rnchat:          T1 h1n1 Vaccine: Do facilities have a right to mandate nurses to get vaccinated?
                 #RNchat...
rnchat:          @andyatFAD Glad you're here. To join the chat, add #RNchat to your answer to a topic.
                 Le...
EllenRichter:    Welcome to all the new people who are joining the chat for the first time! Nice to see
                 m...
11/17/2009 11:53


SafetyNurse:     1/2 My daughter didn't want a flu-shot last year (1st year in college-10 hours from ho...
rnchat:          T2 As a follow up: (I know this is sensitive so do ur best): Over ur career have u seen
                 ...
EllenRichter:    @clearlydriven ~So if theres a nursing shortage, we need to entice more ppl, not lower
                 t...
andyatFAD:      If there wasn't a market for non-BSN nurses, we wouldn't be having this chat. There IS a
                m...
11/17/2009 12:15


BonnieRN:        @EllenRichter U have to wonder, who IS going to be offended and I wish no harm... but ...
StressedFran:   we talk to ppl all the time about fall prevention here ~case studies who have improved
                alw...
are charter members!! #rnchat
                   11/17/2009 12:30


andyatFAD:         Thanks for letting me in today, eve...
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RNchat Transcript November 17, 2009

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Transcript for #RNchat November 17, 2009. RNchat is a Twitter chat for registered nurses.

Topics:

T1 h1n1 Vaccine: Do facilities have a right to mandate nurses to get vaccinated? #RNchat

T2 Education Requirements: Should a BSN be the minimum requirement for RN? Why or why not? #RNchat

T3 Fall prevention: What are best practices? Are dangerous practices still being taught/reinforced? #RNchat

Follow on Twitter: @RNchat - http://twitter.com/RNchat

Blog: http://RNchat.org

Published in: Health & Medicine
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RNchat Transcript November 17, 2009

