2. Why am I doing this?!
Itʼs an important debate, but also a complex one.!
Itʼs a lot easier to go along with jargon and sound-bites than
interrogate the data, the essays and the facts.!
It seems that a lot of people are doing the former.!
And so Iʼve tried to make it a bit more lighthearted and bite-
sized.!
Itʼs not perfect, but hopefully it helps having a proper look at
all this a little bit easier.!
3. Me!
Iʼve spent half my career in agencies that primarily
deal in “engagement”!
And in making this
thing, Iʼve also
plundered
enormously from
Martin Weigel, Ed
Booty and Bob
Hoffman..!
Iʼve spent half my career in agencies that primarily
deal in “interruption”!
Iʼm trying to be fair from the start…!
4. Both interruption and engagement are confusing
words.!
Couldnʼt both be interruptive?!
Couldnʼt both be engaging?!
Whatʼs the meaningful distinction?!
6. Engagement marketing is a marketing
strategy that directly engages consumers
and invites and encourages consumer to
participate in the evolution of a brand.
Advertising, in its purest form, is just Rather than looking at consumers as
getting attention ! passive receivers of messages,
engagement marketers believe that
Alex Bogusky consumers should be actively involved in
the production and co-creation of
marketing programs, developing a
relationship with the brand.
Frederic
P
Miller,
Agnes
F
Vandome,
John
McBrewster
h9p://books.google.nl/books?id=__1fYgEACAAJ&hl=nl&sitesec=reviews
7. The difference!
Interruption: ! Engagement:!
Marketing that Marketing that
communicates to its communicates to its
audience via audience via
projecting a something that people
message to people.! participate with.!
8. The definition!
Interruption: ! Engagement:!
Marketing that is Marketing that is
fundamentally fundamentally
one-way! two-way!
9. Big brands need to communicate to significant
numbers of people in order to grow.!
This is a comparison of communication.!
Iʼm not talking about improving the product, or
the necessary conversion or service tools like
websites, or shops.!
Iʼm just asking:!
Which is a more effective means for big brands
to market to significant numbers of people?!
12. Sometimes, the people who believe in two-way marketing
can come across as a bit self-righteous!
“Interruption marketing is doomed as a mass communication tool”!
“Everyone wants a conversation. They want inspiration. Inspire people with your
website. Donʼt just interrupt, but interact. Asking about Return on Investment is the
wrong question today. You should be asking about Return on Involvement”!
“Many people in traditional marketing roles and organizations may not realize
theyʼre operating within a dead paradigm”!
“Interruption Marketing leaves a bad taste in the mouths of your target audience”!
“And spending millions feels good. Seeing your billboard downtown, or your
commercial on television seems like a strategic win. At least youʼre doing
something, right?”!
Sources are sometimes in the appendix!
13. But we all have the same end!
Making a business richer.!
Brands are not altruistic champions of the people. !
They are businesses.!
14. Whether you impact people with a one-way
message, or a two-way idea, itʼs not, primarily, for
the benefit of people.!
Itʼs about creating something that steals into
human attention / action for the benefit a brand*!
*Thatʼs not necessarily evil, although it often is – but thatʼs for another debate!
18. Yes. Itʼs a whipping boy.!
But in terms of a two-way marketing replacing one-way marketing,
PEPSI refresh is a robust example:!
BIG BRAND! +! $20m SPEND!
2009: Pepsi spend the $20m on one-way Superbowl ads !
2010: Pepsi spend the $20m on a two-way campaign and actually
GAVE THE MONEY AWAY TO GOOD CAUSES. !
19. It didnʼt work.! TheW StreetJournal reported that Pepsi-Cola and Diet Pepsi had each
a!
lost about 5% of their market share in the past year. $
For the Pepsi-Cola brand alone this represents a loss of over $350 million. $
For both brands, the loss is probably something in the neighborhood of
400 million to half-a-billion dollars.$
For the first time ever Pepsi-Cola has dropped from its traditional
position as the number two soft drink inAmerica to number three
(behind Diet Coke.)$
In 2010, Pepsi's market share erosion accelerated by 8 times compared to
the previous year.$
Source: Wall Street Journal andAdcontrarian – see appendix!
