is more than just the customer. They represent the strategic
leadership of the Scrum for the biz. #prodmgmttalk -4:11 PM Jul 11th, 2011
brainmates RT @rcauvin: A1: #prodmgmt role, #agile or not, is to lead the process of making informed
strategic product decisions. #prodmgmttalk -4:11 PM Jul 11th, 2011
rcauvin Product owner is not the same role as #prodmgmt role, though there is
overlap.#prodmgmttalk -4:11 PM Jul 11th, 2011
brainmates Thanks for joining! RT @Ycnt_ibdonlyjen: Phone charged, on train n ready
for#prodmgmttalk. Hi guys! #prodmgmttalk -4:11 PM Jul 11th, 2011
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4. Transcript from July 11/12, 2011
Debate! Product Management vs. Scrum Product Ownership
Global Product Management Talk with Lance Knight
http://www.prodmgmttalk Subscribe: http://bit.ly/ouZN8J FB: http://on.fb.me/ncKUD8
accept360 RT@rcauvin A1: #prodmgmt role, #agile or not, is to lead the process of making informed
strategic product decisions. #prodmgmttalk -4:11 PM Jul 11th, 2011
cindyfsolomon Yeah - disagreement! @nickcoster finally - Debate!#prodmgmttalk -4:11 PM Jul 11th, 2011
wapolanco RT @rcauvin: A1: #prodmgmt role, #agile or not, is to lead the process of making informed
strategic product decisions. #prodmgmttalk -4:11 PM Jul 11th, 2011
cindyfsolomon @lancedknight says product owner is NOT the customer, the product manager
is #prodmgmttalk -4:11 PM Jul 11th, 2011
imusicmash @prodmgmttalk PM in scrum, amongst other non-scrum related activities and roles, has
the role of being product owner. #prodmgmttalk -4:12 PM Jul 11th, 2011
ProdMgmtTalk RT @rcauvin: Product owner is not the same role as #prodmgmt role, though there is
overlap. #prodmgmttalk -4:12 PM Jul 11th, 2011
Beta_Boy RT @brainmates: RT @ProdMgmtTalk: A1: Prod manager is really the customer in the scrum
process #agile #prodmgmttalk -4:12 PM Jul 11th, 2011
nickcoster Do we always assume that the ProdManager and ProdOwner are 2 diff
people?#prodmgmttalk -4:13 PM Jul 11th, 2011
cindyfsolomon Welcome @imusicmash @Beta_Boy Today's questions are athttp://on.fb.me/qxBWAi on
Q1 #prodmgmttalk -4:13 PM Jul 11th, 2011
rcauvin Product owner role includes more tactical responsibility, day-to-day prioritization. Still customer
proxy, though. #prodmgmttalk -4:13 PM Jul 11th, 2011
ErikaLAndersen Product owner single wringable neck of project, prioritizes requirements...
See http://bit.ly/AvDJ #prodmgmttalk -4:13 PM Jul 11th, 2011
ProdMgmtTalk Acc to @lancedknight - Product Owner & Product Manager could be the same person
depending on the size of the company #prodmgmttalk -4:14 PM Jul 11th, 2011
VFigatelix @brainmates @wapolanco @ProdMgmtTalk and do we have 2 b experts in#agile 2 be a
customer? #prodmgmttalk -4:14 PM Jul 11th, 2011
rcauvin @nickcoster #prodmgmt & product owner are different roles w/ some overlap. Can be played
by the same person. #prodmgmttalk -4:14 PM Jul 11th, 2011
StacyLeidwinger In my org I am both - it is tough but reality of our size @nickcoster Do we assume
that the PM and ProdOwner are 2 diff people #prodmgmttalk -4:14 PM Jul 11th, 2011
ProdMgmtTalk Absolutely not acc to @lancedkninght RT @VFigatelix - we have 2 b experts in #agile 2
be a customer? #prodmgmttalk -4:15 PM Jul 11th, 2011
imusicmash @nickcoster no, I think PO is just one of many roles a PM has. Should be same person
except perhaps in large co #prodmgmttalk -4:15 PM Jul 11th, 2011
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5. Transcript from July 11/12, 2011
Debate! Product Management vs. Scrum Product Ownership
Global Product Management Talk with Lance Knight
http://www.prodmgmttalk Subscribe: http://bit.ly/ouZN8J FB: http://on.fb.me/ncKUD8
wapolanco Some orgs have a business analyst in #agile who plays the role of prod owner. Further
clarifies reqs, manages comm, documents. #prodmgmttalk -4:16 PM Jul 11th, 2011
MacMyDay A1 PO: on business side & responsible for P&L and/or UX, PM mgmt of disc's & dec's betw
tech stakeh.& bus. stakeholders #prodmgmttalk -4:16 PM Jul 11th, 2011
rcauvin @imusicmash Product owner has a lot of day-to-day tactical responsibilities.#prodmgmttalk -
4:16 PM Jul 11th, 2011
imusicmash RT @ErikaLAndersen Product owner single wringable neck of project, prioritizes
requirements... See http://bit.ly/AvDJ #prodmgmttalk -4:16 PM Jul 11th, 2011
accept360 Great discussion - ProdOwner/ProdMngr on #prodmgmttalk -
http://bit.ly/pYa8yx #prodmgmt #agile #prodmgmttalk -4:16 PM Jul 11th, 2011
ProdMgmtTalk @imusicmash A PO needs to be available for prioritization but Prod M needs to be out of
the office seeking customer input #prodmgmttalk -4:17 PM Jul 11th, 2011
wapolanco @imusicmash @nickcoster Size of the org shouldn't matter. Ideally should be two diff
people #prodmgmttalk -4:17 PM Jul 11th, 2011
cindyfsolomon Q2 If a product manager is acting like a product owner in scrum, do they have time to
interview customers? #prodmgmttalk -4:17 PM Jul 11th, 2011
rcauvin @imusicmash Possible to also perform the strategic responsibilities of #prodmgmt, but demanding of
time. #prodmgmttalk -4:17 PM Jul 11th, 2011
nickcoster imho ProdManager and ProdOwner Should be 2 diff people that work closely together. Just
saying. #prodmgmttalk -4:17 PM Jul 11th, 2011
StacyLeidwinger @imusicmash I disagree it should be same role - PO's must be more day2day where as PMs
can spend significant time in the field #prodmgmttalk -4:17 PM Jul 11th, 2011
VFigatelix RT @nickcoster: Do we always assume that the ProdManager and ProdOwner are 2 diff
people? #prodmgmttalk -4:18 PM Jul 11th, 2011
brainmates Agree but its an ideal RT @wapolanco: @imusicmash @nickcoster Size of org shouldnt matter.
