Creating Your First Product - Fitness Money Podcast


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In this episode of Fitness Money podcast you'll find out which are the best affiliate offers to promote, where to get recurring payment offers, why creating a video product is better than creating a book, how to create an entire product in just a day, how to come up with ideas on your own product and much, much more!

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Creating Your First Product - Fitness Money Podcast

  1. 1. Fitness Money Podcast Episode 21What Products Sell and Building Your FirstProductGet this podcast on iTunes at: to the Fitness Money Podcast brought to you by Fitness In this podcast,Logan Christopher and Tyler Bramlett teach you the step by step ways to make more money inyour fitness business. Let’s take it on over for this episode of the Fitness Money Podcast.Tyler: Hey guys, Tyler and Logan here, and this is the Fitness Money podcast from How’s it going today, Logan?Logan: It is going good. I think we’ve got what here is the third of our series specifically on onlinesuccess and what you can do in order to make that money online.Copyright © 2013 All Rights Reserved
  2. 2. Tyler: Absolutely, man. We’re going to keep going on this series because ultimately, we could probablytalk about this forever and ever, amen. But today we’re going to talk a little bit about building your ownproduct. We might dig into some traffic generation strategies. I’ve got my take on that. Logan’s got adifferent take on that as well.But before we jump into anything else, last time we talked about affiliates. We talked about how youcan be an affiliate, how you can promote other people’s stuff, how you can go to andstart selling other people’s stuff today, and then you start building your email list and everything. Iwanted to just kind of take a few minutes right now just to talk to you guys about a few of the productsthat Logan and I have had success promoting. That way you guys aren’t just throwing darts at a boardand seeing what works well and what doesn’t.I just want to remind you real quick that these products have to be congruent with your type of list.Again, if you’re dudes who want to build muscle and you’re going to go plug some other course thatdoesn’t relate to that, it’s not going to work. So just some of the stuff that we promoted that worksreally well, I’ll let you guys know about it. Logan will let you guys know about it and that way you guyshave at least a place to start when you start pitching other people’s stuff. Logan, what are some goodproducts that you’ve had success with?Logan: I’ve had pretty good success with this series from this guy. He’s kind of a whacko but he callshimself the Garage Warrior. He has a number of different programs that are pretty decent. Butseriously, Tyler has done some good stuff. You get 75% commission on the front end. I was there fromthe beginning, helping him out, and his programs have only done better and his launches have donebetter. You’ve got good programs for it and they’ll fit a wide variety of people and it’s really solid stuff.Thats the thing.When you’re promoting stuff, you don’t just do it for the money. You definitely should at least check outthe program. You don’t need to study it and put it into action yourself beforehand but most people willprovide you with a free copy that you can view online so at least take a look through. You want to besure you’re promoting something really good that you believe in.Ideally, I’d say you should really check out everything before you do it. Sometimes, you can go off. Youtrust the person but that is an essential thing. So I like your stuff and you’re a good affiliate so onceagain, go to ClickBank and find Tyler’s products.Tyler: Oh man. I would shed a tear but the reefer has dried my eyes. So Ive always wanted to say thaton something after I heard Frank Kern say it one time. Oh my god. I think it’s a Chapelle thing. So yeah,Logan, thank you. I appreciate that. I’ve gotten a lot of attention from my upsell flows, from a lot ofpeople in the marketing community because they convert really well. So that’s something I’m reallyexcited about and things that I really love to do.I’ve got a lot of things that have converted pretty well. If you’re into that kind of hardcore niche, mybuddy, Travis Stoetzel. If you type in ‘Travis Stoetzel’ in the ClickBank Marketplace, he’s got a lot of greatprograms. They convert pretty dang well. He’s kind of like a CrossFit-esque kind of person. Shawna K.,Copyright © 2013 All Rights Reserved