20. 80+ million votes registered; almost 3.5 million "likes" on
the Pepsi Facebook page; and almost 60,000 Twitter
followers arenʼt enough.!
These numbers arenʼt that big really…!
3.5 million fans arenʼt so relevant when your competitor
serves Americans 335 million drinks every day.!
Source: See appendix!
21. A few killer stats…!
Of 200 brands studied, Ehrenberg-Bass have shown that
on average less than 0.5% of Facebook fans engage with
the brand they are fans of. Only 10% of brands manage to
get over the 1% of fans engaging mark.!
80% of branded apps get less than 1,000 downloads, and
most have barely any active users.!
50% of click-throughs on online ads come from the same
6% of people, who tend to come from low income groups.!
Sources: See appendix!
22. Sure there have been a few
awards.
But the transformational
effectiveness case studies for
two-way campaigns are
conspicuously lacking.!
23. There are too many of these instead*!
*This is lazy, and naughty. More on this later."
24. Time to face facts!
TWO-WAY MARKETING
ANYWHERE NEAR
AS AMAZINGLY AS
IT SAID IT WOULD
25. It is of course also true that people are also pre-
disposed to reject one-way marketing.!
And indeed, they do. !
Dave Trott tells us that of the £18.3 billion spent on
advertising in the UK last year, 89% is not even
noticed or remembered. 7% is remembered
negatively, leaving 4% to be remembered positively.!
Looking at some of the work, Steve Henryʼs
anecdote that the average return on a UK advertising
pound is 56p seems plausible.!
26. But the recent success stories are
there for all to, robustly, see!
Hovis – 2010 IPA Grand Prix!
Chrysler – 2012 Grand Effie!
Johnnie Walker – 2008 IPA Grand Prix!
The list goes on… Audi, Old Spice, Bravia,
Compare the Meerkat (Go Compare, even), O2,
Ovaltine…!
27. 250 Case Studies from the last 7 years:
Traditional “one-way” fares pretty well Vs.
“two-way”!
Putting the models to the test: IPAdataMINE 2011!
28. One-way Vs Two-way!
Is there a moral difference? No.!
Which is more effective? One-way. Often.!
Why?!
29. One-way Vs Two-way!
Is there a moral difference? No.!
Which is more effective? One-way. Often.!
Why?!
31. I can remember watching a
football match at University.!
When the ad break came on,
the Cadburyʼs Gorilla advert
started to play. People actually
“shussshed” other people. !
The bar was quieter than at
any other point in the
afternoon. !
People watched with real
anticipation, genuinely
entertained – made happy
even. Some remarked upon
how good it was, and then they
went on with their day. !
That was the moment I
decided I might be ok with
working for brands. !
36. 1. People donʼt care.
Especially about brands.
One-way marketing doesnʼt rely on
them caring much.
Two-way marketing does.!
37. Anyone who has ever
contemplated getting a
much-loved picture framed,
or going to a colleague-
that-we-actually-got-on-
well-withʼs leaving drinks
on Tuesday night, knows
this. !
We can barely be bothered
to engage in two-way
behaviour with most things
we like and most people
we know. !
38. Only 17% of people in the UK are
“intensely” participating with anything online !
39. Shouldnʼt we consider relationships with brands…!
…as scaled back a thousand times from even this?!
40. Ehrenberg-Bass have shown, across 145 brands
and 13 categories: !
Just 20% of a brandʼs customers hold about 40%
of the image associations. !
The rest of knowledge about the brand is spread
hazily across the other 80%. !
Source: Ehrenberg Bass / Martin Weigel – see appendix!
41. For that 80%, who make or break a business, brands
largely exist as a low-involvement processing
function, that allow us to make easy, safe choices
without the burden of “engaged” thought or activity. !
They are more likely to function as a well-
remembered red berry on a bush than a good friend. !
A light guarantee of reliability and general
favourability, not a deep or meaningful connection. !
42. Most of us are polygamously promiscuous with virtually every
brand we ever buy. !
Why?!
Because not caring is a natural, human way of relating to a brand. !
43. In short, success for most
brands is largely dependent
upon people who would
probably find the thought of
participating in two-way
communication with that
brand quite horrible.!