Ideally should be two diff people #prodmgmttalk -4:18 PM Jul 11th, 2011
rcauvin Q2: As I mentioned previously, PO is tactical, #prodmgmt more strategic. Time consuming to
perform both roles. #prodmgmttalk -4:18 PM Jul 11th, 2011
cindyfsolomon RT @rcauvin: Q2: As I mentioned previously, PO is tactical,#prodmgmt more strategic. Time
consuming to perform both roles.#prodmgmttalk -4:19 PM Jul 11th, 2011
MacMyDay @wapolanco @imusicmash @nickcoster But practically it will usually be one person with two
hats. #prodmgmttalk -4:19 PM Jul 11th, 2011
imusicmash Has anyone seen the role of a business analyst or 'jr. owner' as go-between PO and
engineering? #prodmgmttalk -4:19 PM Jul 11th, 2011
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6. Transcript from July 11/12, 2011
Debate! Product Management vs. Scrum Product Ownership
Global Product Management Talk with Lance Knight
http://www.prodmgmttalk Subscribe: http://bit.ly/ouZN8J FB: http://on.fb.me/ncKUD8
ProdMgmtTalk Acc to @lancedknight A2 Prod Manager should be out in the field searching for next features
to drive revenue #prodmgmttalk -4:19 PM Jul 11th, 2011
nickcoster RT @rcauvin: Q2: As I mentioned previously, PO is tactical, #prodmgmt more strategic. Time
consuming to perform both roles. #prodmgmttalk -4:19 PM Jul 11th, 2011
ErikaLAndersen RT @ProdMgmtTalk: Acc to @lancedknight A2 Prod Manager should be out in field searching
for next features to drive revenue #prodmgmttalk -4:20 PM Jul 11th, 2011
accept360 RT @ProdMgmtTalk: Acc to @lancedknight A2 Prod Manager should be out in the field searching
for next features to drive revenue #prodmgmttalk -4:20 PM Jul 11th, 2011
ProdMgmtTalk No acc to Lance RT @imusicmash: Has anyone seen the role of a business analyst or jr. owner
as go-between PO and engineering? #prodmgmttalk -4:21 PM Jul 11th, 2011
Ycnt_ibdonlyjen +1 RT @nickcoster: imho ProdManager and ProdOwner Should be 2 diff people that work
closely together. Just saying. #prodmgmttalk -4:21 PM Jul 11th, 2011
nickcoster I think of this like Officer and NCO (ie sergeant) in the Military. Shared objectives but different
focus. #prodmgmttalk -4:22 PM Jul 11th, 2011
cindyfsolomon Moving on: Q3 If you believe product owners should not be the product manager- then who
should be? #prodmgmttalk -4:22 PM Jul 11th, 2011
imusicmash A2 customer interviewer is just another PM role, just like POis, we wear many hats
:) #prodmgmttalk -4:22 PM Jul 11th, 2011
StacyLeidwinger A2: As someone doing both PO & PM I sacrifice 2b in the field as much as possible or else I
can't set accurate priorities #prodmgmttalk -4:22 PM Jul 11th, 2011
wapolanco A2: Difficult to succeed @ both roles. Orgs save $ w/one body but at what cost? If 1 person, then
reduce prod scope. #prodmgmttalk -4:22 PM Jul 11th, 2011
ProdMgmtTalk Acc to @lancedknight A3: Either a full time analyst or a junior / assoc product manager
should be PO #prodmgmttalk -4:23 PM Jul 11th, 2011
rcauvin RT @StacyLeidwinger: A2: As someone doing both PO & PM I sacrifice 2b in field or else I can't set
accurate priorities #prodmgmttalk -4:23 PM Jul 11th, 2011
ErikaLAndersen RT @wapolanco: A2: Difficult to succeed @ both roles. Orgs save $ w/1 body but what cost?
