Source File: StevenSislerInterview.
Ari: So now I’m speaking with Stephen Sisler who is the founder of Behavioral Research
Group and a discprofile whichyouare goingto findouta lot more about on this call. So
Stephen thank you so much for taking this time to talk to me.
Steve: Absolutely, thank you.
Ari: So why don’twe start withtalkingaboutsortof whatyou do andwhat the disc profiling
Steve: Okay. I am a behavioral analyst and what I do is I look at the intensities of basically for
basic emotions and seven different attitudes. The disc profiling system is one of the
systemsthatcan be usedtogather the informationwhichiswhatIuse it for. And once I
look at those numbers and look at the intensity of those numbers, I am able to help
individualsunderstandtheirwiring,theiremotionsandthen because of that wiring and
emotional data bank, why they will do the things they will do and we can basically
predict outcomes based upon those emotional frameworks.
Ari: So thisobviously,thisappliestopeople’spersonal livesaswell asroutines and business
of course right?
Steve: Absolutely. It’s a universal language so across all boards. So whether it’s the
relationship,relationshipwitha child and their family, a peer at work, a subordinate or
leaderorif theyare a leaderthemselves,itwill tell ushow they will lead, how they will
mother, how they will father, how they will rebel against their parents if they are
teenagerandso once we understand that then we can strategize how to get around it.
Ari: Aha!Okay,so my firstquestionthenaboutthatis,soI filledoutaassessmentandwe’re
goingto talkabout mine onthiscall but there are a lot of questions that were… You are
basicallyjust describing yourself of being like a certain trait and less like a certain trait
and I found some of them were a little confusing and hard to pick. Not a way to beat
this, but are people… How honest is the assessment essentially?
Steve: Well typicallypeopleare paying adecentamountof moneyforthis so they do not try to
be something they are not.
Steve: In the lastdecade I maybe have discovered three that may be tried to do that to such a
degree that it was the opposite of who they were. But typically you don’t have that, I
don’t deal with it, I don’t see very often.
Ari: Alright, okay so you’re not doing disc profiles on like inmates basically?
Ari: These are people whowant toimprove insome wayor anotheror discoversomethingis
about themselves. But even so like there were certain things where, are you more or
lesslike this,andtheywere inmymind,theyweren’toppositesnecessarilysoIfeltlike I
guessed on a couple of them in some ways but is it set up that way?
Steve: Yeah. I could typically get what I call a red flag or a flatline which means I understand
somebodywhoistryingtooverthinkthe instrumentor I can see numbers come in and I
say, “Oh, I bet they are this” and then look and sure enough they are.
Ari: And that is what you do with me actually?
Steve: I did that with you. I knew you over thought the product because you are a high
theoretical. So I assumed you were and 80, I looked at that you were and 83. And that
was like 20 pages away, I just flipped over and looked at it and I was like yeah, that
Ari: So let’stalkaboutfora secondwhat those four letters mean and what they kind of the
Steve: Yeah, the “D” stands for dominance and it represents an anger emotion. So the higher
the anger emotion then the more direct, the more decisive a person becomes. If it’s
lower, which is anything below 50 on a scale of 1 to 100, then the dominance line
becomesmore passive soitbecomesmore amiable,friendly,peaceful,unobtrusive and
kind of not making any waves kind of person.
The influence line “I”,isthe optimistic emotion and is the most emotional health of all
the letters.Sothe higherthe influence line,the more magnetic, the more outgoing, the
more positive,the more talkative verbalaggressionand whenit’s lower down below 50
then we get logic and so we go from the King of Queens to his wife. So the show,
“Everybody loves Raymond? We go from Raymonde to his wife in this show because
they are opposites and that’s why the show works.
The “S” line, the higher the “S” line goals they more [04:49 GAP] unsystematic, alert,
kind of a high wired or person and very variety driven. And then at the compliant line,
that’s the fear emotion. So the higher the compliant line the more they have a
heightenedawarenessof errorsandmistakesbecause they are afraid of screwing it up.
And then when the “C” line drops down, the more independent, self-willed and
stubbornandfearlesstheybecome.Soif youhave achildthat ishigh dominant and low
compliant, they are always not doing what their parents ask but it just means they are
leadersowhatwe dois we punishthe leadership and we try to reward something they
are not and once we understand what’s going on, there is a way around that and they
can become a really great person but most of these people are misinterpreted,
especially in school.
Ari: Okay. I guess the best way to do this is to sort of give mine as an example right?
Steve: Well, I’m going to go with your adapted style, it’s the strongest read which is you’re
Ari: I am sorry, what is that mean “adaptive style”?
