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IN THE UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT
SOUTHERN DISTRICT OF FLORIDA
WEST PALM BEACH DIVISION
HOWARD K. STERN,
CIVIL ACTION FILE
vs. NO. 07-60534
VIDEOTAPED DEPOSITION OF
August 16, 2007
2300 Lyric Centre Building
Lee Ann Barnes, CCR, RPR
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1 APPEARANCES OF COUNSEL
3 On behalf of the Plaintiff:
4 LIN L. WOOD, ESQUIRE
5 LUKE LANTTA, ESQUIRE
6 Powell Goldstein, LLP
7 One Atlantic Center
8 Fourteenth Floor
9 1201 West Peachtree Street, NW
10 Atlanta, Georgia 30309-3488
12 404-572-6999 (facsimile)
15 M. KRISTA BARTH, ATTORNEY AT LAW
16 Law Offices of Eric M. Sauerberg, P.A.
17 200 Village Square Crossing
18 Suite 102
19 Palm Beach Gardens, Florida 33410
21 561-776-0302 (facsimile)
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1 APPEARANCES (Continued)
3 On behalf of the Defendant:
4 ROBERT M. KLEIN, ESQUIRE
5 Stephens Lynn Klein LaCava
6 Hoffman & Puya, P.A.
7 Two Datran Center - Ph II
8 9130 South Dadeland Boulevard
9 Miami, Florida 33156
11 305-670-8592 (facsimile)
14 NEIL C. McCABE, ESQUIRE
15 The O'Quinn Law Firm
16 2300 Lyric Centre Building
17 440 Louisiana
18 Houston, Texas
20 713-222-6903 (facsimile)
23 Also Present: Keith Neal, Videographer
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1 Videotaped Deposition of John O'Quinn
2 August 16, 2007
4 VIDEOGRAPHER: The time is
5 approximately 9:10. We're on the video
6 record. Today's date is August 16, 2007.
7 This deposition is taking place in the
8 offices of The O'Quinn Law Firm, 440
9 Louisiana, Houston, Texas 77002. Today's
10 deponent will be John O'Quinn.
11 Would counsel please identify
12 themselves for the video record, starting
13 with Mr. Wood.
14 MR. WOOD: Lin Wood representing the
15 plaintiff, Howard K. Stern.
16 MR. LANTTA: Luke Lantta
17 representing the plaintiff, Howard K.
19 MS. BARTH: M. Krista Barth,
20 representing the plaintiff, Howard K.
22 MR. KLEIN: Rob Klein, Stephens,
23 Lynn, Klein, et al., Miami, Florida
24 representing the defendant, John O'Quinn.
25 SKWRAO: Neil McCabe from The
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1 O'Quinn Law Firm representing
2 Mr. O'Quinn.
3 VIDEOGRAPHER: Thank you very much.
4 The court reporter will now swear in the
6 (Whereupon, the witness was sworn.)
7 (Plaintiff's Exhibit-1 was marked
8 for identification.)
9 MR. WOOD: This will be the
10 deposition of John O'Quinn, defendant and
11 opposite party. The deposition is taken
12 pursuant to agreement and notice as
13 amended which I am attaching for the
14 record as Exhibit No. 1.
15 The deposition is taken for all
16 permissible purposes under the Federal
17 Rules of Civil Procedure. All
18 formalities surrounding the taking of the
19 deposition will be waived. All
20 objections except as to the form of the
21 question or the responsiveness of the
22 answer will be reserved until the time of
23 trial, hearing, or the formal use of the
25 Are those stipulations agreeable for
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1 counsel for the defendant?
2 MR. KLEIN: They are.
3 MR. WOOD: And we would like for
4 Mr. O'Quinn to read and sign and would
5 agree that that can be undertaken before
6 any notary public subject to the
7 reporter's transmittal procedures.
8 MR. KLEIN: That's fine.
9 MR. WOOD: Good to go?
10 MR. KLEIN: Good to go.
11 JOHN O'QUINN, having been first duly
12 sworn, was examined and testified as follows:
16 Q. Would you state your full name for
17 the record, please.
18 A. John O'Quinn.
19 Q. And what is your present residence
20 address, Mr. O'Quinn?
21 A. 19 Shadder Way, Houston, Texas.
22 Q. How long have you resided at that
24 A. Approximately six years.
25 Q. And you practiced law here in
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2 A. True.
3 Q. The O'Quinn Law Firm, is that the
4 name of the firm?
5 A. Correct.
6 Q. How long have you practiced law The
7 O'Quinn Law Firm?
8 A. Or some version of that name?
9 Q. I want to try to get that -- that
10 name first.
11 A. That's about two years.
12 Q. And how is that set up? Is it a
13 partnership, is it a limited liability
14 partnership, or you tell me.
15 A. It's limited liability partnership
16 or company. I can't recall the details.
17 Q. Are you a partner in the firm?
18 A. Probably I'm designated as a member
19 of the LLC or a partner of the LLP.
20 Q. Does the firm have a managing member
21 or managing partner?
22 A. No.
23 Q. Are you the person that basically
24 fits that role on a day-in-day-out basis?
25 A. Well, ultimately I -- I have that
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1 role. I try to divide up responsibility for
2 management with other people so that I don't
3 have to -- I like to try lawsuits -- so I
4 don't have to spend my entire day handling
5 management issues.
6 Q. Does the authority, though, at the
7 end of the day, does the buck stop with John
9 A. Correct.
10 Q. And what was the name of the firm
11 prior to the change two years ago?
12 A. O'Quinn, Laminack & Pirtle.
13 Q. And they -- they're down on 12 now,
14 I guess?
15 A. That's correct.
16 Q. Okay. How many lawyers do you have
17 in your firm at the present time, Mr. O'Quinn?
18 A. Approximately 25.
19 Q. How did you come to be engaged to
20 represent Vergie Arthur?
21 A. She hired me.
22 Q. Can you tell me the circumstances
23 around that in terms of how she contacted you,
24 where you were?
25 A. Vergie is a Texan. Her son is in
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1 the FBI. I knew -- I knew neither of them
2 before the matter in question. Somebody in
3 the FBI gave my name to the son as being a
4 very good lawyer and he made arrangements
5 whereby she could come see me.
6 Q. What was the son's name?
7 A. You know, I don't have that by my
8 mental fingertips right now.
9 Q. Was he a Texan too?
10 A. Oh, yeah.
11 Q. And what was the scope of your
12 engagement for or with Vergie Arthur?
13 A. To help Vergie get the right to bury
14 her own daughter.
15 Q. Anything else?
16 A. To help her have the right to raise
17 her granddaughter.
18 Q. Other than to help her have the
19 right to bury her daughter and to help her
20 have the right to raise her granddaughter, did
21 the scope of your engagement with Ms. Arthur
22 include anything else?
23 A. No, sir.
24 Q. You were not engaged by her to
25 facilitate or arrange or negotiate any type of
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1 media contacts, book deals, things of that
3 A. No, sir.
4 Q. And did you undertake to do so at
5 any time?