If 1 person, then reduce prod scope. #prodmgmttalk -4:23 PM Jul 11th, 2011
brainmates +2 RT @Ycnt_ibdonlyjen: +1 RT @nickcoster: imho ProdManager and ProdOwner Should be 2
diff people that work closely together. #prodmgmttalk -4:23 PM Jul 11th, 2011
charlieoliver Fantastic discussion in this weeks #prodmgmttalk, if you haven't already, check it
out! #prodmgmttalk -4:23 PM Jul 11th, 2011
cindyfsolomon Moving on: Q3 If you believe product owners should not be the product manager- then who
should be? #prodmgmttalk -4:24 PM Jul 11th, 2011
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7. Transcript from July 11/12, 2011
Debate! Product Management vs. Scrum Product Ownership
Global Product Management Talk with Lance Knight
http://www.prodmgmttalk Subscribe: http://bit.ly/ouZN8J FB: http://on.fb.me/ncKUD8
MacMyDay @nickcoster Anyone with military #prodmgmt experience here? ;)#prodmgmttalk -4:24 PM Jul 11th,
2011
accept360 RT @ProdMgmtTalk: Acc to @lancedknight A3: Either a full time analyst or a junior / assoc
product manager should be PO #prodmgmttalk -4:24 PM Jul 11th, 2011
cindyfsolomon Welcome @charlieoliver! #prodmgmttalk -4:24 PM Jul 11th, 2011
StacyLeidwinger A3: PO is a new role, jr PM's willing to spend more time with dev or someone with a BA
background could qualify #prodmgmttalk -4:25 PM Jul 11th, 2011
nickcoster @MacMyDay @nickcoster Sydney University Regiment 1991 #prodmgmttalk -4:25 PM Jul 11th, 2011
ErikaLAndersen RT @accept360: RT @ProdMgmtTalk: Acc to @lancedknight A3: Either full time analyst or a
jr/assoc product manager should be PO #prodmgmttalk -4:25 PM Jul 11th, 2011
wapolanco Q3 = Funny... "exact role" ;-) #prodmgmttalk -4:25 PM Jul 11th, 2011
nickcoster A3) If you are 'going agile' then staff the dedicated role. Don't be half agile.#prodmgmttalk -4:25
PM Jul 11th, 2011
brainmates RT @ProdMgmtTalk: Acc to @lancedknight Either a full time analyst or a junior / assoc product
manager should be Product Owner #prodmgmttalk -4:26 PM Jul 11th, 2011
cindyfsolomon Could a Product Owner come from engineering with project management muscles (tactical
details)? #prodmgmttalk -4:26 PM Jul 11th, 2011
brainmates RT @nickcoster: A3) If you are going agile then staff the dedicated role. Dont be half
agile. #prodmgmttalk -4:26 PM Jul 11th, 2011
simplybastow @ProdMgmtTalk Role of prod mgr in Scrum is communicating priorities and requirements.
Asking and answering the right questions #prodmgmttalk -4:26 PM Jul 11th, 2011
charlieoliver @cindyfsolomon Thanks for the welcome, sorry I'm late!#prodmgmttalk -4:27 PM Jul 11th, 2011
accept360 can you be 1/2 #agile? #prodmgmttalk -4:27 PM Jul 11th, 2011
rcauvin A3: #prodmgmt should have talent for leadership, acquisitive & emergent learning, and
teaching. #prodmgmttalk -4:27 PM Jul 11th, 2011
VFigatelix RT @wapolanco: A2: Difficult to succeed @ both roles. Orgs save $ w/one body but at what cost?
If 1 person, then reduce prod scope. #prodmgmttalk -4:27 PM Jul 11th, 2011
cindyfsolomon A3) I've heard it referred to as "Scrum, but" (butt) to do scrum, but not
really.... #prodmgmttalk -4:27 PM Jul 11th, 2011
charlieoliver RT @rcauvin: A3: #prodmgmt should have talent for leadership, acquisitive & emergent
learning, and teaching. #prodmgmttalk -4:27 PM Jul 11th, 2011
ProdMgmtTalk what is 1/2 agile? RT @nickcoster: If you are going agile then staff the dedicated role. Dont
be half agile. #prodmgmttalk -4:27 PM Jul 11th, 2011
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8. Transcript from July 11/12, 2011
Debate! Product Management vs. Scrum Product Ownership
Global Product Management Talk with Lance Knight
http://www.prodmgmttalk Subscribe: http://bit.ly/ouZN8J FB: http://on.fb.me/ncKUD8
nickcoster A3) (cont) otherwise it is like running a 4 man relay with 3 people. You can do it but if won't be
effective. #prodmgmttalk -4:28 PM Jul 11th, 2011
MacMyDay @StacyLeidwinger I would agree that PO needs at least a BA background (resp for P&L), but also
PM insight (resp for UX) #prodmgmttalk -4:28 PM Jul 11th, 2011
StacyLeidwinger If they have an eye for business & cust needs @cindyfsolomon Can a Product Owner come
from engineering with proj mgm muscles? #prodmgmttalk -4:28 PM Jul 11th, 2011
wapolanco A3: PM requires a different mix of skills: Sales, Mktg, Be a visionary and strategic
thinking. #prodmgmttalk -4:29 PM Jul 11th, 2011
StacyLeidwinger Agreed! RT @MacMyDay I would agree that PO needs at least a BA background (resp for
P&L), but also PM insight (resp for UX) #prodmgmttalk -4:29 PM Jul 11th, 2011
