Appendix APublic Hearing Transcripts and Written Comments
Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 06                                                    1 1          TOWN OF WAWARSING PLANN...
Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 06 1   FOR APPLICANT: 2         JENNIFER VAN TUYL, ESQ.           Cuddy & Feder LLP 3     ...
Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 06 1   sharp turn, go down the stairs.     The 2   other is here; you go down the stairs. ...
Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 06 2   Fish. 3              CHAIRMAN LONSTEIN:    Give 4   your name. 5              MR. F...
Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 06 4   scopes out on Environmental Impact 5   Statement, is just an outline of it. 6   The...
Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 06 5   the document is now on the web site. 6   Its been distributed to what are 7   calle...
Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 06 7   the Draft Environmental Impact 8   Statement.    So those are the three 9   items t...
Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 06 8   here.     The property entrance is 9   proposed to be off Cragsmoor Road.10   That ...
Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 0610   here.11               That is the long-term12   version of the meditation retreat13...
Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 0611   which is part of our Site Plan12   submission for Phase 1 is the Milarepa13   Compl...
Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 0613   new landscaping to heal any14   disturbance that the land might15   experience duri...
Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 0614   building of the proposed Milarepa15   Center.   It houses the group16   meditation ...
Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 0616   hold 240 people at the maximum amount17   of time?18              MR. CERNIGLIA:   ...
Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 0617   stenographic record. Basically the18   Dharmakaya team is here, John19   Henderson ...
Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 0619   important -- I wont say -- they are20   all very important, but they start off21   ...
Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 0620   Special Permit and this Draft21   Environmental Impact Statement.    We22   will th...
Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 0622               You must give us your name;23   we have to have that for the record.24 ...
Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 0623             I urge everyone here,24   whether they speak or not, to submit           ...
Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 06                                              20 1   is the firehouse, approximately 5,0...
Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 06                                              21 1   such a large corporate campus in an...
Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 06                                             22 1   attorney, and Ive been working with ...
Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 06 1             First with respect to 2   zoning.   The site is in the RC3A 3   district,...
Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 06 1   thoroughly inconsistent with the 2   community character as Jim described 3   and o...
Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 06 2   information is provided to support any 3   conclusions regarding impacts to the 4  ...
Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 06 4   indicating that the water is going to 5   be drawn down substantially. 6           ...
Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 06 5   viewshed impact. Let me say that 6   again.   Completely ignores it.    They 7   go...
Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 06 7   interesting alternative, and clearly 8   one they are not interested in.     The 9 ...
Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 06 8   even larger than it is and more of an 9   infringement on life in Cragsmoor than10 ...
Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 0610   very carefully.    And under federal law11   and state law your responsibility is12...
Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 0611             (Applause.)1213             This lady in the front in14   the pink shirt....
Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 0613   it shows -- first of all, there is14   drawdown of the pumping well No. 1 and15   t...
Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 0614   in that well.15               This is looking at16   production well No. 1, the one...
Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 0616   away the water declines, and then it17   becomes stable for a long period of18   ti...
Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 0617   when the homeowner is using the water18   for whatever, running the dishwasher,19  ...
Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 0619   sitting on top of a mountain.    The20   only water thats there to recharge21   the...
Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 0620               CHAIRMAN LONSTEIN: Excuse21   me, you spoke almost ten minutes.        ...
Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 0622   about 27 feet right there at that23   well.   So I kind of drew it parallel24   to ...
Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 0623                The other point is this test24   was done under optimum conditions.   ...
Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 06                                                41 1   really wants to, if they could ma...
Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 06                                              42 1   very helpful because they are going...
Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 06                                              43 1              MR. BARBOUR:   Im Spider...
Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 06 1   survey had so few species in terms of 2   flora and fauna. 3              If you lo...
Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 06 1   done an assessment in terms of the 2   sites conditions and resources as to 3   the...
Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 06 2   come to a lot of conclusions, but you 3   cant come to conclusions when you 4   hav...
Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 06 4               Also, this hill and the 5   slope below it, Bear Hill, Randy 6   Decker...
Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 06 5   really inadequate identification of 6   species is when you find a species 7   list...
Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 06 7               MR. BARBOUR:   All right. 8   Take two.    I really want to mention 9  ...
Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 06 8   called dilanade. The family, a whole 9   family, this entire family of plant is10  ...
Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 0610   discovery in itself, because its an11   indicator that the habitat, wherever12   th...
Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 0611   bog turtles are seldom found up on12   high mountainous ridges.13               FEM...
Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 0613   Thank you.14              CHAIRMAN LONSTEIN:   Youre15   very welcome.1617         ...
Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 0614   system to turn around, because they15   were the worst.    They were the pits.16   ...
Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 0616   what they do.    Thats what they do.17               MR. LITTLE:    I think youre18...
Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 0617   blocked up for two miles. I got to18   walk with my wife to go to Cragsmoor19   Pos...
Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 0619   pays my taxes and I owe nothing.       It20   is time for the Board to say no.     ...
Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 0620             MS. WAGNER: My name is21   Heidi Wagner.   I am the preserve22   manager ...
Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 0622   Point Preserve and the Shawangunks are23   considered one of the regions most24   i...
Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 0623             The Mahamudra Buddhist24   Hermitage development project is              ...
Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 06                                             62 1   as-of-right development and conclude...
Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 06                                             63 1   perpetuity.   This could be done 2  ...
Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 06                                             64 1   School artists experienced.   Cragsm...
Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 06 1             I can understand why the 2   Mahamudra Hermitage wants to situate 3   in ...
Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 06 1   Grace, and I live in Cragsmoor.       Im 2   in the lower section.    Im at 43 3   ...
Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 06 2   four-year-old child can go out in two 3   feet of water when this occurs every 4   ...
Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 06 4               MR. ROCK:    Yeah my name is 5   Bernard Rock.    Im a year-round 6   r...
Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 06 5   setting of the two National Register 6   listed residential buildings, that is 7   ...
Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 06 7   parts of the DEIS, that later 8   contextual design decisions would 9   mitigate th...
Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 06 8   the integrity of the historic district 9   and the setting of the two affected10   ...
Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 0610   vistas, local ecosystems and11   reforested areas in a pleasing12   balance.   The ...
Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 061112               (Applause.)1314               MS. RADL:    My name is15   Maureen Rad...
Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 061314              (Applause.)1516              I personally welcome the17   Dharmakaya. ...
Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 0614   would have been proposed for this15   hamlet.16               When the center was17...
Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 0616   Cragsmoor Historic District.17               With a project of this18   nature on o...
Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 0617   50 percent. Second, avoid disrupting18   the viewshed from the east side of the19  ...
Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 061920               CHAIRMAN LONSTEIN:     Who is21   next?    This gentlemen here.22    ...
Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 0620   house.     But it is a long story. But21   what I wanted to say is I commute to22  ...
Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 0622              (Applause.)2324              CHAIRMAN LONSTEIN:    Next.                ...
Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 0623   that were brought up tonight. So its24   a difficult position.                     ...
Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 06                                            83 1   it doesnt have to go forward.    That...
Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 06                                              84 1   that it is a problem.    But accord...
Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 06                                              85 1   that the town can go after if they ...
Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 06 1   expansion over the years may be.     Im 2   very concerned about the forest being 3...