Steve: Adaptive style is how you respond to the work environment.
Steve: Okay and so if I am obnoxious, load, talkative, always telling jokes and now I’m at the
funeral,Iam probablynotgoingto dothat. The reasonbeingisbecause Iam responding
differently to that environment because I believe that new environment warrants the
newwayI am acting. Andwe all do that whereverwe go,we puton the game face.If we
go shopping,if we goto a relative’shouse, if we go to the in-laws, there is an adaption
to the behavior. When we go to work, there’s an adaption to the behavior. If I am
carelessbutI go to workto buildbombs,Iam certainlynotgoingtobe careless there so
I have to make an adaptationokay.Soyour adaptationisyour work style and your work
style is what looks like to be the project manager; get it done, get it done right, don’t
bother me unless it’s an emergency.
Ari: Yeah, okay.
Steve: And so that’s a task oriented person. So you have a high anger emotion, you are a 73
which means you are driven, you’re all about results, it means you are pioneering and
your mind, everything is on a timeline; it’s got to get it done now or yesterday. Your
influenceline islow,it’sa38 so you’re goingto be very logical. So if I say, “Hey, are you
goingto go to thismeetingthisafternoon” and you’re not going, you might just look at
me and go, “No.” And that’s it, we’re done.
Steve: And if I am the high influencer I am waiting for, “Oh, are you going or something” but
there isnothingthere.Youansweredthe questionbecause you are high dominant, you
are no influence. So the goal is the goal which was the answer the question which you
answered it, you are done.
Ari: Oh my God, I’m going to make sure my wife doesn’t listen to this podcast.
Steve: Okay. Your steady line is low, it is a 41 which means you’re impatient, which means
nothing other than your extremely flexible. The more flexible you are the more
impatient you become and the reason being is because when things, people or
situations don’t move with you, you get frustrated. And so it displays as what we call
impatience. But what they really means is you have the ability to turn on a dime if
somebody else doesn’t, is going to show up.
And then you are compliant line is high and it’s a 70 which means you have a
heightened awareness of errors and mistakes. In other words if you are going to have
your name onit, itbetterbe right. So therefore get it done on the dominant line, get it
done right in the compliant line and the fear line and then you “I” and you “S” are low
whichmeans,kindof are the people pieces;emotional, how are you doing, “hey, that’s
nice outfitsyou’ve got on today”. You really don’t care about that because you are just
kindof lookingatthe bottomline.You’re looking at, “Are we getting this done today?”
So youare more about the process of getting it done more than you are the product of
getting it done but in the end it’s about is going to get done. So it can be confusing to
people.Andyourgraphiscalledthe creative pattern. It’s very no-nonsense, kind of cut
to the chase. So going to your office might feel like I am going to see the principal.
Ari: Okay, yeah, I could see that.
Steve: So it’s not about good or bad, it’s about how the wiring is. And so you do things far
betterthanyou dopeople.Andbecause thingsdon’targue andthat’sreallywhyyouare
fastand decisive.You are about productivity, you are about control, you want to these
thingsdone.Youare not as interestedinparticipatingwithsomebody because they are
probably going to be in your way and so what ends up happening is you do things in
spite of people,betterthanyoudothingswith our through people. It has nothing to do
withwhetherorwhetherornot youlike people, it just means that when your machine
getsgoing,itis a machine andthenif we getinthe way,we couldlose an arm. And it’s a
machine,it’snotthinking,“Oh, I need to slow down, this guy has got white clothes on,
somethingmightgetonit.”You are the type style that is in the snow cloud going down
the streetand all of a suddenyourealize youhitsomebody.Yourfirst thought is, “What
are they doing in the road?”
Steve: Not,“Oh my God,I hit somebody!” Because youare because youare logical; logical you
don’t stand in front of snow clouds.
Steve: So that’swhere yougo and in the end of course, you’re going to be said, of course that
but the way you are thinking is, “Where are their parents?”
Steve: That’s how your brain works. So this is an efficient machine kind of a style. Is that
Ari: Absolutely! Oh my God, it’s… Yeah!
Steve: Andyou are alwayspayingclose attention toeverything you do without thinking about
it.In otherwords, harder for me to even explain you are not caring about loss of social
recognition, that’s not what you are there, you are there to get something
accomplished, you’re not there to get praised. So if somebody accomplishes in
something they want praise and they work for you, you’re probably not going to give
them any because you are thinking, “That’s what you’re supposed to do, great! What
youwant me to do sing-alonganddance?That’s what I paid you to do.” Like that’s how
your mind works. Whereas they don’t work that way, they are thinking, “I did a great
job.” You are thinking, “That’s what you’re supposed to do” and so there is now a
conundrum that’s created. So if you want to get more out of that person guess what?