  3. 3. the pull up queen. You can type in ‘’ or check that out. You can go join ouraffiliate page. She’s like a 50-year old woman who can do a set of 20 pull-ups anytime, anywhere. I haveseen her do it personally. It’s pretty fucking impressive. She’s wicked strong, a really cool chick. Her stuffconverts really well.One of my favorite programs, and this thing just converted like a wildfire for me a couple of weeks ago,was Workout Finishers. The reason why this does so well is because you can literally add it ontoanything. So if you’re doing yoga or whatever, you can be, “Hey, check out this really cool way to get asix-minute workout in at the end of your workout.” So Workout Finishers is just adding a workout, a tinylittle metabolic conditioner, onto your workout. It’s nothing new but the sales copy is brilliant. Mybuddy, Mike, has lost personally over 105 pounds so he’s got some great social proof on there. Thatproduct converts extremely well.Sylvia Favela, the pilates chick—these are all people I’ve met, promoted, and have had good successwith—Sylvia’s program—this is really weird, you guys—Sylvia’s program killed it to my Garage Warrioremail list. Congruency is a weird thing but I was trying that when I said I’ll throw out a podcast and if itworks well, I’ll run with it. I threw up a podcast and I made a dozen sales from a podcast, which is notvery—that’s pretty dang good. I was like holy shit! So her upsells converted. I think I made 100% net onthe backend. I was like oh, damn. So then I wrote and sent another email then I sent another email withsome scarcity. I think on the last day I threw up a bonus like, “Hey, get a free copy of Warrior Flexibilitywhen you get this.” I made like 40 or something sales of a pilates program from my Garage Warrior list.So you never know what’s going to work. That’s why sometimes you want to just kind of try stuff and ifit works, run with it. If it doesn’t, bail and go with something else because we do make our livings on thisstuff. So those are definitely some of the people. Logan—I can’t forget about Logan—has a thousandproducts. Right, Logan?Logan: Yeah, pretty close to. Well, between me and my partners and everything. My stuff is really morehardcore and also the affiliates I’ve had success with, it has to, of course, be in line with that, once againwith the congruency. Anytime I’ve tried to do—though I haven’t really done the like, if I went fat loss, itreally wouldn’t work too well for my list because that’s not what people are there to learn about.Some people I’ve had good success with: Jedd Johnson from Diesel Crew, he has a number of differentproducts really centered around grip strength and everything. If that fits your list he has some goodstuff. A lot of it’s on ClickBank. The Tapp Brothers, these are parkour guys that actually understandmarketing, which is a very rare combination. They have some cool programs like the Parkour CrashCourse and How to do a Back Flip. That’s done really well for me, granted I have a list that’s all abouthand balancing and acrobatics so it really fits in well there. That came about literally when—I’ve neverheard about these guys—they emailed me and said, “Hey, I think we have some stuff that might be agood fit. Here it is. Check it out. If you’re interested in promoting, here’s the details on how to do that”and I’ve been doing it ever since then. I’ve interviewed them. They’ve promoted me back and forthbecause it really fits well together, the different niches that we go in, the hand balancing and theparkour.Copyright © 2013 All Rights Reserved
  4. 4. Also along those lines is Gold Medal Bodies, which is a group of guys that Ryan Hurst, Andy, and Jarlo.They have a number of programs really based around gymnastics and bodyweight training. Once again itfits in really well with my stuff. I’ve made some good money when they’ve launched their courses overthe years so they’re another person that I actually continually promote because it makes me money.So this is the thing. You’re talking about doing specific promotions for these things. It can also be thrownin an autoresponder. For my hand balancing website, something that I’ve done with these guys, theTapp Brothers and Gold Medal Bodies, because I have made a good amount of money just doing one-offpromotions in the past, I decided let’s put these on evergreen so they constantly go through. So I’mpointing them to videos, which has those soft pitches, links, and everything to those programs so Icontinually make money from these guys because I’ve had success. The more success you have withsomething, why try to find something else new? Just turn it into some way that you can continuallymake money off of it.Tyler: Yeah, absolutely. I just forgot one more person I wanted to give an honorable mention tobecause his stuff has always converted well for me. I know he’s actually converting well for you. He’sRick Kaselj from If you guys have people who maybe have knee injuries who areyour clients or shoulder or elbow, pretty much this guy has got an injury solution for everything. So ifyou guys are questioning like, “Oh, damn. He didn’t have one for gout on the page here,” well you mightwant to email Rick and say, “Rick, where’s your fix my gout pain product?” He’ll probably have it. The guyhas got hundreds of products on specific pain. He’s knee-deep in the research. He’s a very sharp guy.You can make sales, like I said, when you have a boot camp or you have clients and they’re like, “Oh, myshoulder’s tweaky,” “Okay, I’m going to email you a product link. I want you to purchase that productand we’re going to start doing that together. Then I want you to take that home and do that byyourself.” Boom! It’s like the easiest sale in the world because it’s high quality stuff. He helps people outand he’s got a really good solution for people who