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The Five Whys
By Mike Rother and Constantin May
CHALLENGING OUR BELIEFS
We should be careful to not simply accept 20th Century
Lean concepts just because they fit our preconceptions.
We've learned a lot since then and it looks like we may
have misunderstood some Lean concepts.
The '5 Whys' may be an example.
?
2
CONVENTIONAL LEAN WISDOM SAYS...
The 5 Whys is an iterative question-asking
technique used to explore the cause-and-effect
relationships underlying a particular problem.
The primary goal of the technique is to
determine the root cause of a defect or
problem.
"By asking why five times and answering it
each time, we can get the the real cause of
the problem."
~Taiichi Ohno, "Toyota Production System, p. 17
3
TODAY THESE STATEMENTS LOOK MORE
LIKE ATTRACTIVE WISHFUL THINKING
"By asking why five times and answering it each time,
we can get the the real cause of the problem."
~Taiichi Ohno
The 5 Whys concept and the quote from Ohno are
appealing to our brains, which have a natural urge
to want certainty, even when it is not there.
Finding the root cause of a problem is typically not
possible through discussion, brainstorming, logic
and reason. You have to experiment and learn your
way to greater knowledge & understanding.
At best, asking the 5 Whys is a brainstorming
technique, not a problem-solving technique. They
don't reveal anything beyond what we already
think we know.
4
HOW ABOUT 5 EXPERIMENTS INSTEAD?
This is perhaps another case of Toyota explaining
something they do in hindsight, and us misunderstanding
it. The purpose of asking 'why' is more to find the current
Threshold of Knowledge and to do an experiment there.
Notice that Ohno doesn't specify how you should answer
each "Why?".
It's unscientific to cross a knowledge threshold and hunt
for root causes simply by brainstorming and discussing.
When you encounter a knowledge threshold, turn your
attention to designing and carrying out a quick and cheap
PDCA experiment to see further. Then you can ask again.
IN HINDSIGHT you will perhaps have asked 'why' five
times or so, but they weren't asked all at once. They
were punctuated by experiments.
5
THE THRESHOLD OF KNOWLEDGE
The Threshold of Knowledge is the point at which you have
no facts and data and start guessing. The Threshold of
Knowledge is difficult to spot because we donʼt realize
that our brain is automatically filling in our knowledge gaps.
6
Cause 1 Cause 2 Cause 3 Cause 4
Why? Why? Why? Why?Why?
Cause 5
Are you sure?
Can you test it?
Where are the facts?
ASKING THE 5 WHYS IN A SINGLE SITTING
OFTEN DOESN'T MAKE SENSE
Are you sure?
Can you test it?
Where are the facts?
7
BECAUSE THE WAY TO A TARGET CONDITION
IS NOT A STRAIGHT LINE
8
Knowledge Threshold!
Possible causes tested only
to here; via facts, data and
prior experiments.
Condition
Curren
t
Target
Condition
Cause 3
Cause 2
Cause 1
Cause 3.2
Cause 3.6
Cause 3.5
Cause 3.1 Cause 3.3
Cause 3.4
Why
#2 Obstacle 1
Why #3
Obstacle 2
Why #3
TWO DIFFERENT MINDSETS MAY PRODUCE
TWO DIFFERENT INTERPRETATIONS
Find my Threshold of Knowledge,
where I need to do the next
experiment to be able to see further
Purpose of asking the 5 WHYS
A Person who
dislikes uncertainty:
Get to root cause
of a problem
A person who is OK
with uncertainty:
9
10
The scientific process
can only confirm or
refute; it doesn't
define or limit what is
possible ahead of time.
Quote from The Way of Science by Dennis Trumble
HUMAN ENDEAVOR
Perhaps we should more frequently
ask ourselves, "Why not?"
11
VIDEO:
Striving is Different from Troubleshooting
(next page)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qd8PetCER8E
12
Dr. Russell
Ackoff

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The Five Whys - Are We Doing it Wrong?