You’re goingto have to stepout of yourself andgo,“Oh myGod, that’swhat I hiredyou,
Steve: You have to work harder. You see what I mean?
Ari: Oh yeah!
Steve: We have to playto everyone else’s strength,not our own if we want to get more out of
Ari: Yeah, this could be why I don’t have any actual personal employees, everything is
Steve: Right, so that’s going to work really well for you. The less people you have to
emotionally navigate, the better and so your style fits really well with that kind of a
model which will make sky the limit for you.
Ari: AndI just want to pause for a second and point out to people that Steve doesn’t really
know me, we haven’t been friends for years, this is all based on a questionnaire that I
filled out and it’s unbelievably accurate. It’s shocking what you are getting out of this.
Steve: Yeah,I debriefedsomebodyforsix hours one time on 11 numbers. So you’re also, I can
keep going here.
Ari: Oh please!
Steve: You are also a perfectionist. So you are going to be a really hard on yourself, in other
wordsyou don’tgive yourselfanyroom.Therefore youwill see the world this way, you
will be less apt to give anybody else room because you don’t give yourself any. The
other thing with your style is we talk about it earlier, very highly theoretically driven
whichmeansyouare a thinker.Soyou’ve gota lotgoingon inthe craniumof yours. You
know more by accident that some people are trying to learn on purpose.
Ari: Oh yeah.
Steve: So I am not blowing smoke, this is in your numbers.
Ari: That is a cool way of putting it.
Steve: You have what is called a large catchment area; in other words, when we are going
throughout the day, we are taking in information through all our sense gates and you
are bringing in a lot more information than the average bear because you are catching
thingsonthe peripheral andlearning from it which is why you can look at the situation
and just know what to do and you are not sure we’re getting the information from
because you caught it somewhere. And you are catching such a vast amount of it, you
just pull out at random when you need it, it’s sort of like MacGyver.
Ari: That’s awesome!
Steve: That’s kind of your style. Now what happens is you can be very impatient when other
people can’tpull it out as well as you can. You can’t understand why you are looking at
something maybe they are doing and you are like, “Why didn’t you just do this?” And
then look at that as if you just handed them a gift, they didn’t know it was there.
Steve: Andso whatpeople needtounderstandisalotof timespeople like you,peoplewhoare
equal to or greater than we are you are at are your competition, they are not working
Steve: On the average.Andso it’shard havinga companywhenyouare anomolicinyour style;
inotherwords the average in the states is about 44 for theoretically driven minds, you
are an 83.
Ari: Wow, okay.
Steve: Okayso what doesthatmean? It meansout of 100 people you are going to really enjoy
the conversation with less than 20 of them.
Steve: Because it’snotstimulating.Sobasicallytoputitina bluntfashion,youdon’tdo stupid.
Steve: That’s justthe way you are so you are going to tune out really quick if you are with the
situation or a person or something and it’s not at that level like you are already done,
you are just buying your time at that point. Now body language 53% of everything we
say andso words are 7% so guess what, everybody already knows you’ve checked out.
Steve: But because you’re not emotionally astute you are a student when it comes to
theoretically,you’re going to probably miss the cue so you don’t really know what you
looklike ina situationsothatpersoncouldleave withhurtfeelingsandyouare thinking,
“I don’t know what he is upset about!”
Ari: Again, I’m really glad my wife is not listening to the podcast.
Steve: The other thinghere is emotionally speaking, you don’t get into the car unless you are
Steve: Okayso what that meansisyoudon’tdo the backseat.You don’t do with the passenger
seat,youwoulddothe driver seat and I have a lot of people that think this way as well
but they can’t tell the person in the driver seat to get out of the seat but you can.
Ari: So that’s like if I am not angry then you should be angry is that what you mean?
Steve: Well, what I mean is let’s say a situation arises and we will just look at the model of
gettingina vehicle asthat situation, the situation could be anything. If you go to get in
that car and there is somebody sitting in the driver seat, you’re going to say, “Okay,
listen is my time to drive. You need to sit in the back.” You will do that whereas some
people they get in the back and they complain to a safe person that they should be
driving but they don’t allow them to.
