The purpose of life & universe ( iln )

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  • 1. ^^^^^^ The Pupose of LifeAvadhesh Varshneya • Please reada book called "Autobiography of aYogi" by Swarmi Yoganand. Thebook summarily answers all thequestions of yours.24 days ago • Like •2Follow venugopalvenugopal maganti • I believe that the primary purpose of life is to re produce and keep the speciesgoing ,like all other animals.The more important purpose,as humans, is to improve lives of as manypeople as possible,whether or not they related to you,.The universe exists to support the earth,whichalone can support life.The question of life on other planets will be a matter of conjecture forever.,for,man is an animal with infinite capacity to dream and imagine.23 days ago • Like •1Follow Ravi KantRavi Kant Maheshwari • Ravi Kant Maheshwari • I am also excited to know opinions.....keep onposting..23 days ago • Like •
  • 2. 1Follow SteveSteve Dufourny • Hi Dear all,I beleive humbly that we are catalyzers of the universal 3D sphere. Inside this sphere, we have a center,the most important sphere.After we have the cosmological fractal with the moons, the planets, the stars,the BH, the groups of Super BH .......we have also inside this sphere, quantum spheres, coded since thebegining. The evolution is a road of optimization towards the eternal creativity. We are still young atthe universal scale. 13.7 to 15 billions years, it is young still. All is light in fact, a light became mass onthe line of time. All is composed by the same essence, spheres turning .....If we are on Earth , there are reasons, we are catalyzers of spherization and harmonization. Theconsciouness and the intelligence are tools of spherization and harmonization. All is linked since thebegining....23 days ago • Like •2Follow ChiranjeeviChiranjeevi Tallapragada • Thank you @Avadesh. I will check it out. I would also be interested inknowing from common people like us how they feel about life. Sometimes whenI flood the dish to drain out ants I feel may be someone is also drainingus out. May be we are also one sort of bacteria some spoiling and somecleaning up or rejuvenating the earth. What are we in someone elses eyes(like may be god?)23 days ago • Like •2karthikeyan arumugathandavan • Chiranjeevi, interesting topic........ to share a similar thought, when we are forced chase the ants of many types in many situations , Iused to wonder One mug of water is complete flooding for them and a bucket poured is literalTsunami ..!!But could we adjust to live, as suggested by some schools of thought to accommodate all beings &creatures ...... next to impossibility.The compromise is the purpose of life .23 days ago •3
  • 3. Follow jayendrajayendra upadhye • Chiranjeevi Tallapragada:I am a fence sitter. Neither religious nor irrligious. Let me explain. Do you know the mayawadis ..howthey say "Neti-Neti" or "Na-iti", meaning "this is not it".I prescribe to it in my own way ..not all of science nor all of religion!What I like about the Rigveda is its Nasadiya sukta, where the concept of the beginning of time andspace is described. It states that before Cosmos evolved out of Chaos, there existed a single entity theveda calls Hiranya Garbha. "The one with light within". It is interpreted as the Brahmanda or thecosmic egg.Formal religion loses its bearings in such an era. Where time and space have no meaning, when chaospervades all. Described as "Gahanam agbhiram Saleela", the water of space. Narayan (the one whocame over the waters - of space), is the god underpinning Brahma. (Narayan is no doubt a lateraddition).here is a good translation in english...from wikipedia.Who really knows? Who shall declare it here?Whence was it born? Whence issued this creation?Even the Gods came after its emergence.Then who can tell from whence it came to be?None knows when creation has arisen;Whether He made it or did not make it,He who surveys it in the highest heaven,Only He knows, or maybe even He knows not.Hinduism is the only religion that asked such questions thousands of years ago. No wonder Sankhyasgodless creed developed here. (impersonal formless god).Read the real sukta here and may be you will get some answer.This ekam eva advitiya was infested with Ahankara (awareness of the self, ego) and it thought "I amone let me be many" and that started the world.In such a scenario, there will be many like us, at other places in the cosmos, some much more ancientthan us!23 days ago • Like •3Follow jayendrajayendra upadhye • Now using Neti-Neti, switch your position and go the scientefic/logical way.Penguins, to impress their females gather stones all around their legs. The lady-penguin is impressedwith the guy with most stones. The guy thinks "hey I am rich"! Presto, the lady uses the nest to breed.Both are happy. They breed, raise young and die. The stones are forgotten.Now look at humans ..they amass riches and power, (stones on a beach), impress women, raisechildren, fight some wars (sangharsh), win some lose some, then die.The riches stay back, are used up and gone.Who gains? What is the gain?I sometimes feel it is all a jaal. The ultimate gainer is the impersonal collection we call the species.People come and go, the only objective is the simplest one! Perpetuation of the species.
  • 4. And higher up somewhere, the super organism GAIA straddles the planet in splendid isolation. It plans,It plots, Its ultimate purpose entirely out of our puny ambit, and drives life throughout. Kasmai devayahavisha vidhema?Who is this GOD, that we shall worship?23 days ago • Like •2Follow jayendrajayendra upadhye • The sukta link... .23 days ago • Like •Follow ChiranjeeviChiranjeevi Tallapragada • Thank you @Jayendra. Some I understood some I didnt. May be that iswhy Iasked this question. As they say one who knows wont have any questions andone who doesnt know also wont have any questions.I liked your Penguins example. The only difference is both men, women aswell as children are after the pebbles in case of human beings.There is this movie In Time. Where everyone remains young but lives onlyfor one year after they are 20. The transactions are all in terms of time.Very interesting concept. Everyone spends the time left to gain time sothat they can live longer. I wonder if this is the purpose of life on earthto keep working to extend ones life. Those who have plenty of time dontknow what to do with their time. Theirtime goes in protecting that nobody steals their time. It sounds funny whenseen in this way. But how different is real life anyway?23 days ago • Like •1Follow venugopalvenugopal maganti • I am no fence sitter,and the universe is supposed to have started from soonya,--apoint which has no dimensions,but from it emerge lines,figures in 2,3 and multi dimensions-and theentire universe-when did this happen?from the dimension less point emerged the universe in an infinitely tiny fraction of a second,and that is the beginning of the cosmic time scale,on which ,again theappearance and extinction of human beings is ,but a small fraction-and when does it end,and how?itwill go back in to the dimension less point,from which it once emerged,again in a tiny fraction of asecond--and when?when the cosmic time scale decides to stop--and who decides?the same one whoinitiated the creation--whether that some body exists or not,is a question with out answer--one should
  • 5. ask him/her self,what gives a person conscious ness,and what happens to it ,when he leaves the world--it is an oscillating pendulum,between life and death ,with no resting point--only life and death arecertain,and even that appears to be a maya,if you think too much--that is why mere mortals like me arehappy with a simplistic explanation,AS I MENTIONED IN MY EARLIER COMMENT and carry onwith my work in the time left for me on this great earth(I,WHO?)23 days ago • Like •1karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-( then ) .......What is the purpose of the Universe ?!?!23 days ago •Follow jayendrajayendra upadhye • Karthikeyan, mere mortals dont bother with that question.But it is entirely possible that if there is a creator, the purpose may be so alien and lofty, we wontaccept it even if someone were to tell it.Read "Childhoods end" (Clarke / Aldiss). It is powerful SF.It deals with this question.22 days ago • Like •Follow SyedSyed Imam • I think answer to this question is that its a test for us and who pass will be rewardedHeaven and failure to this test will thrown to Hell22 days ago • Like •1Follow UjwalUjwal Jha • I find this post a bit Childish. Young people like to ask these question, there is no answer tothis question however there are many people searching for the answers everyday. We do have betterunderstanding to the world we live.To understand this we need to know what we are, you may not enjoy to learn that we humans are! Weare the most dangerous virus, and as we know that the viruses (most of them) are tuned to use theavailable resources and grow as fast as one virus can. We are doing the same, consuming the resourcesas and growing our population.
  • 6. If you look at scientific researches made through out the history until today has two basic purposes.1. Provide human longer life. Which of course has got lots of success as well. We live twice as longerthan just 100 years ago our ancestors could even imagine.1. Find ways to travel faster. If we want to know what is around earth and what is in our solar system,we must travel faster. We have had great success in knowing about our solar system.There is nothing called Grand Design of GOD. Life is evolved. There are 16 episodes of The universeseries on History Chanel. Watch them ....... It has latest information from different Probes in Spaceupdated till 2010.If the knowledge of these discoveries becomes common, most of religion will lose its holds. But thetruth is truth. We are a kind of virus and we need more and more resources to live comfortably andhealthy so that we can travel faster and gather all the resources available in the universe.22 days ago • Like •1karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-Ujwal,I think about religion / tradition / culture on this subcontinent , you have unscientific view. All Indianpractices have a very strong scientific basis .There are many many examples ..........!!22 days ago •4Follow jayendrajayendra upadhye • Ujawal.." travel faster and gather all the resources available in the universe. " anddo what?THAT was the question.What is the purpose of life on earth? Why does the universe exist? Does anyone or anything else knowsabout existence other than us?Truly speaking, we dont know the answer.If self replicating DNA evolved into what we are today, WHY did that happen? Sirely there needs to bea purpose?You can understand the uselessness of ear sleep breed die cycle after cycle..surely?22 days ago • Like •1
  • 7. Follow jayendrajayendra upadhye • We need to know the higher purpose. Some claom to see it. Others theorize only.But try we must.Even if childishly.22 days ago • Like •Follow jayendrajayendra upadhye • Syed Imam:I have nothing against religion, but...What is the point of sending people to eternal damnation and eternal heaven?That would be a sheer waste of resources. Even for god!Furthermore, a god who makes us, and whom you call Rahim (merciful), why the heck would hebehave llike some D company Don, being judgemental on his own creation!What would be the difference then in such a vengeful angry god and a village hegemon?Break out of this shell of human values plastered on a god.A universal god is above all this. Has to be.Vedic aryans had these jealous gods (Indra). European aryans had Thor and Odin.But later the Indian aryans realized their error and talked of the one god that is all encompassing.Even later, came the nirishwarvadis godless creeds who were equally respected. Buddha himself didnot advocate any god.He stressed more on Pancha-Shila.Something akin to a chinese religion that stresses more on right actions.THAT is nore honest than saying god will eternally damn or reward some one for their actions.THAT leaves NO room for improvement / refornation.Yes the concept of Tauba is there, but what of prople who never repent? Eternal hell?Karma siddhanta atleast holds out promise of salvation even to the damned of the damned.21 days ago • Like •2Follow jayendrajayendra upadhye • Good Zinnia M, but it pains me when perfectly well educated people stick to this"angry god heaven hell" stuff just as an article of faith. I expect educated people NOT to take anythingas just "articles of faith" Afterall here we are, discussing higher things and here is "alice in wonderlandstuff"! Its a bit difficult to sromach once we see that historically these heaven / hell guys have betweenthem killed more people than most other religions. The Bible with its inquisition, and crusades, andIslam with its sowrd. The massacres in India are legend. Are we to endure these things again and again?Akbar the greats massace at Chottod after Haldi Ghati is famous. And so is Nadir Shahs at Delhi.There is something barbaric and uncouth about this pious heaven / hell bullshit, and someone has tocall a spade a spade. Enough of Nehruvian hypocrisy of sugar coating things and calling all that"historical ties"! All I can say is "My foot"!
  • 8. 21 days ago • Like •Follow venugopalvenugopal maganti • I find odd comments like childish--,a bit too harsh--for thosands of years,Indiansspent millions of hours on this subject and concluded that every thing you feel,see and enjoy ismomentary and later a myth.Every thing is dependent on mans imagination,invention,and through hisconstant endeavor man has always tried to modify,nature ,rather than adapt and live with it in peace.Ifthe chinese had advanced science and maths ,back in 4th or 5th centiuries,the europeans re discoveredthe likes of telescope,only in 14 th century from the chinese version--and the Indians had astronomyand maths with them for thousands of years--while the animal lurking in the man always tells him tolive to feed and re produce,even at the expense of others,religion,philosophy,culture,traditions,andcivility tried to reign in these animal instincts,and hence this 7 billion population today--simultaneously,Indian philosophy sought to put the limitations and illusions of human mind throughseveral texts in perspective,which were developed by the best possible minds over thousands of years.A regular example quoted is ,there are a thousand earthern pots with water,and in each pot the Sun ispresent--its image gives you the impression that the sun is present in each one of them--and this is theillusion,that the man feels,as he is himself the earthern pot(body) ,and the conscious of self being theimage,the Sun here represents the universal/cosmic conscious,which itself can be an illusion,andconsequently,the image in the earthern potBy the way,I too am an engineer,and know that science has improved human life,and has given it manypleasures--but,it also threatens to destroy the species,and whether we will bequeath anything to futuregenerations ,again depends on the wisdom of humans--science,my friends,is no gospel of truth,andoften contradicts it self--and the knowledge TV channels also dish out several programmes on Egyptianmummies,allegedly based on re search by western scholars,re searchers,and intellectuals--the visualimpact of all those stars exploding,formation of earth,moon,evolution of life etc,, are theories,myfriends,there is no video of the original events--yes,they give you enough logic,and create the illusionin audience that what they propose is absolutely true and nothing but true--what they do not show,however are the views of a plethora of scientists,who oppose these views as mere imagination,and full offalse assumptions--if theory of relativity it self is disputed,what else can be an etenal truth?And by theway,ALBERT EINSTEIN was no atheist--why?Be cause science helps you only to understand nature and not create it--and to day,as now sciencesays,the axiom that energy can not be produced or destroyed,but can only be transformed from oneform to other--it self stands contradicted,with big bang theory--no body is sure,whether energy gotcreated first,or matter,as they are both interchangeable.Lets keep science and religion separate,but Imust remind you,both are dependent on faith of their followers21 days ago • Like •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • Venugopal.........Nice posting there but please have one point for further thoughts / consideration................ as far this sub-continent is concerned, religion was and is Science !!
  • 9. 21 days ago •Follow VivekVivek Srivastava • The purpose of life is to live on this earth enjoy the resources without any damage tonature or hurting anyone.If you enjoy your life your creator will also feel happy ( Like a parent feelhappy if Kids are happy ).why some one created this life system , to my understanding its all tomaintain the flow of life itself, thats why the reproduction capabilities.There is no sperate Heven orHell , its all in this life only.there are five mahaboot which controls the life - kaam, krodh, lobh, mohand ersya.for more information please refer book Gita.21 days ago • Like •1Follow SyedSyed Imam • @ Jayendra, Yes Allah is Rahim, but also He is the best Judge, and in law Good and Evilcannot be equal, and according to law Evil is bound to be panalised for his acts. You are free to haveyour own views.21 days ago • Like •Follow jayendrajayendra upadhye • Syed thanks for the magnanimous "allowance"!21 days ago • Like •Follow SyedSyed Imam • Its my "pleasure" Sir21 days ago • Like •Follow jayendrajayendra upadhye • Imam..My problem with "He is the best Judge, and in law Good and Evil cannot be equal, and according tolaw Evil is bound to be panalised for his acts." is that who is to say what is good and bad?THIS attachment to heaven / hoors / hell can have devastating results as many in Pakistan are learningevery day.I attended a show titled "Islam religion of peace" by a man muslims idolise. (Zakir Naik).
  • 10. At the end of the show, a fellow got up and asked Zakir.."I have a hindu friend who is pious, takes careof his parents, has no vices like smoking and drinking, is kind to all, will he go to heaven?"..and thencame the Zakir Gem.Please consider Zakirs answer and why I hate "heaven hell" preachers / believers.Zakir said."That hindu will go to hell, simply because he is not a muslim! He is failing to offer Namaz 5 times aday. Plain and simple".I was stumped by the arrogance of that statement.Islam has killed thousands simply because they were not good enough as they were not muslims.(Hajjajs order to Mohammad Bin Qasim that he was being too easy on the Kaffirs and the massacres atDebal and Brahmanabad).Christians under Cortes and Pizzaro decimated whole civilizations in south America and plunderedtheir gold. All because the natives were NOT christian and so were good enough for the kill.What happened in 26/11 and who were the planners every one knows.Can you negate all that?We all know who perpetrated the kiilings in Bangladesh and why. One of the politicians in Pakistan hadgloated during the killings "aaj Iman taaza ho gaya". (Reodad Khan 1971). Wah! kya iman logonko marte dekh taza hota hai !!THIS blood lust can come only in people who believe in heaven/hell and not to forget, the 72 hoorswaiting for them in heaven if they kill people declared vajib-ul-qatl"(ex:- salman taseer)THIS is my opposition to jahil thoughts of heaven / hell.21 days ago • Like •Follow jayendrajayendra upadhye • Imam:Crime and its punishment by Allah apart, what is your take on the three questions posed byChiranjeevi?Just turning the beads of the rosary and going to heaven and enjoying hoors / twanging a silly harp"forever" could not possibly be the answers.Any thing more concrete than that?21 days ago • Like •Follow UjwalUjwal Jha • Sorry for harsh words. I did not mean anything. Friends.... I know what you do not want toknow and have very little knowledge. Even if I pest link of references, but you wont consider becauseof the situation you are in.Let me put it this way. Do we know what is life mean on earth? Life as we know it .... created by godand which is why we had lots of myth. We believed that the earth is in center and our early scientistswere killed or jailed because it was a threat to religion and god. Today its almost gone.
  • 11. We or any other species are basically an energy transforming device. Our job is to harvest energy. True,modern scientific researches has destroyed many species. So it will be worse in future because the newunderstanding is very different. We human need more and more energy. We are growing on rapid speed.To secure the required energy we will take away all the animals from planet earth.I know you do not like to hear that but I am telling you what you would see after 50 years. For anexample cow collects energy and gives us back in the form of milk and beef. But cow as an energytransforming device is not very efficient, or not as efficient as we can make our own, result they willnot be allowed to live on earth for too long because we need efficient tools. It is the future science, youlike it or not but it will certainly happen.Just today Netherlands has decided to ban all kinds of Halal meat. Things will change rapidly andpeople wont go against it because that will give human a longer life. If you are not biased and followthe modern method of life, you may live up to 125 years.The reason we need longer life and faster travelling device so that we can explore the universe. Withthis life spam and speed of travel we cant go far. Which is why if you look at the scientific researchesmade in last two decades are generally to answer two problems.1. How can we live longer?2. How can we travel faster??I am born in a Brahman Family. I am well aware of Hinduism and its ideology. I like to see tomorrow. Ibelieve that every thing has its life and religions are about to finish their life cycle. It is probably not sogreat but Islam is certainly challenged very strongly, the future of any religion is not bright.21 days ago • Like •Follow UjwalUjwal Jha • I had a Poem in my high school Hindi book.Fir kya hoga uske baad?Ravi se Ujjwal, shashi se sundhar nav badhu ghar aayegi,Fir kya hoga uske baad??What will happen next? The boy goes on asking this question and finally mother gets annoyed andsays.Fir may mar jaungi....She says she will die out.So the question what is the purpose of life has got very similar answer. Right now the purpose of life isto explore the universe we live and find more resources so that we can keep growing. We will have newpurpose once we have got what we are searching today.21 days ago • Like •
  • 12. Follow UjwalUjwal Jha • @Mr. Karthikeyan..... I think you do not understand me. You wont understand me. I havesome questions for you, try to answer them if you can. I bet your answers would reveal why India isstill a developing country!You have said "All Indian practices have a very strong scientific basis." Really is that so??Have you seen a movie Water? Directed by Mira Nayar? If not watch and tell me which sciencesuggests to through widows to Varanasi?Burning a dead body is not something we should argue but tell me how scientific it is to take the leftover of ashes of dead and carry it to river Ganges?Is it scientific to kill those who wants to marry in the same Gotra?? Well Islam permits it?? One ofthem must be unscientific?How scientific is Mundan Or janau or Shradha ?? At least I do not find these culture has any scientificbackground.Please do answer and explain how these act of Hindus are scientific??21 days ago • Like •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-Some exotic news,We could live inside a super massive black hole eventually... but super-aliens may have already beatenus to it, claims Russian cosmologist . Most advanced civilization in the galaxy could already be livinginside, claims Vyacheslav Dokuchaev.Despite being considered the most destructive force in space and absolutely uninhabitable, theconditions for life exist inside supermassive black holes, a Russian cosmologist has theorised. comments days ago •
  • 13. karthikeyan arumugathandavan • @ Ujwal,Dont believe it , forget it and there is no hurry to Discover IT :)20 days ago •Follow jayendrajayendra upadhye • Ujwal jee you think like me!I always ask this question ..what is scientific in religion?Mind you philosophy and religion are two different things.20 days ago • Like •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-One example, the traditions in this subcontinent were ( is ? ) highly scientific !___________* The Timing and Quality of Early Experiences Combine to Shape Brain Architecture *Critical aspects of brain architecture begin to be shaped by experience before and soon after birth, andmany fundamental aspects of that architecture are established well before a child enters school The architecture of the brain depends on the mutual influences of genetics, environment, andexperience. Genetics supplies a basic plan for brain development, just as an architect supplies ablueprint for building a house. The genetic plan instructs the basic properties of the nerve cells and laysdown the basic rules for interconnectingnerve cells within and across circuits. In this manner, genes provide the initial construction plan for thebrain’s architecture. The environment in which the brain beginsto develop can have a profound influence on its initial architecture. Just as the selection of the bestbuilding materials enables the realization of the full potential of an architect’s blueprint, a healthyenvironment beginning in the prenatal period allows the full potential of the genetic plan for the brainto be expressed. This includes an abundant supply of nutrients, an absence of toxins, and the healthypersonal and social......................................................................................................................Read more: is a well-known story how Narada Mamuni hijacked an offspring of Asura and literally brain
  • 14. washed him in the womb itself .........Discover IT :)________20 days ago •Follow jayendrajayendra upadhye • Dear Karthikeyan you are referring to whom? Prahlada? or Dhruva?20 days ago • Like •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • ..-JayendraI sincerely do not know who is Dhruva :)--20 days ago •Follow SyedSyed Imam • @Jayendra, I wondered why you shifted each discussion towards Pakistan, actually i amhere to participate in creative discussions not to abuse anyone. on the other hand you are quite poor inhistory (e.g you dont know why Bin Qasim attacked Dibal?). I also want to tell you that you dont tryto think on issues and take media reports as truth. Tell me why India is failed to provide concreteevidence to Pakistan regarding 26/11 just as US failed to provide any evidence relating to Iraqsweapons of mass destruction. Furthermore, you are also biased, why you dont say anything about700,000 Indian soldiers voilating humanity by killing innocent Kasmiris, why you dont talk about UNresolutions on Kashmir Issue,why you dont say anything on Indian voilation of Sind Taas Treaty bybuilding almost 54 dams, why you dont take up the issue of Khalistan, Why you dont say anythingwhat Indian army did in Golden Temple, why you dont tell me about WADA and about more than 25independence movements in india,why you dont say anything regarding Moodys crimes in Gujrat,Why you dont say anything for Shiv Sina and baal Thakure for their sheer harassment toMinorities,why you dont say anything about involvement of Indian serving Colonel Prohit in TrainBombings which has been proved by your own agencies,why you dont say anything against US attackson Iraq and Afghanistan. Are muslims not human?????If you really have love for humanity then have courage to talk on these issues???Otherwise it will be a proof of your biasedness.
  • 15. Now answers to Questions of Chiranheevi,Ans-1) Its a test for usAns-2) universe is an Examination HallAns-3) Allah and Farishte20 days ago • Like •Follow jayendrajayendra upadhye • Dear Syed,You really mean this universe was built by allah for all of us to appear in some sillly examination?Give us a break.Regarding all the other stuff you have written, the less said the better.Have you even read the UN resolutions?They clearly state that Pakistan is to go back to status quo ante, ie return all of kashmir the guys lootedfrom India in 1948 under the guise of Tribals. (old habit that surfaced again in Kargil).Then the Indians would demilitarise.Now PAKISTAN HAS ALREADY ILLEGALLY CEDED POK to the Chinese.So the Pakistani government knows implementing the UN resolutions is impossible.That figure of 700,000 is so much mugged up by most writers, they forget they are bombing their ownpeople with planes and artillery on waziristan.Dont we all know how the Kashniri Pundits were driven oit by slogans "aap ki biwi Behenen yahinchhod jaao" over the loudspeakers?so dont bring in Kashmir. Your records in Bangladesh are all over the net.Regarding dams, see what your own ministers say about the Indus water treaty, that there is no vilationat all. Your poor upkeep of canals is to blame. Most are breached by interested parties as happenedduring the flood this year itself, and reported in your own papers. Stop quoting the bible to us please.Aksai chin China se wapas le lo, POK free karo fir kashmir ki baat karo.20 days ago • Like •1Follow jayendrajayendra upadhye • I have to bringall this up simply because of non serious answers to a seriousdiscussion. no one is interested in harp twanging heavens and fire and brimstone hells.we want something higher than that stone age stuff.20 days ago • Like •Follow SyedSyed Imam • @ Jayendra,You are even manner less, you know that muslims are much conscious about the word Allah, and you
  • 16. intentionally didnt start the word with capital letter. So in my opinion you are not a person with whomany discussion could be made.You are also full of hate for Pakistan. My father migrated from Bihar toBengal (East Pakistan) so i have very well aware that what were happened in East Pakistan.20 days ago • Like •Follow jayendrajayendra upadhye • My posts are full of typos..always. Many know this may be you dont.All my arguments have been against incorrect facts.International opinion seems to be opposite of most of your views.Which you then dismiss as incorrect journalism.Ok with me.Now any deeper thoughts on the 3 questions? Apart from fire and brimstone that is..20 days ago • Like •Follow SteveSteve Dufourny • Indians and pakistanians are brothers like the israelians and palestinians....please dearthinkers, how could you solve the probelms if already the high thinkers of the country are not inagreement ??? The responsbility of universal thinkers is so important,you must show to your countriesthat it is possible to find concrete solutions with universlism and rationality.19 days ago • Like •1Follow ChiranjeeviChiranjeevi Tallapragada • Dear @Syed @JayendraHas god created humans or humans created god is another question that cannever be answered. To me one god created humans but they have become extrasmart and created so many gods. He has given us one tongue but we havecreated so many languages, he has given us one earth and we have created somany boundaries, he has given us two hands and we created weapons sopowerful that can kill millions with one finger tip. So, I am wondering ifGod has really made us or have we made God?God, religion are given to us by our parents. We dont choose them (atleast a majority of us.) Its like a name, an identity. Period. I have nodispute with your name so why should I have any dispute with yourreligion?What makes me feel bad is every discussion turns into a verbal disputebetween two people. This way our minds are not expanding they are just
  • 17. exploding.19 days ago • Like •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • SteveWho is Israel , India or Pakistan - that might bring in some peace out here :)19 days ago •Follow ChiranjeeviChiranjeevi Tallapragada • Verrry smart...@Karthikeyan19 days ago • Like •Follow SteveSteve Dufourny • the peace and the love like the compassion are the only things which remains us....onthis earth is also the only things which can solve our global problems...19 days ago • Like •NimuUnfollowNimu Shenoy, MBA • Chiranjeevi, I will think about your questions and provide a response soon.You also made the following comment,"What makes me feel bad is every discussion turns into a verbaldispute between two people. This way our minds are not expanding they are just exploding." Thankyou for saying this. I personally abandoned a few interesting discussions because there was constantbattle. It is fine to have differing opinions, but I think one should be tactful and respect the othersthoughts.Hopefully, we will all use this forum to learn from each other. If not, I feel that ILN may start losingsome of its good members.19 days ago • Like •Follow jayendrajayendra upadhye • So are we to take hook line and sinker some argument that god made the universefor all of us to pass some silly exam and then go on playung a silly harp forever on some cloud if we
  • 18. pass, and burn eternally in brimsrone if we fail?And all this to be facilitated by a 100 turns of the rosary or bowing xyz times to the ground, destroyingother proples places of worship, beheading and bombing them to hell and then preaching this sillypractice over the net?Do you want me to put up with that crap?Just so that the discussion remains goody goody?I hope we have the honesty to call bullshit just that.Prople who feel I am harsh need to read the book "the subtle subversion", by an ex extremist. Hedescribes how his comrades laughed every time after a bomb blast poliricians came out and said "it isnot the religion that is bad it is the practitioners".And all the time, the book continued to be a primer on how to kill kafirs and enjoy their women andchildren. Clear instructions of "kill all able bodied men and use the women without impregnating them"being some of those holy instructions!We are fiddling when Rome is about to burn.Come on! call a spade a spade at least.19 days ago • Like •1Follow jayendrajayendra upadhye • I suggest keep religious talk away from this forum. But if it is indeed discussed,then at least let us not condone silly and shallow talk. High philosophy is ok, not some barbaric stoneage stuff.Secondly all I have done is clarify wrong facts, and pull down some silly conspuracy theories.One of these guys told me in Dubai, "hum ne India mein bomb fode usliye app log chup ho gaye".(Musharraf recently said the same thing when talking of Dawood Ibrahim). And he was an ordinaryperson, an engineer. He and his friends used to refularly harangue us on statue worship. He was openlycheering the Pakistani side during 20-20. He would regularly force us to reduce TV volume themoment the namaz started. He is now employed in Reliance Bombay. Imagine, with this mindset, whatcan happen if god forbid there is a war tomorrow.And then they say "aap log hamein shak ki nagahon se dekhte ho".Come on!Syed jee ne bade garv se kaha ki unka iman pahele dharam par hai, country comes bad mein.And not one soul here stirred. No pious lectures were heard.Cant you see if that outlook is practiced, how dangerous it is to any country?Yet the slumber is so deep. The mounting of high moral horses continues.Pahele swarg jana hai, achha dikhna gayi bhad mein.On top I am hearing pious talk of two people arguing. Nero is surely busy in India, with his fiddle!19 days ago • Like •1Follow jayendrajayendra upadhye • I am quitting this "all is well" rollypolly thread NOW.
  • 19. Surely some people can reach a step closer to sainthood in the mean time.And as I said, the country may go to.....19 days ago • Like •Follow jayendrajayendra upadhye • Kindly refer:- read the holy book itself ! And be enloghtened as to why Bangladesh rapes happened. And beenlightened what awaits you if you continue to slumber like now.Bye all.19 days ago • Like •NimuUnfollowNimu Shenoy, MBA • Chiranjeevi, I personally liked your question and feel that it is a topic that isgood to answer for oneself. It really should be thought-provoking because it is quite philosophical too.Often times, a lot of questions on ILN are either directly leadership-related or politically-inclined. It isimportant for a leader to also consider philosophical topics because it encourages brainstorming andgoal-setting.I took some time to quickly read through these comments. This question should be ones own reflectionof existence and purpose in life. It is okay if one has feelings that religion is a part of it, but it is notnecessary to express your own set of beliefs.For me, as time passes, I believe that my purpose is to share light-heartness and joy with people. Deepdown, I am not happy all the time, but I would like others to feel that they can smile and laugh throughtheir life journey. Arif K. has a post about abundance mentality, and this is what I believe is mypurpose. Bring something for others and joy will return to me.Well, at least I have an answer to one of your questions!Remember everyone -- The Universe is balanced with the good and the bad. We all contribute to bothgood and bad whether intentional or not. This is what makes the Universe whole.19 days ago • Like •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-............When one is born , physical form as a human being - what all does one bring along with them.Nothing !! or they just appear in a preexisting spacebecause mountains , oceans sun, moon ... all exist before and after their life time -.
  • 20. do they at least come with knowledge / information of such paces ............they can always leave a dent in the space , effects which could be felt for a long time to comehow do people collectively build spaces or clear off each others space for funone builds ones space to keep its form , should it destroy other ones forms & spacedoes one and one&all have thought space too..............................Life is an empty space !19 days ago •Follow jayendrajayendra upadhye • Haha! Karthikeyan! My firm resolve to stay away from this thread had to go once Iread your statement!But then do you mean thinking "all this was there before I came and will be there after I go", oneshould remain passive and not react to the obvious?With this philosophy (similar to the mayavadis running away from the "real world"), people will stopdefending even their own country! (Precisely what ailed India in the midddle ages and ails india evennow).If you look at history, Buddhism had this effect on countries that adopted it. (Central asian republiksand even Mongolia of all countries, were / was Buddhist for a time in the middle ages.These firece people were soon overtaken by others the moment they were introduced to pacifism of theBuddhists. Why! Buddhism was taken to China not by Indian monks but by Turkish Buddhistmissionaries!Kalhan in Rajatarangini mentions that Lalitaditya of Kashmir had a Turkish Buddhist as his minister.I feel savages conquer peaceful states, themselves get civilized and soft in turn to be conquered ongoing process..the wheel of time, the Kaala-Chakra!Example: The turks conquered the eastern Roman empire at constantinople some time in 1500 AD. Indue course, The wily Brits overthrew them easily as they had become soft! Another case is that of theArabs. Once a mighty conquering power, the savage Mongols under Halaku Khan overran Baghdad(1250 AD) and raised a mountain of dead people by strangulating the whole populace, and killing theCaliph by putting him in a carpet and making horses/elephants tread on it! The righteous Halaku itappears had made a treaty with the Khalif that he would take the city without shedding blood!What do you think?19 days ago • Like •Follow SyedSyed Imam • @ Nimu@Chiranjeevi, Everyone is allowed to express his/her ideas but he/she should notbe allowed to impose them on others, i had just given my input on your question.I think this forum is
  • 21. not a place of battle, so i asked everone that just give your opinion without any offensive remarks.19 days ago • Like •1Follow jayendrajayendra upadhye • Just completing my last post.This action of Halaku (sack of Baghdad) had the most salutory effect on the Arabs and their worldview(the mutazilites-asharites debate: search the net for that).This debate is important as in a way it also applies to Indians.While on the Mongols, we should give credit where it is due, The Egyptian Arabs (under Beibers)routed the Mongols conclusively at the battle of Ain-jalut (Spring of Goliath)If that had not happened, the "scourge of god" would have made all Europe subservient to Mongolsupremacy. No womder children had Ming the merciless as villain in flash gordon tales! It alsoexplains the European gut feeling about people with mongoloid features.Coming to the questions, I somerimes feel humans may not be qualified yet to answer them. For we arenot very much above the animals as of now, to put things honestly.19 days ago • Like •THOMASUnfollowTHOMAS AW • Sure Chiranjeevi, Every morning the Flowers know how to smile at you, and thePlants know how to communicate with you, they know that, you are there for them, to keep their spiritHigh.Universe is a large DREAM, we exist to play as actors & actresses, according to thescript of, the Invisible mystic power of NATURE.THOMAS AW19 days ago • Like •2karthikeyan arumugathandavan • Jayendra,* to provide livelihood for his subjects *.News article,The Tamil inscription also says that Rajaditya was killed while seated on the elephant (“aanai melthunjiya Chola deva”). The Karhad plates mention that one of the aims behind Krishna IIIs invasion ofthe Chola territory was * to provide livelihood for his subjects *.