have just kind of muscle and balance issues, thingslike that. If you’re trainer, he’s got some good products out there. I checked out his Muscle ImbalancesRevealed program. He does interviews with some of the top dudes out there talking about muscleimbalances, great information and really cool stuff. So check out Rick’s stuff and sell Rick’s stuff, too. It’shigh quality and converts really well.Logan: Yeah, it’s an easy thing to sell because this goes to a discussion we’ve had before, when you’reselling stuff, if you can get them to feel pain, it’s going to get people to move much better than justsaying, “Hey, you can have six-pack abs and everything.” Better than that, you’d want to go, “You’re fatand disgusting,” if you want to do it. But with pain, it’s easy because—Tyler: You have pain.Logan: Yeah, you have pain and what they get out of it if you offer the solution, it’s relatively cheap andit’s a pretty easy way to go. So yeah, Rick’s stuff has done well in the past and it’s easy to target to theright people. Just say, “Hey, do you have pain?”Copyright © 2013 All Rights Reserved
  5. 5. Tyler: You know what I’m thinking, Logan, right now? Why aren’t we getting second tier commissionson all this shit? We should be getting 5% per sale for referring everybody over there.Logan: I want to mention that, too. There are a couple of different ways you can promote stuff throughan affiliate. In Fitness Money, if you guys haven’t noticed now, we’ve actually had some people call out,“Why aren’t you doing more to promote your show?” and everything. The reason for that is we’re soconcentrated on our other business right now. This is something that in the long term is going to behuge for the both of us by right now we’re really having more fun with it and choosing to spend moretime on our core businesses because that’s where we’re bringing in a lot of money and this will begrown over time. That is why you’re not seeing this promoted out of the whole bunch. We’re reallyleaving it to you, the listener, to spread the information around just because we’re giving such greatinfo.Tyler: Yeah. Maybe like next week or something, we’ll just take this all down, turn it into a product anddrive some traffic at it, and you guys will never see Fitness Money again. I’m just kidding. Keep listeningforever.Logan: Yeah, but one of the things that we’ve done a little bit of I think maybe it’s resulted in a little bitis we get these podcasts transcribed. The reason we do that is for traffic generation. We’ll go into moredetail on that later but we also make recommendations on here. For instance, a couple of podcasts ago,we were talking about Aweber as an email service. Aweber has an affiliate program so in the link on thepodcast where we have it on the site, that’s going through an affiliate link. So if people are looking atthat resource and they click on it, then that can set up a recurring commission.I want to say that, too. If you can get recurring commissions, thats awesome. Recurring payments, anytime you can set that up with a product or anything, a membership site, thats great. It’s not as easy assome people make it sound. It’s the same thing with affiliate stuff. If you can get that recurring, ifsomeone else is selling a membership site and it’s doing real well and you get a commission everymonth that you’re in, that’s a pretty cool thing because then you sell once and get paid repeatedly for it.Tyler: Yeah, absolutely. That’s a good point. I have one more real quick and then we’re going to talk firstabout product creation and then we’ll talk about how to drive traffic to your product and start makingsales of your own stuff. The last one and this one, I can’t believe I forgot this, because you guys areprobably personal trainers, studio owners, BioTrust. It’s a brand new supplement company. It’s onlybeen around for like six or eight months and it’s by a friend of mine, Joel Marion, who is just one of themost amazing marketers I ever met. You’re talking about online businesses. This guy went online and inone year made $700,000. This guy just knows how to hustle. He knows how to write sales copy, abrilliant, brilliant marketer.So he decided to start a supplement company based on the principles that he learned from internetmarketing, which is rare. In a lot of these supplement companies you have to have big media in order tomake money. You have to have traffic from bodybuilding magazine and fitness magazines. BioTrust isdoing it all through affiliate sales right now so get in while the getting is good because your customersCopyright © 2013 All Rights Reserved