Steve: You will never be in that situation. You’re going to be like, “Dude, your time is up, my
turn.” And then you’re going to get into the front seat and so in a conversation I might
say… Let’ssay ina conversationyourwife let’ssay,youdon’tlisten…We eitherlistenfor
one off three reasons;we either listen so we can direct and control once we figure out
what’sgoingon or we listensothatwe can agree withit or disagree with it or we listen
so that we can understand it. Typically, your style listens to direct and control in other
wordsif your wife hada bad dayat somethinghappensandshe says, “Well here’s what
happened”, while she is talking, you are thinking, “Why didn’t you just do this?”
Steve: The firstthingthat comesin your mind now why are you thinking that? You’re thinking
youare goingto helpthe situation,“Well, I would tell her to do this and this will never
happen again, it shall be great.” But if she wants you to listen to understand, then you
don’tunderstandthatmodel because of that doesn’t accomplish anything. So you feel
like you are leaving her in a lurch if you don’t tell her what to do.
Ari: I will just tell you this is really funny because last night my wife wanted to talk about
something and I said something that I wasn’t trying to get her to stop talking but I was
justtellingherthat I was tired and she took that very badly and we had to have a small
argumentaboutit and eveninthe argumentIwas beinganidiotandI am saying,“Okay,
I get it now let’s stop arguing and get back to what you wanted to talk about.”
Steve: Andthat’s because…I’mgoingtosay somethingthat’sgoingtofreakyou out a little but
you’ve got to let me finish what I’m going to say.
Steve: You have psychopathic tendencies.
Ari: Oh,I have talkedaboutthison thispodcastbefore.There wasa bookcalledThe wisdom
of psychopaths and I found it was written for me.
Steve: Okay!Andyou have psychopathictendencies which means if the family dog is 12 years
old, it’s dragging its legs around, it’s sick and the vet wants 600 bucks to figure out
what’s wrong and then another 180 to put it down, you are going to shoot it in the
backyard. Not thatyou will,youcould,youcouldshootthe dogin the backyard, throw a
toy in the hole with it and burry it and go have a Starbucks.
Ari: Our family dog is 12 so you just broke my heart a little bit but okay go on.
Steve: But you could do that.
Ari: Yes, yeah.
Steve: Andit wouldn’truinyourday,itwouldbe like it’s sad, yeah but you know what oh, I’ve
got an appointment. You can compartmentalize it whereas you probably, your wife is
probably a stabilizer and the more verbal person in the relationship I am imagining.
Ari: Yeah, my wife is French if that says anything.
Steve: Yeah,and she probablywasattractedto you because she knows that one of the things,
she knows if anybody broke in the house, it would be the last house they broke into.
Ari: Yeah, wow! You’ve got a lot of good soundbites Steve! Wow, okay.
Steve: So she feels safe with you because she knows you are fearless, you have respect. So
that’spart of whatthat dynamic. The otherthing is, you are efficient, your fast and you
cut to the chase which she may not… She could be, “Oh my God, where did the time
go?” Therefore there is an attraction to the difference in the behavioral dynamics and
then longevity in a relationship comes from the similarities and the attitudes which
And so in your value base, basically you are very protective of your own turf which
meansyouwouldbe protective of yourfamilyand things like that as well. With you it’s
almostlike aCatch-22 whenit comes to people; you can’t live with them and you can’t
live withoutthemsowhatdowe do? Well,we justfindthe goodonesandwe workwith
them.That’skindof how yourbrain worksof these thingsout.Youare also a very black-
and-white thinker; once you know what to do you can drop the hammer pretty quick.
You don’tbelaborit,youjustact whichisanotherplus but it can also, your strength can
become your weakness if you’re not aware how strong they are. And you are very
strong, you are very decisive and you are very cut and dry and so an emotional person
feelslike youdon’tcare wheninreality,youprobably care equal to or greater than they
do, you just show it differently.
So rather than saying, “Oh, you are so beautiful, I love you so much” and touchy-feely
more like that, you’re more like, “You know what, I’m going to give you the studio you
wanted”thenyouwill justdoit.Andthenit’sdone and thenyoufeel like 1millionbucks
because you created something that wasn’t there, you did it for them and she might
have been happy if you looked at that painting and go, “This is so beautiful.” Like that
mighthave beenequal towhat you did you know what I mean? It’s just how you think.