  • 22. If one decides to fill their space as King or Carpenter ....etc, One has to convertnecessary spaces and clear of the space of some living beings too.Imagine how many such space fights happen and likely to extend to space & outer space .Part and parcel of space clearance for again nothing in the end ................China Will Own the Moon, Space Entrepreneur Worries comments days ago •Follow SyedSyed Imam • @Thomas, i think you are inspired by Shakespear ideology, am i right???19 days ago • Like •1THOMASUnfollowTHOMAS AW • Syed, you still read Shakespear ? That was donkey years ago, when He was thecompulsory textbook, in my kiddy school term.I am a Thinking person, * NO Ideology needed to strangle my neck.Cheers ! THOMAS AW19 days ago • Like •1Follow SyedSyed Imam • @Thomas, my dear friend a considerable number of people think that Shakespear was a
  • 23. great philosopher of his times specially in UK. He also Laid that " the world is a stage and all of us areactors, we all play our role and then left the stage"19 days ago • Like •THOMASUnfollowTHOMAS AW • Hi Syed, Correct - Shakespear is talking about the Worldly mundane stage, whereas;Chiranjeevi is asking for the cosmic Universe of infinity.So, she has an Omni Dream with bigger players, looks similar but, once you examine closer, theDifference is tremendous. * Mere physical players of Shakespear : appeared once in the Theatre of life.THOMAS AW19 days ago • Like •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-Mihaly Csikszentmihalyi on flowMihaly Czikszentmihalyi asks, "What makes a life worth living?" Noting that money cannot make ushappy, he looks to those who find pleasure and lasting satisfaction in activities that bring about a stateof "flow." days ago •Follow jayendrajayendra upadhye • Karthikeyan:for once dear fellow do let us YOUR OWN views minus the links! By now I am kind of dying toknow :)19 days ago • Like •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-................Okay :)19 days ago •
  • 24. AtulUnfollowAtul Saksena • I find all comments very interesting and showing different perceptions. Keep Posting..19 days ago • Like •THOMASUnfollowTHOMAS AW • Atul : Welcome to action, participate and give us some comment on what do youThink, all members can discuss on this interesting Topic.Thanks, THOMAS AW19 days ago • Like •Follow ChiranjeeviChiranjeevi Tallapragada • @Jayendra I am sure you will agree that all our philosophy, thinking is butbelief. You may not also dispute the fact that there is no hierarchy inbeliefs. My guess is there is no hierarchy even in evolution of lifebecause there is no direction in space. Which way is up and which way isdown. I think this is how it is intended to be. If we accept that everythought is equally important or unimportant, the choice to connect to anyidea is based on something that is inside us rather than outside us.From: India Leadership Network18 days ago • Like •Follow ChiranjeeviChiranjeevi Tallapragada • @Karthikeyan, one thing one definitely brings (back) with them is mass,which is formed through the processes in the womb. Wow, we are nothing butthe indestructible energy converted into mass. If so we are but recycledenergy. That is why may be we cannot escape from the thoughts that haveexisted before us or if it we have to do it, may be our mind needs escapevelocity to get rid of the gravity of thoughts that keep us hooked.18 days ago • Like •2karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-
  • 25. ChiranjeeviGood one, ..............Discover IT :).-18 days ago •Follow jayendrajayendra upadhye • Chiranjeevi, can you make some sense out of your 2 posts above?Some beliefs we can surmise are truths.example:- Fire burns whether Iam in my house, in America or on a different planet. (As long as fire aswe know it can exist there. Based on that, I can surmise that fire Burns! Period.Likewise, (as said in the Nasadiya and hiranyagarbha suktas), everything that starts, has an end.The gods all started some time (they have their tales of genesis), so perforce they will end some day.This universe by the law of mathematical induction, was not there once (before the big bang), is therecurrently, so will not be there some day.What is THAT which remains through out?Which is THAT (tat in sanskrit) entity which we shall worship? Is the Rigvedic question.About an attributeless it. No gender, no attributes (Nirguna). THIS we can understand.Like understanding the null set which is subset of all sets, this IT pervades all cosmos since timeimmemorial.This we can understand too.IT, (GOD) is all around you. The wind passing over your hair is ITs touch!Think that and it can be really enthralling.Have you read the Gaia theory?Clarkes A encounter with Rama is a similar story.That is why Yogis attempt to Yoke (Yuj) with IT during Samadhi.Now belief is NOT there in this as most of it is pure simple logic.Once the yoke is established (sayujya) by inference all the powers of creation are at ones disposal.(Holographic universe, gagar mein sagar).HUM ye sab jaan sakte hain, lekin janna aur samajhna isme antar hai.Like writing code, and having a compiler.We deal with code (emotions and thoughts and physical experiences). The yogi has the cosmiccompiler. Like in the movie matrix, he can then alter reality by actually compiling the 3d worldsmodified code. (Sankalpa).I always joke that the actual cosmic compiler is with the Guru. THAT is why no yogi can succeedwithout a Guru! :)18 days ago • Like •Follow jayendrajayendra upadhye • Chitanjeevi: On this topic there is much to know. The 3 Gunas, the Pancha Tattvas.The purush as the drashta, Prakriti as the energy driving the cosmos. These are not beliefs, we can
  • 26. easily find and agree that any action has two components. The driver and the driven. The sayujya of thetwo forms what we call "action". Going back along this chain to the root, we reach the concept ofPurush and Prakrit that is why it is called the Adim Dwandwa (Primal couple / original duality).Shankara had to face it up and brought up vishishta advaita to explain how this duality is but anillusion. Prakriti being just an aspect of the purusha.I wonder if you shall agree to all the above. But this is what is there in the Vedanta.18 days ago • Like •Follow jayendrajayendra upadhye • @Zinnia:You are right no offence felt here.But may I know what has stirred you up so much?I have not done any zabardastee with any one, nor insisted "only I am right".I merely put forward some thruths conveyed by Vedanta and Sankhya.As I found them scientrfic and logical.Vivekananda did something etc, that is his problem and he must have had his reasons.That does not mean that Vedanta is "tyaajya"!Hum ek admi ki karni se ja nahi sakte. And I am sure Vivekananda would also not like that! It is YOUwho are using him to say what you want to say ..that hell with Vedanta.Khul ke kahiye, why use poor Vivekananda foe that? :)You are doing something that Zakir Naik does, and which has become fashionable.Praise the vedas then curse hindus for idol worship, as it is not found in the Vedas.Then tell them on the same breath while the iron is hot, to start eating animal flesh because Vedicpeople ate meat a lot, and thus follow the true religion. Rather INSIST on it.This is the thought process of someone who does not believe in change.It is classic case of devil qioting this logic, we should start INSISTING that people should follow and emulate The person who triedsacrificing his child, and see if god intervenes!Iam simply following Zakirs path! Be true to the religion, start attempting to sacrifice you kids toappease god. Afterall Zakie is an authority even on the Vedas!Then comes hypocrisy.Iska ek fayda hai! You get to curse the hindus using hearfelt reformist zeal as a shield!How delectably enjoyable. No one can curse you for it, it is delightful exercise!I too am going to try it now.Some people Criticise others on statue worship, and then look towards a certain object (quibla)themself when it is prayer time. Is THAT any different from statue worship?This fixation with an object is exacrly identical to statue worship.Why criticise village Jahils when they worship a stone then?
  • 27. Lekin in se logically bat karna fizool hai.They think they are free to criticize, destroy (temples and statues, akshardham attack).lekin unhe koi criticise kare to tauba!!Marne Maarne pe utar ayenge!Ye hypocrisy pe madam aap kuchh kahengi?Any creative juices flowing on that one?18 days ago • Like •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-................God is a concept and it is ........................OMni P........., OMni P........,OMni .S......., X.... .Y .... ... etcSee a Snake swallowing a Toad ,Oh ....., one god eating another god ........ one is dead and for the other it is just a days- meal s - sidedish !!.-18 days ago •Follow jayendrajayendra upadhye • Kartikeyan, in one of your previous posts you said you did not about Dhruv.But you knew about Prahlad.Why?I supposed most knew about both vaishnav favorites!18 days ago • Like •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • Jayendra,Expecting this question only , I said sincerely I do not know . The name is not registered with me atall , ready to have some highlights on him .18 days ago •
  • 28. Follow jayendrajayendra upadhye • Dhruv the son of UttaanPaad is quite senior of Prahlad the son of Hiranyaka-Shipu.Both were great VishnuBhaktas.Dhruv asked for and got a place that was Achyut (infallible). He got to be the Dhruva Tara and ruled26,000 years.Actually this is a take on the precession of the equinoxes, an astronomical phenomenon.The axis of the earth describes a cone in the sky, as the earth wobbles slowly on its axis. Polaris ceasesto be the pole star once every 26000 years. The axis points to other stars and after 26,000 years againpoints to Polaris. This is the great cycle of which Indians and Egyptians were aware. THAT also meansboth these people have a history of astronomical observations going far back in time, before theuniversal flood 11,500 years ago. This flood was caused by the sudden rapid melting of the ice caps asthe last ice age ended. (Indra killing Vritrasur who had locked up all water). It flooded the Bering straitsand cut off America from Asia.Imagine! Not a single forest on earth is older than 11,500 years ago. Because then 90 % of the earthspotable water was locked up in ice caps extending to the tropics! A mile thick! And all land was aridand dry, between the two tropics.It also submerged the "Ram ka pul" between Lanka and India. (That pul is actually geologically mucholder, 17,00,000 years old).Many places on the globe still have ancient Indian place names attached to them.But more on that in a later post.18 days ago • Like •2Follow jayendrajayendra upadhye • @Zinnia M;You are putting words in my mouth.I suggested nothing.It is a fact that many many Hindus dont eat meat. Period.If you go to these verisame people and tell them how their Vedic people ate meat, and therefore theyMUST eat meat, and how if they dont do as told they are wrong!THAT is definitely a wrong thing to do.I said some thing tough to syed, and he called me mannerless.Aap Vedanta to tyajya bataa rahee thi to kya main aap ko mannerless bataa sakta hoon?Nahi! The whole holier than thou brigade will pull me down and go one step nearer to sainthood at myexpense!I really suspect now that you are in a habit of doing this. Put words in other peoples mouths and startquoting the bible next.I knew caste, sati, staines, Bangalore everything would come up, you would scour everything youcould pin on hindus, and I had even predicted that. But as I said, NOT say a thing on the mentality thatcaused so many deaths in Bomb blasts. NOT a word on the Akshardham attack, NOT a word on 26/11..
  • 29. Oh! Its NOT fashionable to criticise muslims, poor fellows were just doing a bit of pious and righteousJihad isnt it?THEY were misguided werent they, Why blame them?AND secondly who knows they might take it to heart and pass a fatwa or two and you could come togrief!So criticise only Hindus who never retaliate, but rather pull each other down in their haste to show theworld how great they are, and so you can read sermons chapter and verse and throw in Vivekananda forgood measure.Aur kam ban jayega. Wah wah. Im impressed!18 days ago • Like •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-.......Now I have found the meaning of life :).. find out where ever there is dirt and keep cleaning , welcome sign for the ecology !!.-18 days ago •Follow jayendrajayendra upadhye • Zinnijee if you dont know Zakir Naik, Ignotance is bliss! For apart from being amemory sharp (like a crd sharp) he has nothing to contribute. He is I suspect under Wahabi influence.Many in Pakistan and even India (Muslims themselves) dont agree with his rather strong approach. Forexample he detests sufis. Hindostan se Sufu tradition nikalo to kya bachta hai on Islamic front? Ajmer,Salim Chisti, Nizamuddin auliya in ke dargah aaj bhi mane jate hain. Lekin ye sahab hai ki isko achhanahi mante!18 days ago • Like •Follow jayendrajayendra upadhye • Karthikeyan bhai sahab kam se kam hamen galiyan to mat do! :)Itna kam bhi mat boliye ki meaning samajhna kathin ho jaye.Wo kam Patanjali sahab kar gaye hain.People have to write whole books just to explain his few lines!18 days ago • Like •
  • 30. Follow jayendrajayendra upadhye • Masternijee jara busy hoon, will get back agter some time.Sure, and will wite in english too.They say venom is needed to fight venom..right?17 days ago • Like •Follow venugopalvenugopal maganti • Is this not getting a too un comfortable,with words like venom,crap,bull shit?I think it is time to leave this group--I thought,people can exchange views here, not necessarilyconvince and win over dissenters--or condemned to be burnt in brim stone,to quote one of the hyperactive participants--already,some one advised a tone down of the PH of the acidic comments,but thereseems to be no respite coming17 days ago • Like •Follow jayendrajayendra upadhye • Venugopal, the 3 words you mention are used by most people in everydaylanguage. Honestly tell me dont you use them to describe something untenable?Do you seriously believe the purpose of this universe is to be examined by god and then go to heavenfor ever? And what does one do there? The questions asked are serious ones and demand seriousanswers. Why so uncomfortable with strong debate?Are we here to scratch each others backs and give off prizes for being nice? And for that matter, I haveNOT maligned anyone personally, but others have called me mannerless etc. But surely that you wontnotice. I have only criticised viewpoints, and this is a sort of interaction so one indeed has a right to tryand put forward things that are logical.What is the problem.How come I never have issues with Karthikeyan and others but only one or two people here?Most of my arguments I try to rest on solid foundation. (Almost all)Even the historical facts (some seem to not like that) are as solid as I can make them.Nowhere have I claimed greatness or anysuch thing. All I do is cut wrong views down to size. And thatis about it.Do think along those lines.If someone were to logically come up with something I appreciate them, I always appreciateKartikeyams coolness, Arifs tp the point thinking..uf you care to read other threads you will find thatout. But I dont suffer fools.17 days ago • Like •Follow jayendra
  • 31. jayendra upadhye • @chiranjeevi:Can you expand your last qiestion?"Does anyone or anything else knows about existence other than us?"Because if you mean on earth, all other rest of the animals do know about existence.The primates are quite "conscious", and crows have been known to keep track of "how many peoplewent into a room and how many came out!".On the universal scale we have the aliens! In a galaxy of 100 billion stars how can we say we are theonly people around?I asked because I wondered if you meant anything else?17 days ago • Like •Follow venugopalvenugopal maganti • I am myself an agnostic,but veering more towards theistic side,simplybecause,there is no other alternative to co habit for human beings--it is the culture,traditions,based onwhat has been passed on to us by our predecessors,and is based essentially on belief system--now ifsome body turns in to a religious terrorist,blame the extremist views--in any case if we cannot toleratean alternate view point,can not get along with others with their own weaknesses,and want to forcefullychange others views,I think this is the very anti thesis of a management philosophy--I would look athow to live a purposeful life,rather than worrying about an INVISIBLE GOD,and break my head on hisexistence--after all, human society is not produced by a single mould,and its characteristics,bothphysical and mental vary --no 2 humanbeings are alike--we can only exterminate,what is bad for thesociety,not what some intellectuals do not like--the spat between you and Kartikeyan is not in goodtaste,and a mediatory effort by madam Zinnia also turned some what vitriolic--we are not trying to wina debate,nor can we bring about a revolutionary change like MAO or LENIN,who must be licking theirwounds,in hell,if it exists--for,they forced a change in their countries,extirpating all dissenters,but youknow what had happend--I believe a more relavant discussion would be does economic prosperity exist?or is it an illusion,which keeps appearing once in a while?can such prosperity be perpetuated?you donot need to be an economist to gloat about such questions17 days ago • Like •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • -.Venugopal" -the spat between you and Kartikeyan is not in good taste,and a mediatory effort by madam Zinniaalso turned some what vitriolic "I will repeat the comment for your sake :)"" .......Now I have found the meaning of life :).. find out where ever there is dirt and keep cleaning , welcome sign for the ecology !! ""
  • 32. .-17 days ago •Follow GloriaGloria OMarrah • I havent met any thats smart enough to answere that question, just I think answeres.Iwould suggest drwing an invisable box and cocentrate on whats going on in that area before askingsuch big questions. Why do you need to know that answere? People that are depressed usually asksimulair questions. They dont want to think about themself or solutions so they keep asking why. Theywant someone tell tell them why.I know for sure its helping grow the grass behind you thats feedingthat cow so you can have milk on your cheerios.17 days ago • Unlike •1Follow KPKP SaiRaj • we do not know even 1% of entire universe. Only 5% is matter, 95% is dark matter anddark energy filled in this universe. So no one can answer your question with any near perfection. Butwe know at least one thing that we are all part of universe. Just help each other and forget aboutpurpose of life.17 days ago • Like •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-There could be lot of purposes for life and the Universe , because they are existing ......oh ..... well ......purposeless existence of everything ....... another definite possibility which cannot beruled out ...... one thing for sure is that ... we need to survive ,A GUIDE TO SURVIVAL IN THE 21st CENTURYMan’s consciousness is as powerful as a microscope. It can grasp and analyse experience in a way noother animal can achieve. But microscopic vision is narrow vision. We need to develop another kind ofconsciousness that is the equivalent of the telescope..................... --- Colin Wilson...............................................................................................................................Ideals are primarily visual. Dreams, for example, are full of subconscious ideals. Small wonder idealswork so well in visual media like geometry and the alphabet. Whether scientific, social or spiritual,they’ve been driving our historical record from the start, often for the better. But as projections ofreality, they have one drawback. Time and again it’s been shown that ideals, like their intentions, areonly good for 99% fulfillment. And so in their abundance they clutter the field of reason. Many a
  • 33. wildflower has sprouted from the garden of rhetoric. The Existentialists, sick of it all, declared avacuum.And they are right, for now that the artificial environment we have extended has its own timelesscurrent, we become like the jellyfish, which has no mind of its own, just a direct line to the outsideworld. Yet to deny it consciousness is misleading, for it reproduces, and it’s evolved. We got the firstpart. Now’s our chance to make good on the second, now that with our circuits reintegrating we beholdthe very organism of the global village. days ago •Follow jayendrajayendra upadhye • @Gloria: "Depression".. You have used a word in a completely new context fromIndian point of view. But it was refreshing to connect with western context.In hindu terminology, this state of mind is something similar but not exacrlt identical with the statedescribed by "Vairagya" and a related word "Audasinya / Udasinata" meaning "apathy". Great saints inIndia were led vis this path to self realization.refer:- is also another aspect that breeds such thoights about "where/why/whither" and that is excerss ofcomfort and riches. Siddharthas metamorphosis into the Buddha shows this.Again in Indian tradition, one need not be depressed to reach these Qs, one may be plain curious!17 days ago • Like •Follow jayendrajayendra upadhye • @Sairaj...Has Kali" or any of the 10 (some black some white) mahavidyas to dosomething with this dark energy?Just wondering,.. and ofcourse ready for any tongue lashing that comes my way for coming up withspurious stuff! :)Karthikeyan which avatar of mine had a spat with you of all people?I have already started to check if any imposter has used my name to take you on! :)will let you know asap.17 days ago • Like •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • Jayendra
  • 34. Soap & Surf are costly too, these days...... do not bother about cleaning , Relax :)17 days ago •Follow jayendrajayendra upadhye • Karthikeyan: You literally sent me to the cleaners! :) Soap and all!Chalo I am now hunkyDory white. :)But ek vinantee hai! (one request)Raham karo aur Laconic terseness chhodo.There is genuine danger of mis-interpretation.(Akin to the famous "Naro va-Kunjaro va").17 days ago • Like •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-I will keep it mind to adhere to it ......... but for the fact ............calling Yudhisthira , the lier as one who upholds Dharma .......... :)17 days ago •Follow jayendrajayendra upadhye • fear may be telling a truth to someone but in your shortstyle, and the pooe guy would interpret it as a lie along the narova Kunjarova lines! :)Too much brevity can be dangerous.But again let me not dwell too much on that.By the way what is your take in Glorias refreshing coincidental view of Vairagya?17 days ago • Like •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-One should have vairagya in life for it to be meaningful and there will not time for anyone to ask astold earlier what is life .... - that apart, it does not mean negating our desires or reducing consumptionor avoiding luxurious lifestyle ... etc ..........somehow each one fixes some attitudes and targets to achieve in their lifetime and it could betriggered and concreted any time in life . After that what/ how best are their efforts and direction toachieve the same against all environmental / societal hurdles sets them far up in the vairagya scale .
  • 35. I think anyone who is sure, he does have Vairagya can explain it still better.-16 days ago •AkshayaUnfollowAkshaya Bhatia • Purpose of life, it seems, is to experience, explore, toil, struggle and interact throughour senses within the self as well as with the ultimate perceptible creativity called Universe and be apart of it till our life span.!!...16 days ago • Like •Follow jayendrajayendra upadhye • You see Gloria I presume (I may be wrong) represents western view. She may neverhave heard this concept. But she did imagine one had to have some kind of apathy in order to ask thesequestions. From her perspective she thought of it as depression.The Indians will call it audasinya which is first step of Vairagya.16 days ago • Like •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-I only know Adu Pompe , ............ what is that Audasinya ! ?16 days ago •Follow jayendrajayendra upadhye • Are!Udas = apathetic (adjective)Udasin = apathetic (adjective)Audasinya = apathy (Noun)Udasinta = apathy (Noun)This was all in that web link I gave Gloria. dictionary that one.Audasinya removes apeksha (expectation) and improves "sama drishtee" tendency to look on allfavorable / unfavorable circumstances with equanimity. Which later on leads to Vairagya.Buddhists (Tantra sadhana) to my knowledge used Vipashyana to observe bodies decay in smashana to
  • 36. fix oneself in the Anityata of the body.Buddhists use the word Aniccha which is Pali apabhraunsha of Anitya. Currently the fashionableVipassana (Pali word) is much more sukhad than the one I described.Do Correct me If I am wrong, cause I read about these Buddhist practices long ago..But what is Adu Pompe ?16 days ago • Like •Follow jayendrajayendra upadhye • Karthikeyan what words you use for apathetic in Tamil / Malayalam / Telugu?I dont know which you follow.16 days ago • Like •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .- அக்கறைறையின்மைமை - not much bothered about the events around.-16 days ago •Follow jayendrajayendra upadhye • should have written that in english as I write hindi in english! :)Ler me see what online translarion I get.."indifference, negligence, carelessness."So you are Tamil.16 days ago • Like •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • ..-...put it in google translate ..... and listen to Aaudio :)16 days ago •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .- அலட்சியமை் ..... this also looks more nearer to carelessness about ones goals,
  • 37. .-16 days ago •Follow jayendrajayendra upadhye • My goodness! It has no phonetic similarity at all.You mean you never really came across the sanskrit audasinya?I was of the impression Tamil has more sanskrit words than Marathi.16 days ago • Like •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-................people could be weak in languages :).-16 days ago •Follow jayendrajayendra upadhye • Hmm. Possible, anyway all expertise is always a question of degree!Your hint on google translate was a good one.You seem to be a samyamee like me! (Joke intended)For the geeta says "Ya nisha sarva bhutanam, Tasyam Jagarti samyami"!When the world sleeps, the samyami (Yogi) wakes! :)May be we are "discussion / web yogis!Chalo I am retiring. Enough web yoga for today.16 days ago • Like •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • :)16 days ago •Follow SreenivasaSreenivasa Madenahally • Very interesting thread.Ujwal, I totally agree with you, human beings are most dangerous virus consuming resources atalarming rate and replicating at alarming rate.
  • 38. However, whatever Discovery, National Geographic or BBC tell is not the ultimate truth, perhaps noteven a tiny bit of the big truth. Many a times these "science/truth" channels exagerate things severalfold. I watched a program in BBC sometime last year - conclusion was that no one knows how lifestarted on earth, perhaps it came from somewhere else! How did it start there? Millions of brains aretrying to understand what is there in human body, how it works but still picture is not clear. Off course,with limited understanding we are able to "fix" few things! If millions of focussed brains struggle tounderstand what is there and how it works, think of the intelligence who thought about andexperimented and created it. Such an intelligent thing called life which complements the surrounding,self improving, self replicating cant be accident or some collision/explosion/implosion. What Darwin,Einstein or Stephen Hawking found are truth but few drops in the ocean of truth. My gut feel is that,before we find/realize that ocean of truth, we will be extinct. Darwin didnt explain how life originated,he just explained how they evolved/collapsed with changing climate/time. Till now there are no properexplanations on how different species came-up or life started.Till few hundred years back, atom (a-tom = in-divisible) was considered as the smallest particle ofmatter. Later we found/theorized sub-atomic particles - protons, neutrons and electrons. We are nowthinking of some more - bosons/god particles. Yesterdays news paper reported that there is some"matter" in vacuum!According to science today, nuclear fission is the source of energy in stars. But how did atoms havesuch immense eneregy in them (1 gram of hydrogen can generate energy equivalent to 300 million tonsof coal!)? What started big bang explosion/implosion (if they were ever happened)? If mass and energyare interchangeable, how did they come to existence? How did cells/atoms come to existence? How didcells acquired "self" feeling/boundaries? What explains the origin of feelings, thoughts, care, love,belongingness, jealousy/hatred/possession? In curiosity of understanding these and greed of using ourlimited knowledge for our "comfort and convenience" we will trigger something that will wipe-us outand starts new system.Am I thoroughly confused? You bet, but I am pretty sure, life/universe were not mere accident, there isa grand design/order controlled by bigger intelligence!16 days ago • Like •2Follow GloriaGloria OMarrah • KP, good thought, maybe by helping each other, we find our purpose. The endalways follows the beginning.16 days ago • Like •Follow GloriaGloria OMarrah • I dont know know about you guys, but Im getting more confused with eachsentence. Spelling bees and anger I think. Its hard to feel words. I cant tell if everyone is fighting or
  • 39. talking. I took a class in shiatsu. I always was reading a western medical book. One book said earth,wind,water and fire. The other said stomach,lungs,liver and heart. The symtoms were the same, thecures were the same, the words were all differant. But yet everything was the same. Were never goingto use 100% of our brains untill we can reach a state of total happiness and be filled with love. Thatswhen they say we can answere all those questions.16 days ago • Like •Follow jayendrajayendra upadhye • @Sreenivasa Madenahally:A slight correction. (No offense intended) It is Fusion not fission that drives the stars.But Sreenivasa Madenahally dont you think by the time we know answers to all those qs, we ourselveswill be gods? :)On one person had asked a similar question. "What was before the bang?" I had toldhim the same thing. Not all questions are answerable. We mught only guess / surmise. What happensafter death? (to us). What causes gravity (if spacetime curvature, why does mass warp space? Why timeonly flows in one direction?All unanswerable questions. Why not leave them thus? In the fitness of things, we may some day knowor perhaps we might not.Asimov has a wonderful take on that. But I have quoted that so many times, I will let that pass now. :)16 days ago • Like •Follow GloriaGloria OMarrah • Jayendra, Depression here is considered a diesease. You thought is correct as far aswhat happens to depressed people. They get so bad, reach bottom, and finally get their feet on the floor,instead of just floating throw the air, and can see reality. The problem is, they seem to keep repeatingthe process over and over. Up and down and up and down. Got any words for that. Maybe they arntthere long enough to see the light.16 days ago • Like •1Follow jayendrajayendra upadhye • @Gloria:Nice take on the lighter side.But no, Audasinya and Vairagya (degrees of Apathy) as applied to saints in India are not externallyenforced constructs. Once internalized, the person is NOT UNDER STRESS when in that state. He bynature loses interest in all dependent dualities such as "rich/poor" (the most obvious), even"clean/dirty" which you as a westerner will NOT digest easily.Regarding clean/dirty, comfort/discomfort there are many interesting tales about the Sai of Shirdi andGajanan of Shegaon (both in Maharashtra).
  • 40. Try and check them out on the web.From the western perspective, Jesus, who really was from the sect of the Essenees, and who was thusused to the performance of austerities, bore the event on the cross and lived, thanks to his internalizednatural un-enforced detachment from comfort/discomfort duality.For such people the ultimate duality to overcome is life/death.And there have been cases where the dead have been brought back.Lazarus by Jesus, and Sacchidananandbaba by Dnyaneshwar.16 days ago • Like •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-Now it is absolutely clear, the grand purpose of life and the universe !!....every atom is depressed with compressed energy stored inside , waiting to explode... like electron , it can prefer to run around a nucleus .... OOh that what the moon does and .....stars do ................anything & everybody dances..if one is shy of dancing alone , dance as a group or team ......... if one is depressed to dance, give it a shock it will start running around ...... if one is having extra compressed energy , it is going to burst .......What kind of a design is this .....................Now it cannot be absolutely clear, the grand purpose of life and the universe !!Discover IT :)16 days ago •Follow jayendrajayendra upadhye • Karthikeyan, you have certain properties of Narada!He made light of most things!And often left his subjects in doubt about what he really said!!But I have to say this, you have broken long tradirion and NOT posted a link!The lord be praised..Now dont complain I used roo many exclamations. :) ;)16 days ago • Like •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-
  • 41. O Narada ma Muni ..... na ma ha ! fact he is so powerful that he manifests in so many peoples heart ?!___________________The Joker effect: cooperation driven by destructive agentsAbstractUnderstanding the emergence of cooperation is a central issue in evolutionary game theory. The hardestsetup for the attainment of cooperation in a population of individuals is the Public Goods game inwhich cooperative agents generate a common good at their own expenses, while defectors “free-ride”this good. Eventually this causes the exhaustion of the good, a situation which is bad for everybody.Previous results have shown that introducing reputation, allowing for volunteer participation, punishingdefectors, rewarding cooperators or structuring agents, can enhance cooperation. Here we present amodel which shows how the introduction of rare, malicious agents—that we term jokers—performingjust destructive actions on the other agents induce bursts of cooperation* The appearance of jokers promotes a rock-paper-scissors dynamics, where jokers outbeat defectorsand cooperators outperform jokers, which are subsequently invaded by defectors.* paradoxically, the existence of destructive agents acting indiscriminately promotes cooperation. days ago •Follow GloriaGloria OMarrah • Jayendra, I see the big differance. The depressed person has the feeling of being afailure, unloved, unworthy and feels sorry for themself. That would be a totally differant character.Theywould be dirty.16 days ago • Like •Follow jayendrajayendra upadhye • Gloria, nice you see the difference. People advanced along the track of finding theanswers to these questions, finally reach the stage where one more duality is to be breached. That ofself/other. Once this is breached, the ego ceases to be an impediment for them. And they connect withthe higher reality (whatever that may be).
  • 42. I am not certainly qualified to say anything on that! :)But Patanjali in his yoga sutras calls that "connecting" samadhi.I am still at loggerheads with his most basic "yogah Chitta Vritti Nirodhaha".Because to me Nirodha implies suppression."yogah Chitta Vritti Nirodhaha".Meaning Yoga is the control of Chitta and Vritti. (mind and ones nature) loosely translated.16 days ago • Like •Follow SanjaySanjay Saxena • The purpose of life is to live life. Experience it . Feel it. Sense it. Perceive it. Enjoy it.Celebrate it. Fight for it. Read it. Listen to it. Discover it. Think/Mull over it.Universe exists to give us the infrastructure to do the above.It doesn’t matter whether anyone else knows about our existence as long as we continue to live Life.16 days ago • Like •2Follow jayendrajayendra upadhye • Sanjayjee..and here I was wasting my time on "Yogashchittavrittinirodhaha".Ill have a soda on that one!16 days ago • Like •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-........doine^ ........ doine^ .............. doine^.......... * ...................* .......................* ........ naradas deva ganamPositive CynicismHow to keep your cynic’s integrity without making yourself miserable.the rare opportunity to live in harmony with your valuesfreedom from self-deceptionimmunity against faddish "groupthink"development of an independent, contrarian mind and spiritrealistic expectations from a less-than-perfect worldself-protection against disappointment (we already know what to expect, don’t we?)the joy of using irreverent humor to retaliate against our oppressors
  • 43. more here... days ago •1Follow jayendrajayendra upadhye • Karthikeyan..who asked you to give out my ultra secret behaviour recipe so easily?You ARE Narada in disguise, I am convinced now.16 days ago • Like •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-........doine^ ........ doine^ .............. doine^.......... * ...................* .......................* ........ naradas deva ganam:).-16 days ago •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-...................It is not only a multipolar world it is a Universe of multiple Universes . I think that is whatis mythological / metaphysical / religious studies of this sub-continent point to ..........._________________________________The Pluralistic Universe ---- by Nathan SchneiderScience has a handle on the age of the universe. Now “multiverse” theorists are asking a vexingquestion: Which one? One universe is baffling enough.What little we know is that it’s composed of tiny blips of light in a cloud of black holes, dark matter,and dark energy, which are in turn describable only through the tunnel vision of quantum
  • 44. indeterminacy and chronic uncertainty. Not to mention the matter of where everything came from andwhat it ultimately means. But even this may not be all. As scientists work to understand the cosmos weinhabit, some have come to suspect it might be only one among many...........................................................................................................................Without the benefit of empirical data, guided by imagination and a body of carefully wroughtmathematics, thinking about a multiverse inevitably challenges scientists, theologians, and laypeople toask what far-fetched possibilities they are willing to entertain. Which can you stand, at least longenough to work out its implications: that you are a program on some alien’s computer, the creature ofan intelligent designer beyond space and time, or a quitter in the search for a theory of everything? Orthat, perhaps, you’ll never know? days ago •1Follow ChiranjeeviChiranjeevi Tallapragada • Thanks @Ujwal calling this childish because I dont want to lose that childlike awe and wonder about life. You have also shared your thoughts andsuggested watching episodes of history channel. Again I would like to thankyou for that. As at an individual level even at the scientific level everyprobe, every discovery has only led to more questions. I guess the day onefeels all the puzzles solved is only when one is resting in peace.15 days ago • Like •Follow GloriaGloria OMarrah • Jayendra, Iwasgoingtolookthatupongooglebutiknewiwoulntfindananswere15 days ago • Like •Follow jayendrajayendra upadhye • Gloria...whats that!"Iwasgoingtolookthatupongooglebutiknewiwoulntfindananswere"You are attempting to sanskritise English?Yogah Chitta Vritti Nirodhaha when combined in Sanskrit becomes"YogashChittaNivruttiNirodhaha".The "sh" gets inserted after yoga and the h disappears.But what answers were tou searching and did not find?