44. Which feels pretty instinctively spot on!
Think about all the brands that you interact with,
even buy and use, every day. !
When was the last time you wanted to engage in
any two-way interaction with any of them?*!
*It doesnʼt count if you had to do it for your job. !
45. This kind of thing is starting to look a
little bit shaky…!
46. Are there any exceptions? Maybe…!
Thanks, Sell Sell!
47. Nike have done amazingly well to build up
audiences on things like Facebook, and now
spend less pushing out content through paid
media !
48. But at its biggest and best, itʼs still light, one-way
style communication in a slightly two-way channel!
*Yes, I know people have
to seek this stuff out, and
they do like it and share it."
But you have to wonder…"
How many people
explored the tunnels,
compared to the tens of
millions that watched the
film?"
49. Nike are actually quite similar to most brands:
They donʼt benefit to any extraordinary degree from loyal
customers!
Source: Professor Dawes, UK SPORTSWEAR MARKET 2009, TNS Superpanel Via Martin Weigel – see appendix!
50. Because not even most Back of fag packet
customers of the ultimate high Nike calculations!
interest brand are all queuing up
to engage at a deep level. !
Sell 200,000,000 shoes alone per
I love football, and running. I have year!
Nike football boots, and running
Nike + has less than 5,000,000
shoes. ! active users.!
I have watched their films on TV It seems unlikely that deep two-way
communications are driving all of
and online, and enjoyed them.! their success!!
In fact, it seems unlikely that it is
I have never deeply engaged with driving the majority of it.!
Nike though. !
*Iʼm not saying current one-way
communication is either – 30 years of
Iʼd argue that the majority of their great branding, sponsorship,
customers still fall into that camp.! advertising and distribution and some
two-way marketing are, probably"
51. Can push two-way a lot
The real point is that a
further than brands like
rare brand like this:!
this:!
Almost NO brands are like this! AlmostALLbrands are like this!
53. After consulting the facts, and consulting our
instincts, does it not appear that most people,
quite reasonably, donʼt care very much at all
about most brands?!
Therefore, does it not appear that most people
could well be largely pre-disposed to reject most
two-way marketing with most brands?!
54. One-way Vs Two-way!
Is there a moral difference? No.!
Which is more effective? One-way. Often.!
Why? !
1. Most people donʼt want two-way with most brands!
55. 2. Two-way marketing often seems
focused on what some people can
do.
Not what all people actually do do.
Which is doodoo.!
56. Where the heads of the
new marketing gurus
are…!
Where the behaviours
of actual people are… !
Stolen from Ed Booty!
58. A lot of one-way related media still has majority reach!
1981! 2011!
Average Brit watches 4 hours of TV a day. ! Average Brit watches 4 hours of TV a day. !
Favourite British show is a soap. ! Favourite British show is a soap. !
Favourite British news source is The Sun.! Favourite British news source is The Sun.!
Americans get most of the video they watch Americans get 98% of the video they watch
via TV! via TV!
Americans with TVs watch almost all of their Americans watch almost all of their TV live,
TV live! only 7% of total viewing is “timeshifted”!
Americans sometimes make a sandwich Americans with TiVo skip 11.2% more ads.
while the ads are on! But thatʼs only 1.2 and 5.6% of total ads*!
Americans donʼt even know what Americans do 5% of their total purchasing
Ecommerce is! online!
*Americans also still eat sandwiches, possibly more – Other less funny footnotes in the appendix"
59. A lot of two-way related media is still niche!
Non-majority take-up! Not working for marketing!
OR
INTERACTIVE TV! FACEBOOK
Only 5% in the UK have bought it, and less than Almost nobody interacts with brands on
50% of them have bothered to connect it – that Facebook!
leaves almost nobody to even collect data from
regarding interaction with brands!
APPS!
SMARTPHONES! Almost nobody downloads branded apps, or
Even in the US, only 38% of people have the uses them more than once!
Android or iOS phones that can offer good two-way
experiences!
ONLINE!
TABLETS ! Click-throughs are dominated by relatively
11% of people in the UK have them! small numbers of generally less affluent
people. Itʼs rare that large numbers go to
THE NON-FACEBOOK SIDE OF SOCIAL! micro-sites or campaign pages.!
