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  1. 1. - Chat Notes AND SELF-ORGANISATION? THRESHOLD BETWEEN AUTONOMY Production outside exhibition structures DG: [04/11 14:34] So are you looking at building another form of presentation that goes beyond the material form of a stable framework such as an exhibition or Biennial? Mobilising dysfunctionality/failure Self-Organised Strategies Malleable Forms [04/11 14:39] so at this point there is not a specific frame that we say OK we will only do this and never [04/11 14:44] In many ways as well, what became interesting was also to an exhibition - so the form and the ways in which we see how in some cases informal strategies can work best in terms of work are quite malleable engaging with people, perhaps on a more even playing field - without the prestige and dom inance of a major institution [04/11 14:47] So sometimes being "small" can really be an advantage Emotional Attachment [04/11 14:52] But when you actually come out and say that autonomy & CONDITIONS OF NON-ENLIGHTNEMENT? ILLUSORY AUTNOMOUS FOUNDATIONS? doesnt exist then that triggers off very extreme emotions from people [04/11 14:54] And it is from this point that I am now looking at the set of issues on autonomy, the idea of autonomy as an emotional attachment [04/11 14:57] That fact makes it difficult to move onto concrete research into other forms of autonomy or a repacement of the term THE BATTLE BETWEEN THE I AND THE WE [WHAT ABOUT NANCY’S DEVELOPMENT OF THE BEING WITH - THE CO-ONTOLOGICAL FOUNDATIONS OF BEING IN THE WORLD?] AUTHORITARIAN STRUCTURES OF INTERACTION PARTICIPATION / NON-PARTICIPANT / [04/11 15:07] But arent all forms of autonomy actually co-autonomous to some degree - meaning that we as potentially autonomous actors are always connected to a larger system of interaction and co-presences WHEREIN LIES THE BREAK WITH AUTONOMY AND HOW WOULD WE (HAVE?) KNOW(N) IT? [04/11 15:12] In terms of the break, I thought that it is easier for people to address the process of a break rather than understanding something as complex and difficult as a new model [04/11 15:12] or illusory understanding[04/11 15:14] KEY TO THE RESEARCH INTO PAIS THE EXPLORATION INTO PARTICIPATION [04/11 15:15] Yes this is a difficult issue, since it also holds the reverse side of the PA & PARTIALITY? argument - something I also want to explore further, the non-participant [04/11 15:15] but of course the research into different concepts of participation is as fraught with its own problems and complexs [04/11 15:19] I think there are only really degrees of autonomy, so all forms of perceived autonomous activity can only be partial in order to still have communica- tive potential INTERVENTIONS WITHIN THE GENEREIC? PROBLEM WITH BACHELARDS NOTION OF SELF-DETERMINED EPISTEMOLOGY?A PUBLIC LANGUAGE?(HOW TO MAKE THINGS PUBLIC / EXHIBITION / CATALOGUE) negotiate the terms and language to shape this space DISAGFREE! "common spaces" is their [04/11 15:41] What I worry about in the construction of the potential "watered down" consensus problem, if that makes any sense [04/11 15:42] They could easily become generic - although as a sit a type this, perhaps generic spaces are the ones which can be used as a starting point for discussion SELF-CRITIQUE [04/11 15:42] I think you are right, plus the problem that everyone ought to be GESTURES OF CONTESTATION involved in a project contesting firmly held [04/11 15:52] think if you are involved in testing out or beliefs then as Lenin said you are involved in serious disagreement [04/11 15:53] which Ranciere suggests is also where a real democracy lies [04/11 15:58] In one book he referred to the student strike of 86 (if my memoery is right) [04/11 15:58] That highlights this strategy and tactics difference [04/11 15:58] But I do think this is where many problems with so called collaborative PERPETUAL RITES OF CULTURAL COLONISATION? and participatory projects [04/11 15:59] That the students were successful in their demands precisely because they didnt protest AGAINST the system but rather thought OK the system proposed something we dont like [04/11 16:00] so they worked within the parameters of a system, tactically, in order for change to happen STRUCTURES BUILT OF INTERFERENCE FOUNDATIONAL INTERFERENCES [04/11 16:02] Many artists have in the past suggested a similar strategy if such democratic examples [04/11 16:07] Im wondering though, playing the devils advocate, we chatted about are useful when trying to map out a PA space that doesnt resort to cultural colonisation [04/11 16:13] Something along these lines came up in Turkey [04/11 16:16] I am not sure whether it is good enough to say that with these sort of projects where you are trying very hard to think about testing out your own beliefs [04/11 16:17] and at the same time establish a framework for other people to participate in your project [04/11 16:18] I think along the lines of the participatory projects, there has to be space as well, I mean included within the scope of the projects for the non-participants [04/11 16:18] that you are inadvertantly imposing a framework on the "other" [04/11 16:18] Since participation within something means that you have already accepted some limits of how to manouever [04/11 16:20] sure that too..but maybe a so called experiment into democracy ends up turning into cultural dictatorship [04/11 16:26] Sometimes the conditions for entering a so called collaborative or participatory project are so narrow, rigid and dogmatic that they cannot any longer be called collaborative or participatory [04/11 16:26] Yes, there has to be a place for serious interference - especially within the foundational architecture of how such projects take shape