  • 45. 15 days ago • Like •Follow ChiranjeeviChiranjeevi Tallapragada • @Gloria thanks for bringing up some of the origins for such questions andthe futility of thinking in that direction. Let me share the reason for myasking these questions. As you said one can go on living without thinkingof any purpose or following someone who seems to have understood thepurpose. I too do it but occasionally even simple events like washing offof ants out of a food item could make one think and connect to the statethey must be in. It reminds me of the millions of people who die in naturaldisasters or even accidents. Should one feel sad or take it as part of theroutine cleaning up of someone like us? We go around our business likethose other ants which come back to the same spot looking for food. Is thatthe purpose of life? One doesnt stop living ones life but these thoughtscreate some sense calledvyragya (detachment) that might reduce some of the greed and need foraccumulation, which is on the rise.15 days ago • Like •Follow UjwalUjwal Jha • @ Jayendra Jee.... What is your purpose?? You are a logical person and you should see thatmany of the members do not have consistency in their post. I read most of your posts and giving you anidea. Do not waste your time here. People like you can be a lot more constructive than giving freeeducation.15 days ago • Like •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-........... detachment is not the direct meaning of word .One should have vairagya in life for it to be meaningful and there will not time for anyone to ask astold earlier what is life .... - that apart, it does not mean negating our desires or reducing consumptionor avoiding luxurious lifestyle ... etc ..-15 days ago •
  • 46. Follow jayendrajayendra upadhye • And here is Naradjee hinting detachment so I should head for the himalayas! :)Ujwal, you may have noticed I can be quite scathing with people who just open their mouths and throwout pompous hot air.Like I was told on another thread here, by an educated person that Hindu scriptures sanctionedsacrifices so that viruses could then stick to the blood and air would be pure!People go on and on about "our vedas, our shastras" without an iota of an idea what the damned thingsactually say, and neither bothering to read the originals.And then they get all het up when I cut their views to size.But tell the truth we must.Even if one from them were to get the hint and start reading the stuff, my day will be made.Kam se kam sahi cheez to jano...that is what I say.People become CEOS and what not and the first thing we know they start babbling home truths likethat blood attracting Viruses stuff.One guy told me. on another thread...the mind works completely independent of the brain. I wonderedif he meant it resided in cyverspace or the 4th dimension! :)Trivial statements all. How can the mind that needs to think, and thought itself needing memory beindependent of the brain?But majority has to win kya karein baba!!So one tries. That is the only thing in ones control. And one is regaled by "great posts"!Aap bhi yahi kariye is my advice.15 days ago • Like •Follow UjwalUjwal Jha • As long as you live in your home country at home with your family and friends aroundyou. It would be very difficult to conceive life without GOD. God and religions were created by Kings,advocated by Pundits / monks to keep the citizen in order.The era of kingdom is long gone but there are several social beliefs that exists through out planet earthand has a very strong social hold. Evolution works and religion is losing its grip on society.Those religions will be destroyed soon if they do not change their orthodox acts. It will not be allowedto kill in the name of religion. People are developing more and more logical ideas and that is theprocess by which society will be completely religion free.Finally as I said it earlier.... We Humans are the most dangerous virus on planet earth. Our main job isto grow rapidly and explore more. I am very confident that earth is not the only inhabitable planet inthe universe. It might take time but we will certainly be able to reach several galaxies and grow morerapidly. That is the purpose. Help other humans and develop our self.15 days ago • Like
  • 47. •1Follow jayendrajayendra upadhye • have overlooked the limitation on resources.There is a very powerful study of what happens in unbridled growth.The polynesian Easter Islands were a mystery for many decades. The Isles had strange statues on thembut no people. The last easter islander who could use their language died on another island many yearsago.Archeologists painfully reconstructed what had happened.It was a disaster of huge proportions.The islanders had cultivation and lived on fishing and farm produce.But soon their population grew so much that those resources (island afterall) were insufficient.Cannibalism set in and in the end there was no one left.(That happened in Stalingrad too during the 2 year siege).If we are a virus, we have to stop ourselves from self destruction.Afterall a virus colony lives only as long as the victim!15 days ago • Like •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-................just observe how people are living in Kasi, Madura and Kanchi...Cities alive with buzzing human beings alive for more than 3000 years . Almost you can compare itwith an ANT Colony ... people ... people .... every where .. there is no empty space or nothingness fornothing .where is life hidden inside VirusLife is living , live let live ......Life is living , live let live..........Life is living , live let live.-15 days ago •Follow venugopalvenugopal maganti • In the Rig Veda, the poet wonders what existed before everything else. And aftermuch pondering he concludes, the first to exist, even before breath, is desire - kama. Without kama,there would no movement from formlessness (asat) to form (sat), from darkness (tamas) to light (jyoti),from hopelessness (mrityu) to hope (amrita).This is what tamasoma --song means--whose desire is it remains an un answered question--I repeat itcan be any one--who knows ,even one of the passionate debators even
  • 48. 15 days ago • Like •1Follow SanjaySanjay Saxena • The purpose of life is very simple which is made unnecessarily complicated by somepeople.15 days ago • Like •Follow jayendrajayendra upadhye • The rigVeda is clear. on the Hiranyagarbha and Nasadiya sukta. ("Na sat asit naasat" becomes Nasadasit...and hence Nasadiya sukta and "HiranyagarbhaSamVartate" soHiranyagarbha sukta).That primeval undifferentiated "It" had the first Vikar as Ahankar. Kam needs Ahankar.That "IT" once infested with Ahankara, thought "Ekoham Bahusyam""I am one let me be many", and this was Kama! The desire to multiply.And THAT as you said rightly started the world as per that veda.Though I cannot place where this sentence occurs "EkohamBahusyam"..Nay be you can throw some light on that.15 days ago • Like •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-.......... the original Sin !...... vedam ne iniya ganam ne ........ sadur vedam ne.-15 days ago •Follow UjwalUjwal Jha • Guys can we talk a little bit different things? Did I see it properly that the name of this is"India Leadership Network"??? I cant believe it. I tried for a while and I think its really too much.Why the hell all of us are searching answers in a Religion? I am sorry but I feel its not a businessgroup. There are many countries in the world and I really do not know such country where people seekanswers only in religion.May be you guys should go to a temple and preach rather doing some business.15 days ago • Like
  • 49. •Follow BuddhiBuddhi Singh • The purpose of life on the earth is to know about self through intution and discovery ofthe almighty . The universe is the creation of nature and is the extended form of human body.Theuniverse and human body are synonimous.Even though, we all are unaware about the existense of allthis.To know should be our ultimate motto but we are in sleeping mode and by making walls ofsorrows and agonies we are expecting for ultimate happiness in the universe.15 days ago • Like •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-That is a good one ..-15 days ago •Follow jayendrajayendra upadhye • Ujwal, no. This particular question demands a philosophical answer.So we are giving out such answers.On other topics I have raised, you wont find religion at all.For example my thread about all Indians wanting to be managers.Some references to caste may have come there as it affects the indians worldview and behaviour ingeneral.It is like joining a south african blog and expecting nothing racial there.Why south africa! Right here on linked in you can find it being practiced subtly.I joined the hp Tandem Nonstop blog here.I posted a lot and suddenly I was locked out. Upon inquiring with Linked in I got the interesting reply"Talk to the group owner"!I did so. And what dd that snooty Scandinavian lady say?You are posting too much technical stuff! Its clogging our mail boxes, please go elsewhere! Can youbelieve it,She looked upon me as a pest!And all this after many of the Americans there had actually interacted favorably and heavily with me.Some of them took up the issue with her but she did not budge!Racism is alive and kicking on this very Linkedin forum! But it is cloaked unde "Babugiri" like "talk tothe owner"!If I had been a scandinavian I would have been greeted with great Bonhommie I am sure of that. Noones mail boxed would be clogged then. :)And then these people come and lecture us on how to improve India and pull the chinese down overchild labor. These same people used extensive child labor in their own countries 50 to 100 years ago.Now sau choohe kha ke billi jah pe nikli hai. :)
  • 50. 15 days ago • Like •Follow FloydFloyd Vaz MBC • If any of you want a Christian perspective, please watch this with an unbiased mind.Some amazing photography. days ago • Like •Follow jayendrajayendra upadhye • The god referred to therin is muslim/hindu/christian?Does he favor one over the other?(For the Buddhists and Jains dont believe in God as such but believe humans can strive to somethingakin to godhood).Is he male or female? If male does he need a mate?Does he wear clothes as humans do?Where does he stay and what does he eat and sleep?How does he pass his time?By what mechanism does creation happen? When did it happen?Archbishop Usshers date of 4004 BC is ok?In the Christian perspective what happens after armageddon?Does the universe cease to be?I ask because The questions asked here are more far reaching than that.Surely the purpose of things is not so limited as just please a god and go to heaven?Does Christianity say anything on the deeper mysteries?Whence / whither / why?(Im afraid most religions are mum on that).15 days ago • Like •NimuUnfollowNimu Shenoy, MBA • I am a bit perplexed as to why Ujwal made his comment about discussing
  • 51. religion on a business site. I remember leaving the India vs China thread because Ujwal was supportingthe fact that religion is what makes India stronger than China.Both Jayendra and I recognize the fact that this question is valid because of philosophical implications.I believe that part of leadership is to be able to think about very diverse topics. I was surprised thatNavins prostitution post cleared for approval, but this goes to show that leaders should be able tohandle all sort of topics.My purpose to be a part of India Leadership Network is to be able to connect on an intellectual levelwith other Indians. Unfortunately, where I live now, I do not have the ability to meet the quality peoplethat I have on ILN. If the nature of subjects is not in your favor, there is always the choice of droppinga group.Why does the universe exist? I think it exists to find a balance between good and evil. One side isusually never greater than the other. If there is too much good, the universe responds with evil. If thereis too much evil, the universe tries to calm things with good. Just watch weather, politics, economics,religion, culture, etc -- it is TRUE!14 days ago • Like •1Follow SanjaySanjay Saxena • Some of the questions which no religion answers or touches upon are who is God?Who created God? Who gave them the powers? What was before God? If there was nothing beforeGod, then who created nothing out of which something gets created? Who built that kind of process?Why did God create species which slowly evolves? Why did God create humans who are so weak thateven a small virus can kill it? Why did God walked on Earth only in ancient times? Why don’t theyhelp Mankind now when they need them most? Do they watch us from Heaven? Is it some kind ofSoap Opera? Why did God create Good & Evil? What provoked them to do such crazy things? Why dohave want to maintain such balance? Can they do something better? If Men is in a miserable situationtoday then it means that God has decided that & planned that because everything is pre-destined sinceGod knows everything be it past, present or future. If God had decided everything in advance then whatwrong did Hitler do? He just fulfilled his duties like a puppet.14 days ago • Like •Follow ChiranjeeviChiranjeevi Tallapragada • Except the 5 (earth, air, water, fire and is the 5th one the sky?) elements andthe trees I guess everything else is impure because there is selfishness and purpose behind theiractivities. Does anyone here agree?14 days ago • Like •
  • 52. NimuUnfollowNimu Shenoy, MBA • Sanjay, I really like the line of your questioning. I do not think there will ever beexact answers for those questions. We can spend our time prophesying about these subjects ourselvesor we can simply rely on the faith of our religion to show us the answers.I think the reason that this topic is so difficult and complicated to grasp is because the concept is nottangible. When we cannot see, hear, smell or feel something (taste - not valid), then we must rely onmore than our senses. Some believe in the Third Eye -- there may be some truth to this insight.Chiranjeevi, I think the 5th element is metal. I agree that there is purpose behind certain creations suchas selfishness and selflessness alike. However, I feel that creations become impure with time, but theybegin as a pure creation. Perhaps this is why there is some ambition to move towardsenlightenment....the descendence from impurity back to it original purity. Just a thought!14 days ago • Like •Follow jayendrajayendra upadhye • Nimu, Chiranjeevo is referring to the Pancha Maha-bhutas (5 greate beings).Beings does not mean living creatures here! Sanskrit Bhu means to be to exist. These 5 came into beingafter the Indian equivalent of the Bang happened.The mind matter Mahat of Brahma the ever expanding one (Sagan had a nice take on that one in hisbook Cosmos), differetiated into the 3 Gunas Satva Rajas and Tamas, and after these came these statesof being "Bhuta"s.Prithvi - Solid - Quality: SparshaAap - Liqiid - Quality: To wetTej - A state not clearly understood. - Quality: Akin to heatVayu - GasAaakash - Space - Quality: Shabda.Our current understanding and the old understanding differ as then the concept that sound cannot travelin a vacuum was unknown.During Pralaya the reverse happens and each tattva is consumed by the other bottom up ending withAakash that is absorbed back into Mahat.So much for the Panch Mahabhutas.Blavatsky (Helena Petrova) wrote a giant work "the secret Doctrine" that reads like science fiction.Read and enjoy. She borrowed heavily from the Indian Shastras and cosmogony.14 days ago • Like •Follow jayendrajayendra upadhye • Nimu...patience...we need to learn from Karthikeyan.14 days ago • Like •
  • 53. karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-.........god is a concept , Discover IT :).-14 days ago •AkshayaUnfollowAkshaya Bhatia • GOD-Generator-Organizer-Destroyer....!!!!....iteration in an infinite loop...14 days ago • Like •Follow jayendrajayendra upadhye • Carl sagan in his book "Cosmos" has richly complimented Indian tradition that saysthat the universe is but a Kalpa (Idea) in the mind of Brahma.The chaturyuga concept says 1000 Chaturyuga cycles form a day of Brahma, And there is an equalnight.Brahma lives such 100 years after which He is regenerated by another equally longer cycle.Fifty years have elapsed since creation began (as per Hindu theory) and that period is really reallylarge.I have said all this just to make things known to those indians who do not know and want to know forthe sake of it.Others are free to criticise.I studied these things out of interest, and not necessarily because I believe in them.I am a fence sitter, as I always say. And practice Neti-Neti.Truth can be mutlifaceted and no one claim to truth may be right.The Astronomer eddington may have been close.He said it is a multidimensional cosmos, we limit it by our own 3 dimensional perception.We may be mites in front of the cosmos, But why not try to understand it?14 days ago • Like •Follow jayendrajayendra upadhye • Karthikeyan, even mighty Narada came down to earth once in a while.So for a few days come down to us and speak the language of us mortals so we may understand you!Oblige us maharaj! :)14 days ago • Like •
  • 54. karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-Jayendra............divide an Atom by the Universe and call it X................ I am one of those XI am down in the earth down to earth :).-14 days ago •Follow jayendrajayendra upadhye • Now remain there for a few days so we can cross some decent swords!It is difficult to catch you in the Narad phase.14 days ago • Like •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .- Selfishness ..............Selfish Gene is demystified at least with respect to bacteria colonies and it is likely to hold truefor other higher organisms !!All beings are generally not that selfish as we expect them to be ?!.-14 days ago •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-.......................The natural Purpose of Mankind is to become God ...................Precise comprehension of a role of mankind in the Nature, - is extremely important for the naturalpurpose of the purpose of its existence for a correct choice of the general direction of movement of asociety. The god as an able essence is not that other as higher Reason (Supreme Mind). He will becreated by scientific and technical progress. The mankind already became the God (the Supreme Mind,Reason) in our Solar System and the Nature has given mankind an opportunity to participate in GreatSpace Race of Reasons to become the God of our Milky Way Galaxy, and then it is possible also the
  • 55. God of the Universe in the form of Great Reason.The mankind should soon realize the applicability of this concept; this great natural purpose and theopportunity given to him/her and to do everything, to borrow (occupy) leading position, to not appearin slavery at higher civilizations, and even to disappear from the Universe. In this race mankind canhope only on itself. The only means of victory is our own scientific and technical progress andknowledge of the world environmental about us.Dr.Sci. Alexander A. Bolonkin,July, 2005. USA. Discover IT ........... oh .. I am sorry , Become God :).-14 days ago •Follow SteveSteve Dufourny • Dear Nimu Shenoi,You know I beleive that the good is stronger than the evil. Imagine you are the well, the good, imaginethat your picture in the mirror is the bad. If you break the mirror, the bad disappear. It is the same withthe entire universe, the bad is purely dedicated to disappear in time space evolution, like the bordersand frontiers, like the arms and weapons, like the monney and the power and the vanity,....the bad isdedicated to disapear .The evolution is a pure road of optimization. We have the capacity to evolve andto understand what is the real meaning of this universal sphere. So we have the capacity to see thisimmensity in improvement, and so we can understand that it exists an equation of optimization, ofspherization. It implies a logical humility in regard to this universal sphere and its secrets.Best Regards14 days ago • Like •NimuUnfollowNimu Shenoy, MBA • Believe me, Steve....I think what you said is very beautiful and pure; however, Ido not think that good conquers evil only. I think it is a fairly equal effort.For example, how do you explain global warming? This is a negative act by the environment becauseof our carbon footprint on Earth. Today, we are struggling to do things to counteract this dilemma.Whether this is a correct comparison or not, I would rather have a more peaceful logic, but in my mind,
  • 56. I have seen both good and evil occur simultaneously. Like yin and yang from Chinese culture. :-)14 days ago • Like •Follow ChandraChandra Vishy • A practical answer at the best of timesa) Purpose of Life on earth --- To Liveb) Why Does Universe exist --- To support the need for people to livec) Does anyone else know about the existence of us --- Yes they do. Look around and youd find loadsof people who know they do. For example, I now know that you do.Vishy14 days ago • Like •Follow SteveSteve Dufourny • Hello Nimu,I beleive strongly that the bad will disappear. You know Nimu, for example frankly me in my mind,never I have had hate. I have never had this state.But I am conscious that it is not the case for allpeople.Why? I think it is just due to education and environments. The real secret is there I think, fightthe evil simply. First in the mind if you prefer, and in the reality after. The yin and the yang are moresubtle than this meaning I think. The complementarity, in an evolutive optimization, is evident. Like theBohrian complementarity at the quantum scales, the equilibriums are prefered.It is a little if I said that the sun is the yang and the planet Earth is the yin.....all is light, this masspolarizes light...and mass is light, so the duality and the binar system of equilibriums is respected likethe + and the - in a pure universal road. The evil has no its place in this reasoning of complementarity.Lao Tseu,Buddah,Confucius,...shall agree No ? :)Best Regards14 days ago • Like •1karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .----- That is the whole problem / solution ..... sequence , never stays stable beyond a certain point in time. No one can have that easily, the life cut out for themselves with out referring to some one Elses life orat least some mundane objects like rock, gold .... etc...... Discover IT ........... oh .. I am sorry , Become God :)
  • 57. ,-14 days ago •Follow SanjaySanjay Saxena • @Vishy, I agree...Some cynics may have soda over for this, giving such simple answerto such complicated question.14 days ago • Like •SiddharthUnfollowSiddharth Shah • were a part of gods (or someone somewhere that we dont know of) experiment, justlike a batch of bacteria cultivated on a tray and being observed under a microscope. Or a bunch ofmonkeys ina cage with cameras to understand their social behavior.For each one of us the universe is big as ones own immagination. If you dont care about whatshappening beyond your house thats it, its your universe and to hell with the gardens lakes and roads orother cities too.If you stretch your imagination you could go beyond the solar system into other galaxies and then thatsit,Probanly the experiment will end along with ourselves once we all find out what the purpose of thisexperiment is.14 days ago • Like •1karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-................Mysteries of the Sacred Universeworld and universe from the Srimad Bhagavatams cosmological viewpoint. days ago
  • 58. •Follow venugopalvenugopal maganti • Sanjay asked the relavant questions--man is the only animal capable ofthinking,and all animals have satva,raja ha ,tamo gunas built into them--those who fall prey to theconstant inner urge of feeding and breeding at others expense are the demons,and the rest have to fightthem.In any case,you will find that in nature,there is no new growth,without the old beingvanquished.Did Hitler carry out a pre ordaind course of action?if this isso,NEWTON,EINSTEIN,GANDHI AND MOTHER THERESA too would have followed such acourse only.I believe man is a cultured,crafty animal,perfectly capable of cheating and mobilisingmasses,by using irrefutable arguments ,to resort to genocide--be it BUSH,HITLER,CHANGIZKHAN(,they are historically acceptable chracters),but come in the same pantheon ofRAVANAS,BAKASURAS,etc,,.in other words,control your basic instincts,and use your time on earthto improve the lives of others,along with your own,and use your intellectual capabilities to thisend,rather than indulging in some kind of end less debates --after all, for those who sit on the fence,myquestion is ,is this not the same activity,all those brilliant people tried to do over thousands of years,andproduced volumes and volumes of end less philosophy,which confuses more,the already confused?Ialso believe that they did this only be cause they had very little to do with their intelligence other thanthis ,but is it the same case today also,in the face of 7 billion population,each of whom,trying to findfood and energy,in competition with the rest of us?14 days ago • Like •Follow ChandraChandra Vishy • @Venugopal --- Small correction then --- Everyone has asked relevant questions.Everyone except me who has contributed with their thoughts, has a point and all of them have theirquestions.To your post --- I am trying to find traces of context of this topic, but couldnt find any. If you couldprovide a snapshot of what you are trying to say, it would make things simple for me (A nut like me).ThanksVishy14 days ago • Like •
  • 59. Follow venugopalvenugopal maganti • @chandra,if you look at the topic,it is purpose of existence of universe,life,and ifany E.Ts exist--the discussion took several violent turns,and in stead of simple answers,it has become averbal duel between atheists and the rest--most of the time,at least when I commented,it was a re actionto some body like a sanjy,rather than proving a point,and I do acknowledge the high levels ofintellectual exchanges that take place,but I am dismayed at the lack of tolerance towards dissent--contexts are far from the point of discussion--pl. read all my posts,to get a total idea on what I havebeen costantly trying to say ,i.e. if you have the patience,and if you dont,just forget it--and if you findmy comments in coherent,and even meaning less,well ,just go ahead and say that--no offence taken--14 days ago • Like •Follow ChandraChandra Vishy • @Venugopal ---1) My first point was when you said, "Sanjay has asked the relevant questions". That told me thatothers questions were not so relevant. And thats why Para 1.2) For Para 2, I only read through your last post before commenting, and that is why I did what I did.For a guy with a simple philosophy to life, I dont need to look forward or backwards than my simpleanswers. Keeps me going Venugopal for that matter.3) I had a quick snapshot of what you wrote and must say it is intellectually simulating. That said, Ineed some ounces of intellect up my head to understand it, which I must admit, am short of at this pointof time.Thanks and keep writing.Vishy14 days ago • Like •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-
  • 60. Getting and seeing Something out of Nothing is neither a Joke nor a Magic gets one the Nobel prize too !!__________________________________________Chalmers Scientists Create Light From VacuumThe experiment is based on one of the most counterintuitive, yet, one of the most important principlesin quantum mechanics: that vacuum is by no means empty nothingness. In fact, the vacuum is full ofvarious particles that are continuously fluctuating in and out of existence. They appear, exist for a briefmoment and then disappear again. Since their existence is so fleeting, they are usually referred to asvirtual particles....... the main value of the experiment is that it increases our understanding of basic physical concepts,such as vacuum fluctuations – the constant appearance and disappearance of virtual particles invacuum. It is believed that vacuum fluctuations may have a connection with "dark energy" whichdrives the accelerated expansion of the universe. The discovery of this acceleration was recognised thisyear with the awarding of the Nobel Prize in Physics. all Life is not nothing , it is getting something out of it even if it is Nothing !!!Discover IT :)..-14 days ago •Follow venugopalvenugopal maganti • These are the questions that most of the successful and well to do people face intheir 40s--a kind of mid life melancholy--how ever,you would have found in education,at work,and inlife in general,the more intelligent people work out their own convenient way of finding solutions totheir problems,i.e. there is no specific book,custom built for every individual in his journey at variouspoints in his life..the more ambitious of such people,cleverly manipulate people,processes and systemsaround them ,to rise to leadership levels in their profession.And as for those who can not quite figureout how to get around difficult questions,the easier option is to follow the leaders.By their 40s ,mostpeople mentioned above would have had a reasonable taste of material wealth and carnal pleasures,andit is at around this time,that the man/woman sheds a part of his/her pure biological skin(neuralepidermis?),and starts thinking about the purpose of life--I have no pretense of being an intellectual,butI did struggle for about 5 years,when I read several books,talked to many a philosopher,consultant--but ,finally it was life as JRD TATA saw it,that changed my mind for ever---I stopped looking for
  • 61. answers and in stead related and correlated all that I read,I saw,and I heard over the years,and got to areasonably satisfying theory about the questions that disturb most people,with an inclination to thinkingout side their biological lives(spiritual?,I am not sure) .I find in this group, people at both ends of the hindu spectrum,having wild flings at establishedtraditions--not surprising,since some Brahmins always thought they must resist orthodoxy(probablymore in search of personal liberty,rather than for universal good),and the victims at the other end of thespectrum,the un touchables rightly revolt against oppression--both types of iconoclasts are not new tohindus,as we find mention of them in Ramayana and vedas.To debate is ones right,but it must be purposeful,and must benefit the particular individualpersonally,as he must be able to figure out his own theory at the end of the day--I find violent attackson traditions,and meek resistance from the supporters--and it serves neither if they are unable to takeaway some thing in the end,except bruised/boosted pride,as the case may be..13 days ago • Like •Follow SanjaySanjay Saxena • @Venugopal, I am unable to understand the exact message that you want to convey. Itlooks like you are upset with some comments. By any chance if it is me that let me clarify.. By askingabout God I am not ridiculing God. On the contrary I am probing further. Trying to look with a freshperspective rather than just from the view provided by Shastras.By giving example of Htiler I am justtrying to find the loophole in karma theory. What did Hitler do in his past life that he became a Hitler inthis life? Did many people killed him & so in this life he takes his revenge? Accepting things purely onfaith could be very dangerous. An extremist accepts the faith that only his religion is good & rest all aresinful people & by killing them he is doing a holy act. Do you think he is wrong? From his point ofview he is doing a holy act.13 days ago • Like •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-....... Life is simple & simple if ones wants it to be and makes it that way ............. Life is complex too if one wishes it that way .....................Life is somewhere in between simple to complex .... to do nothing .It is not only the Seas that disappear and mountains that raise , it is also the people and their ideas &
  • 62. ideals , they come and go , they raise & fall .............. some linger over the passage of peoples own time............ haunting Ghosts or Gods Sermons ........... or complexity to make life simple :).-13 days ago •AkshayaUnfollowAkshaya Bhatia • If GOD-Generator-Organizer-Destroyer is biased to any particular ideology thenGOD becomes convergent to human being line of the ideology that demarcates actions of living beingson the line of Karma theory-Good or Bad.., thereby differentiation between GOD and any livingsentient being becomes extinct, which will be principally undermining the authority of GOD...Logically, GOD has to be unbiased if one assumes that GOD is creator of everything,... creator of theTIME, that encapsulate both day and night (darkness and light), not just the extremes but also shades ofevery character as well characteristics prevalent and perceptible in our existence ..!!!!...13 days ago • Like •Follow venugopalvenugopal maganti • I have pretty much said ,what I wanted to--and have no skill to elucidate further--those who are interested,may kindly make their own inferences,jsut as I managed to deduce from myexperiences,thoughts,and studies--thanks for reading my posts--13 days ago • Like •Follow Chiranjeevi
  • 63. Chiranjeevi Tallapragada • @Venugopal, your postings have been interesting and I have been readingthem all. I definitely agree with you that one should not take extreme stand on anything. Good to knowthat what we consider as truth is only our belief and someone else may have some other belief. Toknow what is the right path, I have realized that we just need to choose the right Guru and he/she willguide us. The right kind of guidance will never suggest a change outside, it will always be a changeinside us.13 days ago • Like •2Follow MilindMilind K Kulkarni • Let me start by saying how one defines life.From science perspective, something that grows is a life. It is as per list of perceivable characteristicsaccepted by History channel or other scientists to draw conclusions. A lot of science is built onprinciples, theories and observations. What we know through science is still too abstract to understandlife. Its because whats concrete for humans may be influenced by a temporary phenomenon in this era.In fact definition of atom or even universe is relative. It is purposely done for simplicity and start thethought process somewhere. However have we been able to enough relate the transformation processuniverse or life goes through. Note there is nothing right or wrong. Its all perception as you accept it foryourself.From time(chronology) perspective,Had we been part of the rigveda era when, we would still found some evidences pointing to lifes storybillion years back. You will realize that there is element of relativity.From spiritual and nature perspective,At times I feel, is nature influencing me or I am influencing nature. I can feel vacuum of sky oratmosphere inside me. I can feel coolness and calmness of the water inside me. Most of you also wouldhave loved looking at sky, water and moments you spend with nature. Is that really me ? Are wedifferent ? Its all perception as you accept it for yourself.Every perspective scientifically, spiritually, chronologically or thousand others not mentioned here willfinally take you to a point of "individual perception and theory of relativity". You may draw apattern(or people may call it a scientific theory). It(theory) may be acceptable to set of people, but notsure whether thats truth.Is everything mere perception and as infinite as time and universe. Well that depends on individualagain, for no one can prove anything right or wrong. Diversity is integral part of life and there will bespace of every individual opinion. Enlightenment is essential step in life for anyone to take it in adirection one wants.12 days ago • Like
  • 64. •1karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-.................... Enlightening !.-12 days ago •Follow SanjaySanjay Saxena • A though experiment -- Imagine you have microscopic eye.. what will be you see.Bacteria, Virus all around. A whole world of microscopic living being. Now imagine you have electronmicroscopic eye. You will seeing structures of all things. Magnify further. You will see only atoms. Youwill see a whole world only of space & atoms. You may also see virtual particles popping in & out ofexistence. In this scenario how would you distingush between a living being & non-living being sinceyou see only concentrated network of atoms all over which is constantly moving around at high speeds.Possibly in this case you may feel one with nature. In this case there is no up/down, big/small, etc onlyatoms jingling around.So are Atoms God? God is omniscient, Omnipotent, Omnipresent. Evens Atoms have similarproperties. It is there everywhere & it can have form yet it is formless, it is nowhere to be seen yet it isout there everywhere. It is tiny & yet become gigantic. It is weak yet it has greater power. :-)12 days ago • Like •1karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-Wow ..........continuous Enlightening ................. To meet our friend neutrino ...... we need few 100km s Structure ..... all in the hope that he hassomething Big Inside ............. may be ...................
  • 65. .-12 days ago •Follow MathivananMathivanan Subramaniam • Universe is endless. It exits not created. All the systems are part ofUniverse including the human beings. The purpose of of birth is not to take the rebirth......12 days ago • Like •Follow MathivananMathivanan Subramaniam • Universe is endless. It exits not created. All the systems are part ofUniverse including the human beings. The purpose of of birth is not to take the rebirth......12 days ago • Like •Follow MathivananMathivanan Subramaniam • Universe is endless. It exits not created. All the systems are part ofUniverse including the human beings. The purpose of of birth is not to take the rebirth......12 days ago • Like •1karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-........* .Paradox * ...... People are already born and there are many on the way, seems no stopping atall .......people arent disappearing also ............
  • 66. .-12 days ago •Follow venugopalvenugopal maganti • @Milind,highly engrossing--a look at human evolution from a wild animal to acompassionate political animal to day,--I feel the order is like this ,if you ignore how the first manappeared on earth--arboreal--hunter gatherer--organised farming--purposeful co habitation--societalrules--customs,traditions--superistitions--politics--accumulation of material wealth--efforts toperpetuate prosperity by transfer to own progeny--quest for glory--now, tell me if man has evolvedfrom this stage--all the while,fear of un known(invisible omni potent,later leading to idol worship),andrational thinking(which lead to all the developments ,starting with simple hunting tools by aborigines tonuclear weapons at the height of scientific development) have been lurking some where in mans mindand the debate we see is a result of that-- in fact,these two are complementary,just like day andnight,birth and death etc,,--but, we must remember that all the material wealth we enjoy and all thefood that we eat comes from the earth,and eventually returns to it(NAMAH SARVAYA CHA--in rudranamaka suktam)--as science will some time in future try to tinker with human genes,it will create newspecies,which could potentially host all those millions of deadly viruses,which the human immunesystem now resists succesfully,and man can potentially be the cause for his own extinction--whetherthe omni potent willed the creation of humans can be a debatable point,but, certainly, no body canargue that his extinction is not in his own hands--it is some thing akin to, a boy can be brought up byparents,can be educated,but if he suddenly turns criminal in his adulthood,can we blame his parents?and if he faces the gallows,it is purely of his own making--so belief is the anchor ,and purpose is thedirection and goal of life--what belief and what purpose is purely in ones own realm of things--thedebate about existence of GOD ,to me, is like the sixth fingure of man,which serves no purpose.12 days ago • Like •Follow SanjaySanjay Saxena • Well, the Universe started with a Big Bang. So it implies that it didnot exist before bigbang. Even Stars have a cycle of birth & death. Second law of thermodynamic states that entropy (Stateof Disorder) of the system will keep on increasing. Even if humans act & behave like Gods they willstill all die eventually due to heat death of the Universe.Moreover even Sun is slowly moving towardsits death. So extinction is inevitable.12 days ago • Like
  • 67. •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-one HAIKUWaiting to liveSlog the YearBear the fruitHear the Luck.-12 days ago •Follow RajagopalRajagopal Sevilimedu • I guess the first question that comes to mind is why are we even asking thisquestion? Why do we need to believe there is an eternal and transcendental purpose to life? Answeringthat question itself probably brings us closer to the answer12 days ago • Like •SiddharthUnfollowSiddharth Shah • The whole universe and life exists on the fundamental principal of "F&(K"Thats how all the life came into existence and ends when its F%(ked up..the universe/ purpose will cease to exist the day you dont give a F&(kLife will become great once you stop taking F%(k(Since the moderators are on a break I hope to survive) Well Then I dont give a F&(k.. :-D12 days ago • Like •Follow jayendra
  • 68. jayendra upadhye • woh break aapkeliye acchhee sabit ho rahi hai..Lekin there is a loooong interval between the f and the k, which propels people to ask such questions! take on your take is that humans hate lack of information. So they populate "whathappens after death", "why /how" questions as in this topic with "lot of hot air" we call religion.Some of this hot air is a bit logical, other part of it says "it all started in 4004 BC ofcourse (ArchbishopAssher)m and end with Armageddon". An Armageddon always predicted but never happening.12 days ago • Like •AkshayaUnfollowAkshaya Bhatia • Please also refer:-Which stream of endeavor is more competent to unravel (unearth) mysteries of life, Spiritualism orScience??..!!!... days ago • Like •Follow DavidDavid Dayalan • We are created by God in His likeness to rule over the creation. So in a sense acustodian of all that we see, To love one another, care for the creation and to safe guard the nature. Andabove all to love the creator and to do our duty as an act of worship.11 days ago • Like •Follow jayendrajayendra upadhye • David, if we are gods likeness, you by inference mean such a god also has armslegs and human emotions like jealousy and hate?By inferemce them he would need to eat, he would need a wife and he would have children....howmany in so long a time?Come on these are concepts of an angry stone age god that needed to be pacified by sacrifices.(Thor/Odin/Indra/Jehovah).It boggles the mind that in this century people should be thinking of a bearded god staff in hand lordingit over lesser mortals and extracting revenge and doling gifts to "chosen people"!I remember in Singapore a couple of ardent guys wanted so much to save my soul, they made a point tovisit me sundays, book in hand.
  • 69. One sinday I got tired and asked them...why are you toiling so futilely, when only 14,4000 jews will goto heaven as per revelation?The figure and the chapter may be wrong but 144 figures in it.I told them if your scriptures gaurantee heaven to only "some" after armageddon, you are barking upthe wrong tree!Now upon searching the web I find this has put many in a tizzy as they are unsure if "they" will be onthe "in" list or "out" list!!11 days ago • Like •Follow jayendrajayendra upadhye • So David, isnt there any higher philosophical thought you can share apart fromsimplistic stuff of a controlling domineering angry/jealous/loving/hating anthropomorphic god (withattendent logical issues with that) and his servile fallible children?Somerhing secular and philosophical?11 days ago • Like •Follow bhattathiribhattathiri mulavana • It is clearly explained in Bhagavad Gita.Many great and notable individuals from modern times as well as bygone eras have read the Bhagavad-Gita and have extolled its universal message. We are naming some of them:Albert Einstein stated that when reading the Bhagavad-Gita he thinks about how God created theuniverse and then everything else seemed so superfluous.Mahatma Gandhi stated that the Bhagavad-Gita calls on humanity to dedicate mind, body and soul topurity.Dr. Albert Schweizer stated that the Bhagavad-Gita has a profound influence on the spirit of mankindby its devotion to God which is manifested in all actions.Sri Aurobindo stated the Bhagavad-Gita has a new message for every age and every civilization.Herman Hesse stated that the wonder of the Bhagavad-Gita is its beautiful revelation of lifes wisdomwhich has made philosophy blossom into religion.Ramanuja has stated that the Bhagavad-Gita reveals the goalof the all the Vedic scriptures.Aldous Huxley stated that the Bhagavad-Gita is the most comprhensive statement of perennialphilosophy.Madhvacarya has stated that the Bhagavad-Gita is apauruseya which means of divine origin andeternal.11 days ago • Like
  • 70. •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-....Yes, it has said everything,................. except this one - a small poem^^^^Oh mighty the almightywhere is my mightHidden out of sightMight your sight fall upon this souls plightCreative heights is your mightShower your sight on this souls might^^^.-11 days ago •Follow bhattathiribhattathiri mulavana • every human being has approximately 43,000 separate births and life cycles. Sothe figure is astronomical if one calculates how many human lifetimes transpire in a only year ofBrahmas lifetime. So in this present chapter the truth about redemption from this transmigration fromthe cycle of birth and death is being revealed for this fulfilment. As it is not even remotely possible toachieve the fulfilment of redemption without atma-tattva or realisation of the eternal soul within. So inorder to inoculate this knowledge of truth this chapter will delineate the relationship between prakriti orthe material substratum pervading physical existence and the Pususa or the Supreme Consciousnesspervading spiritual existence that is the source of all existence. It is the lack of discrimination anddiscernment between the prakriti and Purusa which causes delusion and binds the atma or eternal soulwhich is an infinitesimal spark of the Purusa within the etheric heart of the jiva or embodied being,keeping them in bondage locked by samsara or the perpetual cycle of transmigratory existence birthafter birth, life after life. It is by the power of first Purusa and then prakriti that the Supreme LordKrishna manifests all creation and they are distinctly different from each other. Prakriti is related to theksetra or the field and the Purusa is related to ksetrajnam or knower of the field. The ksetra is thematerial body which is the basis for all physical enjoyment and the sprouting ground for endlesstransmigration. The ksetrajnam is that which is conscious of itself and thinks in terms of I and mine andis called the jiva by those who have factual discriminative knowledge of both. This is because the jivais the beneficiary of the results of the actions performed by the body like the farmer who reaps theharvest of his field.