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments
Upcoming SlideShare
Loading in...5
×

FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments

266

Published on

Mahamudra Buddhist Hermitage FEIS, A-Public Hearing Transcripts and Written Comments, WSP SELLS

0 Comments
0 Likes
Statistics
Notes
  • Be the first to comment

  • Be the first to like this

No Downloads
Views
Total Views
266
On Slideshare
0
From Embeds
0
Number of Embeds
0
Actions
Shares
0
Downloads
2
Comments
0
Likes
0
Embeds 0
No embeds

No notes for slide

Transcript of "FEIS A - Public Hearing transcripts and Written Comments"

  1. 1. Appendix APublic Hearing Transcripts and Written Comments
  2. 2. Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 06 1 1 TOWN OF WAWARSING PLANNING BOARD 2 ------------------------------------------ 3 Combined Public Hearing on Draft 4 Environmental Impact Statement (DEIS) and 5 Special Permit/Site Plan Applications 6 In the Matter of 7 DHARMAKAYA: MAHAMUDRA BUDDHIST HERMITAGE 8 ------------------------------------------ 910 November 30, 2006 7:00 p.m.11 Town Hall 108 Canal Street12 Ellenville NY 1242813 PLANNING BOARD:14 MARTIN LONSTEIN, Chairman JOHN CONSTABLE15 DOUGLAS HART DANIEL LITTLE16 PAUL LONSTEIN CLAUDIA OBRIEN17 ALSO PRESENT:18 MARYLOU CHRISTIANA, Town Attorney19 DAWN BENEDICT, Town Engineer DAVID STOLMAN, Planner20 BARBARA PAES, Town Clerk21222324 Reported by: KAREN SCHMIEDER, CSR, RDR 2 Page 1
  3. 3. Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 06 1 FOR APPLICANT: 2 JENNIFER VAN TUYL, ESQ. Cuddy & Feder LLP 3 FRANK FISH, Planner 4 BFJ Planning 5 PHIL CERNIGLIA Architect 6 JOHN HENDERSON 7 Dharmakaya Inc. 8 91011 P R O C E E D I N G S1213 CHAIRMAN LONSTEIN: Good14 evening, everybody. I call the15 special meeting of the Town of16 Wawarsing to order.17 At this time will everybody18 rise and please salute the flag.1920 (Pledge of allegiance).2122 CHAIRMAN LONSTEIN: Thank23 you. For your information we have two24 fire exits here. One is here; make a 3 Page 2
  4. 4. Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 06 1 sharp turn, go down the stairs. The 2 other is here; you go down the stairs. 3 In case of fire you do not use the 4 elevators. 5 At this time I will open the 6 meetings. Its a public hearing for 7 Dharmakaya application, DEIS, site 8 plan special use permit. 9 Now, we were asked for the10 Dharmakaya, please, they want to give11 a short ten-minute presentation. So I12 think that would behoove us all to13 listen to them.14 Im sorry for the lack of15 chairs. I didnt realize this would16 be such a big turnout.17 MR. CONSTABLE: Ask some18 people to stand on this side.19 CHAIRMAN LONSTEIN: Yes, we20 should really have some of the people21 stand over here so we dont block the22 door in case we have to get out of it.23 Okay, who is talking on24 behalf of the Buddhist Dharmakaya? 4 1 MR. FISH: Ill speak, Frank Page 3
  5. 5. Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 06 2 Fish. 3 CHAIRMAN LONSTEIN: Give 4 your name. 5 MR. FISH: My name is Frank 6 Fish. Im with Buckhurst Fish & 7 Jacquemart; we are planners who have 8 coordinated the Draft Environmental 9 Impact Statement. And Pill Cerniglia10 is the architect who is going to11 briefly describe the site plan.12 Id just like to take two or13 three minutes of your time -- thats14 it -- to describe where we are.15 Because I think the public sometimes16 wants to just get a sense of where we17 are in the process.18 This is not our chart. Its19 just a chart that we blew up from the20 State Department of Environmental21 Conservation, and it just describes22 very briefly the State Environmental23 Quality Review time frames. Which is24 what this SEQR stands for. 5 1 We were here one year ago 2 today, November 30th, for the scoping 3 session, and your scoping, which Page 4
  6. 6. Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 06 4 scopes out on Environmental Impact 5 Statement, is just an outline of it. 6 The Board took care with the scoping. 7 I know we revised it before it was 8 finalized by the Board. And you 9 finalized it in I believe about March10 of 2006. And then we prepared a Draft11 Environmental Impact Statement, which12 is in this time frame here. Theres13 no real time frame for the DEIS,14 because the Applicant has to prepare15 that. We prepared it and submitted it16 to you June 30th of this year. And17 then you had David Stolman of18 Frederick Clark, who is represented19 here, your engineers review it.20 We have got all of your21 comments, which your attorney22 coordinated. And you initially23 rejected our first draft, if I may use24 that term. And we revised it based on 6 1 comments that the Board made. We 2 re-submitted the document to you. And 3 then in October you accepted the 4 document for public distribution. So Page 5
  7. 7. Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 06 5 the document is now on the web site. 6 Its been distributed to what are 7 called involved agencies, thats any 8 other agency that has any permitting 9 authority over the project. And its10 been -- we made about I guess11 altogether about 40 copies of this.12 So I hope that its been available to13 all of you. Again, its on the web14 site.15 So that is where we are this16 evening. But this evenings hearing17 would be followed by whats called a18 Final Environmental Impact Statement.19 So all of your comments tonight, our20 job will be not to answer them21 tonight, or wed be here for an22 awfully long time, but to answer them23 in writing in the Final Environmental24 Impact Statement. But tonight is the 7 1 night for the public to be heard on 2 three things really. Theres a Site 3 Plan involved, which Phil is now going 4 to describe. Theres a Special Permit 5 involved to allow the use Dharmakaya, 6 a Buddhist Hermitage use. And theres Page 6
  8. 8. Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 06 7 the Draft Environmental Impact 8 Statement. So those are the three 9 items that the public hearing is being10 held on: Site Plan, Special Permit11 and the DEIS. And because the Site12 Plan is important, Im going to want13 to turn this to Phil to describe it14 briefly, and then Ill briefly15 describe the contents of the DEIS.16 MR. CERNIGLIA: Thanks,17 Frank.18 As Frank just mentioned,19 concurrently with the DEIS submission20 were applications made for a Special21 Use Permit, which is under the Boards22 review for the entire use of the23 property. So the first plan that I24 present to you briefly will be in 8 1 regards to the Special Use Permit. I 2 think this is a plan -- if everybody 3 can see it -- that everybody is quite 4 familiar with by this time. 5 Essentially this is the 6 property. Old Inn Road is up in this 7 direction; Cragsmoor Road is down Page 7
  9. 9. Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 06 8 here. The property entrance is 9 proposed to be off Cragsmoor Road.10 That is the main and only entrance for11 this project, other than the Towns12 requested emergency entrance which13 will occur off of Old Inn Road. But14 that will be used only in times of15 emergencies. The site will be16 utilized through Cragsmoor Road.17 The various centers: You18 come in, there will be a welcome19 house. This large complex is really20 not that large. It is a Bodhisattva21 Dharma Center with a green area in22 front. Alongside is four residences23 called Sanga residences. The24 Bodhisattva Dharma Center will be the 9 1 main group meeting place on the site. 2 The Sanga residences will be 3 residences which will house staff and 4 students who will go through a 5 practice of meditation before they 6 enter into the Naropa Center and out 7 of the Naropa Center. So it is kind 8 of a staging area for that. The 9 Naropa Center are these two buildings Page 8
  10. 10. Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 0610 here.11 That is the long-term12 version of the meditation retreat13 experience at the site. It is a place14 where retreats will be for as long as15 three years. So thats why its16 necessary to have the Sanga residences17 as a place where they transition in18 and out.19 Back in this direction, this20 is a well house. Its of utilitarian21 function. This is the guest teachers22 house. Every so many years there will23 be some guest teachers who come from24 abroad and stay here. And then the 10 1 main Rinpoche or teacher for this 2 complex will eventually live here. 3 That is the teachers house. That is 4 the only building out of the entire 5 complex which will have access off of 6 Old Inn Road, no different than any of 7 the residences there now. So it will 8 function just the same. 9 And then the last complex,10 which I will focus on in a second, Page 9
  11. 11. Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 0611 which is part of our Site Plan12 submission for Phase 1 is the Milarepa13 Complex. That has again kind of a14 common welcome house area. It has two15 residential buildings. The largest16 building I brought an elevation17 tonight to show you. Is where those18 group meditations will occur. Theres19 a library and also another residence,20 and then a smaller version of the21 Naropa are the long-term retreats22 behind Milarepa. Those retreatees23 would be in those facilities for as24 along as a month. 11 1 Another thing I would like 2 to point out, the site is designed to 3 try to preserve as much of the 4 existing vegetation and ecology as 5 possible. You can see this green area 6 around here is a buffer area which 7 basically illustrates all the existing 8 vegetation will remain. 9 As with any construction of10 course there is going to be11 disturbances. But Dharmakaya is12 prepared to provide fairly extensive Page 10
  12. 12. Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 0613 new landscaping to heal any14 disturbance that the land might15 experience during the entire buildout16 of the project.17 So again, this is regarding18 the entire buildout for which the19 Special Use Permit has been submitted.20 The second part of that21 application is the Site Plan. This22 is, as I mentioned, the Milarepa23 Center, which is Phase 1. Again, you24 can see the extensive vegetation in 12 1 more detail here. Not only to create 2 privacy amongst, between the buildings 3 but to also buffer what is going to 4 happen here from the neighbors. 5 And if I just might add 6 again, youve heard it before, whats 7 going to happen here is not 8 celebrations, noise. The theme of 9 this is quiet meditation, learning10 through meditation. Which no matter11 how you cut it is a quiet process.12 And then the last board,13 this is as I mentioned the largest Page 11