cindyfsolomon @lancedknight A3) everybody wants their PRD requirements documents process before they
start going into agile (guarantees ...)#prodmgmttalk -4:29 PM Jul 11th, 2011
rcauvin A3: Great #prodmgmt can come from any background as long as she possesses the
leadership/learning/teaching talents. #prodmgmttalk -4:29 PM Jul 11th, 2011
Ycnt_ibdonlyjen A3: a dev or ba or someone tech respects who wants to move to PM#prodmgmttalk -4:29 PM
Jul 11th, 2011
ErikaLAndersen RT @StacyLeidwinger: If they have an eye for biz & cust needs@cindyfsolomon Can PO come
from engineering w/ proj mgm muscles? #prodmgmttalk -4:29 PM Jul 11th, 2011
simplybastow +1, yet oft the same in small teams RT @rcauvin Product owner is not the same role
as #prodmgmt role, though there is overlap. #prodmgmttalk -4:30 PM Jul 11th, 2011
brainmates RT @rcauvin: reat #prodmgmt can come from any background as long as she possesses the
leadership/learning/teaching talents. #prodmgmttalk -4:30 PM Jul 11th, 2011
VFigatelix @Ycnt_ibdonlyjen hi sweety! What is IMO? #prodmgmttalk -4:30 PM Jul 11th, 2011
saeedwkhan PO shd be part of #prodmgmt team, can be part of Tech. PM responsibilities. #prodmgmttalk -
4:30 PM Jul 11th, 2011
cindyfsolomon @nickmuldoon - join us now debating Scrum Product Owner vs. product
manager #prodmgmttalk -4:30 PM Jul 11th, 2011
nickcoster @VFigatelix In My Opinion = IMO #prodmgmttalk -4:31 PM Jul 11th, 2011
cindyfsolomon @simplybastow @rcauvin Yes, there are some overlaps but PMs should not be running user
stories (from @lancedknight) #prodmgmttalk -4:31 PM Jul 11th, 2011
MacMyDay @cindyfsolomon Can, yes, but also needs to understand and own business side of
product #prodmgmttalk -4:31 PM Jul 11th, 2011
StewartRogers Anyone on team can write stories. RT @ProdMgmtTalk: @lancedknight - Product Managers
should not be writing user stories. The PO should be
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9. Transcript from July 11/12, 2011
Debate! Product Management vs. Scrum Product Ownership
Global Product Management Talk with Lance Knight
http://www.prodmgmttalk Subscribe: http://bit.ly/ouZN8J FB: http://on.fb.me/ncKUD8
ErikaLAndersen RT @brainmates: RT @rcauvin: Grt #prodmgmt come fr any background as long as she
possess the ldrshp/learning/teaching talents. #prodmgmttalk -4:32 PM Jul 11th, 2011
ProdMgmtTalk Acc to @lancedknight Product Managers should be managing features#prodmgmttalk -4:32 PM
Jul 11th, 2011
wapolanco RT @MacMyDay: @cindyfsolomon Can, yes, but also needs to understand and own business side
of product #prodmgmttalk -4:33 PM Jul 11th, 2011
rcauvin @ProdMgmtTalk @lancedknight #prodmgmt should be identifying/managing prospect problems, not
features! #prodmgmttalk -4:33 PM Jul 11th, 2011
cindyfsolomon Acc to @lancedknight A feature is something more than just requirements: Product managers
should be managing features #prodmgmttalk -4:33 PM Jul 11th, 2011
nickcoster @ProdMgmtTalk @lancedknight I think #prodmgmt should be solving user needs via product
features that create value to market. #prodmgmttalk -4:33 PM Jul 11th, 2011
ErikaLAndersen +1 RT @rcauvin: @ProdMgmtTalk @lancedknight #prodmgmt should be
identifying/managing prospect problems, not features! #prodmgmttalk -4:33 PM Jul 11th, 2011
jidoctor RT @rcauvin @ProdMgmtTalk @lancedknight #prodmgmt should be identifying/managing prospect
problems, not features! #prodmgmttalk YES! -4:33 PM Jul 11th, 2011
nickmuldoon I see the PO as a facilitator not just a conduit. The team needs to communicate with the
customer to understand. #prodmgmttalk -4:34 PM Jul 11th, 2011
rcauvin RT @nickmuldoon: I see the PO as a facilitator not just a conduit. Team needs to communicate with
the customer to understand. #prodmgmttalk -4:34 PM Jul 11th, 2011
nickcoster RT @nickmuldoon: I see the PO as a facilitator not just a conduit. The team needs to
communicate with the customer to understand. #prodmgmttalk -4:34 PM Jul 11th, 2011
cindyfsolomon Welcome @jidoctor (Premier female speaker next week re: The Value of Product
Marketing) #prodmgmttalk -4:35 PM Jul 11th, 2011
simplybastow @cindyfsolomon You don't think so? Am doing it wrong then ;) (coming from a startup,
however) cc: @rcauvin @lancedknight #prodmgmttalk -4:35 PM Jul 11th, 2011
StacyLeidwinger RT @rcauvin @ProdMgmtTalk @lancedknight should be identifying/managing prospect
problems, not features! #prodmgmttalk -4:35 PM Jul 11th, 2011
