How to Stop Losing Money    Using Your EMR        John Bachman MDSaunders Professor of Primary Care        Mayo Foundation
You are at the office• A partner’s patient who has hypertension comes to see you because in the last ten days she has note...
It collects for appraisal a large and comprehensive body of information    about the patient’s medical historyat no expend...
1949-1980 “An era of            Questionnaires”• Answer questions in form of paper and physician got paper back• Lahey Cli...
Advantages• Patients complete at their own pace• Patients can do things at home• Patients are prompts to remember things• ...
Disadvantages• Patients do not complete forms• Forms are hard to change• Forms do not clarify symptoms     • Prime MD-3 mi...
General• Mayo Clinic-PPI 13 page form 216 questions, 25 spaces• ACOG on line 90 questions• How many are enough?
Review of AFP in just one year•   44 questionnaires (2 an issue)•   4-37 questions•   CAGE-alcoholism•   Check list to Ass...
Patient Computer Dialogue             • Mayo Proceedings              in January 2003             • Solves input          ...
Recognizing Depression 7                 26,671 Patient visits 6 5 4% 3 2 1 0   1984 1985 1986 1987 1988 1989 1990 1991 19...
8       Time of a Routine Office Visit                                                  S                                 ...
8                                                     S    Future Time of a Routine Office Visit                          ...
Complete Physical Exam             35                                                            S        35              ...
Going to the Web 2005-2012• Primetime “Instant Medical History” went to the web beside computers• Published study of over ...
How many of you have a computer  do a history before seeing the             patient?
2 Competitors
Doctors Good At• Get them the information they can put it together
Companies• Primetime Practice “Instant Medical History”  • Engine for almost all EMRs  • Competitors just do not last• EMR...
How does it work?
OUTPUT IS GIVEN TO YOU           • Given to you on            paper           • Given to you in            electronic form...
ADVANTAGES     Collects more      data then a      clinician and      organizes it      into a readable      form
Patient is better organized   Patients can do this
Patient collects information that the clinician misses                   • 40% of time                     provided useful...
How dangerous is health care?                                   Note: both dimensions are logarithmic scales              ...
Socially Sensitive
Highly Adaptable    SARS
Others• Patient controls interview-length of time• Doctor only deals with positives• Research• Multimedia• High patient ac...
Scales•   Zung Depression•   Rahe Stress Scale•   Urology Scales•   Wast•   Conners•   Anxiety•   Pain impairment•   Patie...
Tough Diagnosis
Jane DoeChief Complaint Sore throat         VS stableSore throat 3 days duration
Lets look at history             80/20 Rule20% of your questions get you 80% of             the content    Negatives are t...
Mining-Topsoil sand it is easy   Open ended questions     Listening 2 minutes
What are the results ofAll this labor
It is like MiningYes/No questioning-tailings
You can use a machine toDo the hard time consumingWork
You are in controlYou will trust the work doneCheck out a few things
Benefits of Patient-Delivered Medical                 History Data•   See more patients each day•   Reduce dictation and d...
Several Studies• Acceptance has been documented in ethnic18 diverse groups, rural practices19, in prenatal visits20, patie...
E mail consultationI had surgery on June 11th, things went pretty well as far as the surgery went. I did feel pretty awful...
Omissions• What Pharmacy?• What do you want from me?• What meds are you on• Are you allergic to anything?
Primary Care Online
Vendor• AAFP Approved• Other users: Mysis and Planned Parenthood• Online Visits• Structured Histories
Missing Features• Spanish• Place for free text• Place for meds and allergies• Place for vitals• Credit Card
Exchange DataYou do not need to be seenIn Reality Why it Could Work     EVIDENCE BASED       PROTOCOLS
Results of  patient symptomassessment
c
Which would you want?• Call                    • Go Online• Nursing time for        • Clinician uses set protocol         ...
Save Time - Go Online           PCOL
Our First Online Consultation
Patient was also scheduled for a mammogram
Billing• Accountants high margin 35 dollars• (Credit Cards) We went through billing• Went very smoothly
Totals 2 years     Largest Study Reported• Total Registrations- 4282   • 7% primary family member   • Linked to 12%• Onlin...
What was the most common  online complaint ???
293 different conditions were found
Who did the consultation???
What else did we learn?  71% were women  Youngest 4 days, oldest 86
8-12
Prevent Visits to Office• 40% of the time saved a visit• 12.8% Come in• 16% Protocols• 11% of the time handled by “on call”
Pictures• 49 pictures were sent in• 2% of our practice   • Diaper rash   • Bites   • Contact dermatitis• Prescription refi...