Steve: Andonce you understandhow anotherpersoniswiredthenthe magicstarts happening
and so rather than saying, “What did I tell you about that?” You might want to say,
“Have we talk about this?” When you know for sure you have talked about it! You’ve
talkabout itactuallythree times!Butif youusedcommasand question marks it creates
a invitation into the situation rather than periods and exclamation points which slams
the door and so depending upon who the person is. Now, you could get away with an
exclamation point with me because my “D” is 100 okay but maybe with your wife you
want.Andyou mightbe thinking,“Whatare you talking about? I am just telling you the
Steve: So she isthinking,“Youare rainingon the parade.” But you are thinking, “It might need
to be rainedon.”It is because if youare familiarwiththe StarTrek series,it’s Mr. Spock.
Steve: It’sjust like,“Spock,you’re alive!” And he just looks at him and goes, “Logical captain.”
Steve: Right. You stated the truth, we are done let’s move on. And that’s how your brain
Ari: Wow! Well Steve, I want to be respectful of your time here. This is very odd because
it’s… Nothing you said is completely surprising but it’s also really eye-opening at the
same time if that makes any sense.
Steve: Sure,yeah.It’sgreat when we understand it and that’s what emotional intelligence is,
it’s understanding how you are wired and managing it depending upon who you are
with, that’s it, it’s that simple.
Ari: Okay so I want to just again reiterate for people. So this is… We’ve talked about
relationships and stuff but this goes into how you hire people, who you choose is a
cofounder, as a partner, this is the kind of work you do right?
Steve: Yeah, absolutely. I work with partnerships, I just did a multi, multibillion-dollar group
that has an online business is selling health products and I looked at the four of them
and it was for me it was hysterical. I know exactly what is going on with these people
and so when we had our conference am like, “Okay, you are the driver, you are the
resistor”andI saidto the otherguy,“You are neutral.”Sowhen you’re with this person
you’re like, “Yeah, I know what you mean.” And when you’re with that person you’re
like,“Yeah,youknowwhatyoumean.”You’re not going to reveal to everybody what is
exactlygoingon.Theywere laughingbutatthe same time takingnotes. They were like,
“Okay, this is making complete sense.”
Steve: Andnowgoingforward,they’ve changedtheir strategy completely with how they deal
with each other and it’s because of our styles and once we understand it to then
everythingworks.Andsowhentryingtobringina high-profile positionand I can look at
that personthatis their candidate and I will say, “Okay, what is this person going to be
doing?Where he needstobe doing…Well,thatingoing to work.” “Why?” “He can’t say
“no”.” You cannotsay “no.” What are the oddsof that happening?82.4% whichispretty
darn high.Now,doyouwant to risk all that? I did that with a company. I told them that
theyshouldn’tdoitand theydiditand thena year latertheylet them go for the reason
I said they shouldn’t do it and it cost them 700 grand.
Ari: Yeah, wow.
Steve: Theyhad me speakingof their sales conference the year after and introduce me as the
guy theyfailedtolisten to. So everybody that works in this company goes through this
Ari: That’s great!
Steve: It helpsidentify what you are looking for in an individual for that particular culture. So
some cultures are ask task oriented, some are very touchy-feely. You don’t want to be
on the tail end of that one.
Ari: Yeah,and thisisfunnytoo because one of the thingsthatI do withclients is I like I have
several clients who will buy companies and they want to optimize them, automate
them, outsource all that stuff and maybe flip them or whatever and I have never have
had an issue aboutdownsizing companies and firing people because in my mind, and I
have explainedthisandIunderstandhow coldthis may sound but in my mind, they are
not,as a resource,thatpersonisnot beingallocatedefficientlyif theyare ina job in this
company that is not being served properly and I think they would be better off in
another job too and certainly the company would be better off. So I guess you sort of
reiterated what I feel that way.
Steve: Sure,yeah!Again,youare veryblack-and-white thinker.Youthinkthere isonly one way
to skin a cat, the right way. Some people think like, “I don’t care how you skin the cat,
just don’t get blood on the carpet” and theywalk out of the room.
Ari: Right.Well,okaysowe are prettymuch outof time here.Thisasbeinglike amazing and
I really… Can people take the assessment on your website? How can people find out
Steve: The assessmenttheypay for and the way I do it because I am in 18 countries, there is a
lot of people that are becoming more and more aware of this, they go on my website,
then they have to contact me through the contact form which kinds of pops up in your
face.So if theywantto contact to do something,that’show we doitand I lettheminon
what it’s going to look like and then they decide yes or no.
Ari: Great. Well so and we are going to put links in the show notes. So what is your URL?
Steve: It’s www.behavioralresourcegroup.com
Ari: So great, we’re going to put that in there in the links and Steve thank you so much for
givingme the opportunity to hear my sort of debrief, I really appreciate you taking the
time, it’s been awesome talking to you.
Steve: The pleasure is mine.