6 A. No, sir.
7 Q. What did you understand, in your
8 mind's eye, when she hired you you were going
9 to have to do?
10 A. I wasn't quite sure.
11 Q. Do you know whether the petition had
12 been filed at that time down in Broward County
13 with respect to the issue of custody of Anna
14 Nicole Smith's body in order to bury her?
15 A. Yes. My understanding was the
16 petition was already filed by other lawyers.
17 Q. And did you expect, then, when you
18 undertook to represent Ms. Arthur, that you
19 would be advocating for her and litigating for
20 her in the state of Florida?
21 A. I didn't know. She already had a
22 Florida lawyer.
23 Q. When did you find out?
24 A. Which subject? That she had a
25 Florida lawyer?
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1 Q. No. When did you find out you were
2 going to be litigating for or advocating for
3 her in the state of Florida?
4 A. After talking to her and the Florida
5 lawyer, they asked that I come over there and
6 assist them to the extent I could.
7 MR. KLEIN: John, let me just
8 caution you. You have to be a little bit
9 careful about your communications with
10 Vergie --
11 MR. WOOD: Oh, yeah.
12 MR. KLEIN: -- because we cannot
13 waive privilege. That's her decision.
14 THE WITNESS: I'll be more careful.
15 Thank you.
16 Q. (By Mr. Wood) Who was the Florida
18 A. Steve somebody.
19 MR. KLEIN: Tunstall.
20 THE WITNESS: Huh?
21 MR. KLEIN: Tunstall.
22 THE WITNESS: Tunstall. I always
23 have trouble remembering how to say his
24 last name. Tunstall.
25 Q. (By Mr. Wood) I struggled with it
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1 for a while myself. Don't feel bad.
2 A. Thank you.
3 Q. Where did you first go -- did you
4 have a meeting -- you said you went over to
5 meet with Mr. Tunstall?
6 A. Yes. I went to Florida.
7 Q. All right. Where in Florida?
8 A. Fort Lauderdale.
9 Q. Did you have a written contract or a
10 written engagement letter with Vergie Arthur?
11 A. I don't know.
12 Q. Would it be your normal practice to
13 have a written engagement contract or letter?
14 A. At that point, it wouldn't be a
15 usual practice.
16 Q. I'm sorry. It would be what?
17 A. At that point it would not be a
18 usual practice because I was not being hired
19 to file a lawsuit. I was -- I was being asked
20 to help her, if I could. You know, if an FBI
21 agent asked you to do him a favor, I don't
22 know about your part of the country, but you
23 try do them a favor.
24 Q. Well, I represented Richard Jewel.
25 We're a little bit leery of FBI agents. I'm
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1 not sure it applies to us in Georgia, at least
2 not to me and my client.
3 MR. KLEIN: That's a little
4 different perspective.
5 MR. WOOD: That's a little different
6 perspective, to say the least.
7 THE WITNESS: So I didn't come in
8 this thing to make money. I tried to
9 help this agent and his mother. In a
10 matter, it was very personal and there
11 wasn't going to be any money made off of
12 who got that body, not by me.
13 Q. (By Mr. Wood) So I take it what
14 you're telling me is that you handled this
15 matter for Vergie Arthur on what you would
16 call a pro bono basis?
17 A. Yes.
18 Q. And have not received any type of
19 fee from her or anyone on her behalf?
20 A. Correct.
21 Q. And have no expectation of doing so
22 in the future?
23 A. Correct.
24 Q. So when you went to Florida and
25 stayed there for a number of days, going there
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1 you knew you were going to be on your dime,
2 not hers; right?
3 A. Yes, sir.
4 Q. So whatever money you spent down in
5 Florida from an expense standpoint to stay
6 there during the hearing and -- did you go
7 back for the appellate argument?
8 A. I did.
9 Q. So to go down for the hearing which
10 lasted several days?
11 A. Correct.
12 Q. And then for the appellate argument,
13 you knew before you left Texas and went to
14 Florida that you were going to be on your
15 dime, spending your personal funds, while you
16 were there trying to advocate or litigate or,
17 as you say, help her out?
18 A. Correct.
19 Q. Do you have any idea how much you
20 incurred in terms of your expenses in the
21 state of Florida?
22 A. Hundreds of thousands.
23 Q. For the time period that you were
24 there for the hearing and the appellate
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1 A. You know, I think I've lumped
2 together the Bahamas and Florida. I don't
3 really know how that divides out.
4 Q. Give me the total amount, your best
5 estimate -- when you say hundreds of
6 thousands, I understand you lump them
7 together, the Bahamas and Florida, give me
8 your best estimate as to the total amount of
9 money that you spent out of your pocket, John
10 O'Quinn's pocket, with respect to those two
11 trips or those two locations?
12 A. Okay. I believe it was about
14 Q. $400,000. And you're not able to,
15 as you sit here today, give us any type of
16 reasonable estimate as to how much of that
17 $400,000 would have been incurred in the state
18 of Florida versus in the Bahamas?
19 A. Total guess. I'd have to go look at
20 a bunch of records to try to figure that out.
21 Q. Give me your best guess, if you
22 don't mind.
23 A. I hate to guess.
24 Q. As long as we know you're guessing,
25 then nobody's going to say that you were being
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2 A. It would be a wild guess. I just
3 hate to do that.
4 Q. Well, how long were you in the
6 A. Off and on over a span of -- of a
7 couple of weeks, I think, and I wasn't there
8 day by day by day. So I think it was over a
9 span of a couple of weeks, a number of trips.
10 There were some court hearings, things of that
12 Q. Well, how would that compare to the
13 amount of time you spent in Florida for
14 Ms. Arthur?
15 A. My guess?
16 Q. Best guess.
17 A. Probably more time in the Bahamas
18 than in Florida.
19 Q. How -- did you make -- how many
20 trips to Florida did you make during the
21 course of the hearing before the Judge
22 Sandlin -- did I get that right?
23 MS. BARTH: Seidlin.
24 MR. KLEIN: Seidlin.
25 Q. (By Mr. Wood) Seidlin. The crying
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1 judge. We all know who we're talking about.
2 A. Seidlin. Yes, sir.
3 Q. How many trips did you make, if more
4 than one, to be present at that hearing before
5 Judge Seidlin?
6 A. I think it was two.
7 Q. You think you came home at the end
8 of the week over the weekend and then went
10 A. I think so.
11 Q. Did you travel commercial?
12 A. No.
13 Q. You have your own private aircraft?
14 A. Yes.
15 Q. And I know you stayed at Pier 66; is
16 that right?
17 A. I can't remember the name of the
18 hotel. It was in Fort Lauderdale.
19 Q. Was it the same hotel on both trips?
20 A. Yes.
21 Q. And then how about when you came
22 back for the appellate argument, did you stay
24 A. Yes, I believe so.
25 Q. Same hotel?
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1 A. No, we were in Coral Gables or West
2 Palm Beach or some other -- that's where the
3 appellate court is.