What are the steps• Vendor• How will you get input?   • In lobby? In office room?   • From the web   • With EMR   • Portal...
It collects for appraisal a large and comprehensive body of information    about the patient’s medical historyat no expend...
How to Stop Losing Money Using Your EMR
How to Stop Losing Money Using Your EMR
How to Stop Losing Money Using Your EMR
How to Stop Losing Money Using Your EMR
How to Stop Losing Money Using Your EMR
How to Stop Losing Money Using Your EMR
How to Stop Losing Money Using Your EMR
How to Stop Losing Money Using Your EMR
How to Stop Losing Money Using Your EMR
How to Stop Losing Money Using Your EMR
How to Stop Losing Money Using Your EMR
How to Stop Losing Money Using Your EMR
How to Stop Losing Money Using Your EMR
How to Stop Losing Money Using Your EMR
How to Stop Losing Money Using Your EMR
How to Stop Losing Money Using Your EMR
How to Stop Losing Money Using Your EMR
How to Stop Losing Money Using Your EMR
How to Stop Losing Money Using Your EMR
How to Stop Losing Money Using Your EMR
How to Stop Losing Money Using Your EMR
How to Stop Losing Money Using Your EMR
How to Stop Losing Money Using Your EMR
How to Stop Losing Money Using Your EMR
How to Stop Losing Money Using Your EMR
How to Stop Losing Money Using Your EMR
How to Stop Losing Money Using Your EMR
How to Stop Losing Money Using Your EMR
How to Stop Losing Money Using Your EMR
How to Stop Losing Money Using Your EMR
How to Stop Losing Money Using Your EMR
How to Stop Losing Money Using Your EMR
How to Stop Losing Money Using Your EMR
How to Stop Losing Money Using Your EMR
How to Stop Losing Money Using Your EMR
How to Stop Losing Money Using Your EMR
How to Stop Losing Money Using Your EMR
How to Stop Losing Money Using Your EMR
How to Stop Losing Money Using Your EMR
How to Stop Losing Money Using Your EMR
How to Stop Losing Money Using Your EMR
How to Stop Losing Money Using Your EMR
How to Stop Losing Money Using Your EMR
How to Stop Losing Money Using Your EMR
How to Stop Losing Money Using Your EMR
How to Stop Losing Money Using Your EMR
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How to Stop Losing Money Using Your EMR

  1. 1. How to Stop Losing Money Using Your EMR John Bachman MDSaunders Professor of Primary Care Mayo Foundation
  2. 2. You are at the office• A partner’s patient who has hypertension comes to see you because in the last ten days she has noted that her blood pressure is elevated from its baseline.• Meds Lisinopril 20 mg daily• BP 152/93
  3. 3. It collects for appraisal a large and comprehensive body of information about the patient’s medical historyat no expenditure of the physician’s time;it facilitates interview by making available to the physician a preliminary survey of the patient’s total medical problems; its data being systematically arranged, are easier to review than those of conventional medical histories, and, by calling attention to the patient’s symptoms and significant items of past history, it assures that their investigation will not be overlooked because the physician lacked time to elicit them
  4. 4. 1949-1980 “An era of Questionnaires”• Answer questions in form of paper and physician got paper back• Lahey Clinic Duke Medical Center Kaiser• Clinicians would write on output
  5. 5. Advantages• Patients complete at their own pace• Patients can do things at home• Patients are prompts to remember things• The forms are inexpensive• More data is retrieved• Provides an outline
  6. 6. Disadvantages• Patients do not complete forms• Forms are hard to change• Forms do not clarify symptoms • Prime MD-3 minutes too long • Mayo 1971 study• Forms not personalized• Too many forms that you need
  7. 7. General• Mayo Clinic-PPI 13 page form 216 questions, 25 spaces• ACOG on line 90 questions• How many are enough?
  8. 8. Review of AFP in just one year• 44 questionnaires (2 an issue)• 4-37 questions• CAGE-alcoholism• Check list to Assessment areas for Maintaining Healthy Geriatric Patients• Depression scales• Smoking Scales• Lead
  9. 9. Patient Computer Dialogue • Mayo Proceedings in January 2003 • Solves input problem into computers • Powerful Tool for Quality • Pilot: You want passengers to use electronic tickets
  10. 10. Recognizing Depression 7 26,671 Patient visits 6 5 4% 3 2 1 0 1984 1985 1986 1987 1988 1989 1990 1991 1992 1993 1994 1995Implementation of Screening
  11. 11. 8 Time of a Routine Office Visit S O7 A6 8 P E543 Plan21 Subj. 2 Obj. 2 Pat Ed0 0.1 Traditional
  12. 12. 8 S Future Time of a Routine Office Visit O7 A6 P E54 Subj. Plan3 Obj. Pt. Ed2 31 3 2 0.1 20 Software
  13. 13. Complete Physical Exam 35 S 35 O 30 A P 25 E 20 17 Subjnutes 15 15 Extra Time 10 7 8 7 Plan Obj 5 Subj 5 Plan Obj 0.1 0.1 0 OLD NEW
  14. 14. Going to the Web 2005-2012• Primetime “Instant Medical History” went to the web beside computers• Published study of over 2500 online visits at Mayo in 2010 at Mayo Proceedings• Integration of patient to the EMR (Sage)
  15. 15. How many of you have a computer do a history before seeing the patient?