  1. 1. rnchat: T1 h1n1 Vaccine: Do facilities have a right to mandate nurses to get vaccinated? #RNchat 11/17/2009 11:35 EllenRichter: T1 As usual, great question: should facilities be able to mandate nurses to get H1N1 vaccine #RNchat 11/17/2009 11:36 StressedFran: The feeling I've been getting from RNs I've talked to is no, but it'd be wise for employees to get it! #RNchat 11/17/2009 11:38 EllenRichter: T1 Honestly, health care practices should be governed by 1self w/ advice from health care professional, not mandated by a company #RNchat 11/17/2009 11:38 bhawkesRN: T1 If I owned a facility I would strongly encourage vacs but not mandate #rnchat 11/17/2009 11:39 InfusionNurse: T1...if nurse doesn't do it voluntarily, I would say yes! #rnchat 11/17/2009 11:39 StressedFran: Many of HCPro website polls of healthcare employees on this issue have been pretty split #RNchat 11/17/2009 11:39 EllenRichter: T1 But on the other hand, if hc professionals are in environment where H1N1 is high, all should be protected to reduce outbreaks #RNchat 11/17/2009 11:40 AbbieCitron: RT @bhawkesRN: T1 If I owned a facility I would strongly encourage vacs but not mandate #RNChat 11/17/2009 11:40 NursingCenter: I agree - RT @bhawkesRN T1 If I owned a facility I would strongly encourage vacs but not mandate #rnchat 11/17/2009 11:40 EllenRichter: Me too! RT @bhawkesRN: T1 I noticed this year more peer pressure for RNs to get vac. Great way to change behavior #RNchat 11/17/2009 11:41 bhawkesRN: T1 You can however make it highly inconvient NOT to get vac...w/out mandating! #rnchat 11/17/2009 11:41 EllenRichter: T1 Getting my H1N1 vaccine on Thursday~ #RNchat 11/17/2009 11:41 AbbieCitron: T1 could be much liability on both sides when mandating vs. strongly encouraging. #RNChat 11/17/2009 11:42 EllenRichter: T1 What if licensure divisions mandated vaccinations for renewals? #RNchat 11/17/2009 11:42 SafetyNurse: T1 Wonder where the cross-over pt is. What % need to be immunized in order to drive risk into the mathematical hinterlands.... #rnchat 11/17/2009 11:43
  2. 2. rnchat: @andyatFAD Glad you're here. To join the chat, add #RNchat to your answer to a topic. Let me know if you have any questions! 11/17/2009 11:43 StressedFran: T1 - any1 from NY? The state removed its mandate, after protests- it seems like this group would agree with the state's decision? #RNchat 11/17/2009 11:43 bhawkesRN: T1 agree w/ @AbbieCitron. Usually always for that matter! :) #rnchat 11/17/2009 11:43 BonnieRN: #rnchat I am needing a primer on how to follow and post. also, what topics? 11/17/2009 11:43 NursingCenter: gotta run...call from school for sick little one...will read transcript. Have fun everyone! #rnchat 11/17/2009 11:43 SafetyNurse: @EllenRichter T1 Now that's different than "as a condition of employment".... #rnchat 11/17/2009 11:44 EllenRichter: ~All staff who choose not to vac wear big red X RT @bhawkesRN: T1 You can make it highly inconvient NOT to get vac w/out mandating! #RNchat 11/17/2009 11:44 SafetyNurse: @EllenRichter The scarlet V? (That could be interesting......) #rnchat 11/17/2009 11:45 bhawkesRN: Welcome @andyat FAD ! #rnchat 11/17/2009 11:45 AbbieCitron: @BonnieRN RT @tully3000: Hi nurses-try using Tweetchat #rnchat what is the accessory website that auto-inserts hashtags? #RNChat 11/17/2009 11:45 EllenRichter: @SafetyNurse Should it be a condition of employment or a professional requirement? #RNchat 11/17/2009 11:46 andyatFAD: #RNchat Gotcha. Thanks. 11/17/2009 11:46 StressedFran: @EllenRichter some hospitals are requiring masks instead of an X for entire shift staff refuse vaccine--that a good idea you think? #RNchat 11/17/2009 11:46 clearlydriven: just got in.. #RNChat 11/17/2009 11:47 rnchat: If you're new to these, Tweetchat is recommended since you don't have to add #RNchat & you can focus only on the chat - http://tweetchat.com 11/17/2009 11:47 EllenRichter: @StressedFran LOL interesting concept! Is that for real? Masks for all who dont vaccinate? #RNchat 11/17/2009 11:48 EllenRichter: @bhawkesRN LOL, no no I take full credit for the red X comment! Was before the RT! ;) #RNchat 11/17/2009 11:48