  • 71. 7 days ago • Like •Follow bhattathiribhattathiri mulavana • The Evolution of the UniversePrakriti or the matrix of the universe, animated by a reflection of Consciousness or Brahman, dividesitself in the beginning into the cosmic forces called Sattva (equilibrium), Rajas (distraction) and Tamas(inertia). These three properties of Prakriti are really its very constituents, not merely qualifications oradjuncts, and stand to Prakriti in the relation of the three strands of a rope to the rope itself. CosmicSattva is called Maya. On account of its transparency and the absence of the property of Rajas in it, it isomnipresent and reflects in its essence Brahman in a universal manner. The cosmic reflection ofBrahman in the Sattva aspect of Prakriti is called Isvara, the Sovereign of the universe. It is Isvara whois the Creator, Preserver and Destroyer of the universe. In Isvara the universe exists in a seed-form, andall the Jivas who had not the opportunity to attain Self-realisation at the time of Pralaya or cosmicdissolution, lie latent in Isvara prior to the subsequent creation. This condition may be compared to acosmic sleep (Yoganidra), where everything lies dormant as the tree exists in a seed. When the cosmicseed slightly manifests itself, showing symptoms of creation, the faint outlines of the universe, it goesby the name of Hiranyagarbha. The fully manifested aspect of this universe as informed by thepresence of Brahman, is called Virat. Thus, Isvara, Hiranyagarbha and Virat are manifestations inCosmic Sattva, and are Omnipresent, Omniscient and Omnipotent.7 days ago • Like •Follow bhattathiribhattathiri mulavana • Questionout of so many human beings who are suffering, there are a few whoare actually inquiring about their position, as to what they are, why they are put into this awkwardposition and so on. Unless one is awakened to this position of questioning his suffering, unless herealizes that he doesnt want suffering but rather wants to make a solution to all suffering, then one isnot to be considered a perfect human being. Humanity begins when this sort of inquiry is awakened inones mind. In the Brahma-sutra this inquiry is called brahma jijnasa. Athato brahma jijnasa. Everyactivity of the human being is to be considered a failure unless he inquires about the nature of theAbsolute Truth.7 days ago • Like •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-........... at times vedantham & siddantham just ooze out in our Life :) Every activity of the human being is to be considered a failure unless he inquires about the nature ofthe Absolute Truth.
  • 72. .-6 days ago •Follow jayendrajayendra upadhye • @bhattathiri mulavana:Athato brahma jijnasa! The first time I read that one, the hair on my arms literally stood out on end.The next to elicit such a reaction was ofcourse Patanjalis "Yigahshcittavrittinirodhaha".You seem to be a well versed man, in Adhyatmik literature.Can you throw some light on this paradox?In the Gita, Krishna says "Hato va Praapyasi swargam, jito va praapyasi mahim".I have always wondered how this sentence has had two opposite effects on people of different psyche.For Hindus it was all about the neccessity of killing in a just battle. DharmaYuddhaFor some others it became a call for cruel killings in jihad, where people kill for the hoors either ofheavenly or earthly variety!For the Taliban use the verisame battle doctrine!But see where it has taken them...only to ignominy.6 days ago • Like •Follow bhattathiribhattathiri mulavana • 1. Up to ten years children get love from everywhere.2. During ten to twenty years one will have curiosity of everything to study and understand.3. From twenty to thirty years one should settle in life with a job and family life independently.4. From thirty to forty years one should be mature foe balanced use of acquired knowledge withchallenge and problems of day today life. Its value lies in accepting challenges and finding solutions.5. From forty and fifty years one should take the responsibility to fulfil family and social obligationswith self confidence and should achieve good name and reputation.6. Fifty to sixty years is the period of anxiety regarding children? Its value lies in forbearance andfortitude.7. Sixty to seventy years is the period of self auditing and reflection of assessing retrospectively aboutthe past failures and achievements and of acquisition and transmission of wisdom to others. This entailsgiving one’s best for the benefit of others and relaxing. Its value lies in adjusting with changingscenario personal, social and declining energy and with dignity and patience.8. Seventy to eighty is the period of health problems and may be neglected by close relative andfriends. One should adjust to live as a guest forgiving all ill-treatment by others.9. Eighty to ninety is the period of suffering with diseases. Spiritual life is good by controlling food,thoughts and work. Always keep body clean and turn mind for an inward journey.10. Ninety to hundred years is the most dependable period to adjust with all surroundings andcircumstances, better to spend time in prayer in silence, solitude and peace. Try to renounce everythingand be free from all possessions, desires and worries to have a peaceful life.6 days ago • Like •
  • 73. karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-There is an interesting trick ( Magic ) out there...................................keep the brains busy searching for some Truths , very very actively....introduce some Truths ( which sells Ones products )....silently .... silently________________________________________________Read this small article, especially the imagesIndia is in the midst of a unique identity revolution. After years of consuming “imported products,” theyouth here is rising to define their own needs and wants. They still want the western “appeal” butdesire the Indian “look.” This concept is Indianization …................................…..................................................................................Indianization is perhaps having the biggest impact in the Fashion space. This concept has now blurredthe lines between the traditionally distinct western wear and Indian wear. From high fashion to kitsch,the use of everyday Indianness is everywhere to be seen …......................... absolute truths many Search for the Practical Truth !!Discover IT .... Oh ... No No .......... Extract Out IT :).-6 days ago •Follow jayendrajayendra upadhye • Karthikeyan! Indians WERE most modern 2000 years ago!Just look at the old sculptures, the "traditional wear of that time" could match any fashion show inParis, the turbans, the minimal clothes, the taste depicted in the elegant designs of whatever they wore.Even the delicate Tribhanga statuettes show a liking for quality and grace.At the present moment our cycle is at the lowest, and the west is ascendent., no rather just beginning todecline.We stilll see tribalism in out present situation with huge gaudy and garish idols used during festivals,accompanied by so much noise they call music, with no place for taste and finesse any where.The "downtrodden" whi have inherited things partly by governmental support and partly by sheer
  • 74. numbers, are freaking out. Once they have had their say, they will feel the cultural vacuum of thesethings and turn inwards and hopefully, they will also raise themselves to the higher standards currentlyseen in western enterprise in workmanship and technology, and the ancient standards set by Indianphilosophy.6 days ago • Like •Prof.SureshUnfollowProf.Suresh Kumar • Very philosophical queries calling for deeply metaphysical answers-there is adeeper question like why should universe exist,and what is the meaning of life which stimulatedthought on concepts lke spirit,Brahman and ParaBrahman,Maya and evoultion.Spirit ,a the esence of energy principle,Brahman as the subtle and singular source of all universe andexistence,Maya as the evolutionary principle and ParaBrahman as the immutable constant andreference point that powrrs all else.That is a symmetric perfection giving meaning6 days ago • Like •1karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-What is * Indianization * in the whole scheme of the Life & Universe ???.-6 days ago •Follow jayendrajayendra upadhye • @Prof.Suresh Kumar:To these deep questions we have had answers like it is all an exam held by god, and after passingwhich, we all will go to an eternal heaven and failing which we will go to an eternal hell!!!Sooooo Simplem it boggles the mind.And this is 2011 A.D.6 days ago • Like •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-........doine^ ........ doine^ .............. doine^
  • 75. .......... * ...................* .......................* ............introduce some Truths (which sells Ones products)...silently ... silently .. SILENTLY.-6 days ago •Follow SanjaySanjay Saxena • I wonder what the people in 4011 AD think about people in 2011 AD. and what wouldchange? Flying cars, Robots, Genetically engineered man/woman, animals, food, flora & fauna. Worldfree of diseases. All humans monitored by computers. Even thoughts could be read & whenever anycriminal thought come in any human being it will be immediately transmitted to centralized computerwhich will take appropriate action.Everything will be driven by strict rules & regulation. There will beno crimes, no prostitution, no wars, no bad people, no evil people, no hate & no divorce because matchmaking will be done by computers which has database of genetic maps of all human beings.Productionof new babies will be customized & planned by the centralized body so that we have only exact numberof professionals needed in the society. Imagine what would be the meaning of life then?6 days ago • Like •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-my mind , my life ...........does that hold True !!something to find out :)Network - "Im as mad as hell" speech [english subtitles] days ago •Follow bhattathiribhattathiri mulavana • Our real, spiritual nature is to seek enjoyment. Thats what everybody does. TheVedas talk about the purpose of life in great detail: Krishna is the cause of all causes, the SupremeEnjoyer, and He expands Himself unlimitedly to make unlimited enjoyable relationships possible.Thats what He does.
  • 76. If we want to enjoy, there are basically two ways to go about it:1) the self-centered approach, and2) the Absolute Truth-centered approach.6 days ago • Like •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-Interesting let us have more of it ................What is SELFWhat is Absolute TRUTHit will be nice to have it in the most ... most ... ENJOY able WayKrishna is no doubt a manifestation of fun & frolic, but at times cunning Killer ..........-6 days ago •Follow MikeMike Rana • On my group The Universe, this topic is being discussed very seriously and objectively. Iam taking all the inpouts for my next bookSome of my friends on this group may be glad to know that my book has been acquired by the USlibrary of Congress. see more in my blog wordpress.mikerana6 days ago • Like •Follow bhattathiribhattathiri mulavana • How Bhagavad Gita has charmed US › Business2 Nov 2006 – Has the Bhagavad Gita replaced The Art of War as the hip new ancient Easternmanagement text? Signs of worldly success abounded as ...6 days ago • Like •
  • 77. karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-Hi Mike,if any thing is lifted in to the book from here, pay suitable royalties :).-6 days ago •Follow MikeMike Rana • If someone curious and innocent wanted to know what is life and what are the stars andwhat happens there, how would you explain to such a person. I have two Eskimo friends who knownothing in life except ICE and they do not have earth below their feet... It is only frozen sea ..6 days ago • Like •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-.. that is the absolute Truth and the beauty of LifeGita in one Line,.* every being sees & experiences, What it is supposed to see & experience in that life *..-6 days ago •Follow venugopalvenugopal maganti • pardon me if I sound childish,but I am curious to know from your eskimofriends,if the ice under their feet is salty--and also,how their ancestors managed to get drinking water inthat 6 month long winter!6 days ago • Like •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-Good Question :)
  • 78. Salty Ice Cubes : / and days ago •Follow MikeMike Rana • @Venu, To know about their life please go to google and search for Novaya Zemalia5 days ago • Like •Follow MikeMike Rana • Hi Karthikeyan,I paid back in sharing of my knowledge with wise people on this forum5 days ago • Like •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-That is cool Mike, I was just kidding and wondering on your return after you have said bye bye to all ofus here .... !!.-5 days ago •Follow MikeMike Rana • I returned because I felt it was necessary to share with you all some news, and I hopedthat some people had promised me to buy the book ... would be reminded. For paper versions (hard andsoft) the best price I can offer because they sent me the books in bulk from USA. Individually it meansshipping. In stores, only a few of the large ones will have in Delhi and Bombay.I focus on my blog, and my group The Universe. It was too much for me to handle the communicationsin this group, I mean volumes.
  • 79. 5 days ago • Like •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-Thanks Mike , sincerely appreciate your efforts and all the best ..-5 days ago •NimuUnfollowNimu Shenoy, MBA • Congrats Mike on your Citizens Manifesto being acquired by the U.S. Libraryof Congress. That is quite an achievement!!! This good feeling certainly gives you motivation tocontinue to Book II. Wishing you plenty of success!5 days ago • Like •Follow KishanKishan Lal • I think it is just like that and question not to think about.5 days ago • Like •Follow MikeMike Rana • Nimu and Karithikeyan,As I mentioned before my ideas were were validated and questioned by people on this network and Ihave acknowledged this fact in the book. I also wrote a chapter on media and social networking. Thereare a few difficulties on social networksPeople divert from the question and the thread of discussion becomes muddled upPeople praise or belittle each other in order to gain publicitySome of the discussions are too long and therefore they become contradictoryAlso, out of the 12 people who offered to buy the book only two have bought so far. This means peopledo not mean what they sayThis is one of the reasons that I focus more on the blog, where controls can be exercised5 days ago • Like •
  • 80. Prof.SureshUnfollowProf.Suresh Kumar • Bhattathiri,nice to hear about that piece on Bhagavad Gita.There is a definite reason why American corporates are taking a relook at it,since it offers morepractical wisdom for all times,including in troubled times especially-there it scores overMachiavelli,Art of War,Ying-Yang,or Kautilya.That is because Gita is a more holistic and practicable philosophy and metaphysics in relation to thephysicalism,and reductionist materialism in the other approaches[except perhaps the yin-yang,to someextent]The method to physically and psychologically,not merely philosophically,attain a state of detachedaction,while being involved[action in inaction and inaction in action]is a supreme principle and perceptfor practice being extolled in Gita.Of course,it is all so grosly misunderstood and misinterpreted that it has lost all its real shine and glory.Inspite of that it is regaining lost ground,in the troubled corporate circles in US where the need fordetached action is at its most now5 days ago • Like •Follow YuvarajYuvaraj Gandipan • What is the purpose of life on earth?.1. The important thing to remember when you ask this question to your self is you are not really you.You are born some 600 billion years ago through a marriage of sun and the sea and you have no ideawhen are you going to die may be tomorrow or after billion years. Basically you are not reproducing,you are evolving.2. Pick a drop of water from the Ocean. Does it know its purpose. We are made of cells, but each cellin each organ functions differently. Do these cell know their purpose.3. I strongly believe that earth constitutes as a vital organ of the universal. We the humans are cells ofthe organ. If we are evolving, the universe also evolves.4 days ago • Like •Prof.SureshUnfollowProf.Suresh Kumar • Chiranjivi,very philosophical and practical questions,at onceOf course self realisation is a real and far away goal,since there are layers of selves to beunravelled,and images in mind and ego consciousness to be refined and ennobled through breath and itsspiritual internalisation[I have discussed this in detail in another thread of discussion on this veryforum]Universe is a reflection of our self and ego consciousness,since we project our mental images on to theworld,and as a consequence the real world is not perceived,but only the pheneomenological universe isapparent.That is the root problem to be addressed,in science,psychology,philosphy and management,and ourphysical=psychical=spirtual life is towards that end
  • 81. 4 days ago • Like •Follow KishanKishan Lal • I have earlier commented on this as " It is just like that " further to add by this meansactually this is the process how lives come into existence and vanishes.Being human we communicate, such feelings but how know this may amongst the animal or goingdeeply may in non leaving things too. It is said nothing created nothing destroyed everything keepingcoming and going again and again in different form, to keep with the momentum to times, soeverything exists for time itself.4 days ago • Like •SiddharthUnfollowSiddharth Shah • To get answers to such questions, Gautam Buddha spent a considerable amount of hislifetime in meditation. Those who hope to get the answers quick through Linkedin Questions, pleasereconsider the "F&*k" theory.Theres no other reason that were born for, and thats the reason weve to life for.4 days ago • Like •Follow ChiranjeeviChiranjeevi Tallapragada • Siddharth you seem to have found the meaning and purpose for your life.May be that is why you are Sidharth (the Gautam Budha.)4 days ago • Like •Follow ChiranjeeviChiranjeevi Tallapragada • Prof...I am not too good with philosophy but I thought Bhagavad Gita is allabout that: " Philosophy in practice." Today we use some of the philosophy without knowing the realmeaning behind it. For instance we do our job and not bother about the consequences. Unfortunatelythough this seems to be something similar to what the Gita says like dont worry about theresults...somewhere I think there is a little difference.4 days ago • Like •Follow ChiranjeeviChiranjeevi Tallapragada • Thank you Prof. Suresh for adding a most interesting point "reference
  • 82. point." In a way life generally understood to be learning, correcting and progressing. For instance takethe Fukushima nuclear disaster, now all the countries, scientists, ordinary people are thinking that theyhave learnt their worst lessons and now we should all change and be more careful, whatever.One funny feeling one gets is, suppose it is like, those who are learning, the experience from which weare learning, the ones which led to this experience, all are but one and the same. Then what do we meanby learning, who is learning about whom, how this learning is hidden from those forces which arecausing these disasters, if it is not hidden then how useful is this learning.This is where the need for the reference point comes. If we are moving at all, changing at all, learningat all, it all needs to be with respect to a reference point, which obviously has to be out of this circle.Who or what is this reference point? When we dont know the answer to this question, how do we knowwe are learning?4 days ago • Like •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-............ Learning without knowing what we are learning .............................................that is certainly funny and as well a fact !!.-4 days ago •SiddharthUnfollowSiddharth Shah • @Chiranjeevi, but Im keen on searching the exceptions. :-DNo matured life form that i know of has come into existence by any other means.Your brain is qualified to make such irrelevant questions because of selective reproduction practices byyour ancestors, i.e. apes. Which means were all related.Anyone whos putting their logic into your question is welcome to put his/her logic in contradicting mytheory..4 days ago • Like •Follow GeorgeGeorge Ballester • Do you know the story about the India Buddhist monk who was visited by auniversity student who asked the monk what the meaning of life is? The monk answers, "The sound ofone hand clapping." The student looks puzzled and says, "One hand cannot clap and make a sound. It
  • 83. takes two hands to clap." The monk looks annoyed and slaps the student on the side of the head withone hand.4 days ago • Like •1Follow RajanRajan Nagane • @Chiranjeevi Tallapragada, It is normal for every thinking human to have suchquestionsIt has been a long human history of thinking & searching. One day you are certain to get the rightanswer to all your questions. I am so sure because I have been a inquiring mind myself for a long time.Today I feel to be the most privileged person, now there are no confusions no mysteries, no riddles. TheBrahmavidya is a easy & very practical & logical way for any individual to learn about whatever theworld is & whatever that we are!4 days ago • Like •Follow venugopalvenugopal maganti • I think this guy was not a monk,but must be a martial art expert,like one from 36chamber of Shaolin,with a deceptive air of equanimimity around them--and as for Gita preaching kartasto act without worrying about result,it was only for the doubting Thomases,and as Arjuna was one--hewas told to do his duty as a self respecting warrior,to uphold truth and justice ,and exterminate evil--buthis doubt was whether it was worth it,whether it was really right on his part to kill so many of his ownilk.We can not interpret that we should be impassionate or in sincere about our duty/task--after all thereis un certainity lurking all around us,no body can truly guarantee success in any task in life--in fact Ihave come to believe that the chance of success of your attempt to achieve something in life isroughly ,directly proportional to the the degree of your desire for sucess in that matter.4 days ago • Like •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-391.Lore worth learning, learn flawlesslyLive by that learning thoroughly..-4 days ago •
  • 84. karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-Knowledge Expansion ManualIntellectual Development FoundationMy Nature, Your Nature & The Nature of Everything ............., Interesting manualHow can I expand my knowledge about anything?You can expand your knowledge about anything by finding:1. What are its parts?1. Who/what has the equivalents of those which it has?1. Who/what is connected by it?1. Who/what can affect it?1. What are its forms?1. Who/what can substitute it?1. Who/what will be satisfied by it? days ago •Follow ShobhitaShobhita Rawal • Chiranjivi this is spritual question,visit the website www.speakingtree.in3 days ago • Like •Follow ChiranjeeviChiranjeevi Tallapragada • Thanks Shobhita. I want to share my view about spirituality. I believe therewere times, much long ago when sipirituality was not separated from the day to day questions onefaced. In fact Gitas origin owes to a practical question of whether to kill my brother to get mykingdom. My question on purpose of life also originates from the same type of confusion like what isdevelopment, what is duty as an employee or a leader or a CEO of a company etc. Given the scale ofthings happening, who has the control to ensure that we are moving in the right direction? One willeither go with the trend or find a separate path. But there could also be another path, which is thecollective consciousness. Forums like this I believe should build such collective consciousness. It is not
  • 85. always possible though.3 days ago • Like •Prof.SureshUnfollowProf.Suresh Kumar • Chiranjeevi,thanks for the comments,and very relevant thoughts there,that youhave posed,not just metaphysical.Unawares of us or thru us operates the forces of Karma and Yajna in self and universe.That is powered by the energy field of Universal spirit and the consciousness of a Mind or knowledgeand intelligence principle in universe.There subtle principles of Dharma or order[Rik] in universe of which we are not aware in our egoconscious states of self:we become aware of these subtle and vital forms,forces and patterns only whenwe attain or try to attain true realisation of self through an internalisation process[of vital energies inand around us]Then we will see a larger picture where the right merges with the wrong in a larger integration wherethere is place for the rights and the wrongs ,as we see from a grosser or mundane plane.There is an awesome relationality in universe ,of which we are not conscious fully in our mundane andmaterially focussed stage of existence.Only when we internalise our vital energies and refine our selfand ego field that we see a brader picture in the events and people and situations around us.We see the place of things and people,and come to develop a sort of detachment despite all ourinvolvement based on action in the world and intentionality in us.These are not entirely in our control in this mortal plane, though at a higher spiritual plane we connectwith the universal principles of order and action,and a broader picture emerges ,and there you are not atthe center of universe[as in our ususal self or ego conscious states],and yet you feel a unitariness withthe universal forces and patterns3 days ago • Like •1karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-............There are different circles, the BIG and the Small, they have their respective centers ....., everysoap bubble blown has its respective centers ....................-3 days ago •Follow RajneeshRajneesh Kumar • Dear Friends,Ive spent years pondering about such questions and found a lot of meaning out of this quest. It is worth
  • 86. of engaging oneself into this journey. I have reflected upon so much of theological, spiritual kind ofperspective. I also attended logical and scientific approaches to such questions. All led me to an everwidening horizons of thoughts and contemplation. It made me more and more and more open to everypossible perspective.Anyone seek to embrace a quicker yet serious journey of such things, then I probably wouldrecommend to start with downloading the DVD of Whats the bleep do we know: Quantum Edition".Though a sequential series of books written by James Redfield have largely satisfied my existingqueries already. These are "Celestine Prophecy", "The Tenth Insight", "In search of Shambhala".My journey seems to indicate me that I would certainly need to read one day a book or a set of twobooks, "The Secret Doctrine: Cosmogenesis" and "The Secret Doctrine: Anthropogenesis" by H.P.Balavatsky. This book I personally believe would be able to answer few deep.......deeper curiosities Ihave developed.Thanks,RK2 days ago • Like •Follow RajneeshRajneesh Kumar • Dear Chiranjeevi,Two of your statements dont make any sense with me."..........This is where the need for the reference point comes. If we are moving at all, changing at all,learning at all, it all needs to be with respect to a reference point, which obviously has to be out of thiscircle. Who or what is this reference point? When we dont know the answer to this question, how dowe know we are learning?""...............Given the scale of things happening, who has the control to ensure that we are moving in theright direction? One will either go with the trend or find a separate path. But there could also be anotherpath, which is the collective consciousness. Forums like this I believe should build such collectiveconsciousness. It is not always possible though."Reason is that yours or anybodys need of any reference point in itself is the root cause of alwaysfeeling lacking inside. Why to have a need of any parameter to judge the progress of ones self?Because this need for a reference point is externally oriented and since it is external, it does not lead toanywhere. It never did to anybody.A version of the same thought-system is search for collective consciousness or collective wisdom. Asum of Zeros would always be Zero. A sum of emptiness would always remain empty. A sum ofaverages is always average. Thus there is only one path: the path of selfs journey, very individual, verypersonal.
  • 87. I have placed this summary of thought on my blog. If you feel, you can visit to the link: and thanks,RK2 days ago • Like •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-...........Bubbles and bubbles, can they make a one single big bubble ???Alka-Seltzer added to spherical water drop in microgravity doubts, Discover IT :).-2 days ago •Follow venugopalvenugopal maganti • @RK,without a reference point,how do we know where we are,what we aredoing,why we are doing,where we are going,and why?the fact that zero exists also demands that thereshould be something other than zero ,and if it is there ,what is it?what we do ultimately is for selffulfilment,and the question is who is this self/is it a part of a universal conscious ness or is ita separateentity?lacking in side of what?self?I think since this is a leadership forum,seeking to understand purpose of our existence,and we do havemeasure of our actions,the consequences of such actions or lack of action,the zero concept ,I am notsure is in the realm of this discussion--pardon me if I sound offensive.2 days ago • Like •Follow DavidDavid Wittenberg • Im fascinated by Hindu philosophy and have had several enlightening discussionson topics such as this one.
  • 88. Rather than propose an answer, let me point out a salient fact: When it comes to discovering ourpurpose, there are only two METHODS (not conclusions).First method: speculate.Second method: learn the answer from the one who knows the answer.The search for purpose is universal. People from every culture want to know their purpose. A best-selling book in the US is called "The Purpose-Driven Life." As I understand it, books such as the Gita,the Bible, and the Quran claim to hold the answer as revealed by a higher authority. The only problemis that these sources dont all agree on our purpose in life.I wish everyone success in his personal search for purpose in life.2 days ago • Like •1Follow RajneeshRajneesh Kumar • Dear Venugogal,Thanks for your thoughts. Why am I thanking you? Is it because of social etiquette I have learnt orbecause of feeling thankful heartfelt. This question belongs to me and my personal query only.The same question is about your last words, "pardon me if I sound offensive".Yes, you are correct that------- I mean by the lack of ..........having actually a self, pure original self,pervert of social learning & devoid of beliefs, principles, conditioning, attitudes, thoughts, judgments,preconceived notions etc acquired from external systems------be it family, friends, society at large. Howmuch of our claimed Self is actually Our Self?Everybody derives his generally conceived notion of self mostly from external systems. Nothing wrongwith it. Thats the way the world, the societies, and the countries moves along generations aftergenerations. But I have learnt in my own life that there must come a point in time down the path of life,where we can attempt to dig into our own concept of Self. It takes some pounding initially as toremove of fabricated layers acquired from externals. After some time our own layers of self startrevealing themselves and we get much space needed in our psyche for possibly newer thoughts,possibly newer beliefs, newer attitudes and newer understandings. As we continue to evolve inside andcontemplate, we just go our own path of understandings about phenomena. Thats the way it goes,everybody who reached to some meaningful understandings had to chart their own paths. Like anybodyelse, they also didnt knew where they would land up.There is one quote in Zen traditions, "If you see Buddha on the way, Kill him". It holds simple messagethat if you find that the Buddha or his teachings about anything comes in your way to progress, get ridof it. Dont behold any thought if it comes in your way. Your movement is more important, than fallingin love with any concept...........If you have some time spared anytime soon, you can make a choice of visiting to the hyperlinks
  • 89. mentioned in previous comment.With thanks,( fully recognizing that there is no need to thank actually, because I am writing for my own sake)RK2 days ago • Like •1SiddharthUnfollowSiddharth Shah • The purpose will be lost if you got to know what it actually is.In other words the purpose of life is not finding the purpose of life and thereby deviating from theactual purpose which wasnt supposed to be known until you have fulfilled the purpose unknowingly.So rather than knowing the purpose which cannot be known, and not living to that purpose knowinglyto know what is not known, which may not be the real purpose..... just get back to what you have beendoing... hugh!!!!1 day ago • Like •1Follow VikrantVikrant Dhoke • Thats the ultimate and real smart answer Siddharth "Karmayogi". You said I what I didnot want to say and actually participate to make this discussion bloat. But this this one comment mademe join, for you Siddharth, not for "Chiranjeevi"It is not for us to go seek purpose of life on earth. Lets think what is the purpose of "My life" and dothat.1 day ago • Like •Follow GloriaGloria OMarrah • Ragneesh, I like the quote. It sounds horrible at first untill you get the real meaning.1 day ago • Like •Follow GloriaGloria OMarrah • Vikrant, its hard to find that one answere. Where is it written, who do we ask, howdo we know. I still dont know if I did it yet, am doing it, or will do it next year.
  • 90. 1 day ago • Like •Prof.SureshUnfollowProf.Suresh Kumar • Gloria,and Vikrant,aKarma Yogi comes to evolve to a jnana yogi ,once he seeksthe meaning and purpose of life.Pure consciousness is a state of mind to be attined at the end of such aspiritual search thrugh true techniques that internalise your vital energies for a real baptism in the fireof inner spirit[and you become a true Brahmin and a Christian at once]Knowledge is the intrinsic property of mind in such purified and refined states,as also inner bliss andjoy,when you realise for yourself the oneness with the universe and its beingThat is the essence of karma yoga which eventually leads to jnana or true knowledge,as the purposeand meaning of life,as a self fulfilling tryst with true destiny1 day ago • Like •1Follow RamakrishnaRamakrishna Chowdappa PMP • LIFE IS ETRNAL CELEBRATION, ENTHUSIASM, ANDSHARING LOVElove and regards to all divine beingsSw Prabu Arpan1 day ago • Like •1Follow VikrantVikrant Dhoke • Professor - I am reminded of line from Hari Om Sharans Bhajan - "Main Gyan kiBaato me khoya... Aur Karam heen Padkar Soya... Jab Aankh Khuli toh Man Roya..."You said "That is the essence of karma yoga which eventually leads to jnana or true knowledge,as thepurpose and meaning of life,as a self fulfilling tryst with true destiny "So Gyan itself is self-fulfilling? Oh, then people who go to libraries, read 40-50 books a year, but donot contribute to anything to change this world are the people who reach salvation?"Is Gyan yoga Next to Karma Yoga? Does that mean you no longer remain a Karma Yogi in order tobecome a Gyan yogi ?1 day ago • Like •1karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-
  • 91. We need to urgently find out who all could have taught Siddhartha - Buddha .:)...........>...........The purpose of the life is revealed to the individual just few secondsbefore his death ..............>.............................கறண்டவர் விண்டிலர்; விண்டவர் கறண்டிலர் .......................-1 day ago •2Follow VikrantVikrant Dhoke • For all those who cant read Tamil.Those curves rolling with dots before and after mean this :Its a Tamil saying ‘kaNtavar viNtilar; viNtavar kaNtilar’ (One who had seen did not convey. One whoconveyed did not see).Karthi - I cant read Tamil but the english statement before that is a gem.1 day ago • Like •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-VikrantThat Tamil sentence comes in one of the Siddhars songs and many people interpret it in many differentways. We can also take it to mean my own English statement , easy to get the point across !!.-1 day ago •Follow RajneeshRajneesh Kumar • Search of Gyan or jnana or true knowledge with limited faculties toperceive ..................????Karma yog without the basic ability to understand of what makes you move inside our individual mindsystems (at the exact moment) when any so called Karma is performed.............????
  • 92. I think this question points to the answer and the way.Aham Brahmasmi It conveys that "The core of my being is the ultimate reality, the root and ground ofthe universe, the source of all that exists."The understanding is profound to grasp as "I consists of everything the universe consists of." I hold allthe answer inside. In order to know the universe I only need to know what I am. This is exactly themessages all the sages have rendered.Even Buddha said after awakening:As I was surveying the world with the eyes of an Awakened One, I saw being with little dust in theireyes, with much dust in their eyes, with acute faculties, with dull faculties, of good dispositions, of baddispositions, docile, indocile; and a few seeing danger in sins and the world beyond. Even as in a pondof blue lotuses or in a pond of red lotuses, or in a pond of white lotuses, (there) a few red and blue andwhite lotuses are born in water, grow in water, DO NOT RISE ABOVE THE WATER but thrive whilealtogether immersed; a few blue or red or white lotuses are born in the water, grow in the water andREACH THE SURFACE OF THE WATER; a few blue or red or white lotuses are born in the water,grow in the water, and STAND RISING OUT OF THE WATER, undefiled by the water.Yet the lotuses all they are.And the lotuses we all are.23 hours ago • Like •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-............what one does generally on missing a bus is to catch the next one ................*.bus <= => life ,..... applies clearly to all - the bus creator, owner , operator .... etc .*.Gita asks nicely,................. What did one bring to this life to take it back with them ....................... pick someones luggage or loose ones own luggage ... options are many......happy Journey :)12 hours ago •SiddharthUnfollowSiddharth Shah • TG!!!!! Im still breathing ... @Karthikeyan :-D
  • 93. 11 hours ago • Like •Follow venugopalvenugopal maganti • @RK,I just want to add what Sri Tyagaraja said in one of his famouscompositions--parama aanandamane,kamalamu pai,baka, bekamulu chelage--o manasa--meaning,(as Iinterpret it),ON THE LOTUS OF BLISS,the frog (from inside the water,)and the crane(from out sidethe water)move--and he tells his self--all the three--the lotus,frog and crane are transient- probablyengaged in an eternal journey10 hours ago • Like •Prof.SureshUnfollowProf.Suresh Kumar • Vikrant,nice questions there.The jnan that I refer to is not the knowledge from books but from pure consciousness and mind,sincetrue knowledge inheres there,and we have access to it through appropriate brain centers ,in meditativementation ,when our mental images are refined through internalising our vital energies[through theright kind of breathing techniques] and through Karma Yoga.Karma does not merely refer to action,but the center in mind that propels one to act,our seat of actionimpulses and intentionality in mind.This is due to mental imagery ,which we are refining trough Karmayoga [and the vital energy internaliastion techniques]That leads to jnana yoga and finding the meaning of life internally10 hours ago • Like •Follow jayendrajayendra upadhye • In one of my earlier posts I had looked into the possibility that the purpose of lifemay be too alien for us to know! "Our" human thinkers are just busy (including myself before I amaccused of any elitism), populating this lacuna with known ideas like anthropomorphic gods, and aprimordial timeless attibuteless singularity the vedic guys called "It" (Tat), and which science calls themother of all singularities just before the Big Bang...Any takers for this line of thinking?7 hours ago • Like •Follow SanjaySanjay Saxena • Ya sure why not. The point of singularity has extremely high concentration of Masswhich causes infinite warping of space-time. There is a possibility that black hole keep getting soconcentrated by sucking galaxies that after a certain critical limit they just explode thereby creatinganother universe. Our Universe is one such Universe out of multiple other parallel universes. The point
  • 94. is that something comes of out of nothing looks wrong. Offcourse there is a talk that virtual particlespop in and out even in empty spaces. Who knows they come out of Dark matter since as of now wecannot identify dark matter or dark energy. There are infinite possibilities & all that we can do is movefrom good to better to best explanation & thats it. Knowing everything may be actually bad because itwill kill our curiosity to know further because there is nothing more to learn. Life would becomeboring.....7 hours ago • Like •Follow jayendrajayendra upadhye • Sanjay ..something irrelevent but just sharing some gyan..As the mass of a black hole increases, the radius of its event horizon expands outwards and its densitydecreases! Asimov (I believe) in scientrfic American had said sometime in the eighties..that Since theuniverse has infinite mass, it is actually a black hole of infinite size and very low density!If you want to know why, just look at the concept of the word universe.It includes everything known and unknown to man!Light never escapes it, because by definition, every place light reaches is technically "inside" such anavaricious universe!So by definition, a universe, because light can never escape it, is indeed a black hole!Asimov ki bat mein dum hai.7 hours ago • Like •Follow venugopalvenugopal maganti • Well,all I know as a science student is 1/0=infinity,,and 1/infinity=0--as also0/0=infinity--big bang or no bang--wonder what is finite and what is infinite7 hours ago • Like •Follow jayendrajayendra upadhye • Venugopal...if we continue along these lines, the moral police will kill us forderailing things!(Just joking baba, before you unsheath any weapons..)6 hours ago • Like •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-.....let us not get bored !!IT needs just few things to know it clearly .