4 MR. KLEIN: West Palm Beach.
5 THE WITNESS: So West Palm Beach.
6 Q. (By Mr. Wood) Where did you stay
8 A. Again, I don't recall the hotel
10 Q. Do you have -- do you keep your
11 receipts in order to document your expenses so
12 that if you ask someone in your office to go
13 back and pull the expenses for the Florida and
14 Bahama trips, you could do so?
15 A. That's the normal practice, and I
16 would expect those papers to be in the
17 accounting department.
18 Q. And who would be the person -- if I
19 asked you it tell me who I should talk to in
20 the accounting department that could give me
21 the information about your expenses and the
22 details regarding your expenses, who would you
23 tell me to talk to?
24 A. Mrs. Shelly Kinkle.
25 Q. How long has Ms. Kinkle worked with
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2 A. Over 10 years. Between 10 and 15,
3 as I recall.
4 Q. Describe for me, if you would,
5 Mr. O'Quinn, exactly what you did for
6 Ms. Arthur in Florida in your efforts to
7 advocate for her and to lend her legal
8 assistance with respect to the burial of her
9 daughter and some role in seeing or raising
10 her granddaughter?
11 MR. KLEIN: John, just be mindful of
12 your privilege concerns, please.
13 THE WITNESS: Thanks for reminding
14 me of that.
15 Q. (By Mr. Wood) Yeah. And it's not
16 my place to remind you of it, but I'm not
17 looking for you to tell me something that you
18 contend violates attorney-client privilege.
19 I'm looking to find out exactly what
20 you can describe and what you recall as to
21 what you did for her while you were in the
22 state of Florida.
23 MR. KLEIN: John, the only reason we
24 even bring it up is lawyers have a bad
25 habit of lapsing into discussions with
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2 THE WITNESS: You're entirely
3 correct. I'm sitting here having, in
4 fact, a conversation.
5 Q. (By Mr. Wood) That's what I want to
7 A. I'm not stopping to say wait a
8 second. So let me go a little slower to be
9 sure I don't violate my responsibilities under
10 the attorney-client privilege rule.
11 Well, I went to the court
12 proceedings. I participated in the court
13 proceedings with Mr. Tunstall, questioned
14 certain witnesses, made some arguments.
15 Things of that nature.
16 Q. Well, when you say, "things of that
17 nature," I'd like for you to be precise for
18 me. Give me your best description of your
19 activities in Florida for Ms. Arthur.
20 I understand you went to the court
21 proceedings before Judge Seidlin. You say
22 generally you participated in them in terms of
23 questioning witnesses and making some
24 arguments. What else did you do in the state
25 of Florida with respect to your efforts to
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1 assist Ms. Arthur?
2 A. I think that's about it.
3 Q. That's all?
4 A. I think that's about it.
5 Q. Did you ever --
6 A. Wait a second. You know, when the
7 case was appealed, I talked to Mr. Klein and
8 his -- and his partner about handling the
9 appeal and made the financial arrangements for
10 them to do that. That's part of the money.
11 Q. That's part of the $400,000?
12 A. Yeah. And I did that.
13 Q. All right. Let me make sure if I've
14 got it all.
15 In terms of your activities in the
16 state of Florida on behalf of Ms. Arthur, you
17 physically attended the court proceedings
18 before Judge Seidlin --
19 A. Uh-huh (affirmative).
20 Q. -- and participated in those
21 proceedings in court in terms of questioning
22 certain witnesses and making certain arguments
23 to the Court, and you also spoke to Mr. Klein
24 and his partner and made the arrangements for
25 his firm to handle Vergie Arthur's appeal,
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1 including making the payment to his firm from
2 your own personal funds for the fee; is that
4 A. Correct.
5 Q. Anything else, other than what we've
6 just gone over, that you did in Florida for
7 Vergie Arthur in your efforts to represent her
8 and assist her?
9 A. I tried to handle as much as
10 possible responding to the media, rather than
11 her having to do it.
12 Q. Anything else now? I want to make
13 sure we got it all.
14 A. I'm sure there's bound to have been
15 something else, but that's in the main what I
17 Q. Well, what makes you think that
18 there's bound to be something else?
19 A. There's a lot of activities going on
20 and I'm trying to remember back several months
21 and, I mean, I don't know whether you're
22 asking things like, okay, it's time go from
23 the hotel to the -- to the courthouse and I
24 would make arrangements for ground
25 transportation, you know, or whether you're
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1 going that far.
2 Q. I want to be as detailed as you can
3 be, sir.
4 A. Well, that would be true.
5 Q. In terms of making arrangements for
6 ground transportation for you and Ms. Arthur?
7 A. Yeah, right. Make sure she got
8 there. Make sure -- help her as best I could
9 to help her get through this -- really it was
10 crazy. I don't know if you know what I'm
11 trying to say. Once you got within 50 feet of
12 the front door of the courthouse -- she
13 recalls -- it was literally crazy, primarily
14 because of the media. You had to actually
15 fight to get into the front door. I don't
16 mean you had -- I'm not talking about hitting
17 somebody with your fists, but you had to
18 really struggle to get through this mass of
19 reporters and other people, primarily
20 reporters, just to get in the front door of
21 the courthouse. They were blocking your way.
22 You could be nice to them, whatever
23 you want to do. I want a comment, I want a
24 comment, I want this, I want that. You can
25 say, you know, "I gotta be in court, please
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 24 of 207
1 let me go, let me get through this crowd."
2 Sometimes she and I would lock arms, and I'd
3 just say, "Follow me," and I would somehow
4 make a path for us or whoever was with me
5 helping me, like Mr. Tunstall. And then
6 Mr. Tunstall and I would join arms. Vergie
7 would maybe hold on to our belts, or whatever,
8 just to get into the courthouse and then try
9 to find some court personnel like a deputy
10 sheriff-type person, who were very nice about
11 everything, I want to say that about the
12 staff. They were very nice and they knew the
13 situation. And we'd say, "How can we get from
14 the front door, sir, or ma'am, can you help us
15 to the judge's courtroom?"
16 And that was a struggle. Even
17 though we were now being guided and led by
18 members of law enforcement and -- but they'd
19 get us there. You know, they'd get us on an
20 elevator and get us there and once you got off
21 on the floor where the court was, there would
22 be another mass of people, reporters, wanting
23 us to not go in the courtroom but instead stay
24 out in the hall and talk to them. So it was a
25 struggle even to get into the courtroom.
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1 Now, I didn't go over there to do
2 that, but it turned out that I needed to do
3 that once I assessed the situation, and I did.
4 If that's a service, then that's a service.
5 Q. Well, when you say you "didn't go
6 over there to do that" --
7 A. I didn't know I was going to have
8 trouble getting --
9 Q. Let me finish. That's what I want
10 to find out.
11 Are you telling me the service that
12 you didn't go over there to do but that you
13 did was to help her get through the mass of
14 the media to get into the courtroom --
15 A. Right.
16 Q. -- or are you telling me that it was
17 dealing with the media in general for her?
18 A. Well, also in general, too, but I
19 was talking about just trying to get in the
20 courtroom at this point.
21 Q. Well, when did you -- did you take
22 on the role of basically shielding Vergie
23 Arthur from the media's efforts to contact her
24 and interview her?