No other network has close to 50% of people on it!
QR!
Do we really need to go there?!
Sources: See appendix!
60. Success for brands comes from
growing with the many, not with the
few!
Source: Charles Graham 2010, TNS Superpanel Via Martin Weigel – see appendix!
61. Two-way also targets the interested minority who
are likely to buy your product anyway !
62. Whilst one-way can impact the disinterested
majority who deliver growth !
SALES! Pantene:!
Sales split by Customer Frequency!
Most sales come from the
most infrequent buyers!
FREQUENCY!
Source: Professor Dawes, 2009, TNS Superpanel Via Martin Weigel see appendix!
63. Which explains why two-way communications
didnʼt work for Pepsi Refresh…
It failed to impact the disinterested majority who
make up the majority of Cola sales!
Source: ByronSharp,HowBrandsGrow!
64. Even great online
products and services that
“engage” people in deep
two-way behaviour every
day are using one-way
marketing to drive growth
via penetration!
65. If weʼre being harsh…!
One-way! Two-way!
Uses mass media! Uses niche media!
to! to!
Give you a shot at Reward small numbers
growing sales with the of loyalists for what they
majority! were already doing!
66. Social media, the internet and technology has changed things for people.!
But that doesnʼt mean that lots of things havenʼt stayed the same too.!
And that certainly doesnʼt mean that the way brands can market to
significant numbers of people has changed overnight.!
67. One-way Vs Two-way!
Is there a moral difference? No.!
Which is more effective? One-way. Often.!
Why? !
1. Most people donʼt want two-way with most brands!
2. One-way can reach and impact the majority!
68. 3. One-way communication has
been practicing making realistic
pitches to large numbers of people
who donʼt care about brands for
years!
69. Maybe two-way marketing is often
struggling because people thought that
it could play by different rules?
It began with a reversal of how weʼd
always thought about marketing.
God knows, weʼve all heard it…!
70. The world has changed. Everything is dead.
The smart people are engaging consumers
with co-creative content that allows them to
share because people are in control of media
which is always on like them and brands
have to move all the time and never sleep and
your handwash product is not a product it is
a perpetual quantum service that the people
want to participate in via transmedia like
everything else and everything has changed.!
71. The gurus who still espouse this make
it all sound so easy…!
"...become social
thru Pinterest ..."
all of a sudden you
become a magnet for
whatʼs hot!”"
Go to the appendix if you donʼt believe me!
72. And then all of a sudden youʼve
spunked a load of money on this…!
76. Surely thinking that people will
ever want to do stuff with brands
will always be a very self-involved,
very unrealistic, very lazy and very
arrogant thing for marketers to
think.!
77. At its best, one-way marketing understands that it makes a
play for attention-lite from a position of enormous
disadvantage.!
It sets out to throw something out to people that is good
enough to overcome the odds so steeply stacked against
it. !
At its best, it remembers that its primary mission, if it is to
have any chance of making any impact, is to win the
precious and rightfully reluctant attention of people by
offering them something incredibly distinctive, beautiful,
interesting, funny, poignant, or all of these things.!
Without asking for something back. !
78. One-way Vs Two-way!
Is there a moral difference? No.!
Which is more effective? One-way. Mostly.!
Why? !
1. Most people donʼt want two-way with most brands!
2. One-way can reach and impact the majority!
3. One-way can often actually feel more generous!
79. REALISM
Accepts that it begins at a position of very great disadvantage!
Is ridiculously mindful of the human disposition to disregard it !
SCALE
Maps to actual, not potential, human behaviours!
Reaches the majority who make or break a brand!
GENEROSITY!
Rewards and entertains people to the nth degree!
Asks and expects as little back from people as possible!
80. One-way Vs Two-way!
Is there a moral difference? No.!
Which is more effective? One-way. Often.!
Why? !
1. REALISM!
2. SCALE!
3. GENEROSITY !
83. Secrets of successful Stumbling blocks of bad
one-way communication?! two-way communication?!
- It recognises that most - It depends upon most
people will never care much people caring about most
about most brands! brands – they really donʼt!
- It works with, not against, - Is often too focused on
the likely human behaviour of possible, not likely, human
most people! behaviour of most people!