  6. 6. are their lifetime customers. It’s really simple. Go to You can just type in ‘BioTrustaffiliates’ and it will probably pop up a page and register. This one actually does take a couple of days forthem to approve your website but—Logan: Actually, I still have not been approved since I did that.Tyler: You might want to check on it because I got approved for two accounts already so I’m good.Anyway, the point is if you have a boot camp list, if you have a gym list, if you have a client list, if youhave supplements you want to use for yourself and you’re just using a whey protein, he’s got a reallyhigh quality whey protein, a good probiotic supplement, some other stuff you could sell to your people,if you’ve got an online list, people are going to buy supplements, no matter what, and you get like 30%on his supplements, 25% or 30%, for life. When you send somebody to his email list, they’re on his emaillist and like I said, he’s a brilliant marketer. So when they get his email and buy through his link, you getpaid. So it’s continuous.I’ve literally sent like maybe 500 people to his site and it just keeps trickling every month, $300, $200.Sometimes I’m just sitting there thinking in my head, “Shit, I need to push this harder.” What if I got to5,000 people on his site then it would be $3,000, $2,000, right. So you’ve got to think about that stuffand supplements are a really easy way to do it. I know if you guys are out there and you’re like oh, it’s apuritan and everything like that, like I said, what you can do is promote the whey protein, promote theprobiotic and you’re good. You don’t have to go into the other fancy stuff that he’s got going on rightthere.But it’s a great supplement company. They have an awesome affiliate program and some fuckingcompanies just suck at that, man. I swear I have an affiliate program with some other companies, I sendpeople and traffic. They buy the stuff, they bring it in and show me they bought it through that link and Inever get paid for it.Logan: Yeah, affiliate tracking is an important thing, kind of a very technical aspect of it but you do wantto make sure that you’re getting credit when you send traffic. That’s a big thing. Another factor to lookat is are you only getting credit for the immediate sales or like with BioTrust here, are you going to get itfor the lifetime of the customer? Does that mean when you send them, you get 75% right now but yousent them that customer and a year from now he buys some other stuff, are you getting commissionsfor that, too? Those are some big factors that can mean a lot of difference in what sort of money youmake that you’ll want to look at when you’re joining these different affiliate programs.Tyler: Absolutely. I’m just going to do a service right now. I have not sent any traffic to BioTrust sincethe beginning of March. I’m just going to open my account real quick and just kind of see where we’re atright here.Logan: Let me mention that with the BioTrust, seeing the success that this company had, I decided tomodel it. If you don’t know, I also have a company called Superman Herbs in which we’re selling someawesome herbs that have some pretty cool benefits. Seeing the success, we decided to model it. It’s athing that we talked about before, modeling those that are successful. We’ve shared with you ourCopyright © 2013 All Rights Reserved
  7. 7. models so we’re rolling out an affiliate program. Now we offer 30% lifetime commissions for the lifetimeof the customer. You can get the same sort of results. You can check them out at down to the bottom, you’ll find the affiliate link and you can sign up there.Tyler: Okay, so there you go. It’s almost $60 and that was, we’re ten days into the month, and I haven’tsent any traffic that way. That’s nothing compared to some of the people that we know who have biggerlists, who are really pitching BioTrust hard. I mean these guys, hundreds, thousands, or even tens ofthousands a month because of this company. So anyway, it’s a great company to support. We’ve beentalking way longer than I thought about these affiliate programs you should support but I think that’sgoing to be really useful information for you guys.Logan, let’s go into product creation. I know we’re not going to have enough time to get into trafficstrategies today so we’ll probably do traffic strategies tomorrow or next time or whenever we’re goingto do it. Product creation, Logan, we already talked about not doing the next P90X. Where do you start?Logan: With product creation, I would say the most essential thing is to do something fast. Whenpeople think in terms of a product, they think it’s going to take months and you know your first product,it tends to be. But it doesn’t have to be that way. You and I have both created products within a matterof days.Here is a huge, huge tip. You might even want to write this one down. It’s that important. Video has thehighest perceived value. You can sell a video or a video series for a lot more than a book typically and it’salso much easier to create than a book. Books take a long time to write and there is a perceived value toa book. If you buy a book from Amazon or a bookstore, $20 or maybe $30, the ebook form is usually,typically in that range, sometimes lower, sometimes a little higher. But a video series, whether you aredoing this online or actual DVDs that you send people, you can charge a lot more for because it just hasthat higher perceived value and it’s also so much easier, it’s insane. The easiest way to create a productis a video.Tyler: Oh, yeah. I’ll tell a personal experience about my Warrior Upper Body System that I recentlylaunched. That was a day of filming. I literally had everything edited and up that same day. It was a longday, don’t get me wrong. It was a 16-hour day but in one day, I went from zero product