  16. 16. 2 Competitors
  17. 17. Doctors Good At• Get them the information they can put it together
  18. 18. Companies• Primetime Practice “Instant Medical History” • Engine for almost all EMRs • Competitors just do not last• EMRs • Incentives are to sell product • Not necessarily add ons
  19. 19. How does it work?
  20. 20. OUTPUT IS GIVEN TO YOU • Given to you on paper • Given to you in electronic form like into Word • Directly into an EMR
  21. 21. ADVANTAGES Collects more data then a clinician and organizes it into a readable form
  22. 22. Patient is better organized Patients can do this
  23. 23. Patient collects information that the clinician misses • 40% of time provided useful information not typically elicited • Essential Questions missed • Pilot’s Checklist
  24. 24. How dangerous is health care? Note: both dimensions are logarithmic scales DANGEROUS REGULATED ULTRA-SAFE (>1/1000) (<1/100K) Health Care Driving 10,000Deaths per year 1,000 Scheduled 100 Chartered Airlines Flights Mountain European Climbing Railroads 10 Bungee Manufacturing Nuclear Jumping Power 10 10,000 100,000 1,000,000 10,000,000 Number of encounters per death
  25. 25. Socially Sensitive
  26. 26. Highly Adaptable SARS
  27. 27. Others• Patient controls interview-length of time• Doctor only deals with positives• Research• Multimedia• High patient acceptance• Scales
  28. 28. Scales• Zung Depression• Rahe Stress Scale• Urology Scales• Wast• Conners• Anxiety• Pain impairment• Patient Education Needs
  29. 29. Tough Diagnosis
  30. 30. Jane DoeChief Complaint Sore throat VS stableSore throat 3 days duration
  31. 31. Lets look at history 80/20 Rule20% of your questions get you 80% of the content Negatives are time intensive
  32. 32. Mining-Topsoil sand it is easy Open ended questions Listening 2 minutes
  33. 33. What are the results ofAll this labor
  34. 34. It is like MiningYes/No questioning-tailings
  35. 35. You can use a machine toDo the hard time consumingWork
  36. 36. You are in controlYou will trust the work doneCheck out a few things
  37. 37. Benefits of Patient-Delivered Medical History Data• See more patients each day• Reduce dictation and data entry time• Cut transcription costs in half• Populate EHR data fields automatically• Support appropriate billing levels• Enhance patient communication and satisfaction• If over Web, option to enable triage: assess urgency, lab/X-ray in advance of encounter, schedule for appropriate amount of time, recommend self-care, etc.• Patients are most incented and cheapest resource
  38. 38. Several Studies• Acceptance has been documented in ethnic18 diverse groups, rural practices19, in prenatal visits20, patients seeking a urologist help21, adolescents22, sports examinations23, and well child visits24. Reliability has been assessed between personal interviews for gynecologic patients25, preoperative patients26, and general practice27-29.