  13. 13. Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 0614 building of the proposed Milarepa15 Center. It houses the group16 meditation space under this large roof17 area. On this side is a library.18 There is some utility spaces in19 between, bathrooms and utility rooms.20 And then on this side are residences21 for the teachers that will be22 conducting meditation studies in the23 Milarepa Center.24 The idea is to create 13 1 architecture which is consistent with 2 the local area, and use of materials. 3 We have stone, we have clapboard 4 siding. We have very low-profile 5 building massing. So were trying to 6 in all ways possible conform to the 7 existing character of the 8 neighborhood. 9 FEMALE SPEAKER: Whats the10 square footage of that building?11 MR. CERNIGLIA: This12 building is about 6,000 square feet.13 Thats the largest building.14 MALE SPEAKER: In this15 complex that youre having can only Page 12
  14. 14. Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 0616 hold 240 people at the maximum amount17 of time?18 MR. CERNIGLIA: Im now19 going to -- the way the program is20 meant to run tonight, per the Planning21 Board is that we are not going to22 answer questions. We are going to23 listen to your questions. We are24 going to answer them in a formal way 14 1 when we write the FEIS. 2 So the last part of this 3 presentation is to turn this over to 4 Frank, who will talk about some of the 5 planning -- the plan studies that have 6 been conducted. 7 MR. FISH: I just want to 8 briefly mention again, I think its 9 until December 13th, everyone has --10 if you have additional questions you11 dont raise tonight or someone12 couldnt be here, you can raise them13 through December 13th on the Draft14 Environmental Impact Statement.15 Our obligation, theres a16 stenographer here, well get an entire Page 13
  15. 15. Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 0617 stenographic record. Basically the18 Dharmakaya team is here, John19 Henderson is here representing them.20 Counsel, legal counsel, Jennifer Van21 Tuyl, the attorneys who worked on22 this.23 So what were -- what I24 would like to just summarize very 15 1 briefly and then please direct any 2 comments or questions again to the 3 Chair of the Board, is that this is 4 what the contents of the Draft 5 Environmental Impact Statement are. 6 The Board went through these in the 7 Scoping Session and asked us. This is 8 sort of by state law set up in these 9 seven categories, but the one that is10 the critical one I think most people11 would be interested in is this Chapter12 IV, where we have to describe the13 environmental setting, the impacts of14 development and then any mitigation15 measures that result from those16 impacts. And you can see, it goes A17 through L. Im not going to read them18 all. But I think some are very Page 14
  16. 16. Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 0619 important -- I wont say -- they are20 all very important, but they start off21 with land use and zoning, community22 character, goes through the natural23 environment of the site, including24 stormwater, surface water, traffic 16 1 issue, which Charles sells has 2 studied, -the civil engineers here, 3 community facilities, fiscal and 4 social/economic impacts, which 5 something that your planners had asked 6 us to look at from Frederick Clark. 7 Cultural resources and noise. So all 8 of those categories are in the EIS for 9 your examination. Again, its online,10 and theres extra copies.11 So that is our presentation.12 We just wanted to say briefly where we13 are in the process; that we are not14 finished. That this is the moment to15 hear from the public. Our obligation16 is to answer your questions formally17 in that Final Environmental Impact18 Statement. So tonight is your chance19 to be heard on the Site Plan, the Page 15
  17. 17. Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 0620 Special Permit and this Draft21 Environmental Impact Statement. We22 will then answer those questions and23 submit a Final Environmental Impact24 Statement to the Board, which theyll 17 1 review for completeness again. 2 CHAIRMAN LONSTEIN: I would 3 like to explain to the public, so far 4 this is what we have received from 5 them on the DEIS. 6 Everybody here well allow 7 three minutes. You should be able to 8 ask your questions in three minutes. 9 And I didnt say start.1011 (Laughter.)1213 I didnt have a signup sheet, because14 I didnt think it was necessary. But15 maybe I made a mistake. Youll raise16 your hand. Youll get your three17 minutes, ask whatever questions you18 want. Please keep it orderly and19 respect everybody elses opinion. I20 dont know what the opinions are or21 anything else. Page 16
  18. 18. Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 0622 You must give us your name;23 we have to have that for the record.24 First one is this gentleman in the 18 1 plaid shirt. 2 MR. McKENNY: Jim McKenny. 3 Im the president of the Cragsmoor 4 Association, and I would like to thank 5 Chairman Lonstein and the members of 6 the Board for hosting this and having 7 us tonight. 8 I dont want to take up too 9 much time tonight since there are so10 many individuals here who want to11 speak. The Cragsmoor Association and12 indeed all of the citizens of13 Cragsmoor take this proposal very14 seriously.15 To that end the association16 has hired a lawyer, who is here17 tonight to make a presentation to you.18 As well as a number of experts who are19 evaluating the DEIS. Some of the20 experts are here tonight, but most21 will be submitting their comments in22 writing following this public hearing. Page 17
  19. 19. Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 0623 I urge everyone here,24 whether they speak or not, to submit 19 1 their thoughts in writing so the Board 2 can evaluate them appropriately. 3 Id just like to take a 4 minute of your time to explain the 5 general feelings of the Cragsmoor 6 residents about this project. In 7 short, its just too big and not in 8 keeping with the residential and 9 historical nature of our hamlet.1011 (Applause.)1213 CHAIRMAN LONSTEIN: Hold it14 hold it hold it. Please, please,15 please. Let the man speak.16 MR. McKENNY: There are only17 four or five somewhat large buildings18 in Cragsmoor, two churches, a library,19 Sams Point Visitor Center and the20 firehouse. All of them no larger than21 some of the homes in Cragsmoor. The22 churches and the Visitors Center are23 less than 3,000 square feet. The24 largest building in Cragsmoor arguably Page 18
  20. 20. Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 06 20 1 is the firehouse, approximately 5,000 2 square feet, including the area where 3 the trucks are parked. This is 4 1800 -- there is an 1800 square foot 5 meeting room which can accommodate up 6 to 120 people by the fire regulations. 7 Imagine what a corporate 8 campus sized facility at 78,000 square 9 feet with one building supposedly of10 17,000 square feet could become. It11 would swallow up all of Cragsmoor, 47012 odd and some not so odd residents.13 Our concern is not that there will be14 20 individuals at this complex15 studying on three-year retreats. But16 the potential to vastly overwhelm our17 small community with this huge18 facility which could serve a vast19 number of people.20 Our concerns then are about21 all of the environmental and impacts22 that result, especially the scale of23 the complex, the threats to our water24 supply and the inappropriateness of Page 19
  21. 21. Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 06 21 1 such a large corporate campus in and 2 near our historic community, which has 3 been designated as a State and 4 National Historic District. The 5 facility needs to be smaller. The 6 community needs to be protected from 7 being overwhelmed by the potential of 8 this project to expand and engulf the 9 community.10 Please keep Cragsmoor what11 it is, what it was, that caused it to12 be listed as a National Historic13 District. Thank you for hearing our14 concerns about our town and the care15 youre taking with this project.16 And I would like to17 introduce David Gordon, who is our18 attorney, and I would like him to have19 at least his three minutes.20 CHAIRMAN LONSTEIN: You read21 yours. You did it right on time.22 Hand it over. Okay, Mr. Gordan.23 MR. GORDON: Thank you, Mr.24 Chairman. I am an environmental Page 20
  22. 22. Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 06 22 1 attorney, and Ive been working with 2 the Cragsmoor Association and 3 representatives of several other civic 4 groups. Ill try to be as brief as 5 possible. Of course as an attorney it 6 is a challenge. Ill do my best. 7 Ill point out, first of 8 all, we fully respect the opportunity 9 to submit written comments in two10 weeks, and we will do so both on my11 own with respect to the legal and the12 SEQR comments. And also we have a13 number of technical consultants who14 the group has hired, as Jim said,15 about taking this project seriously.16 We are looking very seriously at many17 of the technical aspects related to18 water, planning, consistency with the19 hamlet, viewshed and many others like20 it.21 I just want to go through22 some of the preliminary findings very,23 very quickly if I can. Ill be as24 brief as possible. 23 Page 21
  23. 23. Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 06 1 First with respect to 2 zoning. The site is in the RC3A 3 district, which is essentially 4 residential, but it allows houses of 5 worship with a Special Use Permit. 6 Mr. Chairman, members of the Board, 7 this is not a house of worship as 8 contemplated in the Zoning Code. This 9 is a sprawling complex. Its more10 like a corporate campus or sprawling11 multi-family housing complex than it12 is a house of worship. We know what a13 house of worship is. It is a church,14 synagogue. It can be a Buddhist15 temple. The denomination doesnt16 matter, but it is typically a single17 building or one or two buildings.18 This is not that. This is not whats19 contemplated in the Zoning Code. The20 reason is clear, this does not fit in21 the hamlet of Cragsmoor, and the22 zoning recognizes that.23 For that reason as a SEQR24 matter in terms of impact it is 24 Page 22
  24. 24. Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 06 1 thoroughly inconsistent with the 2 community character as Jim described 3 and other folks here will tell you as 4 well. 5 Many of the studies in the 6 impact statement are wholly deficient. 7 We are going to be submitting written 8 statements indicating the deficiencies 9 in the traffic studies. There are10 just technical data problems. They11 didnt take the proper counts. They12 avoided the high season of traffic in13 Cragsmoor. They under estimated the14 growth in the area, because they only15 looked at the growth Wawarsing and not16 in the overall area, and several17 others as well.18 We have with us tonight a19 consultant who looked at the ecology20 and habitat issues. The short message21 is the conclusions in the22 Environmental Impact Statement about23 the impacts on biological resources24 are at least in the preliminary draft 25 1 we put together worthless. Too little Page 23