to product up ona website already set up with edited videos and everything. I did it myself from a fucking Mac so youdon’t have to have anything fancy. You can just—Logan: Don’t get a high-tech camera and find out iPhones have very high quality cameras.Tyler: Yeah, you can do it from your iPhone now. It’s insane. Just plug it into your computer in betweenshots and then you’re good to go. So I did that and then I decided you know what, this is a great videoseries but I’m going to use this as the upsell because I’ve had great success with going from ebooks tovideo upsells. So I was like, okay, I sent it to me transcription lady. Then I pulled some pictures from thevideos and then going through and creating the ebooks for each one of these video courses took me thebetter part of a week.Copyright © 2013 All Rights Reserved
  8. 8. So think about that. I’m selling the front end product for $20 to an upsell of videos for $37. Sotechnically the whole package would have been $57 if I would have put it together in one. The videostook me one day and the books took me weeks. Do I think that that’s a good model to go off of, ebooks,video upsell? Yeah, I think it’s a great model to go off of but it just takes you so much more time to doebooks. So one of the simplest things you can do is think about your idea. We talked about that big idea.You want to have that audience, that direction. You don’t want to be “28-day fat loss.” Whatever yourbig idea is, whatever your cool name is, your cool hook is, make a product out of that.It’s funny because the hook and the name aren’t for the sales letter, it’s for the marketing. It’s notnecessarily for the product. I could write a really cool ass sales letter about high-intensity, metabolicmadness workouts and two methods of this that, people check that out and then they go to the page,and there’s “45 Metabolic Workouts” and they’re just intervals, something like that. It can really be likethat. The product doesn’t have to be something thats never been done before. There are very feworiginal ideas coming out these days. It’s very, very few. I can’t think of any original ideas. Can you thinkof any original ideas, Logan?Logan: Well, I mean there are like small parts that are original. Really in product you can do acompletely “me too” type of product where it’s the same information people can find, in other words,and just change it a little bit. You see what you want to do is you’re going to have a base of informationthat maybe a lot of people can find in different places but you’re bringing in connections from differentareas.As an example, you could read one book on the subject and of course if you then outline that book,filmed that, and turned it into your own product then you could have that. You don’t want to justplagiarize something or just steal all the content. If you take some ideas from that book, you take a fewdifferent other books and you outline the ideas then you bring it all together with some new ideas,some new connections to be made and your own experience, your own twist in different things, that’san easy way to do that.For instance, I was just reading a book by Moshe Feldenkrais and there’s one chapter on breathing andthe specific way that he was going through it was something I hadn’t seen before. That startedgenerating ideas in my head, all the different other stuff I’ve thought about breathing so in the future Imay be doing a breathing course, which would really have some ideas from Moshe, have some ideasfrom different guys, and all these other things and bringing it together, which in studying and workingwith it, I come up with new things that haven’t been seen really anywhere before and it’s reallysomething new and different. I wouldn’t just call it like the Deep Breathing Course. I’d come up withsome sort of sexy name for it.Tyler: Yeah, absolutely. I think that was a great point from Logan because you don’t want to be the “metoo” course because the ability for you to attract other people to promote your product on a “me too”course is really bad. So if you email me and Logan and say, “Hey, check this out. I’ve got his workoutprogram or whatever that uses Tabata intervals, nothing but Tabata intervals.” We’re just going to belike, oh, come on. It has been done. It’s been done over—Copyright © 2013 All Rights Reserved
  9. 9. Logan: Like I could do that. What you’re offering of value—Tyler: Yeah, there’s nothing special. So even if it is something as simple as workouts—there’s nothingwrong with it being as simple as workouts—you just want to have some kind of hook on it. The best wayfor me to tell people to get a good hook is go through sales letters and see what other people are doing.go to the big guys. Go to Adam Steer’s Bodyweight Burn. Check out that program. There are some greathooks in there. Ultimately, his program is just a new program with some bunch of unique bodyweightexercises. It’s really cool.Logan: Just something I’ve been working on lately would be pretty instructive. I’ve been playing aroundwith my whole idea of a morning routine, something that I do every morning where there are somemovements, some energy drills, some different things involved. In some ways, it’s kind of like