  • 95. Nothing, something, all things , everything ..... etclet us take the first one Nothing ......... Know nothing we know everything .Nothing for sure cannot be the Purpose of Life . Everything other than nothing then is a possiblecandidate for the purpose .IT is not Nothing :).-6 hours ago •Follow SanjaySanjay Saxena • yes...IT is nothing yet it is everythingIT is nowhere yet it is everywhereIT is abstract yet it is concreteIT is finite yet it is infiniteIT has form yet it is formlessIT is the end yet it is beginningIT is the source yet it is the sinkIT is the creator yet it is the destroyerIT is time yet time is timelessIT is mass, Mass is energyIT is so many things so how can it be NothingBut yet since there is something like Nothing, it implies that IT is also nothing. :-)5 hours ago • Like •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-Good one there but still.............!!.Nothing is nothing but an impossibility of everything being discounted of its presence !!IT implies everything and hence ........ implies ... Nothing .........>for more on Nothing .......> here, hours ago
  • 96. •Follow SanjaySanjay Saxena • All objects we see are just illusions caused by our brain & quantum effects. We alsohave limited power of seeing, hearing, taste, smell and sensing. Imagine a state where we come out ofour body which has severe design constraints. But how can we come out of our body & then see/hearbecause then we will not have eyes, nose, ear & brain to translate electrical activities. Maybe we can dosome kind of simulation to see the effect in a computer. A dog or any animal see only in black andwhite. Does that mean the world is only black & white? So what the animals see is a partial truth. Manalso has limited power & hence sees only partial truth. It sees a highly concentrated energy vibrating athigh speed as Mass. So does Mass really exists? What if we reduce the speed of vibration of atoms by99% then how do we see the same Mass in slow motion? What would happen if we reduce the speed oflight by 99%.? Whatever we will see then will be past. We will find it difficult to see the present. Why?Because light will take that much longer time to travel to the eye. So what does all that implies?Everything is Mithya? So what is the purpose of Life if we assume everything is Mithya? Realizingpresence of God? Lets assume there is God & everyone realizes it, so now what? Is the purpose just torealize God? What will happen after realization? What will be our next Goals & Objectives?4 hours ago • Like •Follow DavidDavid Wittenberg • Great questions, Sanjay!Asians and Westerners tend to take their views of the universe as acceptedtruth, but in fact, the two systems differ at a fundamental level. ManyAsians believe in the unity of all things, a view known as Monism. MostWesterners believe in the separateness of each thing, which is known asDualism.Understand, therefore, that to many Indians, Western ideas seem utterlyfoolish. Likewise, to Westerners, some of the philosophies of Asia seemequally foolish.So, I commend you for proposing the kinds of questions that philosophersshould pose. Why do I believe what I believe? What convinced me that it istrue? What have I observed? What, if any, evidence did I encounter? Whatpotential logical inconsistencies arise if the propositions of myphilosophy are true?If youll review this chain, youll see a lot of non-answers to thequestion, "What is the purpose of life/existence." Theres a lot ofphilosophizing, and there are some beautiful words and phrases, but I dontremember seeing any direct answers. Why do you suppose that definitiveanswers are missing? Id be interested in your ideas on the same.4 hours ago • Like
  • 97. •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-Sanjay S..................What is Illusion by Quantum effects :).-3 hours ago •Follow SanjaySanjay Saxena • Thank you David. Your questions are challenging & would take time to answer.However one of the possible quick answers is that people have been sold to an idea, concept, ideology& that concept is so badly ingrained in their mind that they stopped applying their own imagination,their own quest to know the truth or solve the riddle. In some culture infact it would be blasphemy orsacrilege to even think of other concepts & some would be afraid to propose any new concept becauseof fear of social ostracism. In some cases the ideology has become part of identity of a person & hasassumed a larger than life role, undermining their own identity. So we are so badly trapped in this mazeof existing concepts/ideology that we will find it difficult to think out of the box.3 hours ago • Like •RamUnfollowRam Navale • Beautiful Thoughts Sanjay and David...Reason for existence of universe : ..........................................................Frog in the well says well is the universe. We need to get out of our observable universe and study itindependently from outside (???) to answer this question :-)3 hours ago • Like •Follow jayendrajayendra upadhye • David Wittenberg:Why dualism? Shouldnt the word "manyism" apply?Afterall dualism applies to two things only.As per what you saidm the western viewpoint believes in separateness of the many.Can you expand on that one?
  • 98. Also what is your own definitive answer to these Questions, or are you like me a fence sitter saying"not this, not this"? (Sometimes fence sitting has its advantages. When one is honestly unsure ofanswers, what is the harm in admiting one is not sure? And differ committing to an answer hopefullywisely?).So do tell us.Meanwhile in eastern parlance, dualism means the Adim dwandwa (Primal duality of Prakriti (actingagent) and Purusha (causal non acting agent / observer).Hindus also term this duality as Kshetra / Kshetradnya (the field and its knower).This was later merged into monism in (13th century?) by Shankaracharya who said that both are twoaspects of the same thing. He termed that A-dwaita oe "absence of duality" / non-duality..Do expand on your perspective.2 hours ago • Like •Follow DavidDavid Wittenberg • Thanks for asking, Jayendra.Dualisms name comes from the idea that the universe consists of two different, separate elements, acreator and creation.The belief in the separateness of individual things arises from that first principle, and it is supported byour observations. Everything we observe seems to be separate. Living beings, including those withwhom we interact daily, seem so obviously separate from ourselves that, to most Westerners, theproposition of separateness seems self-evident.I heard a Western philosopher state that the axiom upon which he builds his case for all his furtherclaims is that our senses are trustworthy. Many Hindus, by contrast, start from the axiom that oursenses are not trustworthy. In this very chain, someone has posted that all we see is actually illusory.With such diametrically opposed axioms, it is hard to imagine a meaningful dialog or any possibility ofagreement between the two philosophical systems.Western thought is based on Aristotelian logic, one of whose fundamental principles is that A=A and Adoes not = B. The monist idea that all is one goes against that fundamental principle, which is anotherreason why Asians and Westerners have such a hard time communicating about philosophy,epistemology, and even logic.I have discovered the purpose of existence. Prior to discovering it, I had attempted to find it throughspeculation. Later, I met the one who assigned my purpose to me, and I learnt it from him.If Im guessing correctly, then many readers of this chain will dispute my claim. They will argue thatthere is no such purpose-assigner, and if there is one, it is impossible to meet him and learn from him.If they cannot accept my method of discovering my purpose, then they will not respect anything I say
  • 99. about my purpose or theirs. Therefore, lets not talk about our conclusions, but about our axioms(presuppositions) and our methods of discovering the answer to the question as originally proposed inthis thread.2 hours ago • Like •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-okay a simple axiom :)It is easy to prove what is right as right with many wrongs .It is not easy to prove what is wrong as wrong with many rights ..-1 hour ago •Follow jayendrajayendra upadhye • Really strange!Dualism creator and creation.There is a similarity in Hindu thought!Prakriti amd Purusha!In Hindu understanding, Purusha does not take part in creation at all.That is the work of Prakriti.The difference in the two systems is but a subtle one.That assigner of purpose is the GURU!Attempt to find it thru speculation (if logical speculation), is "sadhana", meaning "purposeful action".(Sadhya is the purpose / object of action, and sadhana is action towards achieveing that object orpurposeful action / striving).So you are telling me you undertook sadhana, a guru found you (because you were ready), andassigned you a purpose! (May be an objective more suited to your nature).Now how is it different from numerous treaders of the path in eastern philosophy?Mind you eastern philosophy does no exclude anything as "apocryphal". The 6 paths have people whodont believe in god, to people who are dualists, to people who are non-dualists! So welcome!No one here will dispute your purpose as long as it does not turn out to be along the lines of "go outand convert the heathen etc"!!! which would be no purpose at all!Hindus consider all 6 paths with equanimity, not denouncing either.
  • 100. Any serious path that rests its own premise on denunciation of the other is itself false.[Shankaracharya unfortunately had to resort to "Khandan" or "demolition" of the logical foundations onwhich the edifice of Buddhism had rested.Lord knows what the buddha actually had said, as he never discussed god. But his later followers madea god out of him!Even later some ambitious Brahmins had joined the band wagon and added a huge body of SanskritPali canon to Buddhist texts. We can see Sankhya philosophy impact on Buddhist thought, as well asVedic thought too..(similarities in the Vajra-Chhedika Diamond sutra and the vedic Nasadiya sukta).]36 minutes ago • Like •Follow DavidDavid Wittenberg • Jayendra, your response is based on your presuppositions. When I said I met mypurpose-giver, you supposed I was referring to a guru. Thats a method youre familiar with and youaccept as valid. What if I told you I had met a space alien, a god, an author, a deva, an angel, or anavatar, and that being had communicated with me about my destiny? Would you be as willing toacknowledge my experience then, or would your presupposition say that I was either crazy or wrong,because in your world view, such beings either dont exist or cant communicate with us?Then you say that you have insight into which purposes are legitimate and which are not. Youre readyto reject the people who say they want to convert others, but how did you decide that they are wrong?You cite 6 paths because you were taught these 6 paths; whereas I was not taught this lesson. Whatwould you say to convince me that there are six paths and only six paths?See what I mean about axioms? Most of us, as Sanjay commented, are so convinced that our axiomsare true, that we are not open to either questioning them or having them challenged by others. Thus,when people of opposing views discuss these issues, it usually degenerates into shouting their beliefs atone another.I hope the followers of this thread are more interested in honest inquiry and understanding, and that wewont waste time on pointless assertions unsupported by some sort of rational argument or evidence.6 minutes ago • Like •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-.... the thread is really getting serious & interesting :)Shobhita Rawal • Hi Chiranjeeviu started real interesting discussion and all are involved in it.i have question to brainstorm,what do uthink guys about rebirth / reincarnationjayendra upadhye • David, the more the merrier!
  • 101. As long as there is no one up manship and coersion!I am convinced of nothing!I just pointed out in so many words that we believe in all inclusiveness, nothing is apocrpyphal! (except"I am right you are wrong type of teachings).So now what is it?An alien or an angel? I am curious to know. Ofcourse you may not tell. :)Lets say for the sake of this discussion I was speaking things you find Bullxxxx.Now can we go ahead and hear what you want to say about "I have discovered the purpose ofexistence"..?I am eager to understand what that is (meaning ofcourse the much vaunted purpose of existence).Do tell us.David Wittenberg • Jayendra,You remind me of my college professors. They based their Bachelors degree course on the statementthat "there is no absolute truth," but they were blind to the fact that their own statement was presentedas an absolute truth! If you actually believe that "I am right you are wrong type of teachings" are notacceptable, then you are declaring yourself to be right and you are declaring absolutists to be wrong. Inother words, youre contradicting yourself. Somehow, I dont think that was your intention.For the time being, Ill demur on discussing the purpose of my own existence. Im far more interested indiscovering how my Asian friends think and reason through this question.In constructing a truth table (such a Western, absolutist approach!) the first question I would pose iswhether an individual -- or, indeed, our species or the universe itself -- has a purpose or not. Thats asimple yes-or-no question. If this chain is any indication, then one common local view is that either itdoesnt matter, or its unknowable until after the fact.If the answer is that there is no purpose, then the discussion is over.If the answer is yes, there is a purpose, then the next question I might pose is where that purpose comesfrom. Heres where monism vs. dualism may affect the response. Many of my Hindu friends arestriving to attain moksha, which they define variously as full awareness, oneness with the cosmic mind,shedding mara to discover the divine essence within, etc. The purpose of existence is deduced logicallyfrom two beliefs: the unity of all things and the illusory nature of the perceived differences betweenthem. No Western philosophy recognizes any purpose remotely related to moksha because dualistsdont believe that such a state exists.Westerners dont typically look within for purpose; they look upward toward God or outward towardothers in the world. Some believe their purpose is defined by evolution, to propagate the species. Somebelieve in striving for a positive afterlife (no Western religion teaches a cycle of rebirths, but all ofthem teach the persistence of the soul after death and a day of divine judgment). Some believe inserving humanity, the planet, animals, or some other noble cause. Still others believe in hedonism, thatthe purpose of life is to seek pleasure.
  • 102. Does anyone care to take a position and give direct answers to these questions:Does life have a purpose?If yes, where does that purpose come from?If yes, can it be discovered?If it can be discovered, then how?karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-..1) Yes ...2) Birth..3) Living..4) End of Life.-jayendra upadhye • David.Clever! :)Did it occur to you (since you condemn the poor professors to be dim wots who failed to understandsuch a simple irony, I think we must give them some respite) that what the poor guys meant was justthat "The statement that there is only one absolute path to truth need not be true". Or "There aremultiple paths to turth".Truth lends itself to interpretations so that both interpretations are true. what then?A glass half full is also half empty! no one can negate that. Amd that is what they meant.Now are you telling us you are basing your whole premise and grouse against the professors over sucha trivial issue?THAT would be a pity!I said 6 paths were well known in ancient India (not exactly in so many words, but I feel we are abovesuch silly hair splitting).I personally have NOT taken any position at all. How did you surmise I said I WAS right?In plain english (your language not mine), I said any absolitist position that rests itself on pullong otherdown, and which was serious, would be rejected.THAT is different from sayin I was right!I negated absolutism, but did not say I alone was right, in fact I discussed fence sitting.So let us argue if we have to using logic and not foisting words on each other that we never spoke, ormeant even.Your questions...myanswers.I do not claim to know the purpose.My first answer makes rest of the questions redundant.
  • 103. Now some simple questions from me, hope you will expand on the same."they look upward toward God "..well any description of that God?I hope by up you dont mean skywards!Is it a he or a she or It?How old, does he live somewhere?Is it an anthropomorphic god, or has to hide in a bush for some reason?Is he vengeful?Expecting some answers on those.David Wittenberg • Karthik, I saw your four answers. They are a bit hard for me to understand. Do youreally mean to say that:+ The purpose of life comes from birth? If thats true, then wouldnt it also be true that all of us have thesame purpose, since all of us have the same birth? And, if purpose comes from birth, does this meanthat purpose is also hidden and unknown, since most people who are born still claim that they dontknow the purpose of their lives?+ Purpose can be discovered by living life according to your third answer but, according to your fourthanswer, the way to discover purpose is by death? Perhaps Im misunderstanding this, but it seems thatyouve contradicted yourself.Would you care to clarify?karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-DavidYour answer for the 4 , and then I will clarify or at least to the 1st - according to you the answer to 1st ,which then may negate few others !!-------------------------------------------------jayendra upadhye • What I found interesting with david was he has found all people contradicting---themselves, but himself has not said anything! :)Now what happens if he answers those questions? Will that law hold true?(Mathematical induction) ..First the profs were self contradictory, then you, then me, ...I am wondering and fearing for David himself already!...what happens when he answers? :)David Wittenberg • Jayendra,Someone has written that the basic difference between Westerners and Easterners is that Westerners aredriven to reconcile.With our Aristotelian view, when people like me encounter propositions that appear to be contradictory,we are driven to resolve the contradictions. For us, focusing on the words is not trivial nor is ithairsplitting. We are looking for the truth. A speaker or writer who believes two contradictorystatements to both be true appears to a Westerner to be unreliable. A person who asserts that a statementknown to be contrary to fact is true appears to be insane.My Indian friends seem untroubled by seemingly contradictory propositions. See Sanjays post of shortsentences about "IT" earlier in this chain for an example.
  • 104. Its fine to assert that truth lends itself to interpretation, as long as you are willing to state that, at thecore, there is a truth to be known. If you deny that truth is knowable, then this and all similardiscussions are exercises in futility. My Indian friends seem to believe that everyone is entitled to hisown truth. My Western friends say that everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but no one is entitled tohis own facts.There could be multiple paths to truth if truth exists somewhere waiting to be found. If, on the otherhand, truth is invented/owned/controlled by something or someone, then the controller of truth coulddecide to limit the number of correct paths to just one. So, when you say that there are multiple paths totruth, you are also rejecting the possibility that a single source has the truth. My question to you is,"What led you to believe as you do?"If it is accepted that there is a truth to be known, then it follows logically that there are untruths, aswell. Westerners dont hesitate to state that a proposition about philosophy and religion is untrue. Theyall believe that there is a single source of truth -- they just dont agree on which source it is! Christiansbelieve, in accordance with their holy book, that Jesus is the only begotten son of God. Muslims saythats untrue because their holy book says Allah neither begets nor is begotten. Empiricists say that bothare wrong because the single source of truth is science, and science has never observed God in the firstplace, let alone his son.Even though you claim to be a fence-sitter, you still feel offended by the conversion advocates who arepresumptuous enough to consider their views absolutely true and desi views absolutely false. Bewareof the faulty reasoning that goes, "I have not figured out the truth, therefore, no one else has, either."You asked about God. The modern Western faiths all view God as omnipotent, eternal (withoutbeginning or end), sovereign, sentient, communicative, and existing in the spirit (invisible) world yetoccasionally appearing to mankind in natural time and space. All the major Western faiths present Godas masculine, though some attribute feminine traits to him, as well. God is seen as the creator andsustainer of the universe and everything in it. God is understood as the giver of laws and the judge ofmankinds compliance with those laws. He will reward in the afterlife those who, in life, met hisconditions and punish those who did not.In the ancient European religions, gods were anthropomorphic (some male, some female), dwelling onearth or in a heavenly kingdom in some sort of physical way and occasionally encountered directly bypeople. They were prone to internecine fighting and capricious actions. The gods gave no laws, butsought devotion and sacrifices from their followers, offering divine favors in exchange. The Greco-Roman concept of afterlife was that the departed soul would travel to the netherworld and cross a riverto reach the abode of the dead.All comments and responses are welcome.David Wittenberg • Oh, Jayendra, I must have touched a very sensitive nerve in you to provoke such abitter and angry response!Im trying hard to limit my discussion to methods of finding purpose (the original theme of this chain).I stated first thing that dialog between those who hold Asian presuppositions and those who holdWestern presuppositions is very difficult. Your response shows why. I pointed out the two different
  • 105. ways of dealing with contradictory statements, and I pointed out that each thinks the other wrong, andyou accused me of thinking that Westerners are superior.Then, your anger made you unable to accept what I pointed out about your position. Your strong,history-based dislike of Westerners for their intolerance, violence and rapaciousness has caused you toreject their propositions about the universe. You despise the triumphalist views of the Westerners, butyou are blind to your own triumphalism. You are just as intolerant of "one-way" believers as they are ofthe "multi-way" believers. Argue all you wish, but thats a case of doing the same thing you profess tohate in others.You display exactly the reaction that Sanjay Saxena predicted. When I questioned one of yourfundamental beliefs, you became upset and angry.You display exactly the reaction that I predicted. When I revealed my own path to purpose, youaccused me of being wrong because in your world view, my claim is both untrue and nefarious (youimplied that anyone who claims to be in touch with the inventor of life, or who believes that theremight be only one path to truth, is a mass-murdering crusader in waiting).If you want to continue discussing and comparing different paths to finding the purpose of life, kindlyresume a respectful tone and Ill be happy to continue the dialog. If you wish only to attack me, Illignore your posts.@David I respect your knowledge and contribution. Let me put my thoughts...If life has an inventor, who created him? this is a cycle of creation and creator in our view. The cycleends only when the creation and creators are the same. This is where Dualism and Monoisum meeteach other. Life or Universe doesnt change because of the western or eastern thinking process, it is thesame. Its only the way we look at it that changes.Purpose of life...Dinosaurs ruled the world for over 160,000,000 years. What was the purpose of their existence???Size of observable universe 93,000,000,000 light years. What is the purpose of having earth and a manon it? We cant even travel 1 light minute in the space.Does life have a purpose? I dont know.Chandra Vishy • I will again showcase my simple answersPurpose of life on earth --- To liveWhy does universe exist --- To let us liveAnyone else watching us --- By the evidence of all the sci-fi movies, probably yes, but will notcomment unless supported by scientific evidence.David --- Point well made.VishyRam Navale • @David, let us look at the word beginning as it appears in all-most all description we
  • 106. take for discussion. We view creation happened at some point time or it was there all the time.Invariably we deal with time scale.When we look at the time-space 4D picture of the universe and the big-bang theory, we learn that theTIME itself is a creation. TIME itself has a start!!! Its a challenge to think of something that is withoutTIME.I agree with you, when we cant answer (something beyond our limits), we try to answer with religion,philosophy,....Gloria OMarrah • Karthikeyan, so I have learned that nothing is a (void) that something can be put into.Therefore it deffinately is something. :)Sanjay Saxena • Interesting discussion. Now since Religion & philosophy has been removed it wouldbe indeed challenging to discuss further. Now we are forced to think of our own & come up withinnovative ideas :-)venugopal maganti • @david,your posts are very sobre and logical-I agree that every body is entitled tohis views,and can choose his own path to truth,of which we have many in India,as we had thousands ofphilosophers,with multitudes of followers,for over 3000 years.Though we are geographically moreisolated from the rest of the world,with sea on 3 sides,and the mighty Himalayas in the north,we dohave influence of western thinking on us.How ever,with a relatively easy life supportingenvironment,where people did not have to work too hard for their liveliehood,argumentative mind setdominated our people genetically,as opposed to the west,where survival and control of land andresources was a major issue,as opposed to religion--History tells us that even religion has been usedmainly to control people and resources world over--be it South /latin Americas,Asia/Africa--I wouldlike to presume that religion in the west was not used exactly for spiritual emancipation of man--but, Iam not trying to claim that Indians are no holy cows,and fought wars in the name of religion too--but,the fact remains that this is one of the most tolerant land to foreign religions and cultures,and is a greatmelting pot.Iconoclasts,atheists too had always been a part of our system ,even in our epics--I onlyhope that our people would get rid of the fatalistic view of life,with out compromising on our cultureand value system(and also temper their jigoism in English language).Chiranjeevi Tallapragada • Talking about time, is time linear or circular. I guess this is one of thedifferences in thinking between the west and east. May be our beliefs about god originate from here.David Wittenberg • Welcome back to your discussion, Chiranjeevi.You make an extremely insightful observation about Asian vs. Western views of time.It relates to purpose as follows:If time is cyclical, then any failure to find or fulfill my purpose is transitory. The opportunity and thetime for discovering and fulfilling my purpose may come again.If time is linear, then I get only one moment and one chance to find and fulfill my purpose. Then, Imeither finished or I have an eternity to live with the consequences of how I used my single chance.Sanjay Saxena • Why do we have think in terms of East Vs West.? We Good Vs They Bad. Finding thepurpose of life has nothing do with East & West. It is Universal. It would be nice to remove this EastVs West Baggage & think beyond..
  • 107. David Wittenberg • Sanjay, if everyone agreed, there would be no issue. If the source of thedisagreement were something other than culture, we wouldnt use terms like East and West.For whatever reason, Eastern culture prepares us to deal with questions one way, and Western cultureprepares us to deal with them another way.Look back at the first few posts in this thread. All the contributors were native Indians. Everyone wasdancing around the issue of purpose, but no one made a definitive statement that the purpose of life isX. Later, when such statements emerged, they tended to be vague (see Karthiks list of four answers foran example of vagueness), or even self-contradictory (see your own list).I barged in on the discussion and introduced my approach to the question, which is informed by myWestern upbringing and education. I pressed people to examine their method of seeking purpose. Idrove toward propositional truth as opposed to experiential truth. Eventually, some got veryuncomfortable with my approach.If we only discuss with those who grew up where we did and approach problems as we do, we are notlikely to learn much. If we are able to analyze our differences, including any differences betweenWestern and Eastern thinking systems, then we have the opportunity to learn a lot.The good/bad part is the hardest to avoid. Often, in India, merely pointing out differences is seen asarrogance or condemnation. We value relational harmony over many other things, so disagreements arenot always aired. Even our laws place the feelings of communities over the freedom to criticize theirbeliefs and practices, whereas in the US, the law protects free expression of even the most offensiveideas rather than attempting to keep feelings from being hurt.So, if East/West differences are relevant to the topic, I say lets identify and examine them with respectand civility.Gloria OMarrah • Its #3 that you have to fill in yourself, some people dont know how, they let otherpeople fill that part in, so they have no purpose in ther own life.Sanjay Saxena • David, my self-contradictory (my own IT list), is based in knowledge in QuantumPhysics.For example let’s assume IT is atoms.So we cannot see atoms meaning it is nowhere yet actually atoms & virtual particles are everywhere.Atoms can be wave & particles also. Which means they are abstract & yet concrete.Atoms has no form (previously thought as point particles) so it is formless but yet when they combinewith other formless atoms they emerge into a formAtoms can neither be created nor destroyed. Scientist are trying to find out the basic particles &discovered more than 36 particles. If they find out one such particles let assume electrons then does itmean they are made of nothing? It means that from nothing something has emerged. There are otherweird contradictory facts in quantum physics. So we need to accept contradiction too.jayendra upadhye • David, your last two posts I can connect with easily. But I was all ears for that alienbusiness.But again for some reason you did not directly answer my question. Why is that?"Jew" is a race related answer, not a religious answer.Ok I You believe in Jehovah the thundering god of the old testament, who spoke out of bushes!
  • 108. So be it!As I said, the moment a thundering jealous god enters the pavilion, I head for the exit!But tell me, and I ask you as you are a jew, why did God need "chosen" people?I find the concept troublesome as it inculcates the sense of exclusiveness and also the sense that othersare by inference (since they are NOT chosen) weaker / unfit / uncouth etc etc etc.Gloria OMarrah • Sounds like everyones mad to me. Im catholic, believe we all have the same Godand believe everyone should believe whatever they want, there is no right or wrong way to think. I justtalked to God about this. He said its good people fight over their religion, that means they believe andthats all he ever wanted. He never said how or when or where. All the stories change with whoever istelling them, thats we have so many books in the world. We are ALL right. Plus, as far as north southeast or west were all the same, I found that info in an anatomy book.2 hours agoDavid Wittenberg • Jayendra,Your posts illustrate precisely the reason why I did not wish to comment on my own beliefs. Suchdiscussions seem to degenerate quickly into shouting matches about whose religion or philosophy isbetter. Such discussions often involve mockery and insults. You have already decided that my religion,my holy book and my God are silly nonsense, and you seem to take great delight in posting pejorativephrases about them. I feel no need to defend my beliefs or to convince you to change yours.If youre interested in discussing methods of inquiry, epistemology, definitions of truth, logicalconsistency and inconsistency, and the original theme of this chain, which was the meaning ofexistence, then Ill be happy to dialog with you.Otherwise, this will be my last response to you.jayendra upadhye • Gloria: Are you then saying people who did not fill in #3 are purposelessindivisuals?If we agree for the sake of understanding what you meant, did you als oinfer anything more?Such asa) - These purposeless indivisuals are also some how "lesser" dir to that fact?b) - They are less intelligentc) - Any other inferences?Has it crossed your mind the poor fellows may hust be honest and saying a truth, that they dont reallyknow the purpose?If you do know kindly enlighten us what the purpose is!And please dont tell is it is to please god who will then place us in heaven forever etc..THAT could never be a purpose as per eastern parlance.jayendra upadhye • David:But havent you also decided your religion is the only true path for which you have unhdertaken thiswhole excercise of saying people are contradicting themselves etc?You yourself are cleverly doing the same thing you are accusing me now of!It requires arrogance and cleverness of a kind to do that.First enter a discussion politely.Then start pointing out errors in others arguments (somerimes even where they dont exist). (ofcourse
  • 109. not all people will be good at arguments, and they will be polite as hell)Be forceful.Keep your own ideas that others may poke fun at, close to your chest.Then declare there is only one truth! (Your truth). (THAT is the arrogant part)And when asked to come clean on that, come out with a god who is so jealous, a womans jealousy willpale by comparison.A god who uproots and scatters his people to the wind because they broke some covenant with him orworshipped images!A perfect role model for a warlord!And after doing all this, you have the nerve to sermonize!Good going Dave!But has it occured to you, just as you went into pack up mode about your beliefs and god, (when Icriticised) others have a right to do the same!Why question their faith, when you yourself are not ready to give up on a god you believe created theuniverse in 7 days! As if some one was there to witness the event and clocked it!!But If I ask this plain question to you, you will hide behind respecting others viewpoints etc!Wow!jayendra upadhye • David: "Otherwise, this will be my last response to you"...So be it!I will also get to know where all this cat and mouse thing in the end leads...But I make a prediction...After you have had your say...the book shall be thumped!And the heathens shall rightly be vanquished, or at least shown their place in the scheme of things!:) :)So it suits me like hell to see this game unfold. (This game concept was introduced by some high soulson another thread...but I agree..this IS a game). And with a purpose to boot!I will stop my posts and have a ringside view of how to vanquish heathens! :):)1 hour agoChiranjeevi Tallapragada • David my take is that one may never know the purpose of life though thatdoesnt stop us from living, wondering and doing things. Not knowing the purpose makes some to becareless about their activities, where as it makes some others to be more wary of their activities.Also linearity in time could mean that there is no point in learning because past will not repeat. In away linearity of time seems to dominate our thinking because we are always looking for somethingnew. We seem to think that to stop is to die...and there ends our search for purpose. Therefore we needto keep these thoughts aside and find some purpose. But why?Sanjay Saxena • David, I think it would be better if you can do some straight talk. What is it that ideawhich you would like to propose? Is it a new idea or is it a pre-existing idea? If somebody has given aresponse which hurts you then possibly it is because he felt/sensed some hint of you advocating yourreligion which possibly is not what you intended. Comparing Eastern thinking with western thinking orreligion will not help since it is like comparing two boxes. Our differences or finding will still liewithin the combined boundaries of two boxes. Is there a possibility to come out of the box? Propose anew way to understand the purpose of life rather than use pre-existing ideology to understand or answer
  • 110. such basic question.Rajneesh Kumar • Dear Friends,I am just copying and pasting some part of my previous comments...................Reason is that yours or anybodys need of any reference point in itself is the root cause ofalways feeling lacking inside. Why to have a need of any parameter to judge the progress of ones self?Because this need for a reference point is externally oriented and since it is external, it does not lead toanywhere. It never did to anybody.A version of the same thought-system is search for collective consciousness or collective wisdom. Asum of Zeros would always be Zero. A sum of emptiness would always remain empty. A sum ofaverages is always average. Thus there is only one path: the path of selfs journey, very individual, verypersonal................First, I believe we need to ponder upon the booms and banes of this debate of Individualism VsCollectivism. Ayan Rand in her famous novel Fountainhead dealt with the same question about faiths,religions, dogmas and ethos of all kind. You can get the major chunk of her view-line on the hyperlinksgiven below: and, Jew-ism, and Islam all have originated from the same city of Jerusalem and were notfounded any before than 2500-3000 BC. All derived and adopted so many of mythological instancesfrom previous pagan, Egyptian, Sumerian system of faith. I fully understand and condemn the atrocitiesdone over Jews world across and they were denied their own country for approx. 1500-2000 years tillvery late in 1940s. But what was the element of faith before the foundation of these three religions.What was the definition of faith, say, 5000-8000 BC?...............I dont know and I dont want to know?It does not matter to me. It also does not matter to me what todays religions, sects, faiths or sects ,including my own, hold as far as what a man should do or how a man should perform in his lifetime.What would be the face of a God from a Horses eyes? A horse only.I dont believe, in that sense, the existence of God at all. Yes this universe is there and it may have veryknowable and un-knowable forms. Thats the point I am more comfortable with the explanationsattempted in the world of Quantum Mechanics. For I have already suggested my fellows to get a copyof "What The Bleep Do We Know - The Movie + Down The Rabbit Hole 5 Disc set". So as to arrive atimagination that can assist us in contemplating about such questions.Even in India, we as common people, are boost-full of our cultural and religious heritage (SanatamDharma), but dont have access to better knowledge it may hold and we dont have any body of distilledwisdom now which we can learn and make good use of, in living a better life. Even for a Hindu travelerit is still a personal quest and quite a journey.
  • 111. H.P. Blavatsky visited India 150 years ago and found something and she wrote about such theosophicalquestions from very wide perspectives. I choose only to suggest Secret Doctrine out of her set ofwritings. As somehow I could get zeroed upon. What it may hold for can be found we all need to keep our own faculties of knowledge open.With thanks,RKProf.Suresh Kumar • Chiranjeevi,I find your comments very thoughtful and intrinsically interesting andtruly metaphysical.Space time perspectivity the way we know as sectiones of past present and future,and here,there,nowhere,everywhere are simply artefacts in brain due to our localised and illusory self concepts.Science also tells us that-that our self in the brain is a virtul entity.We create t by internalssing world images.But if we can internalise our vital energies then we have a more objective and less subjective universalself perception ,and a different take on space time cognition.We are not bound by ego and bodily consciousness in its gross embodiment.We can even see a time scape and experience subtle spaces and block time.In fact quantum science tells us that we do not see reality since we alter the world by our act ofobservation and measurement.Only in transcendent self states we perceive reality nd truth.That is the essence of all religion and its spiritual processes.The great masters have spoken through metaphors and symbols for their true disciples and the rest ofthe world has misinterpreted it and pudits[so called] spread this misunderstanding.The result is the fight over religions and the shouting matches we see here and elsewhere.The birth-rebirth cycles bind us to temporality and space in a material way,since our soul has a subtlebody and mind and material images as its ego.We can refine it and resurect ourselves thru true baptism in the fire of our spirit and prana,byinternalisation processes that is the essence of spirituality.NOT THE EXTERNALISED WORSHIP AND RITUALISTIC PRACTICESSanjay Saxena • David, Possibly I guess you intended to discuss about Kabbalah. There is a possibilityto compare Indian scriptures with Kabbalah as both are above any specific religion or any form of God.There are some commonalities & differences which you could highlight. But will that answer the basicquestionNitesh Ambuj • To glorify the almighty who created all this - not by force but by our own free will :)jayendra upadhye • Rajneesh :You are the one guy I have come across who has read Blavatsky.But are you aware in later life she was proved a hoax?She had conjured up elaborate "visitations by Mahatmas at Adyar for the benefit of some valued guests,and it later transpired she has a nice system of hidden chambers from which the visitations could bematerialised and dematerialised. She had assisstants trained in that, and even props and mannequins!I gave up on the Secret doctrine after takung what was already said in the Shastras, and additionally inGreco-Roman doctrine *Hermes" etc, and the Egyptian lores.
  • 112. Wonder what theosophists are up to now, after they were done in by their great "find", J.KrishnaMurty.(Not Juddu). He was a theosophical wonderboy, who went sour on them!What I like about the 6 paths is that some of them are godless!Indians tolerated that approach so many 1000 years ago.THAT sets the eastern religions apart from the middle eastern religions that are extremely intolerantand blood thirsty.You wont find secular upanishadic stuff in those religions. Just turn the rosary so many times, bangyour head on the ground so many times, kill kaffirs by the dozens and presto! The hoors befin queueingup! :) Easy!!karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-David,This is beauty of civility and reasonably straight forward arguments .......:)"" Look back at the first few posts in this thread. All the contributors were native Indians. Everyonewas dancing around the issue of purpose, but no one made a definitive statement that the purpose of lifeis X. Later, when such statements emerged, they tended to be vague (see Karthiks list of four answersfor an example of vagueness), or even self-contradictory (see your own list). ""If the purpose is X .................. then what ? ! ? !......... still the table to your is question is left in the air is the table and your answer has made it self explanatory !.......................................................1*1*1*1*1*......................2*2*2*2*2*2..( 1 ) Life has a Purpose .....................Yes............................... Yes.. ( 2 ) From where ..............................Birth ............................ Assigned by Inventor.. ( 3 ) Discovery ..................................Living ........................... Call Inventor.. ( 4 ) How ..........................................end of Life .................... Back to Inventor_______________________________________________________________________where is 3*3*3*3*3*3* ?