  25. 25. Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 06 2 information is provided to support any 3 conclusions regarding impacts to the 4 project. The background research and 5 on-site survey simply ignored many of 6 the times during the year, again 7 similar to the traffic studies when we 8 would be seeing many of the threatened 9 species.10 In particular, the EIS only11 identified three rare species on the12 site. And this is just an astonishing13 result, given the fact that we are14 here the southern tip of the northern15 Shawangunks, which is essentially a16 center of rare endangered species and17 habitats, and The Nature Conservancy18 will be submitting a statement to that19 effect as well.20 We have hired to21 hydrologists to examine the hydrology22 of the project. This is critical23 especially with respect to the size.24 The more water that this facility 26 1 uses, the less water that is going to 2 be available for the rest of 3 Cragsmoor. And the hydrology is Page 24
  26. 26. Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 06 4 indicating that the water is going to 5 be drawn down substantially. 6 One of the two hydrologists 7 that we have brought on is here 8 tonight and she will be speaking a 9 little bit later on.10 With respect to the11 viewshed. This is perhaps -- and I12 dont mean to prejudice any of these13 other impacts -- this is perhaps the14 most important one. You have your15 responsibility is to protect and to16 require a study of what may be the one17 of the most important viewsheds in18 this area of New York State. This is19 the southern tip of the northern20 Shawangunks.21 I was shocked when I saw the22 EIS and in fact the most significant23 viewshed impact of this site is going24 to be from Bear Hill, which is 27 1 essentially right next door to the 2 site, just lightly above it and to the 3 west no more than a quarter mile away. 4 The EIS completely ignores this Page 25
  27. 27. Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 06 5 viewshed impact. Let me say that 6 again. Completely ignores it. They 7 go out onto Bear Hill, and they say we 8 got a view to the south and a view to 9 the southwest, that wont be affected.10 We say we are not going to bother with11 the view to the east, because we are12 off the path. They cite a sign that13 says keep on the path a half or14 quarter mile back near the parking15 lot. Basically telling people not to16 scramble off the bath in order to get17 to the vantage point, which is a world18 class vantage point. Because of this19 they have completely ignored this20 singular critical asset to this21 community, which in many ways defines22 at least one aspect of what it is like23 to live in Cragsmoor.24 One final impact which is 28 1 ignored, is the alternatives. They 2 only list three alternatives. One is 3 no action, which of course no 4 developer is ever interested in 5 pursuing. One is to basically build a 6 housing investment, which is an Page 26
  28. 28. Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 06 7 interesting alternative, and clearly 8 one they are not interested in. The 9 other is alternative site. They never10 look at the possibility of as to11 whether or not their purposes of12 establishing a meditative retreat can13 be accomplished by anything less than14 a 17-building 78,000 square foot15 facility. Or that it can be16 accomplished by a slightly different17 footprint.18 And they havent done any19 viewshed analyses, this is absolutely20 critical. There is no information in21 the EIS whether this can be done,22 whether they can accomplish their23 purposes by anything smaller, which is24 exactly whats needed in this 29 1 situation. 2 Finally, there is no 3 indication in the EIS of the potential 4 for growth of this site. And the 5 potential that this retreat will 6 ultimately attract more people from 7 all around the world, and grow to be Page 27
  29. 29. Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 06 8 even larger than it is and more of an 9 infringement on life in Cragsmoor than10 it is. We will be presenting11 information on that at a later date.12 I want to make two other13 final points. And I know, Mr.14 Chairman, time is short.15 CHAIRMAN LONSTEIN: Youre16 over your three minutes. Go ahead.17 MR. GORDON: First, youve18 been presented in the EIS a statement19 of federal law which essentially says20 theres a law that protects religious21 institutions. The law says you22 cannot -- as you -- you are allowed23 and you have a responsibility to do an24 environmental analysis which protects 30 1 the residents of Cragsmoor from undue 2 environmental impacts at this site. 3 The responsibility is to treat the 4 religious institution the same as you 5 would treat any other institution. 6 And thats what the people in our 7 researchers and commenters are doing. 8 If this were a corporate campus you 9 would be looking at the size very, Page 28
  30. 30. Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 0610 very carefully. And under federal law11 and state law your responsibility is12 exactly the same here. There is no13 special dispensation or special waiver14 of zoning rules because of the federal15 law.16 Finally, I noticed with17 respect to the SEQR timeline that was18 put up, the one thing that wasnt19 there is a Supplemental Environmental20 Impact Statement. Every one of the21 impacts that Ive cited would be22 sufficient to require a Supplemental23 Environmental Impact Statement to be24 certain that you are viewing the 31 1 significant impacts of this site. 2 That would change the timeline 3 substantially. That wasnt this 4 there. In my view thats the 5 responsibility of this Board and 6 thats what we will be explaining in 7 our comments on December 13. 8 CHAIRMAN LONSTEIN: Thank 9 you.10 Page 29
  31. 31. Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 0611 (Applause.)1213 This lady in the front in14 the pink shirt. Give us your name15 please. You had your hand up twice16 MR. GORDON: This is17 Katherine Beinkafner; she is one of18 our hydrologists.19 MS. BEINKAFNER: I think I20 need ten minutes, and Ill talk fast.21 Can we use that? My assistant is22 passing out some relevant copies.23 There are five pages that go together.24 And everybody on the Board should have 32 1 a copy of that. The consultants can 2 have some, and make sure the audience 3 gets some too. 4 First of all, what I would 5 like to do is take a few minutes and 6 describe what the consultants for the 7 Applicant did and then how do we 8 figure out if theres an impact on 9 neighboring wells. And then what is10 the impact on the hamlet of Cragsmoor.11 Our first graph is12 production well No. 1 on the site, and Page 30
  32. 32. Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 0613 it shows -- first of all, there is14 drawdown of the pumping well No. 1 and15 then recovery. They pump for three16 days, they recovered for six days.17 Maximum drawdown was about 29 feet18 after the three days of pumping.19 After six days of recovery, we still20 have three feet left we didnt21 recover. Normally you pump for three22 days, you recover for three days and23 youre back to zero. They were not in24 this case. When pumping well 2 was 33 1 pumped for only 24 hours, this is 2 looking at what was going on at 3 pumping well one, you get 8 feet of 4 drawdown. For two wells that are 5 only -- well, that are actually 250 6 some feet apart, that is a fair amount 7 of drawdown considering the first well 8 was being pumped at 50 gallons a 9 minute. The second well was being10 pumped at 24 gallons per minute. That11 was for one day, 24 hours. Even after12 like four or five days of recovery,13 you still dont have complete recovery Page 31
  33. 33. Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 0614 in that well.15 This is looking at16 production well No. 1, the one we just17 looked at the record for. Normally18 what we do, we try to predict what19 will happen over time. To predict20 what happens with time you use a21 logarithmic scale for the time. In22 other words, youre condensing the23 scale, the time later on as time would24 go on, and you would project a 34 1 straight line. Or my colleague, Paul 2 Rubin, actually wants to project it on 3 a curved line which even accelerates 4 the decline. So out here saying that 5 we are pumping at 50 gallons a minute 6 for three days, and out here after one 7 day. Well, I think I got these mixed 8 up, but anyway, it is equal to seven 9 days at 7 gallons a minute or when we10 get out here it is equal to 70 days at11 7 gallons a minute after ten days and12 so forth. Now, thats saying that13 with continued pumping this well14 doesnt show any stabilization.15 Normally when youre pumping Page 32
  34. 34. Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 0616 away the water declines, and then it17 becomes stable for a long period of18 time if you just kept pumping and19 pumping. Say we pumped for six days20 instead of three days. So whats21 going on is theres no stabilization.22 As you keep pumping, youre going to23 have continued drawdown and even with24 the time the pump is turned off youre 35 1 not going to recover as much as youre 2 drawing it down. In other words, the 3 well discharge is exceeding the 4 recharge of nature to that well. Even 5 when you look at production well 2, 6 which remember was only 24 gallons a 7 minute instead of 50, it doesnt 8 recover. That is really significant. 9 Then how do we figure out if10 theres an affect on a neighboring11 well? I just took the data from the12 well at 71 Old Inn Road, which is13 about 600 feet away from the pumping14 well. And these little doobies here,15 you can barely see them, they are like16 an inch long on this scale, thats Page 33
  35. 35. Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 0617 when the homeowner is using the water18 for whatever, running the dishwasher,19 running the clothes washer, whatever.20 This affect is the effect of three21 days of pumping that well 600 feet22 away. It is drawdown of about 1523 feet. And likewise, this second blip24 is when the recovery or the pumping of 36 1 the second well for the shorter test. 2 And again, this well doesnt recover 3 either after six days of recovery. 4 And again, it doesnt recover after 5 the 24-hour pumping test either. This 6 is a serious problem. This is really 7 indicating that given time this well 8 has the capability of draining a lot 9 of the water out of the aquifer there.10 I just wanted to take a few11 minutes just to describe the12 condition. On the map in purple Ive13 got the site here. And the two wells,14 No. 1 and No. 2. This little orange15 line, the 1800 foot contour, if you16 think of that its where the hamlet of17 Cragsmoor is. It is kind of a18 plateau. And we know it is a plateau Page 34