25 A. Yes.
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1 Q. Did you tell her that you would do
2 that, you would perform that service for her?
3 A. Yes.
4 Q. And so did you then give the media
5 your contact information while you were in
6 Florida so that the media knew they could call
7 you instead of trying to make efforts to call
8 Vergie Arthur?
9 A. No.
10 Q. How did they get your contact
12 A. Well, I just said -- without going
13 into any privilege matters, if the media
14 called Vergie, I trusted she would tell them,
15 "Call Mr. O'Quinn."
16 Q. Well, was that your experience, that
17 she, in effect, followed those instructions
18 and that she --
19 A. Well, I don't want to go into any --
20 Q. Let me finish my question,
21 Mr. O'Quinn. You know I've got to answer --
22 get my question out before you answer.
23 Was that your experience that, in
24 fact, Ms. Arthur, while she was in Florida,
25 did refer media contacts or inquiries directed
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1 to her to you, her attorney?
2 A. Yes.
3 Q. And about how many inquiries did you
4 have to field or deal with over the course of
5 the time you were there?
6 A. Numerous.
7 Q. More than a hundred?
8 A. There were numerous.
9 Q. And you were there the first week --
10 the hearing started on February 13, I believe.
11 Does that sound right?
12 A. I can't recall the date, but it was
14 Q. It went three days the first week
15 and then y'all recessed for a weekend, which I
16 think was President's Day on Monday, and then
17 came back for three more days the second week.
18 Does that sound generally correct to you?
19 A. Generally.
20 Q. Whatever the number of media
21 inquiries were during this time period, while
22 we're talking about your being in Florida
23 dealing with the procedures before Judge
24 Seidlin, do you believe that those contacts or
25 inquiries were made while you were in Florida
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1 as compared to when you were back in Texas
2 between trips on the weekend?
3 A. I believe it's some of each.
4 Q. Again, how would you expect they got
5 your contact information in Texas from -- I
6 mean, the weekend I assume you were at home.
7 If you were at the office, some of us have to
8 come down to the office on the weekends --
9 A. When I'm in trial or in a court
10 proceeding in another place, Saturday I'll
11 have to come back and catch up. I'd be here a
12 lot on the weekend, frankly.
13 Q. Can you give us a breakdown of the
14 percentage of the media contacts that were
15 made to you while you were in Florida versus
16 while you were in Texas?
17 And I'm talking about the time frame
18 of the Seidlin hearings.
19 A. I can't do that.
20 Q. How many interviews did you give
21 while you were in Florida, written or
22 broadcast interviews?
23 A. I believe two.
24 Q. Two broadcast or print interviews?
25 A. I know one was broadcast. The other
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 29 of 207
1 one was -- I don't recall if it was print or
3 Q. The scope of your engagement with
4 Ms. Arthur, to make sure we've closed the door
5 on this, included your participation and
6 attendance at the hearing before Judge
7 Seidlin --
8 A. Right.
9 Q. -- and before the court of appeals
10 for during that argument; true?
11 A. Right, but you understand, I did not
12 make the argument.
13 Q. Oh, no, you paid Mr. Klein or his
14 firm --
15 A. Right.
16 Q. -- but you were there?
17 A. Right.
18 Q. So the scope of your employment or
19 efforts to represent her and help her included
20 helping her with that appeal in Florida?
21 A. Correct.
22 Q. And the proceedings in Florida
23 before Judge Seidlin?
24 A. Correct.
25 Q. And literally, as part of that,
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 30 of 207
1 having to make arrangements to get to and from
2 where you were staying to the courthouse to
3 literally, sometimes physically, have to be
4 involved in trying to get through the media
5 crush to get her into the courtroom?
6 A. Correct.
7 Q. And then you agreed also to respond
8 on her behalf, in effect shield her from media
9 inquiries, to in effect be, to the extent you
10 decided to do an interview, be her
11 spokesperson; is that true?
12 A. Correct.
13 Q. Had you ever been involved, in your
14 practice of -- how many years? How many years
15 have you been practicing law?
16 A. Almost 40.
17 Q. I will never catch you, probably,
18 because you'll probably practice 40 more. I
19 don't think I will. I've got 31 under my
20 belt. Some days it seems like 61.
21 A. Me too.
22 Q. Other days it feels like it's just
24 A. It's like that. Life's like that,
25 isn't it?
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 31 of 207
1 Q. It is, isn't it?
2 A. Yeah.
3 Q. And in your almost 40 years of law
4 practice have you ever been involved in any of
5 your cases, in a -- in a high-profile case
6 that had, what I call and I think would agree
7 with it, a media frenzy to it like you
8 experienced with your respects to help Vergie
10 A. No.
11 Q. And I don't mean to downplay the
12 importance or the profile of your other cases,
13 I think the results speak for themselves, but
14 had you ever had any case that you had handled
15 before this representation that you would even
16 begun to say was close in terms of the media
17 attention and media frenzy that you
18 experienced in the Vergie Arthur case?
19 A. No.
20 Q. Had you done any type of advocacy in
21 the -- I call it -- the court of public
22 opinion, had you done any advocacy for clients
23 in other cases where you would make television
24 appearances to do interviews for them or their
25 case or their cause?
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 32 of 207
1 A. On occasion.
2 Q. Give me -- before the Vergie Arthur
3 representation, give me a ballpark figure of
4 how many interviews you would have given. And
5 I'm not limiting you to television or radio.
6 I include in that print interviews.
7 A. 40 years is a long time. I cannot
8 give you any kind of accurate number.
9 Q. Did you feel like you were
10 experienced, though, in dealing with the
12 A. Slightly.
13 Q. Slightly experienced?
14 A. Somewhat, but I'm --
15 Q. Slightly experienced sounds like
16 greatly inexperienced. Which one is it?
17 A. I would say I didn't have a lot of
18 experience. I had some.
19 Q. Did you do preinterviews where
20 they'd interview you before?
21 A. I don't even know what that means.
22 Q. Where someone would interview you
23 before you actually went on the air to give
24 the interview.
25 A. I don't believe so.
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 33 of 207
1 Q. How many interviews did you do, not
2 just limiting that to Florida, but I want to
3 get an idea of how many interviews you gave,
4 print or broadcast, as part of your efforts to
5 help Vergie Arthur, advocate for her?
6 A. I think I did two.
7 Q. Start to finish?
8 A. Oh, no.
9 Q. I'm looking for the total number
11 A. You're talking about even when
12 things shifted from Florida to the Bahamas?
13 Q. I'm talking about A to Z.
14 A. Yes. You're saying yes?
15 Q. Yes, I am, sorry.
16 A. A dozen.
17 Q. And how many of those were print
18 versus broadcast?
19 A. Guesstimate?
20 Q. Best guesstimate.
21 A. Guesstimate, most were broadcast.
22 Q. Any print?
23 A. Probably -- probably --
24 substantially most were broadcast.
25 Q. Do you recall doing any print
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 34 of 207
1 media -- print interviews?
2 A. Yes.
3 Q. And who do you recall doing those
4 interviews with, the print interviews?