  3. 3. EllenRichter: Welcome to all the new people who are joining the chat for the first time! Nice to see more participation! :) #RNchat 11/17/2009 11:49 StressedFran: @EllenRichter I believe so - kind of the hospital's way around "mandating" it - just makes it uncomfortable! i'll find sources #RNchat 11/17/2009 11:49 SafetyNurse: @EllenRichter Condition of employment runs better for me. Condition for licensure more problematic. All nurses? Clinical nurses? #rnchat 11/17/2009 11:49 bhawkesRN: Hi @clearlydriven! #rnchat 11/17/2009 11:49 BonnieRN: BonnieRN here, LNC, Geriatric Care Manager, IT and Everything health care. #rnchat 11/17/2009 11:50 lorryschoenly: #RNchat T1 My clinical site sent memo that they can require masks for those who do not get vac 11/17/2009 11:50 StressedFran: T1 for seasonal flu, get vaccine or wear mask: http://www.lasvegasnow.com/Global/story.asp?S=11482492 #RNchat 11/17/2009 11:51 EllenRichter: @SafetyNurse Oh clinical nurses for sure. Not aware of any higher risk for non-clinical professionals though--is there? #RNchat 11/17/2009 11:51 BonnieRN: knowing about the tweetchat was very helpful, thank you @Philbaumann #rnchat 11/17/2009 11:51 mkopp1: Hi guys! Marie here. ER RN #rnchat 11/17/2009 11:51 SafetyNurse: @lorryschoenly Carrots and sticks... they're cool tools everywhere you go.... #rnchat 11/17/2009 11:51 clearlydriven: Hi @bhawkesRN #RNChat 11/17/2009 11:52 BonnieRN: @philbaumann I did have an issue w/ hack of late & have remedied. U still following me, sir? #rnchat 11/17/2009 11:52 rnchat: Nice conversation! Next topic coming up in 2 minutes #RNchat 11/17/2009 11:52 mkopp1: Our hospital is mandating that if you didn't get the vaccinations you have to wear a mask as well. #rnchat 11/17/2009 11:52 bhawkesRN: T1 Interesting. Hep vaccines have always been optional but staff are not required to always wear gloves if no vac #rnchat 11/17/2009 11:53 BonnieRN: @philbaumann where do we find out on times of chat, etc... ? U have become so popular it is tricky to find out from hastag alone. #rnchat
  4. 4. 11/17/2009 11:53 SafetyNurse: 1/2 My daughter didn't want a flu-shot last year (1st year in college-10 hours from home). I told her, fine. When u r sick,... #rnchat 11/17/2009 11:53 clearlydriven: how do we submit topics? #RNChat 11/17/2009 11:53 EllenRichter: Hopefully in 10 years we wont have 72 vaccines to take every season to protect against everything out there! Could cause sore arms! #RNchat 11/17/2009 11:54 rnchat: T2 Education Requirements: For example,should a BSN be the minimum requirement for RN? Why or why not? #RNchat 11/17/2009 11:55 mkopp1: We keep track of who is vaccinated and who isn't and also they are tracking staff with ILI and that are calling in sick. #rnchat 11/17/2009 11:55 StressedFran: @bhawkesRN T1 good point - @SafetyNurse haha you painted a bit of a picture for her, seemed to help #RNchat 11/17/2009 11:55 EllenRichter: @SafetyNurse LOL great job with your daughter! :) #RNchat 11/17/2009 11:56 InfusionNurse: T2..depends on the type of job..but for leadership roles, yes.. #rnchat 11/17/2009 11:57 EllenRichter: T2 is a very sensitive question that has been the core of heavy discussion for decades! How do we do it in 140 characters? :) #RNchat 11/17/2009 11:57 BonnieRN: 2/2 Most need to work ASAP. Requirements of degree separates the haves from the have nots that cannot invest right away. #rnchat 11/17/2009 11:57 clearlydriven: agree with @InfusionNurse...leadership...yes #RNChat 11/17/2009 11:58 mkopp1: @InfusionNurse, define leadership? Does this include Charge Nurses or more like management? #rnchat 11/17/2009 12:00 SafetyNurse: The UK just changed their entry to practice requirements, think I saw 2012? Anyone else see it? #rnchat 11/17/2009 12:00 RoRod101: Hello Nursing Tweeps! #RNchat 11/17/2009 12:00 clearlydriven: I would say management...those that set the vision for the future... #RNChat 11/17/2009 12:01 EllenRichter: T2 For the profession's growth in healthcare heirarchy, a 4 year college degree really should be the RN minimum #RNchat 11/17/2009 12:01