  36. 36. Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 0619 sitting on top of a mountain. The20 only water thats there to recharge21 the aquifer has to come straight down22 from the sky. Here in Ellenville,23 where youre down in a valley you can24 get water that comes from the 37 1 mountains down into the valley to get 2 more water. But when youre on top of 3 a mountain, you dont have that 4 luxury. You only have the rain that 5 lands on top of this plateau. And 6 then most of it probably flows down 7 toward the pumping well at this site. 8 These red lines actually show from 9 well No. 1 out to the two wells that10 showed the most substantial drawdown.11 Both of them are on Old Inn Road. One12 was No. 45 or 49, I dont recall13 which, Dunburg. The other one was No.14 71 that I showed in the graph.15 So these lines kind of just16 show the trend of the direction where17 this well can have dramatic effects.18 This is normal -- he on the Shawangunk19 Ridge -- Page 35
  37. 37. Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 0620 CHAIRMAN LONSTEIN: Excuse21 me, you spoke almost ten minutes. Can22 you please wrap it up. Id appreciate23 it.24 MS. BEINKAFNER: Okay, one 38 1 more thing. 2 MALE SPEAKER: If you dont 3 mind, I think some of us would give up 4 minutes just to have this information. 5 Shes hitting some really good numbers 6 here, so... 7 MS. BEINKAFNER: 8 Cross-section: This is like cutting 9 down through the mountain. It is a10 black line on the map and this is a11 cross-section through that area. So12 the ground surface is there. You can13 see where the roads intersect. North14 is on this side. South is on that15 side. So the top of this is actually16 the topographic surface, and then17 these are the elevations going down18 into the earth.19 This is the well at the20 site. And the blue is the water table21 fairly close to the surface. Its Page 36
  38. 38. Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 0622 about 27 feet right there at that23 well. So I kind of drew it parallel24 to the ground surface. I suspect its 39 1 a little lower when you get up into 2 the flat area. The test, if were 3 pumping the well here we have a little 4 bit of drawdown for this test. But 5 this well, because it is 405 feet deep 6 and at the time of the pumping the 7 well pump was actually at 350 feet. 8 If you kept it there, theoretically, 9 you could draw down the entire water10 table in this area.11 The other thing that we12 dont know anything about is what13 happens over on the way downhill to14 Cragsmoor Road? All those houses have15 shallow wells. None of them were16 accessible for testing. A lot of them17 are buried or they are under something18 and we concentrated on getting points19 in bedrock wells. So we dont know20 what will happen if you continue to21 pump here, how would you affect the22 wells down gradient. Page 37
  39. 39. Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 0623 The other point is this test24 was done under optimum conditions. 40 1 According to the report there was 18 2 inches of rainfall in the month of 3 October, prior to this test. Thats 4 an out and out lie. We have never had 5 that much rain or at least that was at 6 Mohonk, assuming maybe we get the same 7 amount of rain on this end of the 8 ridge. I dont know. But certainly 9 that would indicate that this was10 under good conditions.11 What happens if we have12 drought? There just is not sufficient13 water there. The aquifer is very14 fragile. The first thing I noticed15 when we were out in the field and I16 was looking to see what was going on17 is this is a very broad cone of18 depression. Its not just a little19 cone of depression. It is very broad.20 It goes way up past Old Inn Road, and21 I have no idea how much further it22 goes. But I know that theres some23 impact beyond there.24 I would say if the Applicant Page 38
  40. 40. Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 06 41 1 really wants to, if they could maybe 2 do a test over again. Maybe monitor 3 more wells up in this area and to the 4 north. Maybe look at the shallow 5 wells down on Cragsmoor Road. I dont 6 know whether -- because the drawdown 7 is only to this point, and these wells 8 would be down here. I dont know if 9 you can affect them.10 But I did notice the house11 on Clark Road did have some measurable12 effect after the test. And I think13 what it is, is when youre busy14 pumping away here youre disturbing15 the natural flow of groundwater. So16 that three days later the water that17 would be coming down the hill isnt18 there, because it went into this well.19 The other thing is that as20 far as I know the septic system is21 down on the lower side of the22 property, so the argument that oh, we23 are going to put the water back into24 the ground really isnt going to be Page 39
  41. 41. Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 06 42 1 very helpful because they are going to 2 be putting it down on this side of the 3 property but pumping it out from 4 underneath the center. And whats 5 going to happen, it will just go on 6 down and feed the water table down in 7 this area, but will probably have no 8 effect back where the well is, nor 9 will it have any recharge effect back10 in the hamlet. I think those are all11 the things I had to say.12 CHAIRMAN LONSTEIN: Thank13 you.1415 (Applause.)1617 CHAIRMAN LONSTEIN: Yes.18 MALE SPEAKER: Im very hot.19 Do you think you could open the door20 in the back?21 MR. BARBOUR: Im ecology22 here.23 CHAIRMAN LONSTEIN: Your24 name, sir? Page 40
  42. 42. Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 06 43 1 MR. BARBOUR: Im Spider 2 Barbour. Im their ecology expert. 3 Okay, three minutes. 4 Well, Im grateful to Dave 5 Gordon for introducing what I have to 6 say and saving me the first two pages 7 of this long-winded narrative. A lot 8 of this is going to be my written 9 comments, so I dont need to go into10 it in great detail.11 But whats wrong with the12 ecological surveys? Two things13 basically. One that they didnt cover14 the entire growing season, in fact,15 left out the large middle of the16 growing season from mid June to late17 August, which in a high, cold place18 like the Shawangunk Ridge is the most19 important part of the growing season,20 spring starts late up there. Fall21 comes early. So thats the part you22 really need to look at to find all the23 species, to find especially the rare24 species. This is the reason why the 44 Page 41
  43. 43. Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 06 1 survey had so few species in terms of 2 flora and fauna. 3 If you look at that flora 4 and fauna section, it looks like you 5 were in some sort of biological 6 desert, where hardly anything was 7 growing or crawling around. 8 The other problem is that 9 the requirement of SEQR that you send10 a request to DEC and the New York11 Natural Heritage Program for the12 records of rare species on their list13 in or to evaluate which species are14 likely to occur there was -- I dont15 know what went wrong, but Ive seen16 this before, they come back with three17 species. And really, if you look at18 the Shawangunks and what you might19 expect to find on this site, because20 thats where it is, up on the ridge,21 youll fine at least 20 State rare22 plants and 15 State rare animal23 species that they should have known24 about for sure. And they should have 45 Page 42
  44. 44. Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 06 1 done an assessment in terms of the 2 sites conditions and resources as to 3 the likelihood of any of these species 4 occurring there. And they especially 5 missed the ones that are pretty much 6 exclusive to the Sams Point part of 7 the ridge. 8 MALE SPEAKER: Would you 9 give an example?10 MR. BARBOUR: Sure. One of11 them is the Arctic Rush, another one12 is the Appalachian Sandwort, which is13 right on the rocks, and it describes14 bedrock outcrops all over this site,15 and there is absolutely no search for16 this rare plant. The one rare plant17 that they actually seemed to have18 mentioned in the DEIS, which is the19 Mountain Spleenwort, which is a little20 fern that grows on the cliffs. That21 one they managed to find at least in22 the reference for it in the records23 for the rare plants in the State.24 So this really needs to be 46 1 rejected. As Dave was saying, you can Page 43
  45. 45. Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 06 2 come to a lot of conclusions, but you 3 cant come to conclusions when you 4 have no information. How can you come 5 to any conclusion when there is just 6 no data to support one conclusion or 7 another? And thats the problem with 8 this thing basically, with that study 9 is that it really wasnt done at the10 right time of year, and they didnt11 even have the information of which12 species that they should be looking13 for.14 Other than that, another15 really important species, this is a16 species that DEC pays an awful lot of17 attention to, takes very seriously,18 thats the timber rattlesnake. Now19 the Shawangunks have quite a lot of20 timber rattlesnake dens, including one21 thats about two and a half miles from22 this site. Rattlesnakes have been23 seen around the mountain up there, on24 Sams Point Road and on the Sams 47 1 Point Preserve. So we know that the 2 rattlesnakes move into that area 3 during the summer. Page 44
  46. 46. Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 06 4 Also, this hill and the 5 slope below it, Bear Hill, Randy 6 Deckert, a rattlesnake expert and a 7 friend of mine whose authority and 8 expertise I can certainly vouch for 9 says -- and hes the one who should10 know because hes been everywhere and11 he knows all the dens. Bear Hill has12 never ever, ever been searched for13 rattlesnake dens. And it has all the14 characteristics, south and southwest15 facing slopes, the steep slopes with16 the rocks, these are the conditions17 that are really perfect for18 rattlesnake dens. So given the fact19 its in a very wild area, very20 undisturbed, it is quite like likely21 there could be a rattlesnake den on22 Bear Hill.23 How am I doing for time?24 CHAIRMAN LONSTEIN: Keep 48 1 going. 2 MR. BARBOUR: Okay, thanks. 3 Lets see what else I didnt cover. 4 Oh, this is an example of Page 45
  47. 47. Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 06 5 really inadequate identification of 6 species is when you find a species 7 list where things are identified only 8 to genus. And some examples are worse 9 than others. The case of sedges, the10 main genus of sedge is karex. There11 are hundreds of species in New York12 and 70 -- 70 of them are on the13 Natural Heritage List of Rare,14 Threatened and Endangered Species. In15 this plant list from this survey there16 is only one species of karex17 identified. Probably the most common18 one or the one thats most familiar to19 people, which is the tussock sedge.20 Now, there are plenty of other species21 of sedges up there, I can guaranty you22 that, because Ive been up there and I23 found, you know, a dozen at least.24 And including at least one rare 49 1 species thats on the list, at least 2 at Sams point. I dont think Ive 3 ever been on this particular site. 4 CHAIRMAN LONSTEIN: Hold it 5 a minute. We have got to change the 6 tape. Okay, thank you. Page 46