charlieoliver I like it! RT @rcauvin: A3: #prodmgmt should have talent for leadership, acquisitive & emergent
learning, and teaching. #prodmgmttalk -4:35 PM Jul 11th, 2011
cindyfsolomon Welcome @nickmuldoon! #prodmgmttalk -4:35 PM Jul 11th, 2011
rcauvin @nickmuldoon Good point. #prodmgmt as single point of contact w/ prospects is not necessarily the
best model. #prodmgmttalk -4:35 PM Jul 11th, 2011
cindyfsolomon [some skype technical issues - bear with us getting responses from @lancedknight to your
questions & statements] #prodmgmttalk -4:36 PM Jul 11th, 2011
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10. Transcript from July 11/12, 2011
Debate! Product Management vs. Scrum Product Ownership
Global Product Management Talk with Lance Knight
http://www.prodmgmttalk Subscribe: http://bit.ly/ouZN8J FB: http://on.fb.me/ncKUD8
VFigatelix @Ycnt_ibdonlyjen @nickcoster #prodmgmttalk @rcauvin IMO I'm learning a lot! Txs -4:36 PM Jul
11th, 2011
jidoctor #ProdMgmtTalk if the PO is in tech team, then need to defer tro PM as comm vehicle & prob solver,
IMHO -4:36 PM Jul 11th, 2011
simplybastow @cindyfsolomon @saeedwkhan Thanks, and hi all :)#prodmgmttalk -4:36 PM Jul 11th, 2011
charlieoliver @VFigatelix @Ycnt_ibdonlyjen @nickcoster @rcauvin Ain't technology grand! I've learned so
much via these talks! #prodmgmttalk -4:36 PM Jul 11th, 2011
StacyLeidwinger I think all good points for PMs, but I struggle on how POs bring customer voice 2 #agile if
not they r not the PM #prodmgmttalk -4:37 PM Jul 11th, 2011
jidoctor #ProdMgmtTalk and PM is primary comm driver not PO -4:37 PM Jul 11th, 2011
nickmuldoon @saeedwkhan agreed, the PO can still be a product manager. They will be wearing a number of
hats whatever VP they report to. #prodmgmttalk -4:37 PM Jul 11th, 2011
MacMyDay Ideally: yes, practically? @simplybastow @rcauvin @lancedknight Yes there are sme overlaps but
PMs should not run user stories #prodmgmttalk -4:37 PM Jul 11th, 2011
ProdMgmtTalk Acc to @lancedknight Prod Managers work with prospects & customers 2 identify features -A
feature is more than a requirement. #prodmgmttalk -4:38 PM Jul 11th, 2011
saeedwkhan PO is really Backlog Manager for Scrum team. Name is complete misnomer.#prodmgmttalk -4:38
PM Jul 11th, 2011
ErikaLAndersen +1 RT @charlieoliver: @rcauvin Aint technology grand! Ive learned so much via these
talks! #prodmgmttalk -4:38 PM Jul 11th, 2011
StacyLeidwinger If PMs don't run user stories how do u confirm stories match customer
needs @lancedknight PMs should not run user stories #prodmgmttalk -4:38 PM Jul 11th, 2011
ProdMgmtTalk Agree acc to @lancedknight RT @saeedwkhan: PO is really Backlog Manager for Scrum team.
Name is complete misnomer. #prodmgmttalk -4:38 PM Jul 11th, 2011
cindyfsolomon Indeed! RT @saeedwkhan: PO is really Backlog Manager for Scrum team. Name is complete
misnomer. #prodmgmttalk -4:38 PM Jul 11th, 2011
brainmates RT @saeedwkhan: PO is really Backlog Manager for Scrum team. Name is complete
misnomer. #prodmgmttalk -4:38 PM Jul 11th, 2011
Ycnt_ibdonlyjen thx nick! :) RT @nickcoster: @VFigatelix In My Opinion = IMO#prodmgmttalk" -4:38 PM Jul
11th, 2011
rcauvin @saeedwkhan PO owns the product from the point of view of backlog management. #prodmgmttalk -
4:39 PM Jul 11th, 2011
nickcoster In sport we always field a full team with defined positions. Why is it so hard in
business? #prodmgmttalk -4:39 PM Jul 11th, 2011
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11. Transcript from July 11/12, 2011
Debate! Product Management vs. Scrum Product Ownership
Global Product Management Talk with Lance Knight
http://www.prodmgmttalk Subscribe: http://bit.ly/ouZN8J FB: http://on.fb.me/ncKUD8
rcauvin @saeedwkhan Does not own the product from many other points of view.#prodmgmttalk -4:39 PM Jul
11th, 2011
cindyfsolomon Moving on: Q4 What is the exact role of a product owner in the scrum process? (after
answering @StacyLeidwinger quest) #prodmgmttalk -4:39 PM Jul 11th, 2011
saeedwkhan Need to differentiate role of PO with titles of those best fit to do it.#prodmgmttalk -4:39 PM Jul
11th, 2011
ErikaLAndersen RT @cindyfsolomon: Indeed! RT @saeedwkhan: PO is really Backlog Manager for Scrum
team. Name is complete misnomer. #prodmgmttalk -4:39 PM Jul 11th, 2011
nickmuldoon @nickcoster sport analogy doesn't hold, the halfback will sometimes jump in the
lineout. #prodmgmttalk #prodmgmttalk -4:40 PM Jul 11th, 2011
StacyLeidwinger We don't have a full roster budget @nickcoster In sport we always field a team of defined