  39. 39. E mail consultationI had surgery on June 11th, things went pretty well as far as the surgery went. I did feel pretty awfull for the first 2 weeks and the day I left the hospital my incision broke open---I had to pack it for 3 weeks then it was restitched and healed well.I have to admit, the first couple of weeks I was really beginning to wonder if I had done the right thing but my mind is slowly changing. It is interesting to feel myself slowly turn my priorities away from eating. It is consistently amazing to realize how much focus there is on food, in society and in my life specifically. Jim and I always have a ton of company, from friends to family and you know, company centers around food!!It is an amazing feeling to be full so quickly---I am still not used to that feeling. I do have my fears about not getting enough protein in, I seem to be having a problem eating meats but I am not to regular foods yet and I am still trying to tell myself to slow down, that is such a hard habit to break! I cant really eat sweets, so far anything too sweet just makes me sick. The adjustment of not drinking while eating is difficult too, but getting easier. The milk drinking is getting easier too.I am so grateful for the year prior to the surgery---I know it was a long time and it was making me spitting mad at the time but................the group sessions were such and asset to me ---I learned so much, I developed actual habits and restrictions in that year. I had pretty much given up sweets and over eating and I think that has been a springboard for me with my diet now. I went to group every week with few exceptions. I learned so much about myself, others, and eating disorders. I gained an insight that so diet could have ever brought to light. I learned to quit beating myself up, to recognize weaknesses and avoid them. I learned and practiced the importance of activity. The importance of "self-talk" was emphasized and I used it as a tool every day---especially on the bad days. I learned that it was never too late and that being over weight was not a sentence, that it was overcomable but that the road to overcoming was a difficult one and that I needed help in changing from the well trodden path to a new one. I am now acutely aware of emotional eating, but I have no choice in the matter, I simply can not indulge---it is so wonderful. I ended up losing 50 pounds in year that I went to group and I am very glad for that little boost. I had a fantastic group leader, I really lucked out! Not for sure how much more I have lost but I know the total is well over 100 pounds. and yes..............I feel so much better. I can walk up the back of St. Marys Hill without even getting out of breath. I am still riding bike and of course riding horse. In fact, Jim and I are going to Wyoming in September for our 20th anniversary---we are taking our horses out to the Big Horns riding for a week---I am so excited--this has been a lifelong dream for me and now my horse has 100+ less pounds to lug. Let me tell you, riding is so much more of a joy for me, it is like starting all over.Karie is doing well, still in PA with Jason, they were home for 2 weeks this month and we really like him, he is very sweet and seems totally devoted to Karie---while I dont care for his tatoos,(its a mom thing)he really is great. He had a great time in Minnesota---so maybe the might move back here.Justin graduated and Jim and I are really empty nesting it---Justin is working in the cities and staying with my niece--he plans to attend RCTC winter quarter.I am still going to school, I completed my Associates Degree last spring and I only have 22 credits left for my Bachelors.I do so hope all is well with you, I think of you and your family often.I want to thank you again Michelle for all of your years of care and concern, but most of all for directing me to this surgery and the journey that brought me to it.
  40. 40. Omissions• What Pharmacy?• What do you want from me?• What meds are you on• Are you allergic to anything?
  41. 41. Primary Care Online
  42. 42. Vendor• AAFP Approved• Other users: Mysis and Planned Parenthood• Online Visits• Structured Histories
  43. 43. Missing Features• Spanish• Place for free text• Place for meds and allergies• Place for vitals• Credit Card
  44. 44. Exchange DataYou do not need to be seenIn Reality Why it Could Work EVIDENCE BASED PROTOCOLS
  45. 45. Results of patient symptomassessment
  46. 46. c
  47. 47. Which would you want?• Call • Go Online• Nursing time for • Clinician uses set protocol protocol• Clinician time to say • Clinician checks ok prevention• Appointment desk • Instructions that are written• Nurse faxes prescription • Prescription faxed automatically• Verbal instructions • Time in minutes• Time in hours • MMSI $35 charge - margin• Clinic loses money better then an exam
  48. 48. Save Time - Go Online PCOL
  49. 49. Our First Online Consultation
  50. 50. Patient was also scheduled for a mammogram
  51. 51. Billing• Accountants high margin 35 dollars• (Credit Cards) We went through billing• Went very smoothly
  52. 52. Totals 2 years Largest Study Reported• Total Registrations- 4282 • 7% primary family member • Linked to 12%• Online Consultations- 2531• Total Consults Billed- 1159
  53. 53. What was the most common online complaint ???
  54. 54. 293 different conditions were found
  55. 55. Who did the consultation???
  56. 56. What else did we learn? 71% were women Youngest 4 days, oldest 86
  57. 57. 8-12
  58. 58. Prevent Visits to Office• 40% of the time saved a visit• 12.8% Come in• 16% Protocols• 11% of the time handled by “on call”
  59. 59. Pictures• 49 pictures were sent in• 2% of our practice • Diaper rash • Bites • Contact dermatitis• Prescription refills
  60. 60. What are the steps• Vendor• How will you get input? • In lobby? In office room? • From the web • With EMR • Portal??• How to get into your system?
  61. 61. It collects for appraisal a large and comprehensive body of information about the patient’s medical historyat no expenditure of the physician’s time;it facilitates interview by making available to the physician a preliminary survey of the patient’s total medical problems; its data being systematically arranged, are easier to review than those of conventional medical histories, and, by calling attention to the patient’s symptoms and significant items of past history, it assures that their investigation will not be overlooked because the physician lacked time to elicit them
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