  48. 48. Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 06 7 MR. BARBOUR: All right. 8 Take two. I really want to mention 9 this, because this is the thing like I10 just laugh my butt off. I mean I hate11 to, you know, put people down or12 anything, but I mean some of these13 things are really amazing.14 On the list of plants I15 found this thing yellow buttercup, the16 Latin name hibbertia hypericoides.17 Hibbertia refers to some botanist18 named Hibbertus, named after.19 Hypericoides means resembling St.20 Johns Wort. I had never heard of this21 plant. Now, when I find something22 Ive never heard of in New York that23 somebody found, it just -- I go wow,24 whats this. And so I could not find 50 1 it in any flora. I couldnt find it 2 in the New York checklist, Mitchell 3 and Tucker 97. I couldnt find it in 4 Flora of North America. I went on the 5 web. Thats what you do when your 6 references just dont help you. Its 7 an Australian plant in the family Page 47
  49. 49. Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 06 8 called dilanade. The family, a whole 9 family, this entire family of plant is10 not represented in North America at11 all. Its not -- as far as I can12 determine, its not sold by any13 nurseries. If this occurred there,14 this would be a monumental discovery.1516 (Laughter.)1718 I suspect that its a mistaken19 identification. So Im thinking, and20 Ive got pictures of this thing on the21 web sites that describe it. It looks22 an awful lot like a plant called23 shrubby cinquefoil. Shrubby24 cinquefoil is a plant that grows 51 1 almost exclusively in fens. A fen is 2 a rare type of wetland that is the 3 home of the endangered bog turtle. 4 Now, what did they find and how in the 5 world they ever tracked it down to be 6 this Australian thing, I dont know. 7 But what it sounds to me is that maybe 8 what they found was shrubby 9 cinquefoil. That would be a great Page 48
  50. 50. Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 0610 discovery in itself, because its an11 indicator that the habitat, wherever12 they found it, could support bog13 turtle. So heres an intriguing14 little tidbit. I dont know what it15 means, and thats highly speculative16 what I just say, but its possible.17 The other thing they could18 have found is actually a St. Johns19 Wort called shrubby St. Johns Wort.20 But that has a really strange flower21 that doesnt really represent the22 five-pointed flower of the Australian23 yellow buttercup.24 CHAIRMAN LONSTEIN: Dont 52 1 look at me. 2 3 (Laughter.) 4 5 CHAIRMAN LONSTEIN: We have 6 had a long discussion many a time with 7 Paul Medley over these rattlesnakes. 8 I know where youre coming from there. 9 Will you wind it up for us.10 MR. BARBOUR: I can say that Page 49
  51. 51. Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 0611 bog turtles are seldom found up on12 high mountainous ridges.13 FEMALE SPEAKER: Are14 copperheads on the endangered species15 list?16 MR. BARBOUR: Copperheads17 are species of special concern.18 FEMALE SPEAKER: We found19 two on our property just below us.20 Thats why I ask that question. And21 we did not kill them, for the record.22 MR. BARBOUR: Okay, Im23 grateful.24 CHAIRMAN LONSTEIN: Sir, are 53 1 you done? 2 MR. BARBOUR: I just want to 3 make one thing clear about copperheads 4 and species of special concern, 5 recently the New York State 6 legislature acted to put the special 7 concern species under the same level 8 of protection as the threatened and 9 endangered species. So thats10 something. If somebody tries to tell11 you that the special concern species12 are of no concern, thats not right. Page 50
  52. 52. Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 0613 Thank you.14 CHAIRMAN LONSTEIN: Youre15 very welcome.1617 (Applause.)1819 This young fellow with his hand up in20 the air21 MR. SHERMAN: Hi, Im Henry22 Sherman. I live on Route 8. I moved23 to Cragsmoor because I work for24 corporate America. And I know what it 54 1 is like to go from a mom and pop store 2 -- and a lot of people know me here 3 because I sold them a lot of things -- 4 to a corporation. This community is 5 not ready for a corporation. In every 6 place Ive lived in Ive watched town 7 boards allow corporations to come into 8 their communities to taxpayers and 9 people that want to have a family,10 like me, because I dont have any11 kids, but I have kids coming, and you12 want to have a good school system. It13 took years for Ellenville school Page 51
  53. 53. Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 0614 system to turn around, because they15 were the worst. They were the pits.16 Im not going to lie, you guys have17 done a great job. I have nephews,18 nieces and cousins that go to that19 school.20 Youre allowing this21 corporation to come in and they dont22 want to contribute. Youre giving23 them a ten-year reprievement, correct,24 youre not answering questions, but I 55 1 read everything. Youre not charging 2 them tax for ten years. Youre going 3 to let them slide. Im just saying, I 4 got a letter in the mail. It is not 5 just that. They dont want to 6 contribute. They want to buy. You 7 want to build the Concord Hotel in the 8 middle of Cragsmoor. It doesnt fit. 9 CHAIRMAN LONSTEIN: Excuse10 me, for the record, when they bought11 this property, nobody was aware what12 it was for. It was bought previously,13 then they come with this plan.14 MR. SHERMAN: Oh, I15 understand a hundred percent, thats Page 52
  54. 54. Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 0616 what they do. Thats what they do.17 MR. LITTLE: I think youre18 supposed to be asking a question. I19 havent heard any question. Just20 editorial. Thats not what we are21 here for.22 MR. SHERMAN: My question23 for the Board is simple. You dont24 have the road frontage. The road 56 1 facilities. You dont have the water 2 means. 3 Im only 38 years old I 4 havent been around a long time, but I 5 moved there because I fell in love 6 with my wife. I moved there because 7 of the community. My question to you 8 is do you want to ruin that community 9 with corporate America? Because a10 church is a corporation, okay. And11 they are saying eight times a year12 youre going to have a max amount of13 people of 240 at this facility.14 Everybody knows and the Cragsmoor Fair15 theres 200 people you cant get to16 the Post Office because the road is Page 53
  55. 55. Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 0617 blocked up for two miles. I got to18 walk with my wife to go to Cragsmoor19 Post Office. It is time. It is time20 for our board to stand up an say no?21 Go down to 209 on the left and buy a22 piece of property down there. It is23 time for you guys to do this. It is24 time for some community board to stand 57 1 up and say no. 2 I have nothing against 3 religion. Build a church. Thats 4 fine. They already own the house on 5 Bear Mountain, they bought it. Okay, 6 or Bear Ridge, whatever it is. I 7 dont know what it is. But it is time 8 it say no. These people have a lot of 9 time and a lot of investment than I10 do. And I know what it is like to11 come from a place thats over12 populated and it is time to sell your13 house that you owe $200,000 on, and14 you cant sell it because people dont15 want to bring their kids there because16 it is too busy. Im in that jam right17 now.18 Im a hard-working man that Page 54
  56. 56. Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 0619 pays my taxes and I owe nothing. It20 is time for the Board to say no. I21 think everybody will agree here. Its22 time to say no.2324 (Applause.) 58 1 2 MS. CHRISTIANA: I just want 3 to clarify it is a time for comments. 4 Its not only questions. Everyone can 5 comment on the DEIS and Site Plan and 6 Special Use Permit. So I dont want 7 you to think if you dont have a 8 question, you cant speak. 9 CHAIRMAN LONSTEIN: Lady10 with her hand up first.11 MS. WAGNER: Okay, Im going12 to speak for three minutes regarding13 comments from the nature Conservancy.14 But I also would like to read15 something on behalf of Chuck Davidson16 after that. So Im requesting three17 more minutes.18 CHAIRMAN LONSTEIN: Your19 name please. Page 55
  57. 57. Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 0620 MS. WAGNER: My name is21 Heidi Wagner. I am the preserve22 manager for the Sams Point Preserve,23 which is managed by the Eastern New24 York Chapter of the Nature 59 1 Conservancy. And I am a resident of 2 Cragsmoor. I am joined tonight by my 3 colleague Cara Lee, the Conservancys 4 Director for our Shawangunk Ridge 5 program. 6 The Nature Conservancy is an 7 international conservation 8 organization dedicated to the 9 preservation of the diversity of10 plants and animals and their habitat11 worldwide.12 TNC has had a long13 involvement in the protection of the14 Shawangunk Ridge and is responsible15 for the management of Sams Point16 Preserve and Cragsmoor. We and our17 conservation partners have invested18 millions of dollars in conservation of19 sensitive lands of the Shawangunks.20 In addition to the extraordinary21 biological values of the area, Sams Page 56
  58. 58. Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 0622 Point Preserve and the Shawangunks are23 considered one of the regions most24 important recreational areas because 60 1 of the dramatic cliffscapes, vistas 2 and hiking opportunities. At the 3 highest point along the Shawangunk 4 Ridge, Sams Point and the surrounding 5 area represents the most biologically 6 unique area of the entire ridge. It 7 is home to the rarest natural 8 community in the northern Shawangunks, 9 the globally unique dwarf pitch pine10 barrens. This community is ranked11 G1-S1 by the New York Natural Heritage12 Program which indicates the highest13 level of global and state rarity.14 The preserve is also home to15 four other rare natural communities,16 several rare plants and three rare17 animals. Of all the protected natural18 areas on the ridge, which total close19 to 40,000 acres, Sams Point Preserve20 and the surrounding area is the most21 intact and unfragmented portion of the22 Shawangunk landscape. Page 57
  59. 59. Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 0623 The Mahamudra Buddhist24 Hermitage development project is 61 1 proposed in a forested natural area 2 that is part of this ecologically 3 important landscape. At this time we 4 are reviewing the Draft Environmental 5 Impact Statement for the Hermitage 6 proposal and are working with the 7 Cragsmoor Association in identifying 8 issues that may need further 9 evaluation before the DEIS should be10 considered complete. Tonight we would11 like to raise several issues for your12 early consideration.13 Number one: Consistency14 with zoning. Wawarsing residential15 conservation 3A zone is essentially16 residential but allows houses of17 worship with a Special Use Permit. We18 would ask whether a residential19 compound particularly of the scale20 proposed is what is contemplated or21 allowed by zoning.22 Number two: Suitability of23 proposal. The DEIS compares the24 impacts of the proposal with possible Page 58