yourWarrior Warm-up but also very different. Once again, I’m taking ideas from all these different areas,from doing various forms of energy training, various forms of mobility, flexibility, then also strength andskill training, and really putting it all together. I’m calling this right now How to Feel Like a Billion Dollarsbecause that really is the benefit and the end result. If you go through all this, you’re going to feeldramatically greater. You’re also going to be increasing your health, strength, flexibility, mobility, allsorts of things, within a short period of time.With this course, it ended up being about six hours of filming I did over the course of three days orsomething like that and now it’s all edited and ready to go. I just need to start selling it, which I will bedoing soon. I’m deciding whether I’m also going to have a DVD version along with the digital one so I’vejust got to get the art work ready. It’s a really simple process to go through to have that all ready to do.This is like a six-hour video course, six DVDs, high perceived value and didn’t take all that long to do.Contrast that to another project I’m working on. I actually had this as a prepublication offer and as anupsell for the sale I just had, a book. I’ve had this idea for a while. I just haven’t got around to doing itbecause it’s a book. It’s Deceptive Strength: How to Get Strong While Staying Small because a certainnumber of people, when they do that they don’t want to get big, bulky and muscular. They just want tobe really strong for a couple of different reasons.So I actually have already sold this, which is one way to make sure that you work very fast but it’s a bookand I’ve been writing it. I’ve just sort of dragging ass through the process. I need to work faster to do itand I’m actually going to do something that you mentioned that people may have missed. Instead of justwriting it out by hand because it takes a while, if you can record it, whether it in video or audio formthen have that transcribed to be the base of the book that you then edit and format into an actualfinished book project. It’s much faster to speak something rather than to actually type it out. So I’mactually going to do that for the rest of it, having done about half of it by hand so far. It’s already takenmore time and this is something that I sold for $7 thus far now. I’ll be adding some bonuses anddifferent things but this thing has taken more time already than the six-hour video course which I’mgoing to sell at the lowest end at $97, I think. So it’s an interesting case study right there in the time, theeffort involved, and actually what you can get from doing it.Copyright © 2013 All Rights Reserved
  10. 10. Tyler: Yeah, that’s a really good point as well and I think that brings up kind of what we talked about alittle bit last time when I was talking about the whole kettlebell thing that took us days and cost a lot ofmoney is if it’s going to take you longer than a week, then either you’re not motivated or you’ve got likea mental hang up or something. Get it done because all you need to sell a product is a sales letter and apage where you can download the product. That’s it. Thats all you need to sell the product.It’s a sales letter. Go back to our 21-step sales letter formula. Check that out. Write your sales letter. Youcan write a sales letter in one day, easy, and that’s a good template to go off of. You can even check I just put that page up on Friday because I needed something to sell. I took a couple ofbonuses and put them together. That’s what we call a short sales letter. It’s just problem, agitation,solution, benefits. That’s it. It’s super duper easy. That took me literally 45 minutes to put up and I thinkI’ve made—let me just double check here real quick—like $780. Boom! Done! Easy, right?Logan: That brings up a point. Make your first product a short product. Don’t make a huge, huge thing.Don’t do a six-hour video course. If course you want to deliver far more value in the product thanwhatever you’re going to charge for it so if you’re doing a short product, if it’s just a specific solution forsomething, if it really works people are willing to pay for that. But it doesn’t need to be huge.If you are writing a 700-page ebook, no one wants to read that much. They would rather get the sameinformation and it really could be distilled down into 50 or 100 pages. You don’t need to have huge.While there are benefits to having quantity to your product, that definitely does increase the perceivedvalue. If you are looking to get started getting your first product up there because of the things that youlearned in doing that process and then you have something that you can sell then regularly and do abunch more, getting that first product out there is vastly more important than being the greatestproduct ever.Tyler: Absolutely. Logan promoted my first products. It’s good to have a friend in the internet marketingbusiness. We did okay and I built a small email list. I was working forward from there but I made amistake that I changed a couple of months after that. The first—Logan: We should specify this was your second product because your first product, you still haven’t