  • 113. .-David Wittenberg • Interesting response about 50 minutes ago, Sanjay.You ask for straight talk. I admit to asking a lot of questions and to notconveying conclusions very often, but I thought that all my posts werestraightforward. Then again, I come from a low-context culture, where thewords are all that matters. In high-context cultures, such as India, thewords are not usually enough. In fact, speakers in a high-context culturesometimes use words that directly contradict the intended message. Theyexpect their hearers to draw the correct meaning from the context, not thecontent. On the Internet, the context is absent, so high-contextcommunicators may feel uncomfortable.Anyone can propose a purpose for life, but answers without evidential orlogical support are not often helpful. Thats why I focus so much on thepreconditions for deciding on lifes (or the individuals) purpose and thebest process for finding the same.Some here, including Chiranjeevi himself, have proposed that the purpose oflife is not knowable. If its not knowable, then why even discuss it? Wewill end up equally ignorant after the discussion as we were before thediscussion.I believe purpose is discoverable. I pointed out with straight talk my viewthat the intended purpose of each thing is assigned by its inventor. No onehas yet agreed or disagreed with this view, which I think is crucial to thediscussion. If the purpose selected is other than the inventors intendedpurpose, then that assignment comes from a source other than the inventor.The second source might be smarter than the inventor (having used theinvention for a better purpose) or self-motivated (having used theinvention for the second sources goals) or even opposed to the inventor(having used the invention for a purpose inimical to the inventorspurpose).From this question arise many others that may be discussed and debated.Does life have an inventor? If so, who or what is that inventor? What wasthe inventors intended purpose for life? Where can we learn that purpose?Ive shared my belief that the God described in the Jewish holy book is the inventor of life and the onewho assigns it meaning. Prof. Suresh Kumar has a different view about the meaning of life.Ive shared my belief that the way to discover my purpose is to get in contact with the inventor of life,which I can do in my current state. Prof. Suresh Kumar shared his view that the superior way of seeingis to achieve a transcendental state.Im eager to learn what others believe about the purpose of life. Im eager to learn the different methodsand processes that others use to discover that purpose. For those who dont believe purpose can be
  • 114. known, Im eager to know how you manage and evaluate your life, and whether the desire to knowyour purpose, which I thought was universal, has ever touched you.Lets not slide into a childish series of "Im right and youre wrong" posts. Instead, lets compare ourviews, our approaches and our processes. Lets hold them up to the light of logic. We can all learn somuch from each other.Kathikeyan.-An all purpose maxim ,It is easy to prove what is right as right with many wrongs .It is not easy to prove what is wrong as wrong with many rights ..-Sanjay Saxena • David, Fine..If inventor invents human being then who invents the Inventor? we cango on then such as who invents the Inventors Inventor? There is no end to this. There lies the problem.What is the purpose of Inventor inventing human being & then assigning tasks to them? Whydeliberately create weak human being & expect them to show great strength? What are the inventordoing right now? Are they watching us? Since we do not have straight forward answers to thesefundamental question, we have no option but to rely on faith. Faith has been forced upon people bycreating fear. So in different region people have different faith. The Inventor theory also suggests thatwhatever has happened or happening is the wish of Inventor. If that is true then the Inventor is surely aSadist. It also implies that our purpose is to live like puppets since our purpose is defined & controlledby Inventor. So it is difficult to follow this train of thoughts since we come into a deadend in allinstances. Hence we need to propose a better explanation. This does not mean I am right or you arewrong. It only means that we are all ignorant & we together make an attempt to find the real purpose.David Wittenberg • Karthik,I confess to being too dim (or too low-context) to understand the meaning of your four answers withoutmore explanation.Here are the four questions:Does life have a purpose?If yes, where does that purpose come from?If yes, can it be discovered?If it can be discovered, then how?Question 2 asked, "Where does purpose come from?" You said "Birth." I was trying to find out thesource or assigner of purpose. So, I couldnt figure out the role that birth plays in assigning lifespurpose.
  • 115. Question 3 asked for a yes/no answer. Can purpose be discovered or not? You answered "Life." I dontunderstand how that answers the question.Question 4 asked how purpose can be discovered. You answered "end of life" which I took to meandeath. Its not clear to me how death can serve as a method to discover purpose, but if you did meanthat death is the way to discover purpose, Im very curious to know how that works.Id be most grateful for more explanation if you care to offer it.Sanjay Saxena • David, I also offered my explanation for that contradictory IT lists. Waiting for youresponse on the same.Akshaya Bhatia • Does life have a purpose?-Yes,... "Life- Loop Intercepted For Eternity".. Not here bychoice (so cried at birth, not liking to come out in unknown uncertain environment...),.....transition->developed desires, likes plus dislikes, relationships,...Not willing to leave and pass away intime, got entrapped in the beauty of our environ and love for the self....If yes, where does that purpose come from?- The purpose comes from our developed instincts anddesires, our relationships, our passion, our struggle, our successes and failures, from what our sensesconsume and how the "TIME" plays with us and get us in an interaction mode with our environ, otherlife and even non living...If yes, can it be discovered?- Yes, if analyzed objectively within our conscience, normally, highprobability of deciphering when the End is near...If it can be discovered, then how?- Just analyze objectively within conscience, why did it happenedwhatever happened, Who is the controller of our life??.!!..Do we make use of Time or is it the Time that uses us?? is the speed of time ? Wittenberg • Sanjay,You are absolutely right that in such matters, it usually boils down to faith.The most common problem is that people assert their beliefs as if everyone should automatically agree.Even worse, some people have forced others to accept their beliefs. My own people, the Jews, havebeen coerced at the point of a sword to convert on multiple occasions by both Christians and Muslims.Let me share my views on your questions:
  • 116. > If inventor invents human being then who invents the Inventor? we can go on then such as whoinvents the Inventors Inventor? There is no end to this.I posted earlier on the widely-shared notion of a First Cause. Indians, Ancient Greeks and Westernershave all deduced logically that there must be a First Cause with no precursor, or else something camefrom nothing. As a student of physics, you know thats not possible by any observable natural process.> What is the purpose of Inventor inventing human being & then assigning to them? Why deliberatelycreate weak human being & expect them to show great strength? What are the inventor doing rightnow? Are they watching us? Since we do not have straight forward answers to these fundamentalquestion...Many holy books and many philosophers of all stripes give straightforward answers to these questions.Answers are not hard to find. The question is which answer, if any, is correct. Thats harder to discover.> in different region people have different faith. That also suggests that whatever has happened orhappening is the wish of Inventor. If that is true then the Inventor is surely a Sadist?Many critics of various religious systems have accused the various gods of being sadistic. Its entirelycorrect, in my view, to wonder about the motives and morals of the inventor of life (assuming that webelieve that life has an inventor). Its entirely correct to wonder about the multiplicity of beliefs in theworld. Each of us searches for answers in his own way, and each of us has his own requirements beforehe will be satisfied. Ive found my own answers in my holy book and in my contact with the inventor.Id love to know how you and others here have answered these questions.> It also implies that our purpose is to live like puppets since our purpose is defined & controlled byInventor.I think your analysis is brilliant and insightful. If we say that every invention is designed to fulfill itsinventors purpose, then we can end up as nothing but puppets of our inventor. Consider what I postedrecently, however. Often, inventions are used for other purposes than the ones for which they wereintended. Who gets to decide what purpose our lives will be used for? Whose interests and goals mustbe served? To me, thats an important question.I believe that I control my own life. I believe that Ive discovered my inventors purpose for me. Its upto me if I will use my life for my inventors purpose, my own purpose, or someone elses purpose.(Chiranjeevi, this is perhaps my most relevant comment regarding the CEO question you posed muchearlier in this thread.)> So it is difficult to follow this train of thoughts since we come into a deadend in all instances. Hencewe need to propose a better explanation. This does not mean I am right or you are wrong. It only meansthat we are all ignorant & we together make an attempt to find the real purpose.Youve seen at least two people here, Prof. Suresh and me, who claim that we are no longer ignorantabout this matter. We have discovered our purpose. Our conclusions and our processes differ, but weare each convinced that we understand our purpose. If you sense that your personal search for purposehas not yet reached its goal, then I would urge you to continue searching until you find your ownanswer.
  • 117. karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-() <> ()() <> ()() <> ()() <> ()() <> ()() <> ()Discover IT :).-Sanjay,Regarding your self-contradictory list of ITs, I would answer that it might be appropriate as anexplanation of the Hindu concept of the Paratma.I thought that the purpose of this thread is to answer the question posed by Chiranjeevi, namely, whatthe purpose of life and the universe might be.If a question calls for an answer in the form of propositional truth and the medium of expression iswords, then making two contradictory statements does not get us any closer to an answer.If your son asks you, "Papa, what is the purpose of life," and you answer,"IT is nothing yet it is everythingIT is nowhere yet it is everywhereIT is abstract yet it is concreteIT is finite yet it is infiniteIT has form yet it is formlessIT is the end yet it is beginningIT is the source yet it is the sinkIT is the creator yet it is the destroyerIT is time yet time is timelessIT is mass, Mass is energyIT is so many things so how can it be NothingBut yet since there is something like Nothing, it implies that IT is also nothing."then I would not blame your son for walking away scratching his head.If you said, instead,"Son, the purpose of life is to earn as much money as you can,"then he would understand perfectly what you meant, because the answer is given in the form ofunambiguous, propositional truth.
  • 118. Again, can you see why our cultural differences in ways of thinking and ways of speaking sometimesmake it so difficult for Westerners and Easterners to communicate on these issues?Sanjay Saxena • David, Physics is full of contradiction. Electron can be both wave & particle. Atomhas no form but yet when these formless atom combine a form emerges. Electron can be found in twoplaces at the same time. Electrons are supposed to be one of the most fundamental particle. Does Itmean that they are made of nothing?. The other fact is atoms are neither created not destroyed. Sophysics does tend to say that there is something which has been existing without creation & also cannotbe destroyed. There is no first cause here. Also quantum mechanical effects are not deterministic.Cause & effect does not apply in quantum world. Also virtual particles pop in and out even in emptyspaces suggesting that something is coming out of nothing. Further Inventor also seems to be existingwithout creation. First cause does not apply to them it seems. Did the Inventor come out of nothing?We are also not sure that are there only one inventor? There is a possibility that there could be multipleInventors? Are these multiple inventor friends or competitor? In a multiple Inventor scenario, how canwe find out our parent Inventor?Sanjay Saxena • I think you missed the following comment posted earlier...I reply to my son in thefollowing way to make things easier for him to understandDavid, my self-contradictory (my own IT list), is based in knowledge in Quantum Physics.For example let’s assume IT is atoms.So we cannot see atoms meaning it is nowhere yet actually atoms & virtual particles are everywhere.Atoms can be wave & particles also. Which means they are abstract & yet concrete.Atoms has no form (previously thought as point particles) so it is formless but yet when they combinewith other formless atoms they emerge into a formAtoms can neither be created nor destroyed. Scientist are trying to find out the basic particles &discovered more than 36 particles. If they find out one such particles let assume electrons then does itmean they are made of nothing? It means that from nothing something has emerged. There are otherweird contradictory facts in quantum physics. So we need to accept contradiction too.Chiranjeevi Tallapragada • Hi Shobhita, its an interesting question. I dont know if there is incarnationbut if there is then it may be to fulfill the unfulfilled purpose. If there is purpose to life then there couldpossibly be incarnation too. I think everyone will experience at least one moment in life when one feelsthis is it. The 127 hours movie protagonist at one point says this rock has been waiting for me here forages and everything I have been doing has been driving me towards this rock." That was a moment ofrealization for him. I also wonder if Gandhiji felt this way when the bullet hit him because it looks likeeverything he did in his life seemed to have led him toward that point. I wonder if anyone of us hasalready felt that way.Shayeri Roy • Jayendra Upadhye: I really appreciate your thoughts.This discussion was about purpose of life, existence of universe and coexistance in the universe....Isthere a necessity for the intervention of religion and God in this?...I am not a believer nor a nonbelieverin either of these...However I feel religion is mans creation, with a purpose ...disciplining ourlives....People have misinterpreted or used it for their own convenience.Sanjay Saxena • Purpose of Life: To experience Living and death.
  • 119. This is a practical answer since everybody who is alive is experiencing something/manything & sooneror later experience death too. If the experience is bad then one can strive to improve their experience bydefining or aiming for the kind of experience they want & strive for it. That becomes the purpose forthose who are unhappy with the current state of affairs. Happy people who are satisfied and enjoyinglife may not have the time to think about such questions. But wait it can’t be all that simple. Whatabout God? Transcendental stages, connecting with Inventor & all that mumbo-jumbo…Well out of 1lakh ILN members only 2 people could claim to achieve it. Success rate is extremely poor or evennegligible. You can imagine the success rate when we consider 6 billion people. Moreover whathappens after achieving a state or connecting with people? Can you solve the problems of the world?Can you eradicate poverty, hunger & other social problem? Perhaps not. So what purpose does thisspiritual mumbo-jumbo serve? We can be better off learning Moral science & Humanity withoutreligion. It will help us to stay disciplined & also avoid religious conflicts.jayendra upadhye • Thank you Shayeri Roy!Of late, I had decided to see what the rest were doing about some "one god one religion" cloak anddagger stuff going on here.As was expected, (and has been happening for past god knows how many thousand years), mostjumped onto the fray without even understanding that in the end such people always "look down onyou no matter what. After chaptes of dicsussion they always end with "But you just contradictedyourself at line numer such and such"!Our people welcome these guys with open hands, and what do they do? Start demolishing theirarguments, picking "logical defects" etc, and if accosted, accuse us of being impolite! Sahab ko disturbkarne ke liye:)WHEN are Indians going to learn???(the multiple ? has its appeal I have begun to see the light now and understand why Pakis use them themos)!Mike Rana • This thread has now become unreadableRajneesh Kumar • Im complete deep inside me ..............I am at peace inside me......................I am freeto live, learn and believe whatever I want.................................I am free to un-live, un-learn and un-believe whatever I want and whenever I want..................................I am free to choose whatever I wantto make a choice about...............I am free to feel pleasure or happiness when I get what Iwant.................I am also free to feel sad, agitated or sorrowful when I dont get what Iwant.....................................My lucidity is my choice is my freedomand successes are failures are my celebrations..................................because Im complete insideme even if I feel incomplete inside me....................................I am at peace inside me even if I am at warwithin myself..........................I am free even if I feel strangulated inside at times.I know....................Sometimes when I think that I am on the way, I have actually lost theway........sometimes when I think that I have lost the way, I am actually on the way.............the purposeof my life is still being realized even if I feel that it is something that is yet to be realized. And the daywhen I will die, a whole universe will die with me, till then, there is a whole world which lives life.Thanks,
  • 120. RKkarthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-...........every being born comes with a package to live as long as it can................ practically making one to dash with the other for its own survival & longevityones extension need not necessarily be at the expense of others life.. practically that is again not possibleback to an old comment ," One mug / bucket Tsunami on ants and other little beings " ...............!!!........ still there is some beauty in one being supporting the other beings life........ that again comes packaged inside all beingsdig it out , see it ..................... there IT is ? , the purpose ...................... put that in to action, live a purposeless life .where is then life & death :)jayendra upadhye • Naradjee I thought by now you would have been passed thru the logical tests anddeclared self contradictory and hence redundant! Unless you sudddenly fell on love with one book onegod one truth that is!Kya hal hai?Are all joints and bones ok?Are you suddenly seeing the world with unitary vision?2 days ago • Like •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-Jayendra,*( dig it out , see it ..................... there IT is ? , the purpose ...................... put that in to action, live a purposeless life .where is then life & death * )
  • 121. ..... as many * life s as they escape .......... as many Gods :).-2 days ago •NimuUnfollowNimu Shenoy, MBA • Jayen, I think you should star in your own Comedy Show. (apologies forinterruption.)2 days ago • Like •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-Nimu.... a small gift for the interruption, help us solve this :)....... ........... Nothing is the center of the Universe ...................-2 days ago •Follow jayendrajayendra upadhye • Nimu...But I would make a very dark comedian, literally, and any which way youwould look at it. I enjoy pinpricking people high up on morals, as I feel too much of morals somehowtakes one closed to sinning..difficult to explain, and will retract the statement of you guys wring myneck sufficiently! ...I always say I am a beilever of PAN!On that creativity thread by Arif..he IS one of the enlightened souls haunting this nerwork...Karthikeyan are taxing my overloaded nerves with brevity! Do take a long breath and expand onwhat it is you are saying...the air is not being mercifully taxed yet so use it by the lungful.2 days ago • Like •Follow jayendrajayendra upadhye • topic...a centerless universe a 4d bubble of 3d space!Karthik..the centre resides on the inside of that bubble, "out" of 3d space!2 days ago • Like
  • 122. •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-Get out of the Life Cycle,I me my you we us .. ant tiger virus .... all can become God ?!.-2 days ago •Follow jayendrajayendra upadhye • Oh now I understand are speaking Mandarin right, Karthikeyan?My bad :)2 days ago • Like •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-these ones have a better language days ago •Follow CA SudhirCA Sudhir Shenoy • Profound questions. From what I learnt from books, discourses and debates I havethe following to offer. These can neither be proved nor disproved. With this disclaimer I proceed.What is our purpose of life on earthWe are not human beings having divine experiences, but divine beings having human experiences. Forthose who believe in rebirth, the soul (for those who believe in soul) is on an ongoing journey oflearning and experiencing everything that is needed to reach that ultimate state - which is described asmoksha by some and nirvana by some others. In this journey the soul progresses upwards and assumeshigher life forms by virtue of the good deeds performed by the name and form currently assumed by it.Conversely if the deeds performed are otherwise than good it assumes lower life forms like plants andanimals.
  • 123. So the purpose of life is to help the soul to attain higher and higher forms of existence till there is nohigher form other than the highest at which point the soul will merges with that highest form andbecomes one with it just as a drop of water falls into the ocean and becomes the ocean.Why does the universe ExistI do not think Science has an answer to that yet. The term universe means different things to differentlife forms. For the fish in the deep seas, for the animals in the dense forests, for the insects, for thepeople in remote places untouched by civilization - for each of them the term universe has a differentmeaning. What is the universe to you?Universe need not be only what is commonly understood as a collection of planets, stars galaxies andthe space between these. Universe does not be limited to what can be perceived by our five senses.Universe need not be confined to that which is visible, audible or tangible. Universe need not also bewhat is outward to our physical self.There is a whole universe within each of us for e.g when you sleep you dream. Who is the author ofthis dream? You are. Who directs this dream? You do. Who creates the characters of your dream? Youdo. Who all are able to see your dream? None but You. When you wake up what happens to your dreamand all the characters? Everything ends within you.Can you share your dream with anyone else whileyou are experiencing the dream? No way. Your dream is born in you, lives in you and also ends in you.You create it, you sustain it and you destroy it, You are the Bhrama, Vishnu and Shiva of your dreams.What then is your Universe when you dream? Only what you experience in your dream And not theReal and Physical world in which your physical form is sleeping. At this point suppose we ask Doesthe physical and real universe exist for you when you are asleep the answer would be NO because atthis point your universe is your Dream alone.Now that Science has no answer, we turn to our ancient texts which mentions that we are characters ina cosmic dream which is being dreamt by the supreme being by whatever name called. He creates us,watches us for some time and after some time puts us to rest and conjures up fresh characters and thisplay goes on.Here we introduce the concept of Maya or Illusion and the corresponding concept of reality with thefollowing story.King Janaka once was very disturbed and when inquired of him he said "Last night I dreamt that I wasa butterfly". The minister said that was no reason to be disturbed to which King Janaka said I amdisturbed because now I am not really sure if I am King Janaka who dreamt that he is a butterfly or amI a butterfly who is dreaming that it is King Janaka" He was wondering if he was living in reality andbeing a butterfly was only a temporary illusion or was he in reality a butterfly and living in the theillusion of being the King.To conclude, instead of asking why does the universe exist it would be more appropriate to ask does theUniverse really exist in reality or is it only an illusion that we are experiencing?2 days ago • Like •
  • 124. Follow CA SudhirCA Sudhir Shenoy • Does anyone or anything else knows about existence other than us?That is an easy one after all that has been said in response to Q2.Firstly I would ask Does this "Änyone or anything" exist in reality or do they only existin someone dream like we all do.Secondly assuming “Anyone of Anything” exists in reality then I would ask you “Do you know aboutthe existence of all the life forms on earth? Leave alone earth, in your own Country? Leave alone yourcountry, in your City? Or your own house? Or within your own body (virus, bactria etc) Are you awareabout the different insects, the different types of spiders, mosquitoes, ants , bugs etc that live in andaround your house? The answer, I am sure is again NO. Now if you ask are all these life form knowYOU exist? It would be ego shattering but it again is NO. They do not know about our existence and Idon’t think they care.Lastly to “Know” about our existence that level of intelligence is required to be present in the “Anyoneor anything”. Just as Higher forms of Intelligence i.e. us humans are aware of the lower forms of lifementioned above and not vice versa, in my view and belief there exists an form of Intelligence muchhigher than us which is aware of our existence though most of us refuse to acknowledge existence ofthat higher form without tangible proofSudhir2 days ago • Like •1karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-Sudhir,Great posting ........... just a small query !Maya and Illusion .............. interchangeable or there are differences intheir ...................................................................................................meanings ?!.-2 days ago •Follow CA SudhirCA Sudhir Shenoy • Yes Interchangable. Both refer to the same thing - in different languages.Sudhir
  • 125. 2 days ago • Like •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • Thanks Sudhir.2 days ago •Follow ChiranjeeviChiranjeevi Tallapragada • Thank you Prof. It is easy asking questions especially the ones that one cantanswer. I like this group a lot because everyone is honest and open with their true opinions. There areso many learned people in this group like Jayendra, it amazes me how much he reads. Your thoughts onthese questions are I guess is the essence of all learning about life. In my own experience there weremoments when one feels close to realizing the moment of truth. What has always held me back fromcontinuing in that state is my own fear of losing all that I have been living for. My attachment to myworld. This I realize is like wanting to continue a dream.I really liked the example of King Janaka when he wonders if he is a butterfly or a king. Fortunately weare ignorant enough not to have such doubts. I am sometimes scared of being enlightened. As a child Ifelt sad that Budha left his kingdom, wife and child because he was bothered by all the sadness he sawaround him. Do I want to become Budha? Absolutely not. But I want to be careful that I dont go to theother extreme either, though I dont know what it would be.2 days ago • Like •SiddharthUnfollowSiddharth Shah • When Im dreaming I prefer not to think about waking up, and prefer not to dreamwhile awake.I bet theres got to be some post in some ancient scripture for its validation. :-)2 days ago • Like •Follow ChiranjeeviChiranjeevi Tallapragada • Hi SiddharthThese questions are also part of my dream. Its like why am I dreaming?2 days ago • Like •Follow CA Sudhir
  • 126. CA Sudhir Shenoy • Dear Siddharth,The option and therefore the preference, not to think about waking up does not exist at the point atwhich you are experiencing your dream. This is because at that point you do not think of yourself as adreamer but you identify yourself with the character you play in your dreams. Think about it. Supposeyou are one of the characters of the cosmic dream, as you read these lines or at any other time (in the socalled reality) , has a thought ever occurred to you like, "Ok man, I have dreamt enough for the day, letme now wake up and get back into the real world"The second part of of your statement i.e. prefer not to dream while awake" happens in your state ofawakefullness(if there is such a word) and the first part of your statement i.e. prefer not to think aboutwaking up when dreaming, ALSO happens AFTER you come out of your dreams and not in the state ofdream.Wishing you more and most of everything.Sudhir Shenoy2 days ago • Like •Follow CA SudhirCA Sudhir Shenoy • Chiranjeevi,After reading about King Janaka, most people are inclined to think about it and it helps the most whenour life takes us through testing times. We can stop worrying and replace that with the thought that it isall a dream we are experiencing and that we shall soon wake up to the good times of life andsimultaneously work on finding our way out of the problemsThe last part is important though.Sudhir Shenoy2 days ago • Like •SiddharthUnfollowSiddharth Shah • @Chiranjeevi,Let me assure you, Im also a part of your dream, I too am a creation of your subconscious mind justlike everyone else.Also listen to this with great attention Chiranjeevi : Sudhir is trying to capture your mind, Hes aninception, hes a creation of your mind which will totally make you go crazy and you might wake upexhausted.Chiranjeevi, When this life is a dream why are you being told about your life in awakening that too by
  • 127. a man who says you really have no option of thinking about awakening while dreaming???And if you are living a real life why is he telling you that youre dreaming.Hes a hypnotist whos purpose is to drive you mad... dont fall from him... enjoy your dream, make thebest out of it. Go back to sleep, dont think of anything, let your mind rest, can your feel your eyesheavy and brain empty, TRY IT!!!! Theres only a few hours of sleep left make the best of it..Sweet dreams Chiranjeevi.2 days ago • Like •Prof.SureshUnfollowProf.Suresh Kumar • This dialogue about wakeful stage and dream state are very interesting andrelevant.Let me point out that science has found out that dream state cognition and wakeful thought areunified ,and the difference is only in the quality of contents.Both are along a perception-emotion-hallucination continuum in brain.WE come out of it only when we are along a perception-meditation continuum,to the right of thedream-wakeful thought emotional continuum in brain.That is posssible through some special yogic methods,not widely known or practiced.WE have mental images which we project to the world,and in dreams we experience it internally,in ahallucinatory stage,and in wakeful thought we replay it emotionally,and externally ,in this world ofphenomenology.That is why philosophers and scientists and psychologists study dreams and say that both dream stateand wakeful thought are unified,in terms of contents,though not in qualitative terms.Real awakening is possible only in pure consciousness states of eastern meditation[our ancient yogishave descibed it]That is when and where we see real perceptions of reality and experience the truth of world andexistence2 days ago • Like •Follow jayendrajayendra upadhye • While on dreams, Has anyone read up on one of the 10 Maha-Vidyas of IndianTantrism? I am referring to Tripur-Sundari.At one time I used to look down (and many of you do so too) on everything that had anything to dowith Tantra.Then I learned Raman Maharshi (Arunachal fame) considered it (Tripura-Rahasya) his favorite!Then I learned (read up) Tripura Rahasya by Haritayan, as was taught by Parashuram and Datta-Atreya.These personalities were no mean personalities and if they thought highly of something, it was worthhaving a second look.Tripura-Sundari is the diety presiding on th three states of the mind. Jagriti-Swapna-Sushupti
  • 128. (wakefulness - deams - deep sleep).Worth a read by all who inquire after the questions under consideration here.By the way, few know that Laxmi is also worshipped under Tantra as "Lalita / Kamala".There is likewise a connection between Nila-Tara and Saraswati.2 days ago • Like •Follow jayendrajayendra upadhye • There is one state of the mind that is often referred to by yogis, but which I havedifficulty interpreting. It is a state between wakefulness and sleep. It is called "Turiya".Dnyaneshwar has referred to it If I am not mistaken.2 days ago • Like •Follow VikrantVikrant Dhoke • Going too deep into anything may make you disoriented2 days ago • Like •Follow jayendrajayendra upadhye • Yes Vikrant, but If one can "go deep" and learn complex subjects as medicine /engineering, whats to prevent one from learnig these things!And remember, these things were once university level stuff in Nalanda and Taxshila! (You may call itphilosophical archeology)! Because the Tara I mentioned above also was part of Vajrayan Buddhismwhich is heavily Tantrik in nature. The Buddhits "came to life" at a period when people had tired ofhinduism! (Familiarity breeding contempt).Plus the lower casts wanted their share of Adhyatmic pie too. Buddhism offered a way out. TheBrahminic Bastile of sanskrit purity was was thus stormed and breached by its corrupt, but popularsister Pali.There is on the net an interesting thesis that finds resonance in things half a world away. Archeologistsfound graves in America that showed the occupants were a priestly family of red Indians, allslaughtered together.It was the priod of a very long draught. So long, the people lost faith in their gods and slaughtered theuseless priests wholesale.Now this theory says in India too something like that happened. A droughty period lasting decades.(Was that the one when a famous Rishi got by on dog meat?).There is mention of a twelve year drought.It says that was when Hinduism lost its grip on the populace, as all the gods failed to deliver! (Asordered by the praying masses, in the end all gods are but slaves of the masses).I personally ascribe the Bharatan war to the demise of hinduism.The ruling classes suffered, causing loss of patronage to the Brahmins, causing wholesale breakup of
  • 129. the Varnashram.The third tier the Vaishyas prospered and thats why Jainism has more followers amongst the Vaishyas.Buddhism was altohether classless.2 days ago • Like •KarunaUnfollowKaruna Manke • Well friends...I was going through the comments but didnt have the patience to gothrough all the comments. I would just give my inputs....The purpose of everyones life is enlightenment and we are all knowingly or unknowing on our path ofsalvation. Some of us may be aware about it and some may not be aware that is the only difference. butyes all of us are already on our path. Gautam Buddha, Jesus, Lord Mahavir had reached Z in therejourney, I , you and we may be at H, I, J, K or L anywhere. This I feel is more of a spiritual question.To go more deeply to understand this I would recommend you guys to read Oshos books. One by onethe Master has revealed everything beautifully.regards2 days ago • Like •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-Illusions are many Kinds . Maya as refereed by the old scriptures is bit different and veryspecial ............ happy to hear some details from the exalted souls !!.-2 days ago •Follow ChiranjeeviChiranjeevi Tallapragada • Yes are also part of my dream and I never take my dreamsvery seriously. So dont worry, I will sleep, wake up intermittently...look wise and then go back to mydream again.2 days ago • Like •2karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-
  • 130. ........I think once quantum computing is realized in full scale , it should be easy to related dreams withhappenings in individuals Life.............:).-2 days ago •Follow KrishnaKrishna Garg • Purpose of life is to know more and more how life came to this planet which can beapproached only asymptotically.2 days ago • Like •Follow RajneeshRajneesh Kumar • For having a go at such altered states of mind and experience the expanded states ofawareness first hand, we can choose to download the The Gateway Experience by Monero Institute. Ihad two such encounters with their type of hemi-sync music.With thanks,RK2 days ago • Like •SiddharthUnfollowSiddharth Shah • @Chiranjeevi, You know what , you really dont have to tell me anything (Since Imjust your brain barking inside your head). You just need to convince yourself of the truth and takecontrol over your thoughts and dreams.2 days ago • Like •Follow VikrantVikrant Dhoke • Donkeys love thinking on this subject - sometimes standing quietly in the middle of astreet - Why do I exist ?2 days ago • Like •1
  • 131. Follow SanjaySanjay Saxena • It is amazing , dreams & all...Sounds more like masturbation of thoughts to get somevicarious experience :-)2 days ago • Like •1karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-.....................All animals too have their birth right to know their purpose of existence , many times it isjust quite unfortunate that we need to bend before them to Learn about Ourselves............... sad but not abad reality :)Rats Free Trapped Friends, Hint at Universal Empathy“Rats help other rats in distress. That means it’s a biological inheritance,” said neurobiologist PeggyMason of the University of Chicago. “That’s the biological program we have.”........................................................................................................................The experiment built on research conducted several years ago by geneticist Jeff Mogil at McGillUniversity, where mice were shown capable of “emotional contagion” — a slightly scary-soundingterm denoting a tendency to become upset when cagemates were in pain. This might not seemsurprising, but anecdotes from wild animal observations don’t pass academic scrutiny, and it hadn’tbefore been shown in captive mice. It hinted at unexpectedly sophisticated cognition: Mice weresupposed to feel pain, but not each other’s, at least not outside children’s stories. "" days ago •SiddharthUnfollowSiddharth Shah • Hello Sanjay ji, Good to see you after a long time.You reminded me of the FU(k theory I proposed earlier in this discussion. And nobody is ready tobelieve in such simplistic phenomenon where a species is reproducing to give birth to new species forcontinued nonsense time over time as our friendly lesser brained species are doing.The best they do is outfight each other to compete over food and mating partners. But we humansfound alternative foods, we literally started eating every bloody piece of crap lying around on the faceof the earth and thus we had too much time to fuck around with ourselves and our thoughts.
  • 132. 2 days ago • Like •Follow SanjaySanjay Saxena • Hi Siddharth, I agree with this theory. It is a bitter truth.2 days ago • Like •Follow ChiranjeeviChiranjeevi Tallapragada • Thanks for the suggestion Sidharth..I guess I have the right to do what I feelright, even if I am a donkey. Poet Thyagaraja says " endaro Mahanubhavulu, andhariki vandhanamulumeaning so many enlightened people, salute to all of them.2 days ago • Like •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • ..-F... theories implications are huge , for example see this fun :பராசக்தி – கறார்பன் டிோஹாக்சிடா [Carbon Diokside]மைகறாவிஷ்ணு – ஆக்சிெஜென் [Oxygen]பிரம்மைோதவன் – ைநைட்ரஜென் [Nitrogen]மைோகறஸ்வரன் – ைஹட்ரஜென் [Hidogen]translated to,Shakti is carbon di oxideVishnu is oxygenBrahma is NitrogenMaheswara is hydrogen days ago •
  • 133. karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-Light Higgs Discovered And About To Destroy The Universe after all, life & death is nothing for the Universe too :).-2 days ago •Follow jayendrajayendra upadhye • Dearies ...why bring the F word here?Or are there any chhupa Rajneeshites here? Out to corrupt innocent minds? :)2 days ago • Like •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-There are two groups of metalsone rusts ......... keeps rusting to the coreone rusts .......... forms a film , protective coating to prevent further rusting..109 Elements & 108 Gods.-2 days ago •Follow ManojManoj Acharya • Agreed that sometimes there is no better way to express a feeling without the F-word,but allowing it in the public forum invites copying by those who dont understand. So please bepolitically correct. It is also good professionally.The comment was flagged and has been removed.2 days ago • Like •
  • 134. Follow jayendrajayendra upadhye • Manoj! And I was telling Nimu on the other thread that a sergeant at arms wassomerimes required!Think of the devil....:)2 days ago • Like •Follow ManojManoj Acharya • The devil never sleeps. And now that Siddharth is back, there is more reason not to ;-)2 days ago • Like •1Follow jayendrajayendra upadhye • You are scaring me now! :)1 day ago • Like •NimuUnfollowNimu Shenoy, MBA • I am starting to think that Manoj knows that I like suspense thrillers!1 day ago • Like •Follow GloriaGloria OMarrah • Manoj article about swearingWhy do people swear?By John M. Grohol, PsyDFounder & Editor-in-Chief“Swearing is like using the horn on your car, which can be used to signify a number of emotions (e.g.,anger, frustration, joy, surprise).”Swearing injects a direct, succinct emotional component into the discussion, usually in order to expressfrustration, anger or surprise.when you want to emphasize how great you feel something is, a swear words emphasizes the positivefeelings you haveVirtually all people swear, and people swear pretty consistently throughout their lifetimePersonality research suggests that people who swear more, not surprisingly, score higher on traits suchas extraversion, dominance, hostility and Type A personalities.Swearing is not just for the uneducated or people of a lower socioeconomic class — it knows no socialboundaries in its expression.