positions. Why so hard in business #prodmgmttalk -4:40 PM Jul 11th, 2011
ProdMgmtTalk PMs should not write stories RT @StacyLeidwinger: If PMs dont run user stories how do u
confirm stories match customer needs #prodmgmttalk -4:41 PM Jul 11th, 2011
charlieoliver @ProdMgmtTalk What do you mean by 'backlog'? (cc @StacyLeidwinger)#prodmgmttalk -4:41 PM
Jul 11th, 2011
wapolanco PM should manage Themes, Epics. PO/BA should manage Stories, Spikes#agile #prodmgmttalk -
4:41 PM Jul 11th, 2011
rcauvin @saeedwkhan In a healthy org, there really is no single person who owns the product. The team
owns it. #prodmgmttalk -4:41 PM Jul 11th, 2011
ProdMgmtTalk PMs should review user stories RT @StacyLeidwinger: If PMs dont run user stories how do u
confirm stories match customer needs #prodmgmttalk -4:41 PM Jul 11th, 2011
saeedwkhan @rcauvin Agreed. PO owns backlog mgmt and not product. Thus name of role is wrong. Shd be
Backlog Mgr or Backlog Owner. #prodmgmttalk -4:41 PM Jul 11th, 2011
StacyLeidwinger Ok agreed. So by "run" you mean write & define but PMs still review &
adjust @ProdMgmtTalk By reviewing backlog #prodmgmttalk -4:42 PM Jul 11th, 2011
jidoctor @nickcoster #ProdMgmtTalk - hard in bi because of perceived "power" by ownership -4:42 PM Jul
11th, 2011
nickcoster @nickmuldoon Teams can adapt to change, but half a team is planning to lose before you
start. #prodmgmttalk -4:42 PM Jul 11th, 2011
StacyLeidwinger RT @rcauvin @saeedwkhan In a healthy org, there really is no single person who owns the
product. The team owns it. #prodmgmttalk -4:42 PM Jul 11th, 2011
StewartRogers RT @rcauvin: @ProdMgmtTalk @lancedknight #prodmgmt should be identifying/managing
prospect problems, not features! #prodmgmttalk -4:42 PM Jul 11th, 2011
saeedwkhan @rcauvin we are in agreement on ownership #prodmgmttalk -4:43 PM Jul 11th, 2011
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12. Transcript from July 11/12, 2011
Debate! Product Management vs. Scrum Product Ownership
Global Product Management Talk with Lance Knight
http://www.prodmgmttalk Subscribe: http://bit.ly/ouZN8J FB: http://on.fb.me/ncKUD8
jidoctor RT @rcauvin: @saeedwkhan In a healthy org, there really is no single person who owns the product.
The team owns it. #prodmgmttalk -4:43 PM Jul 11th, 2011
ProdMgmtTalk Agree @StacyLeidwinger: So by "run" you mean write & define but PMs still review &
adjust @ProdMgmtTalk By reviewing backlog #prodmgmttalk -4:43 PM Jul 11th, 2011
StewartRogers Yeah! RT @saeedwkhan: PO is really Backlog Manager for Scrum team. Name is complete
misnomer. #prodmgmttalk -4:43 PM Jul 11th, 2011
cindyfsolomon Welcome @StewartRogers (all the greats present today!)#prodmgmttalk -4:43 PM Jul 11th, 2011
Ycnt_ibdonlyjen RT @rcauvin: @saeedwkhan PO owns the product from the point of view of backlog
management. #prodmgmttalk -4:43 PM Jul 11th, 2011
imusicmash Had to step away to groom a story for engineering :) #prodmgmttalk -4:44 PM Jul 11th, 2011
StacyLeidwinger Backlog mgr sounds too project mgmt focus - POs still needs business eye to set priorities
on what is MOST valuable to work on #prodmgmttalk -4:45 PM Jul 11th, 2011
jidoctor RT @imusicmash Had to step away to groom a story for engineering :)#prodmgmttalk LOL! -4:45 PM
Jul 11th, 2011
cindyfsolomon Yes @StewartRogers Acc to @lancedknight :prospect problems become feature/epic
stories #prodmgmttalk -4:45 PM Jul 11th, 2011
VFigatelix @rcauvin @ProdMgmtTalk @lancedknight but PM needs 2 have an opinion on
features #prodmgmt #prodmgmttalk -4:46 PM Jul 11th, 2011
nickcoster I see backlog grooming as the Activity of the PO, but the Goal is to ensure business priorities are
met by Agile Project #prodmgmttalk -4:46 PM Jul 11th, 2011
cindyfsolomon Reposting Q4 What is the exact role of a product owner in the scrum
process? #prodmgmttalk -4:46 PM Jul 11th, 2011
StacyLeidwinger RT @nickcoster backlog grooming as the Activity of the PO, but the Goal is 2 ensure biz
priorities are met by Agile Project #prodmgmttalk -4:47 PM Jul 11th, 2011
ProdMgmtTalk Q5: What are the downfalls of the product owner and product manager being one and
the same? #prodmgmttalk -4:47 PM Jul 11th, 2011
brainmates RT @nickcoster: I see backlog grooming as Activity of PO, but Goal is to ensure business
priorities are met by Agile Project #prodmgmttalk -4:48 PM Jul 11th, 2011
rcauvin @VFigatelix Opinion on features is fine, but features encroach into design, which is
not #prodmgmt focus. #prodmgmttalk -4:48 PM Jul 11th, 2011