5 A. I just recall that there were a
6 couple that were print. I can't tell you
7 which organization it was.
8 Q. Did you or someone in your office
9 keep any clippings about those interviews?
10 A. I don't believe so.
11 Q. Why not?
12 A. Why?
13 Q. Well, I'm just suggesting that
14 sometimes people do it for their own ego.
15 They like to see their names in print. Other
16 times lawyers want to keep up with it because
17 they want to know what they said so they make
18 sure they say the same thing the next time.
19 There are various reasons to keep them.
20 The question is you say you did not
21 and I take it you didn't make a conscious
22 decision to keep them or not?
23 A. I didn't make a conscious decision
24 to do it.
25 Q. Didn't make a conscious decision to
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 35 of 207
1 keep them or not?
2 A. If my staff kept them, they kept
4 Q. You don't know whether they did or
6 A. No. I don't sit down every day and
7 read my interviews.
8 Q. You think in any given case you've
9 ever done any more interviews than the dozen
10 that you believe you did in the Vergie Arthur
12 A. For a case, no.
13 Q. This would have been the largest
14 case in terms of media interviews?
15 A. Yes.
16 Q. Most television appearances?
17 A. Yes.
18 Q. Before you did your first television
19 interview in connection with representing or
20 helping Vergie Arthur, how long had it been
21 since you had been on television for a client?
22 A. In some other matter?
23 Q. Yes.
24 A. I can't recall.
25 Q. Are you thinking years?
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 36 of 207
1 A. No, I don't believe it had been
3 Q. Months?
4 A. I believe that would be more
5 accurate, yeah.
6 Q. So you believe you probably had done
7 an interview in 2006?
8 A. Probably, yeah.
9 Q. Any idea what case that would have
10 been in connection with?
11 A. I know I tried a breast implant case
12 to a verdict in 2006 and I believe there was
13 an interview about that.
14 Q. Local or national?
15 A. Local.
16 Q. You understood how the national
17 television interviews worked, though, as a
18 general proposition, did you not, sir?
19 A. As a general proposition, perhaps.
20 I'm not a technically smart guy about how
21 broadcast works.
22 Q. Well, I don't mean to suggest that
23 you would know the technical aspects of it,
24 but what I do mean to suggest is that I think
25 you would tell me that you are aware that when
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 37 of 207
1 you do an interview with a national network,
2 that you knew that that interview, in some
3 form or fashion, was going to be broadcast on
4 a national basis; true?
5 A. It may be broadcast.
6 Q. Did you have any reason to believe
7 that it would not be?
8 A. I had no reason to believe any way.
9 I know I've given interviews that turned out
10 not being broadcast.
11 Q. Those weren't your good interviews?
12 A. No. It just whoever the news
13 directer was decided they -- you know, news
14 has limited time, not to go with that
16 Q. Did you give any broadcast -- did
17 you participate in any broadcast interviews in
18 connection with the Anna Nicole Smith case?
19 A. Did I do what about them?
20 Q. Did you participate in any broadcast
21 interviews for television in connection with
22 your representation of Vergie Arthur or the
23 Anna Nicole Smith case that were not, in some
24 fashion, broadcast?
25 A. I believe on one occasion, yes.
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 38 of 207
1 Q. Do you know who you gave that
2 interview to?
3 A. I'm not sure, but I believe -- I'm
4 not sure. I recall something -- you know, a
5 lot of these broadcasts are for like 30
6 minutes. They've got a set amount of time.
7 And then they've got more than one story they
8 want to do and then they -- they run out of
10 I remember I was supposedly being
11 interviewed on one broadcast, and so I get
12 there at the right time, you know, I'm there
13 miked and everything and they start talking
14 about some new breaking story, some child was
15 killed or trapped in a mine or something like
16 that, and they went with that story primarily.
17 And by the time we got to the end of the show
18 they said, "Well, we're real sorry,
19 Mr. O'Quinn" --
20 Q. You got bumped?
21 A. Try us again another time.
22 Q. You got bumped?
23 A. Right.
24 Q. You recall it happening one time?
25 A. I do recall that, yes.
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 39 of 207
1 Q. Now, you gave interviews to Larry
2 King, did you not?
3 A. Yes.
4 Q. You appeared on the Larry King show
5 how many times?
6 A. I would guess three.
7 Q. You knew that was a live interview,
8 Larry King live, it was not taped, was it?
9 A. I believe it was.
10 Q. You believe it was taped?
11 A. No. I believe it was live.
12 Q. On all the appearances on Larry
14 A. I believe so.
15 Q. And did you do any live media
16 interviews on the Greta Van Susteren show, On
17 the Record, Fox News?
18 A. I believe so.
19 Q. How many?
20 A. Now, you're talking about the whole
21 time, even when we're in the Bahamas?
22 Q. Yeah, which you told me you thought
23 consisted of about 12 interviews, print and
24 broadcast total.
25 A. I would say on her show maybe about
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 40 of 207
1 three times.
2 Q. How about Good Morning America?
3 A. One -- none.
4 Q. No interviews?
5 A. Is that the ABC deal?
6 Q. Yes.
7 A. No.
8 Q. The Today Show?
9 A. I don't believe so. Yes.
10 Q. How many on The Today Show?
11 A. One.
12 Q. Who was that with?
13 A. Matt Louder (sic).
14 Q. Where were you when you gave that
16 A. I don't recall.
17 Q. Were you on set in New York?
18 A. No.
19 Q. In Florida?
20 A. No.
21 Q. Was it a phone interview?
22 A. They brought the camera to me.
23 Q. To Texas or Florida?
24 A. One of those places.
25 Q. So it could have been in Florida?
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 41 of 207
1 A. Could have.
2 Q. When you came over to represent
3 Ms. Arthur in the proceedings before Judge
4 Seidlin, am I correct that you understood that
5 the issue that was being litigated in that
6 proceeding was the question of custody of the
7 body of Anna Nicole Smith for purposes of
8 determining where she would be buried?
9 A. Yes.
10 Q. And that was, in fact, the only
11 issue that was decided in that proceeding;
13 A. I believe so.
14 Q. To your knowledge, was there any
15 other jurisdiction of Judge Seidlin or effort
16 to determine any other issue other than the
17 custody of Anna Nicole Smith's body for
18 purposes of determining where it -- she would
19 be buried?
20 A. I believe the other issues were
21 raised or attempted to be raised but I don't
22 think they were decided.
23 Q. I'm sorry. They weren't decided?
24 A. I don't believe they got decided by
25 Judge Seidlin.
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 42 of 207
1 Q. Did you attempt to raise other
3 A. No.
4 Q. Or are you talking about issues
5 raised the by other parties?
6 A. Others.
7 Q. Vergie Arthur didn't raise any other
8 issues. You were there focused on trying to
9 help her have a role in where her daughter
10 would be buried; right?
11 A. Correct.
12 Q. And then ultimately, as it turned
13 out in the Bahamas, your role expanded, did it
14 not, into efforts to help her either obtain
15 custody or visitation with her granddaughter;
16 is that right?