  5. 5. rnchat: T2 As a follow up: (I know this is sensitive so do ur best): Over ur career have u seen differences in different Educ bakgrounds? #RNchat 11/17/2009 12:01 EllenRichter: @rnchat The T2 topic would be a great international public wave topic #RNchat 11/17/2009 12:02 bhawkesRN: Hi @RoRod! There's a late sign in sheet being passed around :) #rnchat 11/17/2009 12:02 lyall: T2 In Australia there's only 1 edu pathway to be RN: go to Uni & get a Bachelor of Nursing. Hospital training phased out by end 80s #rnchat 11/17/2009 12:02 andyatFAD: A few decades ago, when this topic first came up, there was virtually no difference after the first year. Not sure how it is now. #RNchat 11/17/2009 12:03 lorryschoenly: #RNchat T2 Our Pharmacy and PT colleagues have moved to doctorate as practice entry while nurses continue to debate BSN 11/17/2009 12:03 BonnieRN: 1/2 T2, of course dif. in education but experience rains supreme (safe enough answer, yet true)... #rnchat 11/17/2009 12:03 EllenRichter: T2 As we know, a degree alone doesnt make someone more effective as a healthcare prof, but educated ppl learn abt more options #RNchat 11/17/2009 12:04 clearlydriven: there's a nursing shortage now...if there is a BSN minimum requirement, the supply will be impacted #RNChat 11/17/2009 12:04 EllenRichter: Yes!!! RT @lorryschoenly:T2 Our Pharmacy and PT colleagues moved to doctorate as practice entry while nurses continue to debate BSN #RNchat 11/17/2009 12:04 RoRod101: T2 I am for the advancement of nursing. I have worked side by side with excellent nurses of a variety of educational backgrounds. #RNchat 11/17/2009 12:04 mkopp1: #rnchat experiencing tech difficulties. Was booted out and now can't log back in to tweetchat :( 11/17/2009 12:05 RoRod101: @bhawkesRN Darn! I tried to sneak in. :) #RNchat 11/17/2009 12:05 BonnieRN: 2/2 T2 I am very happy to have BSN but got ADN 1st. Ihave memberships that w/o BSN would not be possible as a Nurse Entrepreneur. #rnchat 11/17/2009 12:05 StressedFran: T2 Well, as a novice to this topic, what do you guys think are the benefits of a BSN? Your "Unique Value Proposition" if you will #RNchat 11/17/2009 12:05 joniwatson: Sorry to miss the #RNchat. Having an OB ultrasound! 11/17/2009 12:05
  6. 6. EllenRichter: @clearlydriven ~So if theres a nursing shortage, we need to entice more ppl, not lower the standards for RN completion #RNchat 11/17/2009 12:05 clearlydriven: Pharmacy and PT has learned to use technicians more effectively than nursing has used its support staff #RNChat 11/17/2009 12:06 BonnieRN: T2 we must remember there will always be a nursing shortage. ADN and LPN always will be needed. #rnchat 11/17/2009 12:06 bhawkesRN: T2 Need fed funding to subsidize BSN entry level. Set a future date, grandfather #rnchat 11/17/2009 12:06 grimalkinrn: Late to the party... just woke up. #rnchat 11/17/2009 12:07 BonnieRN: T2 my favorite line: there is not a nursing shortage (truly) but a shortage of attractive nursing jobs. #rnchat 11/17/2009 12:07 mkopp1: I'm searching for #rnchat live on TweetGrid Search - http://tweetgrid.com/search? q=%23rnchat 11/17/2009 12:07 clearlydriven: I agree - don't - lower standards...there are pleanty of interested people...not enough school openings #RNChat 11/17/2009 12:07 mkopp1: I'm back. #rnchat 11/17/2009 12:07 grimalkinrn: RT @bhawkesRN: T2 Need fed funding to subsidize BSN entry level. Set a future date, grandfather #rnchat 11/17/2009 12:07 BonnieRN: T2 I will always remain a Nurse Enptrepreneur. Without the private sector of demand vs supply... etc... #rnchat 11/17/2009 12:08 EllenRichter: RT @bhawkesRN: Absolutely~lets do it already! T2 Need fed funding to subsidize BSN entry level. Set a future date, grandfather #RNchat 11/17/2009 12:08 RoRod101: T2 This is a hot topic in New Jersey. A bill has been proposed to make it a requirement for nurses to obtain BSN within 10 years. #RNchat 11/17/2009 12:08 mkopp1: I had a BA first then my ADN, so I am viewed as a BSN at work. Currently undecided for my next career step and best school. #rnchat 11/17/2009 12:09 BonnieRN: @philbaumann is there a way to tell how many nurses are involved with the conversation? #rnchat 11/17/2009 12:09 mkopp1: T2 either way it will be a higher level program such as a Masters #rnchat 11/17/2009 12:10