soldyet.Tyler: Yeah, okay. This was a side project. Anyway, so I made this killer video series. I edited it, uploadedit, blah blah blah. I even created an upsell—we’ll talk about upsells later—for the product and startedselling it. The front end offer was $47 and so we had takers. But I had no email list. I had my boot campemail list. That was it. So if you are trying to build an email list, do you think it’s smarter to charge $47,$97, or $67, or how about $7? Who do you think is going to buy more? Obviously, the lower cost one.So one of the things that I did to really accelerate my business was to do a low end offer on the frontbecause then if you are able to contact affiliates like Logan, like me now, like some of the people wetalked about in the beginning of this episode, and they sent traffic your way, as long as your sales pageconverts, you’re going to get a little bit of money on that front end but you’re going to get theircustomer for the life, as long as those people stay with you, for the life of it.Copyright © 2013 All Rights Reserved
  11. 11. And if you’re smart, if you’re good, building an upsell flow behind the product you can make a ton moremoney. I’ll tell you my best upsell flow has generated as much as 430% increase in net on the back end.So what does that mean? Let me pull out to my calculator here real quick. They came to my sales pageand said, “Okay, I will spend $7,” and they ended up spending…Logan: This is the average person spend.Tyler: This is the average person and they’re spending $37. They thought they were only going to spend$7 and they spend additional $30 on the back end.Logan: Now had you had a product that sold for—to make it the same amount--$44, then you wouldn’thave had nearly as many people enter the front end so you wouldn’t have generated that same amountof sales.Tyler: Exactly.Logan: You probably got ten times as much money, at least, or five times as much, I’d say, by having thelow end, front end offer. A lot of people are doing this because it’s working very well these days. It justmatches up with the economy. It’s an easy way for people to get to know, like you and trust you.They’re willing to risk $7 to see if your product is any good, to see if you’re worth following.Tyler: Yeah, if you’re any good. Totally. You know it’s made it so easy for me to build an email list, forme to connect with affiliates, and if you look at percentages of conversions—that means the amount ofpeople who are going to your page versus the amount of people who are buying—if you’re doing like a$7 offer or $9 offer, if you’re doing like a $20 offer or $27 offer, if you don’t get 3% of the people buying,you’ve really got to tweak your sales letter. It’s not good enough. For the most part, what I see isbetween 3% and 10%. If you’re close to that 10%, like if you’re in the 8% range, sure you can make itbetter but you’re kicking ass and taking names. So thats good. If you guys can get up to that 8%, 7%, 6%range, it’s way better. If you’re not at 3% redo your sales letter. Even if you’re at 7%, 6%, or 8%, you cando some advanced split testing stuff and still improve your conversion rates.But if you’re in that $7 range, I’ve had people convert as high as 23%. That’s almost one in four. Say Isent an email out to your webpage and a thousand people go to your webpage, 230 of them are goingto buy your product. That’s amazing! You have 230 customers and if you have a good upsell flow, you’regoing to make way more money on the back end, way more money on the back end. So get a low end,simple front offer up and running and then—I guess we’re going to have to talk about upsells anotherday, Logan.Logan: Well, we’re only scratching the surfaces somewhat in what product creation is. We gave acouple of ideas here but there is so much more you can do, so many ways to make it easy, to make itfast, that this is something we can definitely cover a lot more but it looks like time is up for this episode.Tyler: Yeah. So make it simple, get it up. If you are making a goal of selling your own stuff, ideally youshould have started two episodes back by focusing on your blog, your content, your email list, andCopyright © 2013 All Rights Reserved
  12. 12. providing good content. Then if you’re smart, you probably would have gone straight into some affiliatesales, so making a couple of bucks pitching other people’s stuff, building good relationships, doing thebest you can.My friend, Rick Kaselj, that we plugged in the beginning, he said something to me once that was reallypowerful. He said, “I’m sick of these fucking people saying they have small email lists. Own your lists, dothe best you can.” Because even with somebody like myself with like 3,000 or so people in my email list,you can still get fourth place in a gigantic launch if your people know, like, and trust you enough.Logan: The size of your list is definitely important but it is really that relationship you have with the list,how many of them are actually opening and reading your emails, how many of them are clickingthrough, how many are trusting your recommendation in order to go check out this new thing, thesethings all matter a lot more than I’d say the fact that you have whole bunch of people