17 A. Correct.
18 Q. That was an issue, in terms of the
19 scope of your engagement, that arose after the
20 Florida proceedings; true?
21 A. I believe that they may have arisen
22 while I was representing Ms. Arthur in Judge
23 Seidlin's proceedings.
24 Q. That you would help her out down in
25 the Bahamas on the custody issues?
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 43 of 207
1 A. Right.
2 Q. But the custody of Dannielynn, the
3 paternity of Dannielynn, was not an issue
4 before Judge Seidlin? It was not a litigated
5 issue that you were down there working on, was
7 A. Well, the paternity was an issue
8 that was sought to be raised.
9 Q. But not by you?
10 A. Not by me.
11 Q. Not by Vergie Arthur?
12 A. Not by Vergie Arthur.
13 Q. Someone else sought to raise it, but
14 ultimately it was not an issue to be decided
15 by Judge Seidlin; right?
16 A. That's my memory.
17 Q. Again, the only issue you went down
18 to advocate for, in terms of representing
19 Ms. Arthur in the Florida proceedings and the
20 attendance at the appellate argument, was the
21 issue limited to the custody of Anna Nicole
22 Smith's body for purposes of determining where
23 she would be buried; true?
24 A. I believe so.
25 Q. It was not your intent, going down
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 44 of 207
1 to Florida, to litigate the issue of the
2 paternity of Dannielynn; right?
3 A. Not in Florida.
4 Q. And it was not your intent, going
5 down to Florida, to litigate the issue of
6 custody of Dannielynn or visitation; right?
7 A. Well, things -- things got changed
8 because this gentlemen Birkhead showed up and
9 he was claiming he was the biological father
10 of Anna Nicole's daughter and he was claiming
11 that for that reason, perhaps he should have
12 the say-so in where Anna Nicole was buried.
13 My position, of course, was that
14 Vergie Arthur should have the say-so. So any
15 competing claim that would adversely affect
16 Vergie Arthur, I felt was -- was in my
17 bailiwick to oppose, to the extent that I
18 could legally oppose it. So once he started
19 making that claim, -- I mean, there were a lot
20 of reasons why I didn't think the claim had
21 any merit, don't get me wrong. But at least
22 somebody was there saying, "I'm the biological
23 father of the person who's dead -- of the
24 child of the person who's dead and I want to
25 have some say-so in where she's buried."
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 45 of 207
1 Q. Any other issues that arose --
2 raised by other parties or issues that you
3 thought you needed to address in the Florida
4 proceedings other than what you've told me?
5 A. I believe one line of argument that
6 Stern was claiming was that since he was
7 taking care of the child and since he had this
8 relationship with Anna Nicole, he should be
9 the one to decide.
10 Q. On where the body should be buried?
11 A. Yeah.
12 Q. Do you think he was taking that
13 position because he was a companion of Anna
14 Nicole Smith's and had a relationship with the
15 daughter or were you aware that he was there,
16 sir, as the nominated executor of the estate
17 of Ms. Smith?
18 MR. KLEIN: Lin, this is -- I've got
19 to inquire. We're in a jurisdictional
20 deposition. I don't know what relevance
21 it has to what Mr. Stern's position was
22 or how it was taken or why.
23 MR. WOOD: Yeah. And I appreciate
24 the question. I believe that I'm
25 entitled to go into this area because I
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 46 of 207
1 think I'm entitled to find out what he
2 went there to do, what he did there, what
3 he may have done beyond that all tied to
4 the issue of his reasonable expectations
5 of being haled into a Florida court and
6 being sued.
7 MR. KLEIN: I understand.
8 MR. WOOD: That's why I'm doing it.
9 MR. KLEIN: And I've allowed some
10 latitude for that reason. I don't think
11 that inquiry as to his mental impressions
12 as to what Stern's position was or was
13 not, that it was valid or not.
14 MR. WOOD: I'm not asking that at
15 all. I don't mean to be asking about
16 whether it's valid. I'm just trying to
17 find out, plain and simple.
18 Q. (By Mr. Wood) Didn't you know, sir,
19 going into this proceeding that the petition
20 had been filed and Mr. Stern's role was as the
21 nominated executor of the estate of Anna
22 Nicole Smith?
23 MR. KLEIN: That I don't have a
24 problem with.
25 THE WITNESS: When I came into the
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 47 of 207
1 proceeding initially, I'm not sure I even
2 read the papers to really know, but by
3 the time I got to Judge Seidlin's
4 court --
5 Q. (By Mr. Wood) You knew?
6 A. -- I knew that was the position
7 of --
8 Q. Mr. Stern?
9 A. -- Stern.
10 Q. Okay.
11 A. At least on paper.
12 Q. At least on paper in terms of his
13 filings; right?
14 A. Yeah.
15 Q. And did you file an application to
16 appear in that proceeding pro hac vice?
17 A. I think Mr. Tunstall did.
18 Q. On your behalf?
19 A. Yes.
20 Q. Did you have any type of fee
21 arrangement with Mr. Tunstall?
22 A. No.
23 Q. Did you pay any of Mr. Tunstall's
25 A. No.
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 48 of 207
1 Q. Did you pay any of Mr. Tunstall's
3 A. In a way, because I -- I did things
4 like paid for the appeal.
5 Q. Well --
6 A. I did --
7 Q. That would be Vergie Arthur's
8 expense, I think.
9 A. Did I reimburse him for money he had
10 spent, no.
11 Q. Did you pay for any of his expenses
12 that he had incurred on behalf of Ms. Arthur
13 other than the fee to Mr. Klein's firm for
14 handling the appeal? Assuming that's -- that
15 was his expense. I don't think it was but,
16 nonetheless, I'm going to clear up whether or
17 not you paid anything else for him or not.
18 A. When I took on the job of getting
19 her from the hotel, transportation, into the
20 court, I guess if I had not been in Florida,
21 Mr. Tunstall would have had to do that.
22 Q. Well, I understand that. I mean,
23 that's -- apparently you paid some sort of a,
24 I guess, a limousine service or some type
25 of --
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 49 of 207
1 A. Right.
2 Q. -- to get you-all picked -- was she
3 staying at the same hotel where you were?
4 A. Right.
5 Q. And you were paying for her hotel
7 A. Right.
8 Q. Did you pay for anybody else's hotel
9 rooms, other than yourself and Vergie Arthur's
10 hotel room in Florida?
11 A. On occasions her husband would be
12 with her. On occasions a relative/friend
13 would be with her and they would stay at the
15 Q. Well, I'm assuming that her husband
16 stayed with her?
17 A. I am too but I did not go --
18 Q. You did go in the room --
19 A. But I did not go in the room to see
20 who was in the bed.
21 Q. Okay. That would be asking for just
22 a little bit too much representation, wouldn't
24 A. That was not my job.
25 Q. I'm assuming you didn't pay for an
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 50 of 207
1 extra hotel room for him. I'm looking for any
2 other hotel rooms you paid for for individuals
3 in Florida other than the room for yourself,
4 the room for Vergie Arthur, which may have on
5 occasion been shared with her husband, and
6 then you mentioned another relative, I
8 A. There was a woman who would be with
9 her -- she needed moral support, emotional
10 support. So if her husband could not be with
11 her, there sometimes was another woman who was
12 with her who was introduced to me as a
13 relative and/or friend.