  7. 7. andyatFAD: If there wasn't a market for non-BSN nurses, we wouldn't be having this chat. There IS a market, I'm afraid. #RNchat 11/17/2009 12:10 bhawkesRN: T2 Everyone who chooses not to get vac has to get BSN, hows that? #rnchat 11/17/2009 12:10 rnchat: Next topic coming up in 2 minutes - #RNchat 11/17/2009 12:10 SafetyNurse: The 2 year programs in my community require so much basic science pre-reques that the "2 year" nurse winds up w/ far more. #rnchat 11/17/2009 12:11 BonnieRN: @philbaumann is it protocol to introduce the next topic by you or is this a multi-level conversation? lol #rnchat 11/17/2009 12:11 RoRod101: T2 @mkopp1 Nurses are natural mavens. There are so many different advance degrees in nursing that one can pursue. #RNchat 11/17/2009 12:11 EllenRichter: @andyatFAD ~Hopefully we will change the market needs & more pull will be for BSN and higher #RNchat 11/17/2009 12:12 BonnieRN: @bhawkesRN lol... I had my vaccination. Can I get a bonus or is not being sick enough... #rnchat 11/17/2009 12:12 EllenRichter: ~LMAO!! RT @bhawkesRN: T2 Everyone who chooses not to get vac has to get BSN, hows that? #rnchat #RNchat 11/17/2009 12:13 grimalkinrn: @bhawkesRN But I got the vac and I want a BSN... just can't afford to go back to school right now. #rnchat 11/17/2009 12:13 EllenRichter: @BonnieRN ~We all love you here because you ask many great chat questions that others might just be thinking but not asking! ;) #RNchat 11/17/2009 12:14 grimalkinrn: @SafetyNurse Exactly... I had to take 4 years total of classes for my "two year" degree. However, I could work and go to school. #rnchat 11/17/2009 12:14 BonnieRN: T2 is it yet politcally correct to say American Nurses need focus on filling needs of positions? #rnchat 11/17/2009 12:14 rnchat: T3 Fall prevention: What are best practices? Are dangerous practices still being taught/reinforced? #RNchat 11/17/2009 12:14 mkopp1: RT @RoRod101: T2 There are so many different advance degrees in nursing.~Just can't decide what to be when I grow up! LOL #rnchat 11/17/2009 12:15 bhawkesRN: T2 @grimalkinrn re: can't afford to go back to school- I wish that weren't a barrier for anyone who has the Want-To like you #rnchat
  8. 8. 11/17/2009 12:15 BonnieRN: @EllenRichter U have to wonder, who IS going to be offended and I wish no harm... but I went to a poor comm. college 1st. T2 #rnchat 11/17/2009 12:15 EllenRichter: @grimalkinrn Yes thats sad...we want to get higher nursing education but there are no funds! Was monetary struggle for my MA too :( #RNchat 11/17/2009 12:16 EllenRichter: T3 There is no nurse working in a clinical setting today that doesnt live & breathe fall prevention! #RNchat 11/17/2009 12:16 clearlydriven: T3 AONE discussion board this week talking about removing baby powder from units B/C falls #RNChat 11/17/2009 12:16 grimalkinrn: T3 - Frequent rounding to check 3 P's - pain, positioning, potty. Use of fall risk protocols, bed alarms. Bedside commodes, #rnchat 11/17/2009 12:17 grimalkinrn: RT @EllenRichter: T3 There is no nurse working in a clinical setting today that doesnt live & breathe fall prevention! #RNchat Preach it!! 11/17/2009 12:17 lyall: Ever since getting the CSL PanVax I've been getting uncontrollable urges to wallow in mud. Is this an adverse effect? #rnchat 11/17/2009 12:18 EllenRichter: T3 Just as we all can imagine, there are right & wrong ways to prevent patient injury & I'm sure there are poor practices out there #RNchat 11/17/2009 12:18 clearlydriven: anybody here involved with NDNQI? #RNChat 11/17/2009 12:18 SafetyNurse: T3 Think the relationship (and prevention strategies) r/t medications and falls needs to be explored more. #rnchat 11/17/2009 12:19 mkopp1: RT @grimalkinrn: T3 Frequent rounding to check 3 P's -pain, positioning, potty. Use of fall risk protocols, bed alarms. BSC. ~AMEN! #rnchat 11/17/2009 12:19 EllenRichter: T3 Yes the hourly rounding for the 3P's or 4P's has really shown dramatic improvement in safety AND pt satisfaction with care #RNchat 11/17/2009 12:19 grimalkinrn: I wish call lights would call when they fell on the floor. Often, a call light is the sign that someone is about to fall #rnchat 11/17/2009 12:20 SafetyNurse: T3 Out of curiosity, how many clinical people are seeing the Beers List in use (visible? or integrated in CPOE/eMARs?) #rnchat 11/17/2009 12:20 BonnieRN: @phillbaumann so the chats are 1 hr? PRN? lol #rnchat 11/17/2009 12:20