  • 135. Swearing is a natural part of human speech developmentWe then learn that we may be able to say a swear word in one social context, but not another1 day ago • Like •1karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-doine^ ....... doine ^...............hope it is back to businessIllusions are many Kinds . Maya as refereed by the old scriptures is bit different and veryspecial ............ happy to hear some details from the exalted souls !!....... doine ^.-1 day ago •Follow GloriaGloria OMarrah • Improvements in HellAn engineer died and ended up in Hell. He was not pleased with the level of comfort in Hell, and beganto redesign and build improvements. After awhile, they had toilets that flush, air conditioning, andescalators. Everyone grew very fond of him.One day God called to Satan to mock him, "So, hows it going down there in Hell?"Satan replied, "Hey, things are great. Weve got air conditioning and flush toilets and escalators, andtheres no telling what this engineer is going to come up with next." God was surprised, "What? Youvegot an engineer? Thats a mistake. He should never have gotten down there in the first place. Send himback up here.""No way," replied Satan. "I like having an engineer, and Im keeping him."God threatened, "Send him back up here now or Ill sue!"Satan laughed and answered, "Yeah, right. And just where are YOU going to get a lawyer?"Read more: day ago • Like
  • 136. •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-Gloria, thanks - good One.How / why did engineer land up in the Hell :).-1 day ago •SiddharthUnfollowSiddharth Shah • .................... pls dont flag this one. Its by Osho.1 day ago • Like •Follow ManojManoj Acharya • Nimu, actually suspense and thrill are genres missing from this forum. Someone hasto find out how to get here.1 day ago • Like •SiddharthUnfollowSiddharth Shah • Manoj, in my dictionary "Awesome" starts with an F.1 day ago • Like •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • doubt he is ..... out of 26 countries :).-1 day ago •
  • 137. Follow GloriaGloria OMarrah • Karthikeyan, I guess he did bad things. The benifits he had to offer must haveforgiven his sins so God was willing to take him.. That happens alot on earth. Or, maybe he was a goodguy all along trying to make life better for all.1 day ago • Like •Follow GloriaGloria OMarrah • My license plate is awesom and it starts with A1 day ago • Like •Follow GloriaGloria OMarrah • Sunglasses make words differant1 day ago • Like •Follow GloriaGloria OMarrah • Vikrant, I had to take care of horses, they never think those thoughts. He wasprobable thinking happy thoughts, like this is the life, no one is on my back, but, where is the food?Every brain has their own program.1 day ago • Like •Follow GloriaGloria OMarrah • Vikrant, I agree with that saying, going to deep will disconnect you. Some answeresare so obvious and right infront of are face, I think thats the common sense factor. We dont use that butinstead try looking for 100 other reasons. Its like a parent watching their child jumping off the kitchentable. Common sense would be to stop them. Or you could take him to theraphy, or maybe he has atalent to jump out of planes, or maybe he needs glasses.1 day ago • Like •Follow GloriaGloria OMarrah • All this dreaming going on. Dreams happen when asleep. It is info you have in yourbrain that is randomly running around. Day dreaming is when you decide to think about stuff in a way
  • 138. you want, pretend. Uncontrolled dreaming is an hallucination caused by drugs or a brain disorder.Pretending that you lost your job is just a dream is an escape from reality. You can feel everything willturn out right, thats a good attitude. To escape into dreaming is not dealing with reality. It will alwaysbe there, deal with it.We can keep telling ourself that something is real because we want to believe it.Some things have proof, like I know he loves me and he says, never did, end of dream. Some things wecant prove, like I saw God, cant ask God can we, so that dream you can keep because no one canprove otherwise, and it makes you superior to others and cravy to the other others.1 day ago • Like •Follow GloriaGloria OMarrah • Jayendra, I like brevity, usually it means an answere. Sometimes words get you lostor say nothing, people use them to avoid the answere that they dont have. Agree sometimes they areincomplete thoughts, or meant to make you think and see the answere yourself. Its like going to apsychiatrist, who dose all the talking? When the patient stops talking and realizes what he just said, hehas an awakening.1 day ago • Like •Follow JVJV Raj • This question is fundamental. It has troubled minds through out. It is important to know lifespurpose. First of all, there is a purpose for life. and we can know it. We have been created with apurpose. We are not a product of accident. There is a fine book, " purpose Driven Life" by RickWarren. Gold Meir said, she knew the purpose of her life when she was 9years of age,,,direction andnot details.1 day ago • Like •Follow ProfProf Kamalakar • I am happy that Chiranjeevi started this discussion. It shows that at least some oneamong todays youth is interested in the answers of this type. Yes this is very much needed albeitchildish. I also congratulate Jayendra for his knowledge and the replies. This is bringing out interestingfacts and i hope would create necessary interest inthe youth. Are you all aware that the scientific searchis on for the missing energy ? which the "Purusha Sukta " says is some where in the cosmos. Only aquarter of the creation has been manifested according to it and the modern science is also able toaccount for only about 30% of the energy that should be available according to the theories of Physics.The point I am trying to make is, both religion and science have to meet at some point they are notparallel like a rail road. I do hope more and more considered opinions will pour in in response tochiranjeevis question and will lead us some waht nearer to that point.1 day ago • Like •
  • 139. karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-........ that is real sad story as far as this sub-continent is concerned, all traditional / spiritual / religiouspractices were based on Scientific queries .............. but these days all are dumped as myth , funnystories , useless adherence ...... added to that is the fact Swamijis are straight away labelled asfrauds ,.......... but not without reason ?!Difficult to discover and tough to recover !!.-1 day ago •SiddharthUnfollowSiddharth Shah • Dear karthi, true about 26 countries. But just also do a count of no. of countries atPune Ashram.Sunglasses cut out the glare and colors, providing a clearer vision.Anyways Im not a follower of Osho or any other guru for that sake. Cursing in air is different frommaking personal abuses at someone.What Osho missed is that F can be used as a good punctuation mark too, and attracts great attention onthe stuff you need to highlight.1 day ago • Like •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-Siddharth,.... though he is not liked by all, he is a great Orator and what he has done is no meanachievement.............. he even made the whole life look very simple !!One of the great & notorious Gurus , No doubts :).-1 day ago •Prof.SureshUnfollowProf.Suresh Kumar • One may not confuse the missing energy or dark energy in the universe with spiritand its energy.Dark energy or its equivalent vacuum energy/cosmological constant like entities are
  • 140. energy of empty space or what our ancients referred to as VAYU[element air]What is mentioned in our ancient texts like Purusha Suktha refers to Spirit as Purusha which is thecource of life and all energies of a vital nature.That may not be mistaken for dark energy[which constitutes empty space and its energies comprisingmore than 75 percent of universal energy density]or electromagnetic and radiant energies since these are elements of Prakrithi or material nature ,and notPurusha.Our ancients referred to radiant energy as AGNI[or element theyu-our fire is only a very grossequivalent]1 day ago • Like •Follow venugopalvenugopal maganti • Some times I find some crazy analogies,and when I see a spider,I am reminded ofa human soul--now,a spider weaves its own web(different species weave more complex ,creativedesigns),engrossed in the the task ,and happily feeding and breeding(living its own dream),tillsuddenly a breeze of air blows the whole web away --I dont know if the spider ruminates over the loss,but soon it starts creating one more web--human soul is the spider and the web is the body it creates--and the spider prefers dark places for its web--my analogy ends here,but I am certain that time is linearand not circular,-for, the repetetion of history ,is purely on account of mans inability to learn from themistakes of his predecessors and change his thinking pattern,which determines his actions, (for his owngood).And ,as for the thory of reincarnation to fulfil ones purpose of life,I believe man has a predetermined prologue,but a self written epilogue.--and each chapter of the book of soul ,has its ownprologue and epilogue.confusing? some point logic must end, and faith begins.Somehow,looking at the depth of the arguments here,I feel a strange urge to end it somewhere--(physical attraction leads to procreation,where as deep dissection and anatomical knowledge can lead torepulsion).,not with standing the intellectual intensity of the arguments,bordering on abysmal depths.1 day ago • Like •Follow jayendrajayendra upadhye • Gloria..thanks for the gyan! :)But Karthikeyan knows what I was referring to when I brought up the context "Naro-Va-Kunjaro-Va"! Since you may not know the looong background behind that phrase, you disposed offsome gyan into an empty vessel.So be it !As I always say nothing ever goes waste! Somewhere at the back of my mind it may have an effect.But I am incorrigible! Nature being what it is..better to be oneself..whether others like you or hateyou! :)Honesty being the best of policies.1 day ago • Like •
  • 141. karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-doine^ ....... doine ^...intellectual intensity of the arguments, ( bordering on ) jumping to abysmal depths. :)Illusions are many Kinds . Maya as refereed by the old scriptures is bit different and veryspecial ............ happy to hear some details from the exalted souls !!....... doine ^.-1 day ago •1karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-Latest Fermi studies find no trace of dark matter" Independent analyses of data from the Fermi Gamma-ray Space Telescope have found no trace oflow-mass dark matter – the mysterious substance thought to make up much of the universe. The resultsappear to go against recent direct evidence for low-mass dark matter, although some physicists believethere is no conflict. " day ago •Follow GloriaGloria OMarrah • Jayendra, yes honest is best, people that dont like you, dont know you and yes, Idont know what your talking about most of the time and cant even pronounce the words.1 day ago • Like •1Follow GloriaGloria OMarrah • Thought this was goodCHOOSING...WITH KNOWLEDGE
  • 142. "Many people are held in bondage by illogical ideas and faulty concepts. Their knowledge usuallyconsists of someone elses theories. Not willing to analyze and experiment for themselves, they becomeengulfed in a web of fantasy and theory devoid of fact...."Every day we are choosing in an attempt to avoid pain and obtain pleasure. With knowledge we mayhave greater pleasure. The borning process us not without incident. Painful as they may be, setbacks orreverses-when understood--always bring new ideas. Ideas implemented bring new experiences.Observation and analysis of experiences according to law adds much knowledge. Only through the useof KNOWLEDGE can confusion be eliminated and greater PEACE and PLEASURE be gained."from "Knowledge Brings Greater Pleasure," Dr. L.L. Chesney, printed in The Beamer, September-October, 1964, pg 71 day ago • Like •Follow GloriaGloria OMarrah • Siddharth, The sun glasses may give you clearer vision, but you will never see thered in the apple and you will be blind at night.1 day ago • Like •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-Gloria,Yes , that is what this Thriukural too says............dates back to few centuries ..கறற்கற கறசடறை கறற்பைவ கறற்றைபின்.நைிற்கற அதற்குத் தகறLore worth learning, learn flawlesslyLive by that learning thoroughly..... learn whatever should be learned , ... most thoroughly and after learning stand by or practice whatone has learned with avid interest .......
  • 143. .-1 day ago •Follow GloriaGloria OMarrah • Religion and science are better if they are side by side running together and nevergetting in each others way.. Meeting is temporary. A dog sled is joined side by side and will take youwhere you want to go.Its like a husband and a wife. They have to keep teir own identities our one islost.1 day ago • Like •1Follow ChiranjeeviChiranjeevi Tallapragada • Each one of us has a parent, child and an adult in us. The parent says stopfooling around, get serious and be polite. The child says have fun, be careless, be selfish and clever, getwhat you want. The adult says give space, listen, apply knowledge, learn. Our responses to anystimulus could come from any of these ego states. One can be natural or one can choose from whichego state to respond.1 day ago • Like •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-Gloria,......... I think here there is some trouble with what you know :).-1 day ago •SiddharthUnfollowSiddharth Shah • @Gloria, when the colors and glaze is removed the real textures and patterns arerevealed. Which make much more sense: the F- theory of universe is an absolutely original piece of work. Nobody ever dared to attemptsuch a bold explanation, you are lucky to be reading the first references of it. Maybe later on it will sell
  • 144. as a very high priced 5th grade school book. :-)1 day ago • Like •Follow jayendrajayendra upadhye • Karthikeyan...Now you are going to be the next recipient of "Glorious" Gyan!After she said "those who do not like you do not know you"..I am in two minds...she likes me, she likes me not...and ..she knows me , she knows me not..Karthikeyam ab tumhati bari hai..Gloria:["Many people are held in bondage by illogical ideas and faulty concepts. Their knowledge usuallyconsists of someone elses theories. Not willing to analyze and experiment for themselves, they becomeengulfed in a web of fantasy and theory devoid of fact....]Now you will know why I cant stand "the book" and world being made to order in 7 days!!!...Fantasydevoid of fact...illogical ideas and faulty concepts ...all the right ingredients satisfying that "quotedquote"!True, I am indeed at peace, having the right knowledge...:)After all who decides which knolwdge is right?The ignorant fundamentalist who in his ignorance is blissfull, or the scientist who in "his knowledge" isblissfull?1 day ago • Like •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-Jayendra, ab tumhati bari hai.. , ....... put it in Hindi Script :).-1 day ag •Follow jayendrajayendra upadhye • Karthikeyan, my r/t interchange is killing me.Ab tumhari bari hai....Its your turn now! you .....:)
  • 145. 1 day ago • Like •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-ज्ञान ज्ञान है, तो कोई समस्या नहीं ..:).-1 day ago •Follow AdnanAdnan Khan • if you think too much on what our purpose of life here, you would loose that purpose.just go with the flow1 day ago • Like •1Follow jayendrajayendra upadhye • Adnan what is your take on the questions? can you re-iterate it for me?1 day ago • Like •Prof.SureshUnfollowProf.Suresh Kumar • Purpose is intrinsic to being and inherent in the mind as intentionality and egosubstrate.The search for a higher purpose than purely the material and the apparent or evident is also a part ofthat ego substrate or intentionality in mind[karma]That is anyway not for all and sundry but only for the evolved beings to look beynd the flow and itsmundane material existence14 hours ago • Like •Follow JVJV Raj • Purpose is related to destiny and hence always out side of the individual seeking it.12 hours ago • Like •
  • 146. Follow jayendrajayendra upadhye • @Prof.Suresh Kumar:Have pity on guys like me and re-translate what you said in that last post! It is all chinese to me, insimpler english.11 hours ago • Like •Follow GloriaGloria OMarrah • Dont know if thats chinese or polish.. JV is speaking the same language. Destiny isour choices that take us to the place we end up. So it cant be on the outside, unless he is referring toactions.10 hours ago • Like •Follow GloriaGloria OMarrah • Adnan, going with the flow is good to a point. If you get on a boat and you need toget to a certain place, and you go with the flow, what are your chances of getting there?10 hours ago • Like •Follow CA SudhirCA Sudhir Shenoy • Gloria,Jayendra is referring to the post by Karthikeyan wherein he has put in the following line in devanagariscriptज्ञान ज्ञान है, तो कोई समस्या नहीं ..:)Which when translated means, If knowledge is Knowledge then there is no problemSudhir10 hours ago • Like •
  • 147. Follow GloriaGloria OMarrah • Jayendra,speaking only from my own experiance, every person I hated or didnt like,once I got to know them, I liked them. Were all the same inside but we all have differant faces.10 hours ago • Like •2Follow CA SudhirCA Sudhir Shenoy • That is right Gloria. The last line in your post is especially true.The Traditional Indian way of greeting each other by joining the palms of the hand in front of the chest(called Namaskar or Namaste) conveys the same truth, You in spirit and I in spirit are one and thesameSudhir10 hours ago • Like •Follow GloriaGloria OMarrah • So what is the debate? The deffinition of knowledge?10 hours ago • Like •AkshayaUnfollowAkshaya Bhatia • Derive it from here:-Labyrinth of colors insideWorld is changing, pixel by pixelChoose the one you likeOh lord, so low on sensesSeems like choices are manyEyes blink through shutter of lensesLove devoursWho knows, seems realDesire hauntsLooking out, still thereTears flow unguided intermittentlyCatch me, hold meIn case you care.....10 hours ago • Like •
  • 148. Follow GloriaGloria OMarrah • To bad only children seem to be able to grasp that concept, one and the same. When Iwas a child I had a friend, he was black. When my mom found out I was forbidden to play with him. Inever noticed he was black. I never knew why that meant I couldnt play with him.10 hours ago • Like •2AkshayaUnfollowAkshaya Bhatia • Good glorious inference, Gloria,...Child is always smarter than adult becausethinking is yet to become much adulterated or biased, yet open to learning, understanding andexploring without much inclination to conflict or self glorification....So, nearer to GOD,....Please also refer, a great query from a child:-How Did God Create Himself? hours ago • Like •Follow PalashPalash Chatterjee • Life is something existing in our thoughts and feelings. Going to its roots leads usto a facinating world. This is what I have experienced9 hours ago • Like •1Follow GloriaGloria OMarrah • Some people are afraid to go there, they have choosen to close the door. Maybe theyknow whats there and don;t want to see it face to face.8 hours ago • Like •1Follow jayendra
  • 149. jayendra upadhye • @Gloria:"So what is the debate? The deffinition of knowledge?".Well the questions stated in the topic seemed obvious, but then we had some really smart people tell ushow every other guy had faulty logic, including the poor professors who presumed to teach them, andthen we had other prople say "those who say they do not know the purpose are no good...and then someguys who said they definitely had that knowledge about who they were and what was their purpose.But for some esoteric reason, they never divulged that divine purpose to us lesser mortals...Now we are here ...discussing how children are smarter and awaiting some more "glorious Gyan" sothat we may get properly started again.So now let us continue from here.8 hours ago • Like •1karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-...... Jayendra ,so you want the Truth .... the purpose of life in earth The purpose of life in the Earth is to never come back here again :).-6 hours ago •Follow Bal KrishnaBal Krishna Gupta • PURPOSE OF LIFE: FREQUENTLY ASKED QUESTIONSWe keep wondering about life, its purpose/futility and existence of God etc. We keep on searching foranswers from religious tomes, Gurus and parents. Still, we feel unsatisfied and unconvinced. I put forthmy views on some of such questions.Who am I? Once you learn how to live, this question becomes redundant.What is life? Life is a 70-80 years long journey into pleasant and bitter experiences, relationships,financial highs and lows which are unique to each one of us. Life can be fun if lived positively and hellif lived grudgingly.Is God there? Why should we bother? If our conscience is clear we need not worry about His presence.But, to share a secret with you, He is there.Why am I what I am? If you were not what you are presently, the question would remain the same.Why is there so much tension in this world? We have become artificial and hypocritical in ourthoughts, speech and action (manasa, vacha, karmana). We have acquired affectations and gone faraway from nature. We have surrendered ourselves totally to materialism. Spiritual and religious aspectsof living have been relegated to the background.
  • 150. Why does evil seem to prevail? When the good become passive and docile, the evil doers have a fieldday. To split a bucketful of milk, a single lemon and to break a glass pane, a single pebble is sufficient.Materialism has made us a bunch of cowards. People act selfish for the smallest of apparent gains.Why should we live? Do we have an alternative? And pray, why should this question arise, at all, inanybody’s mind? For any doer, life is too short to do so many things he has planned and enjoy allaspects of life. Enjoy life to the hilt. Remain cheerful under all circumstances. Learn from nature. Allflora and fauna live through the vagaries of weather, without even once questioning the maker.6 hours ago • Like •2Follow Bal KrishnaBal Krishna Gupta • How can I manage my feelings and emotions? When we are sad, depressed,frustrated or disheartened we question the very purpose and existence of life. We must learn the lifeprocesses completely to understand them. Then we shall have no trouble with the self and the soul. Thesoul shall remain restless till we don’t learn to relate to happenings around us with a non-aligned anddetached state of mind. Excessive attachment or total lack of feelings/compassion both lead to misery.How should I manage my time? Basic principle of time management is to devote 7 hours (29%) on selfdevelopment, 8 hours (33%) on sleep and 9 hours (38%) on career/business. Sleep is the mostimportant aspect of living. Unless you sleep for at least 8 hours daily, you cannot perform well in thewaking hours. Similarly, unless you spend at least 7 hours on eating, exercise, leisure and selfdevelopment, you cannot achieve much in life. Most successful persons follow these principles.How much is enough? In nature, whenever any excess takes place, overt signals start appearing atregular intervals. With experience, we should be able to judge when a thing or act is being given undueimportance or time. To a balanced person, the sense of proportion comes effortlessly.How should I decide on a career? Lucky are the ones who make their hobbies their career. Don’t thinkin terms of engineering/medicine/IAS only.’ Develop your faculties in the field you feel mostcomfortable at. Go for theatre, personal effectiveness, public interest litigation and the like.How to avoid temptations? Do a quick SWOT analysis of each such opportunity and take the mostreasoned view. How much education should I receive? Level of formal education depends on manyfactors: economic status of parents and their attitude towards education, your place of birth, your ownI.Q., aptitude and dedication. However, learn to read, write and speak at least your mother tongue,national language and English and specialize in some discipline. Be conversant with computers andinternet. You should have a fair idea of the different parts of body and their functions. Keep yourselfcurrent with the local, national and international happenings and the latest in your profession. Basicknowledge of Economics, Sociology, General Science, History and Geography and the law of the landis equally important.How should we take the criticism by others? Take it sportingly and treat it as a feedback to improveyourself. It is an occasion to introspect and correct. But if you feel that the criticism is born out ofjealousy/ignorance/with an intention to discourage you from the chosen path, vehemently shrug it offyours shoulders. Otherwise, you shall be handing over the remote control of your self-esteem, self-respect and decision making into the hands of your critics.6 hours ago • Like •2
  • 151. Follow Bal KrishnaBal Krishna Gupta • What sustains life? The lust for life sustains it. This feeling is intrinsic to all livingbeings. Interest in life is also created by hope, ambition and attachment to near and dear ones/fellowbeings.What is the purpose of life? Every living being is programmed to grow, learn while growing, mature,realise the potential in totality and live a full life till death. Distortions are caused by societalinterference, misleading advice by fellow beings and wastage of substantial time in unwarrantedpursuits.Artificial way of living, synthetic products for natural ones, diversions, excessive automation andcommercial way of thinking have made life miserable for most of us. Blessed are those who have seenthrough it all at an early age, and taken corrective steps. They have understood the purpose of life, in itstrue sense. Upon them lies the task of making maximum people aware of the basic purpose of life andto guide them to lead a contented and fuller life.What obligations do I have towards society/world? You owe your very existence to the world and thesociety. Whatever you have received from them, you should repay with interest. The society mouldsyou, sustains you and supports you. You should do like wise. It is a symbiotic relationship.What should I do to live longer? Living life correctly itself ensures longevity. Balanced food, moderatephysical exercise, noble thoughts, positive outlook, lofty ideals and pious deeds make life longer andliving worthwhile.What is the right mix of work and play? Please follow the principle of 6,8, 10. Depending on yourcurrent situation, you may slightly vary the ratio. But in the long run, this ratio is just appropriate.What is the place of love in life? Where there is no love there is no life. Love for others, for near anddear ones, love for humanity, love for one’s place of birth, love for self- these are the most ardentfeelings of human beings. One devoid of love leads a miserable life- rather does not live.Who should decide about my future? Upto 12 years, let your parents take decisions. After 12, theyshould consult you for all major decisions.Should I believe in luck? In life, chance plays a major role. Avail the chance if it comes your way. Butdon’t waste your time waiting for lady luck to smile at you. If you keep working, the smile is not faraway.The Sanskrit word for purpose in life is dharma. As per dharma, we each have unique talents which weare most likely to discover when we ask “What can I give?” Rather than ‘What can I get?’“We were given magnificent birth gifts, talents, capacities, privileges. Because of these gifts, thepotential within an individual is tremendous, even infinite. The more we use and magnify our talents,the more talents we are given and the greater our capacity becomes.” Steven Covey6 hours ago • Like •4karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-नारद कहते है,आप ज्ञान के एक िबिट के िलिए पूछा ........ यहाँ यह िनयाग्रा :)
  • 152. Thanks Bal Krishna..-6 hours ago •1Follow jayendrajayendra upadhye • hahaha Naradji!4 hours ago • Like •SiddharthUnfollowSiddharth Shah • Mr. Bal Kishan, didnt know you had a copy of MOU that every human signs with thegod before landing on the third rock from the sun.4 hours ago • Like •Follow DavidDavid Wittenberg • Siddharth,You wrote: Mr. Bal Kishan, didnt know you had a copy of MOU that every human signs with the godbefore landing on the third rock from the sun.Finally a comment that makes sense! Thank you!Most of this chain has been pretty poetry, citation of ancient texts, and know-it-alls spouting that theirway of thinking or believing is true and anyone who disagrees with them must be stupid or evil. To myway of thinking, thats no way to answer a question.Siddharth, thanks for challenging someone who simply asserts an answer without explaining why thatanswer is trustworthy, logical, or correct.3 hours ago • Like •1Follow VikrantVikrant Dhoke • Thats not MOU, Sid, its the Instruction Manual for life.But most people fail to read manuals and end up in misery using the thing called Life.
  • 153. Great - Bala , loved it.3 hours ago • Like •Follow VikrantVikrant Dhoke • Narad ji - We call it the fountain of Gyan - why did you choose to cite a water "fall"?( All that goes up, comes down eventually ?) or because there is no fountain on earth large enough topraise Bala ?3 hours ago • Like •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-Vikrant.... no known fountain name that is quite popular and as well most of us are aware !.... may be we can list few now :).-3 hours ago •1Col PuneetUnfollowCol Puneet Sehgal • What is the purpose of life on earth?My purpose be useful to somebody.At higher level - Self realisation.Why does the universe exist?The Cosmic vacuum was the original cause of the universe, life and our thoughts. Our achievementsare only reflections of its infinite wisdom. Can any human subsisting in the endless ocean ofconsciousness claim originality or individuality?( Mandukya Upanishad )Does anyone or anything else knows about existence other than us?We ourself are not clear about our existence thats why this question has been raised. Only enlightenedmind will have answer to this.2 hours ago • Like •1
  • 154. NimuUnfollowNimu Shenoy, MBA • David W, before your comment gets washed away by more of the same, I wantto acknowedge that you are not the only one who feels that way. A lot of comments are either beautifulflowery words or fighting..even if done in jest.Chiranjeevi posted a philiosophical question, and most people went "nutszoid." The poster is forcingmembers to think and use their own insight. This is certainly a good test for all to challenge themselvesto decide what this question really means to them.When I posted my purpose on this Earth a while ago, my comments were ignored and notacknowledged because it did not fall into the realm of poetry or "sweet battle."I feel that Chiranjeevi has given us poetic freedom to interpret the universe in any way we like. It doesnot have to be scientfic. I am still thinking about this question and may decide to post my answer to thequestions at a later time.2 hours ago • Like •Follow DavidDavid Wittenberg • Thanks, Nimu!After about 500 posts, if anyones still reading, Ill be stupid or daring enough to repeat my proposedpath of inquiry into the question.Before deciding what the purpose is, I think we should first determine where the purpose -- if there is apurpose -- comes from. I proposed that life is an invention, so its intended purpose is assigned by itsinventor. Col. Puneet, above, suggested otherwise. He suggested that life is not an invention, but itsprings from a vacuum. Others may have other ideas.2 hours ago • Like •1karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-..* few liters or one bucket full of knowledge from Niagara ( BK G )"" What is the purpose of life?Every living being is programmed to grow, learn while growing, mature, realise the potential in totalityand live a full life till death. Distortions are caused by societal interference, misleading advice byfellow beings and wastage of substantial time in unwarranted pursuits........... ""
  • 155. .-48 minutes ago •1Follow SanjaySanjay Saxena • There are several other ideas such as Platonism, Aristotelianism, Cynicism,Epicureanism, Stoicism, Classical liberalism, Kantianism, Utilitarianism, Nihilism, Pragmatism,Existentialism, Absurdism, Secular humanism, logical positivism, Postmodernism, Evolutionarypsychology, Naturalistic pantheism, Mohism, Confucianism, and Legalism. The other is religiousperspectives which include western and Middle Eastern religions, south Asian religion, East Asianreligion etc apart from scientific inquiry & perspectives.It apparently looks like that the purpose of life is to experience life by seeing it through differentperspectives/lenses & make the experience richer. It would be unwise to experience things throughlimited perspectives such as only religion, science or any specific philosophy.39 minutes ago • Like •DDUnfollowDD Mishra • IMHO, there is something which is super conscious but we do not know and neither wecan feel it. There is so much of intelligence that I wonder how it can be a coincidence. There is abalance in nature. There is cause and effect. All these things, rationally thinking must have somegoverning principle. I can only say that my intelligence can go upto the point that there is somethingwhich is so intelligent which has made it happen from galaxy to earth, from black holes to supernovaand why the get created has reasons. What is beyond these reasons, I am not able to understand but canspeculate only that there is something more conscious than everything else.36 minutes ago • Like •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-That is being too goody, goody ................humble , humble ..simpleCan X , the one who feels its limits negate that no other Y, Z has the ability to find out - thepurpose......>.-30 minutes ago •
  • 156. Follow DavidDavid Wittenberg • Great list, Sanjay!You wrote: It apparently looks like that the purpose of life is to experience life by seeing it throughdifferent perspectives/lenses & make the experience richer.I, too, want a richer experience in life! I agree that variety is the spice of life (hey, I even shifted fromanother country to India to experience variety). I also agree with your much earlier comment that wemust embrace contradiction.If I associate your list with your comment about different perspectives, I might conclude that the bestpurpose in life is to keep shifting my philosophy say from cynicism to epicureanism to stoicism and myreligion from time to time, say, from Judaism to Hinduism, to Zoroastrianism. I might conclude thatnone of those philosophies and religions is correct, just like no type of food is correct, and that weshould go through life sampling them like we sample foods at a buffet.Have I understood your view and your post correctly? If not, then what was the intended meaning.Siddharth Shah • Exactly Sanjay ji,Jesus wasnt a born christian , Mohammad wasnt a born Muslim, Buddha wasnt a born Buddhist,Mahaveer wasnt a born Jain, just like the way Ram bhagwan never celebrated Diwali.They found the purpose by themselves and people who follow them blindly are fools who actuallywasted their lives for their purpose rather than their own.Gloria OMarrah • Krisna never said he had a manuel or a MOA, you just didnt like his certainty.Sounds more like common sense to me. I usually dont read manuals because Im to smart. I read themafter I do it wrong.8 hours ago • Like •Follow GloriaGloria OMarrah • I always ware sunglasses to, but not in pictures.8 hours ago • Like •Follow GloriaGloria OMarrah • How many people talk a walk through the woods and go off the path. The path iseasy and tells you were you are going, how long it will take. Thats good enough for some, otherwise
  • 157. they probable wouldnt go into the woods at all.At least they get some benifit because someone else hadthe iniiative to do it.Buffets are good, why waste $3o on a meal you wont like. Most of us order the same food all the time,who wants to leave hungry8 hours ago • Like •Follow SanjaySanjay Saxena • You asked for other ideas so I gave a list of ideas available. This list is like lenses. Aphotographer uses different lenses to shoot a particular picture. Some time the same picture can becaptured in a different way by using different lenses. A creative & professional photographer does notuse compact digital camera. They don’t buy different camera every time.By applying different perspectives I don’t think it is necessary to change or convert to a new religion orchange to a new ideology/philosophy. I don’t have to become Chinese first to eat Chinese food. Alsowhen we discuss a topic in any forum we are trying to understand different views/opinions of otherpeople and make our learning richer. Discussion in forum would be meaningless or time waste if theperson just adheres to his/her viewpoint. If that is the case then why debate.3 hours ago • Like •Prof.SureshUnfollowProf.Suresh Kumar • There are subtle worlds of which we are not aware.There are also subtle lifeforms,and forces and powers we are not cognizant of.But we are capable of knowing all this given ourcognitive capabilities in brain and its expanded space.Human brain is proportionately much larger thanthe brain size of mammals and primates,and we are not using this capacity to be awre of subtle worlds.Certain specific metaphysical and vital energy techniques help humans to develop their subtle powersand sense of a third eye kind to experience and be aware of there subtle worlds and its forms andpowers.Of course there are hallucinatory experiences along an emotional continuum,that is physically andphenomenologically different from the above.The experiences of the human organism along a perception-meditation continuum based on such subtleand vital methods can be truly exhilarating and emancipating.It is part of the true spiritual journey through the depths of the universe in us that correspond subtly tothe external world.That journey takes us through the subtle worlds of which we are not now aware,for atrue tryst with our destiny-that is oneness with the unveral spirit and its being,right thru usSiddharth Shah • @Gloria my vision of the world is squint, I see sideways, Thats why the glasses toprevent people from getting disoriented... *-)As far as reading manuals is concerned, One may be referring to a washing machine manual for a TV.And guess what even they wouldnt have a clue until the TV breaks down.When destination is not known, path is irrelevant. Wandering and getting lost can be fun, thats howhalf the world was explored.