saeedwkhan @rcauvin we are in agreement on ownership (or lack thereof)#prodmgmttalk -4:48 PM Jul 11th,
2011
nickcoster A5) That person will only be able to give full focus to one role at a time. The other role will suffer
or both will. #prodmgmttalk -4:49 PM Jul 11th, 2011
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13. Transcript from July 11/12, 2011
Debate! Product Management vs. Scrum Product Ownership
Global Product Management Talk with Lance Knight
http://www.prodmgmttalk Subscribe: http://bit.ly/ouZN8J FB: http://on.fb.me/ncKUD8
nickmuldoon @ProdMgmtTalk You can easily be pulled in two different directions when wearing the PM and
PO hat. Sales vs CSat for instance. #prodmgmttalk -4:49 PM Jul 11th, 2011
StacyLeidwinger A5: As both stuck in day2day and focus too much on what is possible 2do not what
customers want solution 2do #prodmgmttalk -4:49 PM Jul 11th, 2011
cindyfsolomon Acc to @lancedknight the Product Manager (my interpretation) both roles important, product
manager higher status.... #prodmgmttalk -4:49 PM Jul 11th, 2011
imusicmash A4 PO serves the scrum master by preparing the backlog, getting obstacles out of the way,
simplifying #prodmgmttalk -4:49 PM Jul 11th, 2011
brainmates RT @nickcoster: A5) While focused on Project, you lose sight of market changes that may make
the product irrelevant. #prodmgmttalk -4:51 PM Jul 11th, 2011
ProdMgmtTalk A5: Acc to @lancedknight If PM & PO same role will have a lack of customer
focus. #prodmgmttalk -4:49 PM Jul 11th, 2011
cindyfsolomon Acc to @lancedknight - we all get it as product managers - we don't need to get to
Q6 #prodmgmttalk -4:50 PM Jul 11th, 2011
ProdMgmtTalk 10 minutes left to our weekly discussion. #prodmgmttalk -4:50 PM Jul 11th, 2011
nickcoster A5) While focused on Project, you lose sight of market changes that may make the product
irrelevant. #prodmgmttalk -4:50 PM Jul 11th, 2011
saeedwkhan @stacyleidwinger I'm open to suggestions for a better title but Product Owner has to
go. #prodmgmttalk -4:50 PM Jul 11th, 2011
ErikaLAndersen RT @nickcoster: A5) While focused on Project, you lose sight of market changes that may
make the product irrelevant. #prodmgmttalk -4:50 PM Jul 11th, 2011
brainmates RT @nickcoster: A5) While focused on Project, you lose sight of market changes that may make
the product irrelevant. #prodmgmttalk -4:51 PM Jul 11th, 2011
StacyLeidwinger +1 RT @nickcoster While focused on Project, you lose sight of market changes that may
make the prod irrelevant #prodmgmttalk -4:52 PM Jul 11th, 2011
MacMyDay Yep and P&L @StacyLeidwinger POs still need business eye to set priorities#prodmgmttalk -4:52
PM Jul 11th, 2011
rcauvin A5: Risk of strategy vacuum or uninformed strategy, or risk of day-to-day execution getting short-
changed. #prodmgmttalk -4:52 PM Jul 11th, 2011
ProdMgmtTalk Disagree acc to lance - term so widely used @saeedwkhan@stacyleidwinger - Product Owner
title has to go. #prodmgmttalk -4:52 PM Jul 11th, 2011
jidoctor Interesting how we all agree that we need both PO & PM roles, but can't agree on name and/or
responsibility lines. #ProdMgmtTalk -4:53 PM Jul 11th, 2011
ProdMgmtTalk Acc to @lancedknight POs should not have P&L responsibility. Product Managers
should #prodmgmttalk -4:54 PM Jul 11th, 2011
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14. Transcript from July 11/12, 2011
Debate! Product Management vs. Scrum Product Ownership
Global Product Management Talk with Lance Knight
http://www.prodmgmttalk Subscribe: http://bit.ly/ouZN8J FB: http://on.fb.me/ncKUD8
ErikaLAndersen RT @jidoctor: Interesting how we all agree we need both PO & PM roles, but can't agree on name
and/or responsibility lines. #prodmgmttalk -4:54 PM Jul 11th, 2011
brainmates RT @jidoctor: Interesting how we all agree that we need both PO & PM roles, but cant agree on name
&/or responsibility lines. #prodmgmttalk -4:54 PM Jul 11th, 2011
rcauvin Missing from this discussion: how #prodmgmt & PO must coordinate for iterative feedback loops that
inform requirements.#prodmgmttalk -4:55 PM Jul 11th, 2011
ProdMgmtTalk Acc to @lancedknight - Each company needs to find their own
way... @ErikaLAndersen @jidoctor #prodmgmttalk -4:55 PM Jul 11th, 2011
nickmuldoon RT @rcauvin: @nickmuldoon Good point. #prodmgmt as single point of contact w/ prospects is not
necessarily the best model. #prodmgmttalk -4:57 PM Jul 11th, 2011
nickcoster RT @rcauvin: Missing from this discussion: how #prodmgmt & PO must coordinate for iterative feedback
loops that inform requirements. #prodmgmttalk -4:57 PM Jul 11th, 2011