on your list. Thinkabout it. If you have a 2,000-person email list and you’re getting 50% of the people to open and read,which would be pretty good, even compared to someone with a 100,000-list that’s getting a 2%, you’reactually working with about the same numbers there—I think the math is slightly off—but you get theidea that how you treat your list, how much they’re going to trust you and look at yourrecommendations thus buy from that is a huge part of it and it really does grow over time.This isn’t a get-rich-quick scheme. It does take some time to do this but it does have a lot more potentialfor getting rich quicker than you’re going to get raises at your day job. So this is something that works. Ifbusiness wasn’t growing by several double digits each year, I’d be kind of bummed out. My growthslowed down a bit from like over 50% year over year this past year and I was kind of bummed aboutthat, that I’d only grown about 30%. Try to get a 30% raise at your job, typically it’s not going to happen.There’s no ceiling here. You can really go very far and it doesn’t take all that much to really do it.Tyler: Yeah, absolutely. You guys can replace your job income if it’s $20,000, $50,000 or even $100,000.You can do within six months in your spare time on your online business. Literally six months. Don’tcome in, like Logan said, expecting to get rich quick but do all the steps that we’ve been talking about inthe last few podcasts, give the best information, have a great personality, just keep working on it hardbut like Logan said, you don’t even have to spend a ton of time on it. I have a few friends who arebuilding multiple six-figure or seven-figure online businesses in three hours a day. It doesn’t have to takeall the time in the world. You can replace your income from it.Get your product up. Get your sales letter up. Go back to the 21-step sales letter solution to get yoursales letter up. Get your product up and you know what? Send us a fucking email. Let’s take a look at it.Let’s see where it’s at. Let’s see if it’s something that Logan and I could potentially help you out with andmake some money off of.Logan: Yeah, if you have a good offer, we’re always looking for good promotions that fit our list and canhelp us make money. If thats what you have, then yeah, absolutely. Tell us about it.Tyler: If you can generate me $0.50 per click, I’ll probably send an email for you. If you can generate $1per click, I’m going to send an email for you, or probably two or three. So you can do your own math, ifCopyright © 2013 All Rights Reserved
  13. 13. you don’t math, go to your community college and take math classes and whatnot but if you cangenerate me $1 per click, almost every affiliate’s going to go out there and do that.I know we’re going off tangent here but you can take that data, let’s say you get somebody small topromote you and you go to ClickBank, because you can sell your products through ClickBank which Ihighly recommend because it’s really easy for other people to sell your stuff, you can go take ascreenshot of the data and say, “Hey, look! Tyler made a dollar per click.” Then you can send an email tosomebody bigger. Say, “Hey, check this out! Tyler Bramlett,, made a dollar per click.Do you think that you’d be willing to send an email for me? I’d love to send you a swipe or some greatcontent” and say they’ll either say yes or no. If they say no, say, “Well, I would love to promote yourstuff. Maybe I can get you on the phone sometime and do a podcast,” because thats a great way to getto know somebody. It’s huge. All right, we’re done dropping gold today. You done dropping gold today,Logan?Logan: I think we’ve dropped enough gold. I’ve got to hold onto some.Tyler: You’ve got to hold onto something for yourself. No, I’m just no holds barred on this thing, man.Logan: We got more gold to drop next time.Tyler: Yeah, we will. So well then we’ll talk about sales traffic.Logan: We’re going to traffic definitely. I think we can do two episodes on traffic, thereabouts. It’simportant. Even for a local business, we can touch on that with the subject, too. How do you apply theseconcepts to grow your local business because you can get online traffic to come to a brick-and-mortarplace.Tyler: Yeah. Internet marketing is universally applicable and the people who get good on selling stuff topeople that they don’t know are going to be way better at selling stuff to people that they do know. It’sfantastic. It’s just completely high level stuff that you guys can use in any area of your life. All right, ifyou guys dig this episode share it with your friends. Send us your questions. We’ll get you someanswers. Like us on FacebookFitnessMoneyPodcast,, and I think that’s it, right?Logan’s laughing his ass off.Logan: I believe so.Tyler: He’s like waiting. He’s been crossing his eyes. Did you say everything right? All right, we’ll talk toyou guys next time.Thank you guys so much for listening to the Fitness Money podcast. For more information on how youcan make more money in your fitness business today, go to or go Thanks so much for listening. We’ll see you next time.Copyright © 2013 All Rights Reserved
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