  • 158. 6 days ago • Like •Follow jayendrajayendra upadhye • Siddharth..your last post reminded me of an old debate...whether reaching the goalis more joyful, or the journey to the goal is more joyful!There are many many things written on this and I believe many Urdu poets have emptied theirInkbottles expanding on that.In Urdu shayari I believe the journey is considered as more important than the goal. Because once thegoal is achieved, what remains?The thril and fun of the hunt is in the chase!Kisee asli Shikari se poochho to voh yehee kahega.6 days ago • Like •Follow AmritAmrit Bindra • The question-answer is blind asking the blind, and blind responding to blind. Just as wecant witness our own indivdual conception we cant know the purpose behind the universe. Lookwithin to know who you are. The knower cant express while the talker does not know.Jayendra is well read and has expressed it well but has no answer for the original query. But even theVedas claim that they dont know. However, effort to know yourself brings internal peace and it couldbe experimented by any one. That has the most practical value.God depicted as an egoistic and ruthless father who subjects his children to eternal hell or heaven whileproclaimng him to be merciful is the most irrational concept beleived by the two prominent cultreligions. Further, claiming a specific person as the path to God or a creed devised by a self declaredprophet as the only path being followed by even educated people is the height of absurdity. It provesthat man cant be Gods best creation or be in his own image. Because if he is then that God has a lot ofroom for improvement.6 days ago • Like •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-Interesting ,......... having more than two eyes is as good as being blind...Yes , there is room for everyone to improve .........>.-6 days ago •
  • 159. Follow SanjaySanjay Saxena • But since we are blind we cannot look within ourself to know who we are. How canwe look since we are blind?5 days ago • Like •Follow DavidDavid Wittenberg • Hi, Amrit! I guess you think that people like me who follow what you call "cultreligions" must be stupid fools, right? You called me absurd and irrational, so Id like to know therational basis for your conclusion. I thought I was pretty intelligent and rational, but if I have a blindspot, Id really appreciate it if you could correct me and set me straight!You wrote: "God depicted as an egoistic and ruthless father who subjects his children to eternal hell orheaven while proclaimng him to be merciful is the most irrational concept beleived by the twoprominent cult religions. Further, claiming a specific person as the path to God or a creed devised by aself declared prophet as the only path being followed by even educated people is the height ofabsurdity."These seem like pure opinions to me. They are backed by neither evidence nor logic. Would you care toprovide some evidence and logic? Or did you reach your conclusion by raw emotion or by blind faith insome other system?5 days ago • Like •Follow jayendrajayendra upadhye • Amrit, I think you may not have read all my posts.Right at the outset I had said I am a fence sitter, and even said that the vedas ask in the HiranyaGarbhaand Nasadiya Suktas "Kasmai devaya havisha vidhema" whom shall we worshup if in the befinningeven gods did not exist?In fact I also propounded that may be the truth behind the universe may be too alien for us to know.And that we populate that one lacuna with various myths to sort of "fill in the blanks".But I agree and endorse your views on cult religions 100%.I cant imagine perfectly well read guys suddenly thumping a book and proclaiming frpm the rooftops"Our god is the ONE living God, all others are false gods"!In Singapore it has reached epidemic proportions. There in front of every church we find bannersproclaiming loudly "Come to Jesus only he can offer salvation".As though they were advertising some brand of pain balm!! :)On top of that they hold subversive meetings where new converts come out of the group holding"meetings" at a beach, and denounces his old religion, one the poor fellows parents are still following,explains how coming to Jesus has made him somehow feel superior, and there is merry making allaround. I attended one such meeting as some one thought I was the next convert in making.Some of them persistently called at my residence with long faces and stories of impending doom and
  • 160. how only Jesus could save me. I asked them if the reveletions says that only 144,000 jews will go toheaven why are you toiling fruitlessly to convert me? When even you are not assured heaven as you arenot jews?THAT put them off.The funniest part was the Europeans have usurped Jesus completely. In Christmas cards in India he isshown as a European man, complete with white skin, blue eyes, golden hair etc tec while the actualJesus was a dark person with Negroid curls.Churches in Constantinople and Italy did show a negroid Jesus for a while, only to have himtransformed into an European guy!Asimovs story of Ruth is telling. It is titled "Lost in translation". It precisely dwells on this subject.And on top of all that they say "you have eaten his flesh and drunk his blood!" On one hand they willlambast Indians for Sati, and in the same breath have this cannibalistic stuff in their formal prayers! Toomuch.If the Indian Europhils came to know that Jesus resembles a Negro, Most of the "flock" would revert totheir old religions overnight!! :)The glamor would be gone.5 days ago • Like •Follow SteveSteve Dufourny • spherization harmonization optimization.....5 days ago • Like •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-Look carefully at Nothing................ incessantly & bit deep, we will end up with something :).-5 days ago •Follow SteveSteve Dufourny • Look at the truth, like a bird flying above its hopes, look at the contemplations, like aflower smiling to this truth. Look at the all, the whole, the SPHERE ...5 days ago • Like •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-
  • 161. .....though the bird is flying high, its eyes are on the Ground :).-5 days ago •Follow NirmalNirmal Bajwa • There is no purpose, those who find the purpose will gain lost in finding the purpose ofpurpose. the existance is there for you in is there to be enjoyed, each and every moment of itis to be relished. is there any purpose of Sun if so can anyone define. it was there before we inventedwords, its beyond words. still if one want to attempt, then how many suns, how many milky ways andso on................... fell the communion with nature and enjoy the existance.4 days ago • Like •Follow SteveSteve Dufourny • they turn these spheres and they build like a music, harmonious of evolution, theuniversal sphere and its center .......4 days ago • Like •Follow GorripatyGorripaty Ramprasad • I like the question, Purpose of life on earth, others existing else where. First ofall, I appreciate chiranjeevi for the thought she had. Let me start this way, every one who born on theearth has come with a purpose including animals, trees, Plants, water, fruits, vegetable and many to say.Every one on the earth has a destiny to reach in a righteous way having godly qualities. Humans areborn with a special gift from the creator having mind to think to implement the thought without hurtingthe environment that gifted to us by the God. like leaving & non living beings on the earth like animals,plantation, water, air, fire, land, space and many, positively to create unity with love by elevating one tothe higher levels of life to attain oneness.We have born for this purpose and this is the way we have toattain and leave the body with smile. It is not related to any religion or any caste or any creed and it isjust human. In this love is the catalyst to act to move forward with all the things that are surroundedaround us, living and non livings things to be as one family. Anyone who follows the conscious but notthe mind, that is the inner heart filled with love will end with destined purpose, designed by the creatorof the earth and enjoys the life to the fullest having inner bliss that is permanent, which takes to higherlevels of life and leaves the body with smile.If we follow the mind without considering the conscious(love within), we will start getting in toconfusion, attachments, ego, pride, jealousy, anger, commenting others, abusing others, misbehaving,loosing control, selfish, identifying ourselves, lack of understanding others, foolishness, mentallyinstable, feeling as we are carrying lot of burden on us, more hunger towards everything that we comeacross, sickness, no confidence, depending on others. no happiness, full of sarrow, becoming difficultto leave with lot of ups and downs in life and many. Finally we forget the purpose for which we have
  • 162. come to the earth and die with sickness having lot of attachments with face as if we lost everything aswe failed the exam and lost everything in life by not knowing for what purpose we have come.Coming to existence of others in other worlds. First of all we are wasting our valuable time on thinkingon this subject. In the present world, neighbor does not know who exist next to him and finally hisexistence as a role to act. Where the question comes to think of others existence in other worlds. Ratherit would be better, healthy and very good to us to think, whom we are, from where we have come, whywe are existing here and what is our purpose here? Once we know the answer, we will know everythingautomatically and we will enjoy meaning and purpose of life and we say thanks from the bottom ofheart to the creator for giving us an opportunity to be human. My sincere request with love, to startsearching within to know the above mentioned question to enjoy the ultimate bliss to reach higherlevels of life and die with a smile on face as a gift given to us by the creator.4 days ago • Like •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-நைந்தவனத்தில் ஓர் ஆண்டி - அவன்நைாலாறு மைாதமைாய்கற் குயவைன ோவண்டிெகறாண்டு வந்தான் ஒரு ோதாண்டி - ெமைத்தகற்கூத்தாடிகற் கூத்தாடிப் ோபாட்டுைடத்தாண்டி...>There is a mendicant / saint with only a loin clothRequested to be molded in to a POT which takes about 4+6 monthsPot is shattered in dancing with IT to hearts glee.......>.-4 days ago •1karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-.........It is worth knowing what UNESCO thinks of the purpose and hence Education for the upcominggenerations
  • 163. "" Everything we know is subject to error and illusion.The education of the future should confront this double-faced problem of error andillusion. The greatest error would be to underestimate the problem of error, the greatest illusion tounderestimate the problem of illusion. Recognition of error and illusion is all the more difficult in thaterror and illusion are not recognized as such. Error and illusion have been parasitizing the human mindfrom the first days of homo sapiens. When we consider the past, including the recent past, it seems tous that people were blinded by countless errors and illusions. In German Ideology, Marx and Engelsobserved that men have always had misconceptions about themselves, about what they are doing andwhat they ought to do, and about the world in which they live. But neither Marx nor Engels was able toavoid the same kind of errors..................................""more : days ago •Follow SteveSteve Dufourny • each creation is unique and precious without exception !Not need of an ocean of words to see the universal love !3 days ago • Like •Follow EvelynEvelyn Sayos • Its what you can do to yourself and to others...3 days ago • Like •Follow NinanNinan Mathullah • No matter what your opinion or my opinion, the Truth is only one. It our job to findthe truth. Tried to answer all the questions that I can think of in Metamorphosis of an Atheist- A lifejourney to the Truth More information about the book- Foreword, Preface, Contents and First Chapterlisted at or Book also available and OM Book stores in India.1 day ago • Like •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-
  • 164. It is difficult to understand people many times ,............searching for purpose life without knowing that it is already written in the books :).-1 day ago •NimuUnfollowNimu Shenoy, MBA • I think it is fascinating that if you ask this same question five years from now,each contributor may change his or her answer. The purpose of life on Earth and the existence of theuniverse are honestly based on what has happened in the world and what has been discovered in spaceexploration. Almost as if one backs into an answer rather than giving a direct answer.In Science, changing your answer so many times is not very accurate. It seems that what is taught isFaith in lieu of actual Science. Faith is our belief that a purpose of life on Earth exists in our Universeand in many galaxies beyond. I sometimes wonder if there is another Nimu somewhere is anothergalaxy? How is her life? Does she look like me? Is Nimu even a human being or another soul?So many questions to ask and no real answers. This is precisely why philosophy feeds some of itsreality to Science so that some of the answers can be discovered. Until then, we are just contemplating.1 day ago • Like •Follow MikeMike Rana • I did not want to enter into discussions, since I was busy lecturing on Bhutan. But I wouldrequest that the members may distinguish between the dualism and non-dualism aspects as outlined bySamkhya and Vedanta philosophies. They oppose each other. Budhhism and Jainism is close toSamkhya.21 hours ago • Like •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-w e . h a v e . N o . c o n t r o l . o v e r . D e s t i n y ---------- Non Dualism..............w e . h a v e .. c o n t r o l . o v e r . D e s t i n y ---------- Dualism.-21 hours ago •
  • 165. Follow NinanNinan Mathullah • What follows is from the 18th Chapter- the Purpose unveiled of the book entitledMetamorphosis of an Atheist- A life journey to the Truth. The theme of the book is related to thepurpose of life. All the world religions are brought in the book to answer the purpose of life, and toshow how one answer is related to the other. To do justice to the subject, it cant be answered in a fewsentences as that will cause misunderstanding and confusion.The book is available at 29 OM book stores in India in all the majoe cities and their Also available at The Book Cover, First Chapter, Preface,Foreword and contents are listed at www.BVpublishing.orgOnce we wereworking in theclinical lab. In a clinicallab, samples takenfrom sick patientsare cultured, and thebacteria causing thedisease, if any, isolatedand studied as to thetype of antibiotics that will wipe it out; this result is given tothe doctor.One day a telephone call came from a doctor. One of thesenior technologists attended the call. Th e doctor required apreliminary report of a patient who was suff ering from urinarytract infection.Th e Purpose Unveiled161Chapter 18162 Metamorphosis of an AtheistTh e technologist who attended the phone was supposed to openthe incubator, fi nd this patient’s plate used to culture the urine, andgive a preliminary report to the doctor. While the call came from thedoctor, the senior technologist was discussing his research project withanother one. Irritated by this interruption, the senior technologistasked the doctor to hold for a minute, came back and talked twominutes to the other person, and reported to the doctor, “No growthat twenty-four hours,” without looking at the culture plate.What do you think of the faithfulness of this technologist?He was not faithful in his job. If you are not faithful in the smallresponsibilities entrusted to you, who will entrust you with greaterthings? If you cannot do the job of a lab technician faithfully, doyou think God will entrust to you or your children, jobs requiringgreater responsibility?Mother Th eresa once said that she was called not to be successful,but to be faithful. She considered it the purpose of her life.Jesus once summarized it in the following two
  • 166. commandments—to know your creator and love Him with allyour heart, and to love your neighbor as yourself. On anotheroccasion Jesus summarized the purpose of life in a single versecombining the essence of both in Mathew 5:16 “Make your lightshine, so that others will see the good that you do and will praiseyour Father in heaven.” (Matt. 5:16)20 hours ago • Like •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-What is the answer for this.................>.-w e . h a v e . N o . c o n t r o l . o v e r . D e s t i n y ---------- Non Dualism..............w e . h a v e .. c o n t r o l . o v e r . D e s t i n y ---------- Dualism.-20 hours ago •Follow NinanNinan Mathullah • We have control over our destiny as man is created with a Free-Will. Both good andbad are out there. It is your choice and reap the consequences.On the other hand things are set according to a Master Plan the creator has for man. Within the framework of that Master Plan, we have Limited Free-Will only. We cant do anything outside that MasterPlan.God has set a time and place for All the cultures of the world to rise, reach its pinnacle, decline and set.That is part of the Master Plan. We cant change it.18 hours ago • Like •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-Ninan, ThanksAs I understand , if someone believes that he has Control over his destiny then he is at risk to face theconsequences ............ which is most likely , from the way it is presented above . So it is advisable toforget the destiny and surrender to something ?!
  • 167. Non Dualism.-18 hours ago •Follow NinanNinan Mathullah • Whether you belive a certain way or not will not change the Truth. You can believeanything anyway you want based on your knowledge, experience, revelations and the resultantunderstanding. For example you can believe that there is a God or you can believe that there is no God.Based on your belief the Truth will not change.About choice of Good and Bad, all religions are basically the same in this respect. Even if you do notbelieve in any religion, still God has given a conscience as to the Good and Bad of a behaviour. If youdo not follow the conscience, you have to reap the consequences.18 hours ago • Like •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-...............The question is then God or Gods if we assume God is definitely there somewhere oreverywere .....>What is IT ?.-8 hours ago •Follow SanjaySanjay Saxena • IT is there everywhere although seen nowhere. Atoms and Photons. :-). Tell me a placewhere IT isnt :-)4 hours ago • Like •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-................IT is There and There is No Doubt on IT...............It so happens that IT one was looking for is not the IT one wanted to see IT or feel IT .
  • 168. What is IT :)Ninan Mathullah • A desire to know IT is the first step to know IT.Our knowledge of God is limited to what is revealed to us by God. God has given in us a desire toknow God. All religions are mans search for God and Gods interaction in that search; little by little.Nature reveals the presence of God. Nature proclaims the manifestations of the glory of God. Theremust be a reason behind anything as nothing comes from nothing. God is the reason behind nature.Now you might ask who created God. God has not revealed that to us yet. If you choose not to tellsomething in your mind to me, there is no way to find that out. I can only assume things and notnecessarily true.Let us Go to Vedas and Upanishadsॐ असतो मा सद्गमय ।तमसो मा ज्योितगमर्गमय ।मृत्योमार्ग अमृतं गममय ।ॐ शािन्तः शािन्तः शािन्तः ॥Om Asato Maa Sad-Gamaya |Tamaso Maa Jyotir-Gamaya |Mrtyor-Maa Amrtam Gamaya |Om Shaantih Shaantih Shaantih ||Meaning:1: Lead us from Unreal to the Real,2: Lead us from the Darkness to the Light,3: Lead us from the Fear of Death to the Knowledge of Immortality.4: Om Peace, Peace, Peace.What you see is not real. God is the ultimate reality or Truth.What you see is manifestations of the Truth.Bible says that the color of God is light and God resirdes in light that nobody can approach. Light is aform of energy and you know that matter is energy and matter can be converted to energy and energy tomatter. God the supreme source of energy can convert energy in to matter to create the nature you see.4 days ago • Like •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-IT is not IT ,.....................IT is IT, IT, IT, .....>.-
  • 169. 4 days ago •Follow shailendrashailendra kumar • logically to understand the human would be possible only by somethingsuperhuman. obviously then, we can only have questions like what is my purpose on earth , whyuniverse exists and so on. but we are most unlikely (i wouldnt say impossible) to be able tounderstand the answers due to the limitation of our brains, and limitation of time in life .Hence thesimplest way would be to believe that god exists , i do my karma and get on with it. or even simpler ,be an animal, dont bother about,eat ,love and if you think you are human you maypray.4 days ago • Like •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-That sounds like a Cool Life Policy :)One person can lift one stick and 100 persons can lift more than 101 sticksOne Human understands one or few and ............................,........................Super Human is Nothing !!.-4 days ago •Follow DavidDavid Wittenberg • Fantastic analysis, Shailendra!If we (or the universe, for that matter) have any purpose at all, it is only because whatever invented usassigned us a purpose. If we cant reach our inventor, then we are doomed to never know our assignedpurpose.Or, if we werent invented, then were just the product of some cosmic accident. Were no better thanwild animals. We can invent our own purpose or borrow one from a parent, guru, or political leader,and no one can call it correct or incorrect, because purpose is then nothing more than a matter ofopinion. A mass murderer and a saint can both justify their chosen purposes, and there is no counter-argument.One additional comment: this forum is India Leadership. I wonder how our view of our purpose affectsour leadership.
  • 170. 4 days ago • Like •1Follow AlokAlok Misra • you are wrong if if you believe animals have no direction.they have and I think it can beproved.4 days ago • Like •Follow JOYJOY MUKHERJEA • Dear madam...this is your spiritual quest and I welcome you in this discussion asit has arrested my attention today.With my humble regards to every other participant in this discussion, I will try to sum it up in short, thechief purpose of human life is to "REALIZE GOD", the creator of this universe and the souls livingtherein. Now the question is how? One can only be enlightened with "GOD KNOWLEDGE" and"REALIZE GOD" through the blessing of living "TRUE MASTER" and nobody else. In this context,let me tell you further that GOD is "FORMLESS ENTITY", which is also known as the "ABSOLUTECOSMIC ENERGY" or "THE SUPREME ENTITY", while a true master, who can only reveal god isthe "HUMAN FORM OF THIS FORMLESS ENTITY". And one can not realize God unless there is ahuman guidance through communication. Interestingly, one can realize God in the fraction of a secondif he is blessed by the true master. And God realization leads to self realization, which means you willbe able to know who you are, where have you come from and where will you go. Therefore, pleasenote that nothing which is limited by its extent in this universe like earth, sun, air, sky, water, stars, fireetc. can be termed as God in any remote logic of faith. Its because...1. Any FORM is the manifestation of "maya", only illusion and nothing else asa. It is subject to change, not eternal as its finiteb. It is destructiblec. It can never be omnipresent in the same form / texture2. GOD is formless and that never changes, its the only "CHANGELESS ENTITY" in this changinguniverse, thus remaining omnipresent, omnipotent, omniscient, infinite and eternalJust imagine...we see everything like the sky, sun, moon, stars, birds, mountain, ocean, falls...but wefail to see the "SPACE".....and thats the vital link to this spiritual quest!Actually we all have only one religion....the religion of "HUMANITY" & "LOVE...howeverdisrespectful or cynical we always are towards other religions leaving our own. And this sense ofenlightenment can only touch you once you actually know "THE INFINITY (THE ABSOLUTETRUTH)" and never before that. Knowing GOD is GOD REALIZATION...and knowing about GOD isonly some knowledge as "knowing about something" is miles different from "knowing something".Therefore, those who worship idols in the name of devotion to God, are ignorant about this fact (say
  • 171. truth!) and superstitiously challenged. However, although spiritual enlightenment comes throughignorance with only fewer exceptions and hence everyone in this world can realize God with theblessing of a living true master to "KNOW & UNITE WITH ONE".Yes...the ONE!If you find sense in my observation through my experience this far...your next question "why doesuniverse exist" has an answer embedded in the process of knowing the ONE through the living truemaster like I said before.If you like to know and discuss more, I cordially invite you to go through or writeback to me at I EARNESTLY PRAY, MAY ALL BE BLESSED BY HIS HOLINESS, THE LIVING TRUEMASTER TO KNOW ONE & CONNECT WITH THE POWER OF ONE!All other endless barrage of spiritual queries / curiosity ends there the moment you are able to connectwith the living true master.Sincere regards,Joy Mukherjee4 days ago • Like •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-One Human understands one or few and ............................,........................Super Human is ( Nothing !! ) something !! ( Now ) ..-4 days ago •Follow MikeMike Rana • Yahoo newsMoscow, Dec 17 (IANS) Bhagvad Gita, one of the most sacred Hindu religious texts, is facing a legalban and the prospect of being branded as an extremist literature across Russia, with a court in SiberiasTomsk city all set to deliver its final verdict Monday in a case filed by state prosecutors.The final pronouncement in the case will come just two days after Indian Prime Minister ManmohanSingh was here for a bilateral summit meeting with Russian President Dmitry Medvedev from Dec 15
  • 172. to 17.The case, which has been going on in Tomsk court since June this year, seeks to get a Russiantranslation of Bhagvad Gita As It Is written by A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada, the founder ofthe International Society for Krishna Consciousness (ISKCON), on the Hindu religious text banned inRussia and declaring it as a literature spreading social discord, apart from rendering its distribution onRussian soil illegal.In view of the case, Indians settled in Moscow, numbering about 15,000, and followers of the ISKCONreligious movement here have appealed to Manmohan Singh and his government to intervenediplomatically to resolve the issue in favour of the Hindu religious text, an important part of Indian epicMahabharat written by Sage Ved Vyasa.The ISKCON followers of Russia have also written a letter to the Indian Prime Ministers Office inNew Delhi seeking immediate intervention, lest the religious freedom of Hindus living here becompromised.The case is coming up for a final verdict on Monday in Tomsk court. We want all efforts from Indiangovernment to protect the religious right of Hindus in Russia, Sadhu Priya Das of ISKCON and adevotee of a 40-year-old Krishna temple in central Moscow, told IANS.The court, which took up the case filed by the state prosecutors, had referred the book to the TomskState University for an expert examination Oct 25 this year.But Hindu groups in Russia, particular followers of the ISKCON, say the university was not qualified,as it lacked Indologists.The Hindus had pleaded with the court that the case was inspired by religious bias and intolerance`froma majority religious group in Russia, and have sought thattheir rights to practice their religious beliefs be upheld.The prosecutors case also seeks to ban the preaching of Prabhupada and ISKCONs religious beliefs,claiming these were extremist in nature and preached hatred of other religious beliefs.They have not just tried to get the Bhagvad Gita banned, but also brand our religious beliefs andpreachings as extremist, Das said.In fact, the ISKCON devotees have taken up the matter with the Indian embassy in Moscow too, apartfrom writing to the Prime Ministers Office in New Delhi, for an early diplomatic intervention, beforethings get worse and the court passes an adverse verdict banning the Bhagvad Gita and Krishnaconsciousness teachings.In the Nov 1 letter, addressed to Principal Secretary to the Prime Minister Pulok Chatterji, ISKCONsNew Delhi branch Governing Body Commissioner Gopal Krishna Goswami, said the prosecutorsaffidavit claims Lord Krishna is evil and not conforming to Christian religious view.Goswami also urged Singh to accord priority to the matter during his Moscow stay and to take it upwith the Russian authorities.
  • 173. Indian diplomatic corps officials at the embassy here, who were unwilling to be named, told IANS thatthey have been following up the case since the time it was brought to their notice earlier this year andthat they had also taken up the matter at the appropriate levels in the Russian government to get thecase either withdrawn or get the defence to fight the case to obtain a favourable verdict.Officials at the Indian Prime Ministers office, who are part of the Indian delegation accompanyingSingh, confirmed the case and the letter they received from ISKCON in this regard to IANS.4 days ago • Like •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-Mike, Thanks.That is real apt news here.Coming to Bhagwad Geeta ( in my view ).......... That is beauty of a philosophical treatise ........ .We can read , reread ,... debate N number of times and still each individual can draw his likes / dislikesof characters portrayed ............still never get tired off IT !!May be they are facing the wrath of their own misinterpretation :).* every being sees & experiences, What it is supposed to see & experience in that life *..-4 days ago •SiddharthUnfollowSiddharth Shah • Dont worry Karthikeyan, banning a scripture or any other media will only make itmore popular and generate more interest in it. There will be a wave of readers wholl now read Geetajust to check the validity of its extremist nature, followed by analysis which will generate more gyan.2 days ago • Like •Prof.SureshUnfollowProf.Suresh Kumar • One should also understand that there are presently a lot of charlatans and showmen or god men who misrepresent ,and misinterpret gita and the texts like mahabharatha ,in the nameof spirituality and religion and bhakthi cult making it all appear very superstitious and bigotry,blind and
  • 174. nonsensical.The real meanings are not being projected by these ignoramuses who proclaim themselves to bepundits and upholders of ancient knowledge without understanding a wee bit logically and semanticallycorrectlyThey are the real culprits and scoundrels and not the Russians for such outcomes and actions eventually2 days ago • Like •1SiddharthUnfollowSiddharth Shah • Completely agree with Prof. Suresh Kumar. In modern era of easy languageconversion there remains no scope of these Godsmen to tamper with the original works. Its time theoriginal works to be preserved and presented.Otherwise it wont take much time before someone uses it to create another Hindu Taliban with Geetainstead of Quran.2 days ago • Like •Follow JVJV Raj • Around 2 million Jews wandered for forty years in the wilderness and did not find their way,though the journey could have been over in 11 days. Do The string of comments in response to thequestion indicate that all of us like who have lsot our way?2 days ago • Like •SiddharthUnfollowSiddharth Shah • @JV Raj, Were chit chatting our way to the destination in typical boring Indian RailJourney. Its more fun that way. Anyone got Pickles??? I got some Namkeen... :-D2 days ago • Like •Prof.SureshUnfollowProf.Suresh Kumar • Sidharth,true--now it looks more like that-only that the destination ispredetermined,as such2 days ago • Like •
  • 175. Follow JVJV Raj • good one2 days ago • Like •SiddharthUnfollowSiddharth Shah • and were all on the same train.... some got upper birth some got side one and sometraveling in first class, some in general.... But the destination is the same.2 days ago • Like •Prof.SureshUnfollowProf.Suresh Kumar • Eventually,of course,and that is the evolutionary one,in the longest run,and thenpurpose and purposelessness coalesce holistically beyond all words and its science and semantics2 days ago • Like •SiddharthUnfollowSiddharth Shah • Oh yes!!! and everyone has there own purpose of traveling, some for work, some forfamily, some for wandering, some just boarded the wrong train. Some will travel throughout whilesome will just get off and board another train.2 days ago • Like •Follow SanjaySanjay Saxena • Since God is all knowing it can be logically deduced that final destination has beenpreplanned & everything that is happening is also well planned. If everything is not planned then itwould mean God is not aware of the future which would mean God is not all knowing which is notpossibly true based on the definition of God. Hence it is obvious that everything is well planned. Wecan further explore as to why God planned the way they planned --meaning their purpose. If we canfind their purpose then our purpose can be deduced.2 days ago • Like •Follow JVJV Raj • Some will get off the train enroute? Some might catch the wrong train? Different trains,different destinations??
  • 176. 2 days ago • Like •Prof.SureshUnfollowProf.Suresh Kumar • When the path is one and narrow and long [where parallels eventually converge]then predeterminism is convergent and all paths lead to rome ,only that immortality is an heavenlyessential reference,unlike the mortal mights of yesteryears on earth2 days ago • Like •Follow JVJV Raj • Do parallels converge? I thpought they dont?2 days ago • Like •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-..............God is a concept..............Gods are Travel Agents for all the Journey by all the beings & matter around theUniverse ...........>BTW, I should check whether I have the right Ticket , boarded the right Train and have ...........the IDCard :).-2 days ago •Follow SanjaySanjay Saxena • If everything is well planned then it can also be deduced that we are just puppets &our job is just to experience since our spiritual growth is also planned. In such a case our purpose seemsto be just to experience & wait for final destination.2 days ago • Like •Follow SanjaySanjay Saxena • @KA, whether you boarded the right or wrong train is immaterial. It is all planned..:-)
  • 177. 2 days ago • Like •Prof.SureshUnfollowProf.Suresh Kumar • The so called free will is found to be a mirage in he brain since the unconscious isfound to predetermine the conscios cognition.Similarly we see a point space with no space having dimensions and parrallellism,and itspathways,from our illusory space-time prspectivity, which is part of the brain based illusion of self andthe Kantian notuions of space time built into our brains as a virtuality.We eventually get out of it to the point beyond the parrallels,and where the whole space-time fabricconverges,and towards a measurement -invariant reality which is the ultimate either byscince[quantum,relativistic and neuro] and philosophy[east or west,and psychology[phenomenology orphysiol9gy2 days ago • Like •Follow JVJV Raj • An Interesting idea, God is a concept!!. Alternately, God is Spirit. God is a person, who can beexperienced.A vocation is often found at the intersection of a compassionate heart and an overwhelming needaround. What does your heart want to do in lifes context is one clear way to find direction in life.Often, only be hindsight many have known that their life has fulfilled a purpose..?2 days ago • Like •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-Sanjay S.............. you mean the famous DestinY :).-2 days ago •Follow SanjaySanjay Saxena • Reminds me of Bells theorem in quantum physics in which two particles seperated bythousands of kilometer can communicate faster than speed of light which is against the theory ofrelativity. So possibly in real world space time just converge. It could also mean that we are inside ablack hole since spacetime curvature becomes infinite in black hole. So what could be the purpose of
  • 178. God to create such mirage?2 days ago • Like •Follow SanjaySanjay Saxena • @KA, yes, offcourse the famous Destiny. Whatever happens, happens as per the willof God since they are all powerful. If anything happens against their will then it means that there issomething which is more powerful than God which is possibly not true since God is all powerful.Hence it is can be deduced that everything is planned.2 days ago • Like •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-.... the most simple one I can think is you play , I play and we all play - inclusive of all gods !!( more if interested ,Do Gods live inside the Black Holes ?! ?! ?!We could live inside a supermassive black hole eventually... but super-aliens may have already beatenus to it, claims Russian cosmologist ).-2 days ago •Follow SanjaySanjay Saxena • Our playing together with Gods inside a supermassive black hole is a will of God.:-).But it also means that there is other Universe outside the black hole & hence since you have localizedGod within black hole, there are other Gods in other Universe which is against the definition sincethere is only one God who is all powerful and they are everywhere. Hence it can be deduced that atleastGod should not be living inside black hole or rather they should be in all places simultaneously.It also mean that the black hole in which we live will sooner or later will evaporate completely due toHawking radiation.2 days ago • Like •
  • 179. Follow JVJV Raj • Some theories of Physics about the Metaphysical. Interesting, but getting no where?2 days ago • Like •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-Sanjay SThat is Your God ............ my God is different , his god is different , her god is different and their god isdifferent ... etcso many, many Gods are out there .......>But one needs to be purposeless & playful to see IT :).-2 days ago •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-...........How does the driver of the Train ( or even the guard ) knows the Purpose of every passengertraveling in the Train ???.-2 days ago •Follow SanjaySanjay Saxena • @KA, God is formless. Man give God a form due to their limitation, constraints,characteristics. When you give a form to God they become localized & limited by the boundary of theform created. But that will down grade God. Hence God has to be formless since they are all powerful,knowing and present everywhere.The purpose of Train driver & guard is predetermined. They just drive from A to B.We cannot become purposeless to see IT. The will of God will decide whether we become purposeless& playful to see IT and whether we go nowhere or reach somewhere :)2 days ago • Like •
  • 180. karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-........I do not agree, we can become God !.-2 days ago •Follow SanjaySanjay Saxena • In that case we need to redefine the definition of God. Perhaps God to you means ahighly idealized form of Man. A vision set by Man so that they transform themselves to this idealform.But still when you define or set a form or vision, the boundaries are set and once Man becomesGod they becomes localized.2 days ago • Like •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-........Escape........... No arguments :).-2 days ago •Follow davulooridavuloori bheemeswar • Try to do some self realization works or listen to some tatva geethas ( songswith metaphysical aspects full of logic for lifes). We are born as humans to live as humans and to seethat humans continue to live on this earth in peace, harmony ans serene conditions.2 days ago • Like •Follow MikeMike Rana • For those friends who care, the book has been sold 200 copies, most of them in Canada2 days ago • Like •Follow RajeshRajesh Chopra • Let’s Keep Things simple; do not get into complex solutions.
  • 181. Inspite of hovering on these issues, facts, why don’t we look into something like this –“Make a gift of your life and lift all mankind by being kind, considerate, forgiving, and compassionateat all times, in all places, and under all conditions, with everyone as well as yourself. This is thegreatest gift anyone can give.”By: David R. HawkinsAlso, let’s learn to enjoy & celebrate the struggle part of our life to make the entire life an enjoyableone, each moment a celebration.This is very important as a part (major or minor) of our life goes in struggle – whether its career,money, family, relations, spouse, children.The success part - in all circumstances – we are celebrating & enjoying.Once this art of enjoying & celebrating struggles & failures is mastered, the entire life becomes acelebration, an enjoyable one.And believe me. this can be practiced & mastered.We can’t allow ourselves, at any cost, to make any part (small or big, this will depend from person toperson) of our this valuable life to be sad, a burden, a thing to mourn.Happy Living!2 days ago • Like •Follow JOYJOY MUKHERJEA • True religion unites, never divides.So...No God, no peace. Hence know God, know peace (and every other query that one have have!).2 days ago • Like •Follow AlokAlok Misra • there are certain ratios that are baffling,.the ratio between the distance of electron tonucleus and that of sun to earth is the same in multiples between the navel and center of the head.if it isan exact multiple then the man in question would be a saintly figure. recent discoveries in universe hasproved this point- life is expected more on such planets which has near about multiples of this ratiofrom their sun.atleast two such planets have been discovered in two solar systems even though millionsor billions of light years away. That means there can be life on other planets ! If we artificiallyduplicate this we can create life serving planets.But this is not possible in this solar system In order totravel faster than light we need to enter the dark space or the black hole which means extinquish ourexistance.Time will then collapse meaning we will go back billions of years in effect see the
  • 182. creation.At that point of time we may get the clue to the energy which create life which in my View isthe energy that collapses light into dark hole and is a particle whose existance could last for a picosecond.I believe it is generated when we leave our body or die.Extreme sensation of spirituality canhelp us see this- this is part of that we call God- Collectively in Cosmos2 days ago • Like •Follow NinanNinan Mathullah • Is this science or magic?Ninan MathullahAuthor: Metamorphosis of an Atheist-A life journey to the Truth2 days ago • Like •Follow davulooridavuloori bheemeswar • It is all maya, a magical bliss that makes us all to feel what we think is rightand the ignorance creates all the problems. Whether GOD. whose GOD, is there or not is immaterialfirst recognize others as humans like one it self. Most of the problems are settled. If one has the right tolive even others have the same right, some may be poor some may be wealthy it has nothing to do forlife how harmoniously and peacefully people live is the criteria and making the environment serenethats all. No comparisons please that makes the degrees rise up tempers flare up and we are all introuble which is the present situation.If any body has read carefully the Ramayana Hanuman is a savak of Rama, but god himself becomesslave to the devotee also. But most of the Indians pray to Hanuman as well Rama. the story tells onlyone thing be humble with other fellow humans trust and build the faith in each other, any thing can besolved on this earth. Trust and faith comes from culture and culture teaches ethics and moral, onessomebody degrades his or her own culture means they are culture-less. if this so this entire world is fullof uncultured people who are defacing the humanism if any thing left on this earth.It is left to individuals whether they wanted to see to that humans are left on this earth or not if theyhave any humanism left in them. The purpose of the human life is to make humanism stays on thisearth for this one should not become slave of satanic forces.If people of the world do recognize what is humanism then every thing is possible to make the lifecontinue on this earth.2 days ago • Like •Follow ChiranjeeviChiranjeevi Tallapragada • Thank you Joy...I agree with you on many things like knowing aboutsomething is not the same as knowing it, and to know God/your creator is the ultimate purpose of anylife. My only concern is that humans with all our brains and knowledge and intelligence may be
  • 183. moving away from our purpose. Does living in sync with nature is the way to get closer to our creator?Like not killing everything that is not useful to us. Or accepting the fact that how much ever the scienceprogresses nature will always be one step ahead of it because science is not outside the nature butwithin it.2 days ago • Like •Follow NinanNinan Mathullah • Dear Davuloori,I like to get some clarification here. Peace is good. Everybody wants it. Now nations go to war for thesake of Dharma as Krishna advice Arjuna in Gita. Arjuna lost all courage thinking of killing all thosepeople. He doesnot want to fight for the sake of peace, and if the price to be paid is high he doesnotwant to fight for Dharma. Now Krishna is advising why it is necessary to take action. How do youjustify that?.If Hitler had won that war many ethnic groups in India would have gone to the Gas Chamber. British,Americans and Russians were ready to sacrifice the life of their children for the sake of the peace weare enjoying now. Gandhiji wholehrartedly supported the British and Indian soldiers were fighting forthe British in the Second World War.Now Gita is being banned in Siberia as some consider it extremistview.RegardsNinan Mathullah2 days ago • Like •karthikeyan arumugathandavan • .-....... most of the Wars are fought in the name of Gods..... it is even claimed that it is his instruction , we are just executors of HIS Vision..... either they were lying or the gods want us to fight with others..... boils down to the fact it is quite Natural among beings.........................Discover the Purpose through Fight or Flight ...............................-1 day ago •
  • 184. Follow ANANDANAND B V • We are guests who are invited to this earth.There are many levels of existence withinand outside our sphere1 day ago • Like •Follow JAMES