imusicmash We're hiring a PM (who can also be PO) reporting, analytics, data viz background a must. Please pass
on http://bit.ly/i9LqYM #prodmgmttalk -4:57 PM Jul 11th, 2011
cindyfsolomon Acc to @lancedknight re:@StacyLeidwinger Ken Schwaber, Scrum founder, disagree w/key to agile
is 1 person & title has to go #prodmgmttalk -4:57 PM Jul 11th, 2011
StacyLeidwinger Agreed, it is hard why often same person @rcauvin Missing is how#prodmgmt & PO coordinate
iterative feedback requirements #prodmgmttalk -4:58 PM Jul 11th, 2011
cindyfsolomon Please blog about your insights to today's talk to be reposted
athttp://www.prodmgmttalk.com #prodmgmttalk -4:58 PM Jul 11th, 2011
VFigatelix Have 2 dive out of this great talk! C u next week #prodmgmt #prodmgmttalk -4:58 PM Jul 11th, 2011
cindyfsolomon Thank you @lancedknight for an excellent debate today! Everyone's participation
appreciated! #prodmgmttalk -4:58 PM Jul 11th, 2011
StewartRogers Slide to easier tactical activities. RT @ProdMgmtTalk: Q5: What are the downfalls of the PO and PM
being one and the same? #prodmgmttalk -4:58 PM Jul 11th, 2011
rcauvin @imusicmash Buckingham & Coffman say hire people based on talent, not so much for
experience. http://bit.ly/dAitdw #prodmgmttalk -4:58 PM Jul 11th, 2011
ProdMgmtTalk Final words fr @lancedknight - This debate must continue... Each company needs to define this for
themsleves #prodmgmttalk -4:58 PM Jul 11th, 2011
MacMyDay @saeedwkhan @stacyleidwinger And Backlog Manager sounds a bit dodgy + might not really say all
about the role #prodmgmttalk -4:58 PM Jul 11th, 2011
cindyfsolomon Join us next week for our premier female speaker: Jennifer Doctor@jidoctor on The Value of
Product Marketing #prodmgmttalk -4:59 PM Jul 11th, 2011
cindyfsolomon Happy to announce #PCampUtah on Sept 10, 2011http://pcamputah.org #prodmgmttalk -4:59
PM Jul 11th, 2011
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15. Transcript from July 11/12, 2011
Debate! Product Management vs. Scrum Product Ownership
Global Product Management Talk with Lance Knight
http://www.prodmgmttalk Subscribe: http://bit.ly/ouZN8J FB: http://on.fb.me/ncKUD8
cindyfsolomon Join me on Google+ for Global Product Management Talk Circle & trying out video
chat #prodmgmttalk -4:59 PM Jul 11th, 2011
StacyLeidwinger RT @ProdMgmtTalk Final words fr @lancedknight - This debate must continue... Each
company needs to define this for themsleves #prodmgmttalk -4:59 PM Jul 11th, 2011
cindyfsolomon Unedited transcript available immediately athttp://bit.ly/pnF8SG #prodmgmttalk -4:59 PM Jul
11th, 2011
rcauvin RT @cindyfsolomon: Join us next week for our premier female speaker: Jennifer Doctor @jidoctor on
The Value of #prodmktg #prodmgmttalk -4:59 PM Jul 11th, 2011
ErikaLAndersen RT @cindyfsolomon: Join us next week for our premier female speaker: Jennifer
Doctor @jidoctor The Value of Product Marketing #prodmgmttalk -5:00 PM Jul 11th, 2011
ProdMgmtTalk Plug in for Product Camp Melbourne 20 August
2011http://pcampmelbourne.com/ #pcampmelb #prodmgmttalk -5:00 PM Jul 11th, 2011
saeedwkhan @stacyleidwinger bcuz 1 person almost never 'owns' priorities. Scrum needs to acknowledge
that. PO is a bad role title #prodmgmttalk -5:01 PM Jul 11th, 2011
MacMyDay @jidoctor It's probably because we all have different organisational setups, but yes it's
interesting #prodmgmttalk -5:01 PM Jul 11th, 2011
ProdMgmtTalk Thanks guys. Great chat. Speak next week. #prodmgmttalk -5:01 PM Jul 11th, 2011
ErikaLAndersen Thanks all! #prodmgmttalk
cindyfsolomon Unedited transcript from today's talk (read from bottom up) July 11 transcript
cleaning http://bit.ly/pnF8SG #prodmgmttalk -5:05 PM Jul 11th, 2011
saeedwkhan @stacyleidwinger. See here http://tinyurl.com/3o7ujjr #prodmgmttalk -5:05 PM Jul 11th, 2011
reorgco RT @rcauvin: @saeedwkhan In a healthy org, there really is no single person who owns the product.
The team owns it. #prodmgmttalk
cindyfsolomon Please blog about your insights from today's talk - summarize salient points from your
perspective or choose 1 issue & rant! #prodmgmttalk -5:08 PM Jul 11th, 2011
reorgco RT @nickmuldoon: I see the PO as a facilitator not just a conduit. The team needs to communicate
with the customer to understand. #prodmgmttalk -5:09 PM Jul 11th, 2011
saeedwkhan Thx all for good discussion and thx to @aircanada for delayed flight that let me participate
in #prodmgmttalk gotta go board now! -5:12 PM Jul 11th, 2011
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