14 Q. What was her name?
15 A. I don't recall it.
16 Q. And did you pay for that relative or
17 friend's hotel room?
18 A. Yes.
19 Q. Same hotel?
20 A. Yes.
21 Q. Out of the number of nights you were
22 there, Ms. Arthur was there every night you
23 were there; right?
24 A. Yes.
25 Q. And she stayed the weekend? She
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 51 of 207
1 didn't come back to Texas did she?
2 A. I believe so.
3 Q. Did she stay the weekend in Florida?
4 A. I'm not sure. I just said I believe
6 Q. Did she stay on in Florida after you
7 came back following the ruling of Judge
9 A. I believe so but I'm not certain of
11 Q. Did you continue to pay for her
12 hotel room at all times while she was in
13 Florida, Vergie Arthur?
14 A. Yes. So far as I know.
15 Q. So you believe -- your best
16 recollection and belief is is that any
17 expenses incurred by Ms. Arthur in connection
18 with her presence in Florida -- hotel rooms,
19 transportation, meals, incidentals -- you,
20 John O'Quinn, paid for those; true?
21 A. Probably, but I've not reviewed the
22 expense file of what got paid. I'm speaking
23 from the standpoint I think more likely than
24 not that's true, what you're saying. Now, she
25 may have gone down to the store and bought
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 52 of 207
1 some sundries and paid for them out of her own
2 purse. I've not doublechecked her bills. I
3 really haven't.
4 Q. Did you have arrangements -- when
5 you were not there, had you made arrangements
6 in Florida with the Florida transportation
7 company or the limo service, to continue to
8 provide transportation to Ms. Arthur?
9 A. I made no arrangements.
10 Q. Did you have someone on your behalf
11 make those arrangements?
12 A. Somebody made those arrangements.
13 Now, whether they were to continue to be her
14 car and driver even though I was gone on the
15 weekend, even though there was no court
16 proceedings going on on the weekend, even
17 though maybe she had elected to stay in
18 Florida rather than -- rather than go back
19 home to Texas for the weekend, I don't know
20 how those arrangements got made. I really
21 don't, sir.
22 Q. Did you ask anybody in your office
23 to make those arrangements?
24 A. Yes.
25 Q. So someone made those arrangements
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 53 of 207
1 on your -- for you --
2 A. Yes.
3 Q. -- for Ms. Arthur, knowing that
4 we're talking about transportation
5 arrangements in the state of Florida; right?
6 A. If you're talking about while she
7 was being transported --
8 Q. Yes?
9 A. -- in Fort Lauderdale, it would be
10 in Florida. But I did not tell anybody to do
11 what you're describing.
12 Q. Well, how did -- who told them to do
14 A. The -- the staff that works with me,
15 they kind of know what needs to be done. I
16 mean, we've been doing this a long time, and
17 if I'm out of town, I've got to have a way to
18 get from point A to point B.
19 Q. Well, I'm not talking but you now.
20 I'm talking about Ms. Arthur, what you paid
21 for for Ms. Arthur --
22 A. She has to have a way --
23 Q. Hold on one second. I'm trying to
24 make clear, and maybe just a question I want
25 to get to and we can move on to another
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 54 of 207
2 The fact of the matter is that you
3 paid for transportation for Ms. Arthur in
4 Florida at times when you yourself were not
5 physically present in Florida; true?
6 A. I may have.
7 Q. Do you believe that you did?
8 A. I believe I probably did, but I've
9 not verified that. I don't know for sure
10 either way, sir.
11 Q. Who is Don Clark?
12 A. He's an investigator who works for
13 my law firm.
14 Q. Did he spend any time with you in
16 A. I believe so.
17 Q. During the time periods you were
18 there for the proceedings before Judge
20 A. I believe he was there some of the
22 Q. Separate hotel room?
23 A. Sure.
24 Q. Same hotel?
25 A. Probably, yes.
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 55 of 207
1 Q. And paid for by you?
2 A. Probably.
3 Q. Well, probably. Sir, if you had an
4 investigator there working with you in your
5 representation of Ms. Arthur --
6 A. Sir --
7 Q. Let me finish, please, sir. -- you
8 would know, would you not, sir, as a matter of
9 fact that you would pay his expenses?
10 A. He may have flown in there, checked
11 in the hotel with his own credit card and paid
12 the bill and flew out.
13 Q. But you're going to reimburse him
14 for those charges?
15 A. Yes.
16 Q. So at the end of day, whether you
17 gave him the credit card, John O'Quinn, don't
18 leave home without it, or whether he used his
19 credit card, the buck came out of your account
20 to pay for his expenses; true?
21 A. That would be usual.
22 Q. And that's what you believe happened
24 A. Only because that would be usual.
25 Q. Right, sir.
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 56 of 207
1 A. I have not gone back and checked the
2 records on any of these points you've been
3 talking about.
4 Q. I go back to the scope of your
5 engagement and that was to participate in the
6 court proceedings, examine witnesses, make
7 arguments, help with transportation, help with
8 physically getting Ms. Arthur in and out of
9 the courtroom and acting as, in effect, her
10 media spokesman fielding media inquiries that
11 were directed from her to you; right?
12 A. Right.
13 Q. And then the other thing you told me
14 was that you were also involved in the efforts
15 to hire counsel for the appeal of Judge
16 Seidlin's ruling; right?
17 A. Right.
18 Q. And that covers the entire scope of
19 your engagement for Ms. Arthur as it relates
20 to Florida; true?
21 A. As best I recall it right now.
22 Q. Why -- why did you have an
23 investigator come to Florida?
24 A. I don't recall.
25 Q. Did you have Mr. Clark undertake any
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 57 of 207
1 investigative efforts into the cause or causes
2 of the death of Anna Nicole Smith?
3 MR. KLEIN: John, let's be real
4 careful here. You've got an ongoing
6 THE WITNESS: Yeah.
7 MR. KLEIN: I want to be careful not
8 to -- any violation of attorney-client
9 work product privileges.
10 THE WITNESS: That would be covered
11 by attorney-client work product
13 Q. (By Mr. Wood) Well --
14 A. To tell you the truth, it would be.
15 Q. But did you authorize Don Clark to
16 talk to Ashley Banfield of CNN about the scope
17 of his investigative work?
18 A. I think that's covered by the same
20 Q. Well, sir, you know he did?
21 A. No.
22 Q. You're not aware that Mr. Clark
23 provided Ms. Banfield with information that he
24 was down in Florida to try to get dirt that
25 might reopen the investigation into Anna
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 58 of 207
1 Nicole's death? You weren't aware that he
2 gave that information to Ms. Banfield?
3 A. No.
4 Q. Well, was he, in part, down there --
5 and I don't -- I'm not asking for the work
6 product now, please. I'm asking for the scope
7 of his assignment which I do not believe is
8 protected by any privilege or the work product
9 doctrine --
10 MR. KLEIN: An investigator --
11 MR. WOOD: The scope of his
13 Q. (By Mr. Wood) Was he in Florida, in
14 part, to investigate any aspect of the death
15 of Anna Nicole Smith?