- Is extremely generous and - Isnʼt often not being
asks very little back from generous enough, and is
people! asking too much back!
84. The irony is…
That two-way marketing could
probably do better by learning from
the very principles of the
“traditional” one-way marketing*
that it has so often declared to be
dead. !
*The amazingly good examples"
87. REALISM – this wonʼt
SCALE – this might change, a bit
GENEROSITY – this wonʼt!
88. If it is to succeed, two-way marketing will have
to seriously raise its game, and seriously
lower its opinion of itself.!
And it will only do so by following the same,
traditional, paths to success as good one-way
marketing…!
91. Slide 12!
Seth Godin!
Permission Marketing. New York: Simon & Schuster, 1999.!
(I donʼt disagree with everything Seth Godin says. I do disagree with this. I singled
him in the picture because his glasses matched the halo)!
Read more at
http://www.thedrum.co.uk/news/2012/04/25/marketing-dead-says-saatchi-saatchi-
ceo#IVB5r9HUhly5YEqK.99 !
http://www.tumblr.com/tagged/bill-lee!
http://www.prdaily.com/Main/Articles/
Advertising_doesnt_work_anymore_for_your_brand_11895.aspx !
http://www.catalystmarketers.com/tag/interruption-marketing/!
http://www.copyblogger.com/advertising-is-dead/!
98. Slide 58!
1. Ed Booty - http://bbh-labs.com/majority-report-looking-through-the-digital-hype !
2. Ed Booty - http://bbh-labs.com/majority-report-looking-through-the-digital-hype !
3. Ed Booty - http://bbh-labs.com/majority-report-looking-through-the-digital-hype !
4. Adcontrian - http://adcontrarian.blogspot.nl/2010/09/amazing-invisible-tivo-effect.html &
http://www.admavericks.com/2012/05/14/lessons-from-the-ad-contrarian/ and
http://www.scribd.com/doc/92847814/The-Cross-Platform-Report-Q4-2011-Nielsen-May12 !
5. SEE BELOW FOR THE MATHS: Adcontrian - http://adcontrarian.blogspot.nl/2010/09/amazing-invisible-tivo-effect.html &
http://www.admavericks.com/2012/05/14/lessons-from-the-ad-contrarian/ and
http://www.scribd.com/doc/92847814/The-Cross-Platform-Report-Q4-2011-Nielsen-May12 !
6. SEE BELOW FOR THE MATHS: Adcontrian - http://adcontrarian.blogspot.nl/2010/09/amazing-invisible-tivo-effect.html &
http://www.admavericks.com/2012/05/14/lessons-from-the-ad-contrarian/ !
7. Adcontrian - http://adcontrarian.blogspot.nl/2010/09/amazing-invisible-tivo-effect.html &
http://www.admavericks.com/2012/05/14/lessons-from-the-ad-contrarian/ !
http://www.dukeresearchadvantage.com/laura/2010/05/04/tivo-is-not-kryptonite-for-tv-ads-after-all/#more-1166 !
About 35% of households have DVRs. !
They time-shift 5% of the time. !
Total amount of time-shifted TV is 1.7%!
People skip ads while time shifting 70% of the time.!
Total percent of TV ads being missed in America is 1.2%.!
(Ball Uni study actually has the figure at less than 5% of TOTAL viewing shifted.)!
http://www.scribd.com/doc/92847814/The-Cross-Platform-Report-Q4-2011-Nielsen-May12!
Nielsen report above has TVR shifting at 16%.!
35% of people have TVR.!
They time shift 16% of the time.!
= 5.6% of total viewing is time shifted.!
For the 35% of Americans with TiVo:!
Those that do time shift do it 16% of the time, and when they time shift they skip ads 70% of the time.!
So even the TiVo crowd are only skipping 11.2% more ads!!
99. Slide 59!
1. Ed Booty - http://bbh-labs.com/majority-report-looking-through-the-digital-hype !
2. ComScore Smartphone Penetration cut by iOS and Android share of market!
3. Ofcom UK study:
http://media.ofcom.org.uk/2012/07/18/uk-is-now-texting-more-than-talking/ !
4. Sfheat.com !
5. See slide 21!
6. See slide 21!
7. See slide 21!
8. Use your brain! !