  • 1. The Five Whys By Mike Rother and Constantin May
  • 2. CHALLENGING OUR BELIEFS We should be careful to not simply accept 20th Century Lean concepts just because they fit our preconceptions. We've learned a lot since then and it looks like we may have misunderstood some Lean concepts. The '5 Whys' may be an example. ? 2
  • 3. CONVENTIONAL LEAN WISDOM SAYS... The 5 Whys is an iterative question-asking technique used to explore the cause-and-effect relationships underlying a particular problem. The primary goal of the technique is to determine the root cause of a defect or problem. "By asking why five times and answering it each time, we can get the the real cause of the problem." ~Taiichi Ohno, "Toyota Production System, p. 17 3
  • 4. TODAY THESE STATEMENTS LOOK MORE LIKE ATTRACTIVE WISHFUL THINKING "By asking why five times and answering it each time, we can get the the real cause of the problem." ~Taiichi Ohno The 5 Whys concept and the quote from Ohno are appealing to our brains, which have a natural urge to want certainty, even when it is not there. Finding the root cause of a problem is typically not possible through discussion, brainstorming, logic and reason. You have to experiment and learn your way to greater knowledge & understanding. At best, asking the 5 Whys is a brainstorming technique, not a problem-solving technique. They don't reveal anything beyond what we already think we know. 4
  • 5. HOW ABOUT 5 EXPERIMENTS INSTEAD? This is perhaps another case of Toyota explaining something they do in hindsight, and us misunderstanding it. The purpose of asking 'why' is more to find the current Threshold of Knowledge and to do an experiment there. Notice that Ohno doesn't specify how you should answer each "Why?". It's unscientific to cross a knowledge threshold and hunt for root causes simply by brainstorming and discussing. When you encounter a knowledge threshold, turn your attention to designing and carrying out a quick and cheap PDCA experiment to see further. Then you can ask again. IN HINDSIGHT you will perhaps have asked 'why' five times or so, but they weren't asked all at once. They were punctuated by experiments. 5
  • 6. THE THRESHOLD OF KNOWLEDGE The Threshold of Knowledge is the point at which you have no facts and data and start guessing. The Threshold of Knowledge is difficult to spot because we donʼt realize that our brain is automatically filling in our knowledge gaps. 6
  • 7. Cause 1 Cause 2 Cause 3 Cause 4 Why? Why? Why? Why?Why? Cause 5 Are you sure? Can you test it? Where are the facts? ASKING THE 5 WHYS IN A SINGLE SITTING OFTEN DOESN'T MAKE SENSE Are you sure? Can you test it? Where are the facts? 7
  • 8. BECAUSE THE WAY TO A TARGET CONDITION IS NOT A STRAIGHT LINE 8 Knowledge Threshold! Possible causes tested only to here; via facts, data and prior experiments. Condition Curren t Target Condition Cause 3 Cause 2 Cause 1 Cause 3.2 Cause 3.6 Cause 3.5 Cause 3.1 Cause 3.3 Cause 3.4 Why #2 Obstacle 1 Why #3 Obstacle 2 Why #3
  • 9. TWO DIFFERENT MINDSETS MAY PRODUCE TWO DIFFERENT INTERPRETATIONS Find my Threshold of Knowledge, where I need to do the next experiment to be able to see further Purpose of asking the 5 WHYS A Person who dislikes uncertainty: Get to root cause of a problem A person who is OK with uncertainty: 9
  • 10. 10 The scientific process can only confirm or refute; it doesn't define or limit what is possible ahead of time. Quote from The Way of Science by Dennis Trumble
  • 11. HUMAN ENDEAVOR Perhaps we should more frequently ask ourselves, "Why not?" 11
  • 12. VIDEO: Striving is Different from Troubleshooting (next page) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qd8PetCER8E 12 Dr. Russell Ackoff