  60. 60. Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 06 62 1 as-of-right development and conclude 2 that the Hermitage proposal will have 3 lower impacts than a standard 4 subdivision. We would suggest that 5 as-of-right development is a poor 6 measure of what would be suitable 7 because of the sensitivity of the 8 site. We would remain concerned about 9 the proposed disturbance of 39 percent10 of the site which would result in11 permanent loss of habitat, erosion and12 stormwater impacts. The impacts on13 ground and surface waters.14 Number three: Use of a15 conservation easement. Due to the16 sensitivity of the site and the17 concern of residents in Cragsmoor18 about the potential for additional19 development on the site, we urge the20 Planning Board to consider21 requiring -- requiring a conservation22 easement on the undeveloped portion of23 the property to assure that24 undeveloped land be protected in Page 59
  61. 61. Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 06 63 1 perpetuity. This could be done 2 without hardship to the landowner and 3 can be triggered by either the 4 building permit or some other measure 5 of the projects progress. 6 Okay, thats the end of that 7 part. 8 Now, Id just like to read 9 this on -- this is a totally different10 approach, but it talks about what we11 all feel and he says it so well, I12 needed to read it to everyone.13 A Hermitage that is.14 Cragsmoor is a rare example of a15 balanced, comprising, environmental,16 historical, social, architectural and17 spiritual elements. Cragsmoor is a18 geological sanctuary millenniums old19 where today people visit to revive20 their spirit and gain perspective from21 its vivid displays of nature and22 harmony.23 Cragsmoor is a reflection of24 the inspiration that Hudson River Page 60
  62. 62. Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 06 64 1 School artists experienced. Cragsmoor 2 is an ancient pristine fauna, flora, 3 lakes, streams and the delicate 4 balance of their existence for 5 contemplation. 6 Cragsmoor is the community 7 that is to a great degree has taken on 8 the responsibility of caretaker. 9 Cragsmoor is a spiritual10 place that has evolved naturally, and11 passionately, and meaningfully.12 Cragsmoor is an13 environmental stronghold, an ecosystem14 near the tipping point.15 Cragsmoor is the present16 experiencing the past, not just a17 memory in books.18 Cragsmoor is a place that19 has kept its integrity through20 discipline, restraint and concern --21 not personal agendas.22 Cragsmoor is like a rare23 bird that should be deemed a protected24 species. 65 Page 61
  63. 63. Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 06 1 I can understand why the 2 Mahamudra Hermitage wants to situate 3 in such a special and mystical place: 4 Because of what Cragsmoor is. What 5 Cragsmoor is is because of what 6 Cragsmoor isnt. 7 It isnt foul water and 8 earth quality that cant support its 9 pristine habitat.10 It isnt an imbalance of11 people to environment.12 It isnt a place of stress.13 Cragsmoor is an example of14 defining possible bills and15 responsibilities. Cragsmoor depicts16 the axiom less is more. I believe one17 Hermitage on the mountain is all that18 it can support. Chuck Davidson.1920 (Applause.)2122 CHAIRMAN LONSTEIN: This23 lady over here.24 MS. GRACE: My name is Karen 66 Page 62
  64. 64. Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 06 1 Grace, and I live in Cragsmoor. Im 2 in the lower section. Im at 43 3 Cragsmoor Road. 4 Presently on my property a 5 couple years ago I came to the town 6 board because I wanted to put a shed 7 up. I had limited space on my 8 property to do it, due to the fact 9 that there is severe runoff and my10 property is so wet that I could not11 just put a shed anywhere. I had to12 get a variance in order to do it to13 put it right close to my neighbors14 property. Thank you to my neighbor,15 they allowed me to do that and the16 Board.17 Over time Ive been there18 for 22 years. I find that when we get19 rainfall, when we get snow my property20 gets two feet of water in its front21 yard that my neighbors child can22 drown in. I dont mean to sound like23 I have an attitude, but this has been24 a fight for me for 22 years. I cannot 67 1 get drainage on my property. But a Page 63
  65. 65. Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 06 2 four-year-old child can go out in two 3 feet of water when this occurs every 4 so often during weather and storms and 5 potentially drown. 6 Right above where I am is 7 where this proposal is to land. Well, 8 if I already have runoff problems, my 9 concern is with the vast buildings and10 vast population for that area, that11 when I first moved up there had a12 residency of 260 people and I think13 what I understand now is 420. Well,14 it has since doubled in that time.15 And as more population has occurred, I16 find more runoff problems where I get17 water in my basement that I did not18 get 22 years ago.19 My question to this board is20 how can anyone even consider such a21 vast project? Thank you.22 CHAIRMAN LONSTEIN: Thank23 you.24 68 1 (Applause.) 2 3 next, gentleman on the side here Page 64
  66. 66. Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 06 4 MR. ROCK: Yeah my name is 5 Bernard Rock. Im a year-round 6 resident of Cragsmoor. My problem is 7 the opposite Im afraid, because my 8 well runs dry if Im not careful. I 9 have a 30-foot shallow well, hand dug,10 probably built sometimes in the 1930s.11 Beautiful. But if Im not careful12 during the months of July, August and13 September, I dont have water.14 And Im going to be very15 brief. Im concerned -- I am16 profoundly concerned that this project17 is going to affect my water. Thank18 you for listening.19 CHAIRMAN LONSTEIN: Lady20 there. Your name please.21 MS. MATZ: My name is Sally22 Matz. Im president of the Cragsmoor23 Historical Society, and we want to24 thank you for providing this evening 69 1 for us. The Historical Society Board 2 has reviewed the DEIS and is very 3 concerned with the propose 4 developments adverse impact on the Page 65
  67. 67. Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 06 5 setting of the two National Register 6 listed residential buildings, that is 7 the home of Richard Harts and Elaine 8 Caldwell and the home of Bernard Rose. 9 And the historic open spaces between10 that also National Register listed11 property.12 Specifically, the proposed13 teachers house is presently shown in14 the site to be sited in the historic15 open space within the viewshed of the16 former Cragsmoor Inn and in close17 proximity to the two aforementioned18 historic residences.19 The DEIS acknowledges that20 the proposed building is in the21 historic district but makes no case as22 to why the building could not be sited23 elsewhere, so the open views could be24 protected and the privacy and setting 70 1 of the two historic residences could 2 be maintained. 3 The DEIS does not 4 acknowledge the adverse impact, and 5 thus is in error. The Applicant 6 presumes, based on comments in other Page 66
  68. 68. Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 06 7 parts of the DEIS, that later 8 contextual design decisions would 9 mitigate the adverse impacts. This is10 not a wise approach. We believe that11 finding another location for the12 teachers house is the obvious13 solution. New construction in the14 listed historic district is avoidable,15 and easily mitigated by redesigning16 the site in this portion of the17 development. As sited, the proposed18 building constitutes an adverse impact19 on the historic district.20 The Board of the Historical21 Society would be pleased to meet with22 the Applicants consultants to23 consider options that would remove or24 mitigate these adverse impacts on the 71 1 registered districts. 2 In summary, the Cragsmoor 3 Historical Society believes that there 4 are prudent and feasible alternatives 5 to the proposed siting of the teachers 6 house and urges the Planning Board to 7 request a plan revision that protects Page 67
  69. 69. Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 06 8 the integrity of the historic district 9 and the setting of the two affected10 historic residences.11 The Historical Society is12 also concerned with a proposal by the13 Cragsmoor Fire District seeking a14 substantial upgrade to the Inn Road,15 possibly requiring the removal of the16 national register listed stone entry17 gates at Cragsmoor Road. Presumably18 this request is based on the need to19 have fire trucks pass anywhere along20 the road. Such an upgrade would bring21 a significant adverse impact on the22 district.23 If a second access road is24 needed for the project to meet safety 72 1 standards, then we suggest a study of 2 alternatives, including a new second 3 access road that could be dedicated to 4 emergency access. 5 Lastly, the historic 6 character of Cragsmoor, both within 7 and beyond the National Register 8 district boundaries is one that blends 9 cultural resources, open spaces, Page 68
  70. 70. Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 0610 vistas, local ecosystems and11 reforested areas in a pleasing12 balance. The proposed development is,13 we believe, a compatible use for the14 land in concept, but we are concerned15 that the intense use of the site,16 mostly as a result of traffic brought17 by significant periodic visitation and18 by significant water and septic19 requirements threatens that balance.20 The society asks the Board to protect21 the resources and community character22 by asking the Applicant to reduce the23 scale of the project as a matter of24 buildings, roadways, parking lots and 73 1 landscape modifications desired are 2 out of balance with the surrounding 3 community. The Historical Society 4 will continue to review and discuss 5 the proposal and provide these and 6 additional comments, if necessary, by 7 the close of the public comment 8 period. 9 CHAIRMAN LONSTEIN: Thank10 you. Page 69
  71. 71. Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 061112 (Applause.)1314 MS. RADL: My name is15 Maureen Radl. Im a 30-year resident16 of Cragsmoor. I am vice president of17 that Historical Society and very proud18 of it. And also vice president of the19 Friends of the Shawangunks.20 And because of those21 affiliations I take a very serious22 interest in any development on the23 ridge in general and Cragsmoor in24 particular. And I have attended many, 74 1 many meetings like this. And I wanted 2 to thank the Board as well as the 3 applicants for the way all of the 4 meetings on this topic have been 5 conducted, with a great deal of 6 respect for each other. And I hope 7 that all of the meetings on this topic 8 will continue in the same way. The 9 tone is one of cooperation, seeking10 understanding, and I hope that11 continues and will result in a project12 that we can all live with. Page 70