  9. 9. StressedFran: we talk to ppl all the time about fall prevention here ~case studies who have improved always say hourly rounding is the best method #RNchat 11/17/2009 12:21 bhawkesRN: T3 @SafetyNurse ? not familiar w/Beer list? #rnchat 11/17/2009 12:21 SafetyNurse: @bhawkesRN Think its been updated since this: http://www.dcri.duke.edu/ccge/curtis/beers.html. #rnchat 11/17/2009 12:23 EllenRichter: T3 Our facility has placed hourly rounding sheets into the medical records. Yes, its more charting but it shows we are involved #RNchat 11/17/2009 12:23 RoRod101: RT @mkopp1@grimalkinrn T3 Frequent rounding 2 check 3 Ps -pain, positioning, potty. Use of fall risk protocols, bed alarms BSC. ~ :) #RNchat 11/17/2009 12:24 EllenRichter: @SafetyNurse I never heard of Beers List! Have a good link you can share? Maybe I call it something else out here~ #RNchat 11/17/2009 12:24 BonnieRN: T3 I use the Beers List in care for the Elderly --> http://www.fmda.org/beers.pdf There are many on the internet w/ simple search #rnchat 11/17/2009 12:24 EllenRichter: @SafetyNurse Is it a numerical value given to a person based on the number of safety- altering drugs they take? #RNchat 11/17/2009 12:26 SafetyNurse: @EllenRichter 1/2 I've started following @SusanNeimeierRN on Twitter. She posts lots of e-stuff, describing auto-documentation #rnchat 11/17/2009 12:26 EllenRichter: GREAT chat! Thanks so much @philbaumann & all the nurses (& others) who shared today. I must run & meet my parents for lunch! xox #RNchat 11/17/2009 12:27 EllenRichter: @SafetyNurse That link to susan doesnt go to a Twitter acct! #RNchat 11/17/2009 12:28 BonnieRN: I like this TtweetChat for conversing... how cleaver (it boggles the mind). #rnchat 11/17/2009 12:28 SafetyNurse: @EllenRichter No, what I know i just a list. But u r on the right track in thinking about how to use it to ID risk. #rnchat 11/17/2009 12:28 bhawkesRN: T3 @SafetyNurse tried to follow @SusanNeimeierRN... page does not exist? #rnchat 11/17/2009 12:28 SafetyNurse: @EllenRichter I will look up the correct spelling. My bad. #rnchat 11/17/2009 12:29 rnchat: We're coming up on an hour already! Before we end, share a parting thought with us. #RNchat 11/17/2009 12:29 bhawkesRN: Thanks to @philbaumann for coordinating. You guys, this is such a cool venue and we
  10. 10. are charter members!! #rnchat 11/17/2009 12:30 andyatFAD: Thanks for letting me in today, everyone. It was my first. Thanks @philbaumann. Gotta run. #RNchat 11/17/2009 12:30 RoRod101: Luv chattin' with you all! Nurses are truly awesome! Thank you @philbaumann for setting this up! #RNchat 11/17/2009 12:30 BonnieRN: @andyatFAD I am happy to meet you, welcome! #rnchat 11/17/2009 12:31 SafetyNurse: twitter.com/SusanNiemeierRN #rnchat 11/17/2009 12:31 StressedFran: Thanks everyone! love the insight #RNchat 11/17/2009 12:31 BonnieRN: I plan to go back and follow those who have joined in. I imagine most are on my list already. #rnchat 11/17/2009 12:31 clearlydriven: great youtube link about the changing workforce that effects us all http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kY3AgpmQ6ZU #RNChat 11/17/2009 12:31 rnchat: THANK YOU Everybody! Another great convo! Transcript of today's #RNchat will be posted later. 11/17/2009 12:32 BonnieRN: Yes, thanks @philbaumann :-) Nice to say hi and participate today! #rnchat 11/17/2009 12:32 rnchat: Next #RNchat is Tuesday 11/24 11:30a EST (16:30 UTC). Cheers! 11/17/2009 12:32 clearlydriven: love talking to nurses...love being a nurse...have a great day everyone #RNChat 11/17/2009 12:32 SafetyNurse: Thanks for sharing the 3Ps and the 4Ps! So nice to have had the chance to "chat"! #rnchat 11/17/2009 12:33 lyall: Night (actually morning now) but I still particip... ZZZzzzz ZZZzzz #rnchat 11/17/2009 12:36 StressedFran: Don't be stressed! Nurses, take time 2 talk with your colleagues from all over the place! Follow hashtag #RNchat at Tuesday 11/24 11:30a EST 11/17/2009 12:40 SusanNiemeierRN: Thanks for the call out @SafetyNurse ! #rnchat 11/17/2009 12:41

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