  72. 72. Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 061314 (Applause.)1516 I personally welcome the17 Dharmakaya. I feel a kinship to their18 deep respect for the rare beauty and19 spiritual quality of the mountain.20 When I look at the photographs on21 their web site of the beautiful land22 they have acquired I know they have23 chosen it for the very same reasons24 that have inspired us to fight long 75 1 and hard to protect this extraordinary 2 setting. Cragsmoor, as you have heard 3 several times from several experts, is 4 a fragile environment, which can only 5 permit a limited number of people to 6 sustain life on this narrow plateau 7 without disturbing the delicate 8 balance with nature. 9 At the moment many of us10 feel that we may be at the brink of11 over stepping our limits. That is why12 were concerned about this building13 project, which is by far the largest Page 71
  73. 73. Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 0614 would have been proposed for this15 hamlet.16 When the center was17 originally described to the community,18 we visualized a much smaller footprint19 with a few small structures, primarily20 designed to accommodate three-year21 retreats. Now the proposed22 centerpiece will be a meeting hall23 larger than any structure in24 Cragsmoor. The combined number of 76 1 residents and the staff who will stay 2 at the center for long and short-term 3 retreats is quite large in proportion 4 to the number of people who reside in 5 the hamlet, without even considering 6 the number of people who will also be 7 present on festival days and probably 8 remain for those weekends. These 9 factors still raise serious concerns10 regarding the overall scale of the11 project, occupancy load, water12 consumption and runoff, sewage,13 traffic, parking, fire protection,14 land conservation, viewshed impacts,15 loss of tax revenue and impact on the Page 72
  74. 74. Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 0616 Cragsmoor Historic District.17 With a project of this18 nature on only 90 acres, Im afraid19 that ten years from now those20 beautiful rolling hills and magical21 woods that presently appear on the web22 site will be covered with so many23 buildings, parking lots, roads,24 utility structures and large meeting 77 1 halls to accommodate hundreds of 2 people that its pastoral quality will 3 be lost forever. 4 So I would like to request 5 that the Planning Board examine this 6 DEIS with the greatest of care and 7 work closely with the Applicant to 8 find ways to mitigate its impact on 9 the area.10 And I would like to offer11 just four suggestions, four12 recommendations to make the center13 more compatible with the community and14 its surroundings.15 First of all, reduce the16 overall size of the project by 40 to Page 73
  75. 75. Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 0617 50 percent. Second, avoid disrupting18 the viewshed from the east side of the19 Bear Hill Preserve that looks down20 upon the area designated for the21 Gurus house. This is in the historic22 district as was just mentioned and is23 characterized by very wide spaces24 between residences. It should remain 78 1 that way. 2 Third, designate a specific 3 amount of money in lieu of taxes to be 4 paid annually to the Cragsmoor 5 Volunteer Fire Company to cover the 6 cost of protecting the center and the 7 increase in our population. 8 And fourth, as has already 9 been mentioned, create conservation10 easements on all lands which will not11 be used in the project proposal.12 When these suggestions are13 carried out, Im sure youll find more14 people who will graciously welcome the15 Dharmakaya as valuable neighbors in16 our community. Thank you.1718 (Applause.) Page 74
  76. 76. Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 061920 CHAIRMAN LONSTEIN: Who is21 next? This gentlemen here.22 MR. GRACE: Good evening.23 Audience, members of the Board. My24 name is William Grace. And I live 79 1 down on Lower Cragsmoor Road. My wife 2 has already spoken to you about the 3 sewage -- not the sewage but the 4 runoff, the storm runoff. And looking 5 at this map on basically down here by 6 discharge point D and they indicate a 7 nominal increase in the runoff. And 8 unless something will be done about 9 adding more culverts or something, I10 mean Ill have an indoor pool in my11 house.12 With that said, I just want13 to also state that Im a short-timer14 here. Ive only been here 22 years.15 We bought up here because we just16 loved the area. My wife actually17 lived in the house next door when I18 first met her. I said I could live up19 here, and we moved into the next Page 75
  77. 77. Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 0620 house. But it is a long story. But21 what I wanted to say is I commute to22 Morgan, New Jersey every day, and Im23 getting near the point Im hoping to24 look to retirement soon. I spent 22 80 1 years up here and put a lot of money 2 an effort to make my house as nice as 3 it is. You may notice the nice 4 flagpole out front. I plan to retire 5 up here and plan to retire what 6 because of what this community is now, 7 not what this thing may become. 8 And I also want to let you 9 know I enjoy coming home on the10 weekends and feeding my birds and11 watching the coyote run through the12 backyard. And I know we have bear13 because I had my suet feeder ripped14 down many times. These are the15 reasons I enjoy this area and thats16 why Ive stayed here 22 years and17 hopefully, God willing, will stay here18 another 22 years.19 And I am not in favor of20 this proposition. Thank you.21 Page 76
  78. 78. Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 0622 (Applause.)2324 CHAIRMAN LONSTEIN: Next. 81 1 Gentlemen against the wall, go ahead. 2 MR. NOLAN: Thank you. My 3 name is Dick Nolan, and my wife and I 4 live at the intersection of Clark Road 5 and Cragsmoor Road, about two tenths 6 of a mile south of the planned 7 project. And Ive got a number of 8 comments, but Ill keep it very brief. 9 Im not going to reiterate things10 already said.11 First of all, I said your12 sat in your position one time on the13 Dutchess County Planning Board, and I14 realize youre in a tough position and15 youre going to wind up getting a lot16 of grief over this no matter which way17 you go. It is difficult for a town to18 deal with subject matter experts that19 come in like this. They give you the20 thousand pages, and as a result of21 tonight youre going to get 500 more22 pages that now explain all the things Page 77
  79. 79. Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 0623 that were brought up tonight. So its24 a difficult position. 82 1 If theres a way to -- and I 2 also realize that your hand are tied 3 in a lot of cases. You cannot just 4 decide to do things because you want 5 to do it. I understand that. If you 6 have a way, if this Special Use Permit 7 can be denied, I think that would be 8 great. That would probably stop it 9 dead in its tracks. If it is not, and10 it moves forward, Ive got just a11 couple comments.12 One. I read on the web13 site, and I didnt read all of it,14 because I have a job like you guys do,15 Im sure nobody has enough time to16 read everything provided. But they17 had an archeological study done, and18 it went through phase 1, and then they19 recommended it had to go to phase 220 because the likelihood of some type of21 ancient man artifact or whatever were22 moderately present. Thats what they23 said. So they dug, what I read, like24 212 holes with a shovel, decided that Page 78
  80. 80. Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 06 83 1 it doesnt have to go forward. Thats 2 it. Thats the end of that. 3 Now, what Im asking, if it 4 does move forward, and I hope it 5 doesnt, it may be behoove the town to 6 require the town hire an architect or 7 an archeological expert at their 8 expense and have him on site doing all 9 excavation.10 Because I think between11 bulldozers, excavators and backhoes,12 they are going to move a lot more dirt13 than 212 shovelfuls. I think it would14 be in our best interest to have15 somebody there all the time.16 Im also concerned on water,17 based on where we are, Im not an18 expert in water or hydrology at all.19 My well is two-tenths of a mile20 downhill. I also read in the best21 that I can understand it, that water22 isnt a problem as far as they are23 concerned. Now we already heard24 tonight in the battle of the experts Page 79
  81. 81. Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 06 84 1 that it is a problem. But according 2 to them its not. 3 Now, if thats true, maybe 4 they can bond or post a bond that 5 would fix anybodys well within a 6 reasonable distance of this project 7 that goes dry as a result of this 8 project. Now, if their position is 9 absolutely this is no issue, then I10 dont know why they would post a bond11 to do it. My guess is they wont put12 their money where their mouth is and13 theyll decline to do that. But that14 will be a good indication to me that15 it is not as much of a non-issue as16 they may make it.17 I got one final point. I18 cant figure out in all of this that19 who is the legal entity that somebody20 would go after when and if they dont21 do what they are supposed to do. And22 hopefully somehow when we go through23 this, is there going to be an entity24 thats somewhere in the United States Page 80
  82. 82. Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 06 85 1 that the town can go after if they 2 either need to execute some kind of a 3 bond or they need to do anything or 4 get them to do something that they 5 havent done? I dont know that wed 6 be real successful chasing somebody in 7 Nepal. Thats all I have. Thank you 8 very much. 9 (Applause.)1011 CHAIRMAN LONSTEIN: Lady12 there.13 MS. LESSICAN: Hi, Im Joan14 lESSICAN. Im an adjacent property15 owner and year-round resident in16 Cragsmoor, and Ive been here a very17 short time, less than five years.18 But I will say I do have19 water in my basement. I am on the20 southern slope of the prospective21 development. And I as many people22 have spoken am very concerned with the23 issue of runoff, of water, of the24 change in population and what the 86 Page 81
  83. 83. Public Meeting Transcript 11 30 06 1 expansion over the years may be. Im 2 very concerned about the forest being 3 divided and the danger to the flora 4 and fawna that exist there. And Im 5 also very concerned with the visual 6 impact. 7 I go to Bear Hill very 8 often. And from the plans that weve 9 seen tonight I see really a10 slaughtering of that 91-acre forested11 land where I live right below that.12 Based on what Ive heard13 tonight, I do have some questions14 specifically for the Board, which are:15 Can the wells below the site16 be studied? Mine was not dug up at17 the time because I was on my way to18 work, and we discovered that it had to19 be dug out and I couldnt get my boots20 and shovel it out. Its the third21 well on my property, so water has been22 an issue in the past. And based on23 what our hydrologist has pointed out,24 theres likely going to be a great 87 Page 82

×