16 And that's a yes-or-no question, if
17 you don't mind. I'm not looking for a
18 substantive what did he do at the moment.
19 MR. KLEIN: I've got to suggest a
21 MR. WOOD: Okay.
22 MR. KLEIN: You can, I believe for a
23 jurisdictional deposition, we don't have
24 to get into the question of whether or
25 not --
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 59 of 207
1 COURT REPORTER: Can you speak up,
2 please? I'm having a hard time hearing
4 MR. KLEIN: -- that you can answer
5 whether or not Clark was performing
6 services at his request as opposed to the
7 scope of the services that he was
9 MR. WOOD: Well, let me ask that and
10 then we'll -- probably a good time to
11 take a break. Let me ask that and then I
12 can come back, because I don't think that
13 I'm limited, as you have suggested, but
14 let me get this down.
15 Q. (By Mr. Wood) In fact, Mr. Clark
16 was in Florida performing investigative
17 services at your request in connection with
18 your representation of Vergie Arthur in
19 connection with the Anna Nicole Smith matter;
21 MR. KLEIN: That, you can answer.
22 THE WITNESS: Yes.
23 MR. WOOD: Okay. Why don't we take
24 a break now.
25 MR. KLEIN: Sure.
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 60 of 207
1 MR. WOOD: We've been going for
2 about an hour.
3 VIDEOGRAPHER: The time is
4 approximately 10:07. This concludes Tape
5 No. 1. Off the video record.
6 (Thereupon, there was an
7 interruption in the proceedings.)
8 VIDEOGRAPHER: The time is
9 approximately 10:27. We're back on the
10 video record. This marks the beginning
11 of Tape No. 2. You may continue.
12 Q. (By Mr. Wood) Mr. O'Quinn, as part
13 of your representation and efforts on behalf
14 of Vergie Arthur, did you, within that scope
15 of representation, did that include, in part,
16 efforts to investigate aspects of the death of
17 Anna Nicole Smith in Florida?
18 A. I believe so.
19 Q. Did you yourself conduct any
20 investigation in Florida into any aspect of
21 her death?
22 A. Well, we've got this issue about
23 work product privilege.
24 Q. Well, I'm asking about your
25 activities in Florida. And so again that it's
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 61 of 207
1 clear, I'm not asking you at the moment what
2 you may have learned from the investigation,
3 okay, which I -- I will at least concede might
4 fall within an argument about whether it's
5 work product or not, whether I agree with that
6 we have to determine that another time.
7 I'm just trying to find out for the
8 moment whether you yourself engaged in any
9 investigative activities in Florida that
10 related to the death of Anna Nicole Smith?
11 THE WITNESS: What do you think,
13 MR. KLEIN: Whether you personally
15 THE WITNESS: No.
16 Q. (By Mr. Wood) You didn't
17 participate in any interviews of witnesses?
18 A. No.
19 Q. Do you know whether any witnesses
20 were interviewed at your direction and on your
21 behalf as it would relate to the death of Anna
22 Nicole Smith?
23 And I'm referring to witnesses in
25 A. No.
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 62 of 207
1 Q. Did Mr. Clark, at your request,
2 engaged in any investigative activities in the
3 state of Florida related to trying to
4 ascertain information about the cause of the
5 death of Anna Nicole Smith?
6 MR. KLEIN: We have the same problem
7 with work product. I mean, I -- let
8 me --
9 MR. WOOD: Again, I'm not asking him
10 what he found out at the moment.
11 MR. KLEIN: I know, but whether or
12 not and getting into the scope, even, of
13 his investigation may really reveal work
14 product issues and potentially
15 attorney-client privilege issues. Let me
16 make a suggestion --
17 MR. WOOD: Okay.
18 MR. KLEIN: -- because I understand
19 your need for jurisdictional discovery.
20 I think there's a relevant inquiry
21 as to whether or not it was an issue in
22 the litigation and something that would
23 have been within the scope of his
24 services that he was performing, without
25 having to get into the specifics of what
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 63 of 207
1 he did to further those efforts.
2 MR. WOOD: Well, let's do that.
3 MR. KLEIN: Yeah.
4 Q. (By Mr. Wood) And that's the
5 question at the moment.
6 At your request, did Don Clark
7 engage in investigative activities in the
8 state of Florida on the question of the cause
9 or causes of Anna Nicole Smith's death in
11 A. With all due respects, you said it
12 differently --
13 MR. KLEIN: Than I did.
14 THE WITNESS: -- than he did. So
15 now I don't know what to do.
16 Q. (By Mr. Wood) Let me go back and
17 try to see if I can find some happy medium,
18 either by adopting Mr. Klein's.
19 Well, let me go back again. I'm not
20 asking you for the specifics at the moment of
21 what Don Clark did.
22 For example, I'm not asking you who
23 he interviewed and what he learned. But I'm
24 asking you whether at your direction Don Clark
25 did, in fact, engage in investigative
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 64 of 207
1 activities in the state of Florida that
2 related to the cause of the death of Anna
3 Nicole Smith in Florida?
4 MR. KLEIN: And my only suggested
5 correction is at the very end of that
6 sentence. Related to his representation
7 of Vergie Arthur in those proceedings, I
8 don't have a problem with. The moment
9 you get into whether it was Howard Stern
10 and whether he was involved as a cause of
11 her death, that, I have a problem with
12 because now you are getting specific.
13 MR. WOOD: Well --
14 MR. KLEIN: Your issue is whether
15 it's related to the proceedings?
16 MR. WOOD: No. My issue is this
17 lawyer's activities in the state of
18 Florida --
19 MR. KLEIN: I understand.
20 MR. WOOD: -- whatever -- whatever
21 they might be related to.
22 MR. KLEIN: Right.
23 MR. WOOD: But specifically this
24 question is whether there were
25 investigative activities undertaken at
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 65 of 207
1 Mr. O'Quinn's direction in the state of
2 Florida by Mr. Clark related to the cause
3 of the death of Anna Nicole Smith.
4 MR. KLEIN: And that's where I have
5 a problem, is that is very specific as to
6 work product.
7 MR. WOOD: Specific as to scope but
8 it's not specific in any way asking for
9 information that could constitute work
10 product at the moment.
11 MR. KLEIN: Well, how is it any more
12 relevant to the jurisdictional issue as
13 to the specific issues that the
14 investigator was exploring as opposed to
15 he was conducting investigation in the
16 state of Florida on John's behalf?
17 MR. WOOD: Because this man's been
18 sued for comments that he made that we
19 contend accused Howard Stern of
20 involvement in the murder. So I think I
21 clearly entitled to know the scope of the
22 activities of this man or his agents or
23 people agenting on his behalf because it
24 may go to the issue of whether he
25 reasonably expected to be haled into a
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 66 of 207
1 Florida court, and I think I'm right.
2 And I'd like to get an answer today on
3 that. And I won't go into substance. I
4 may just to make the record, but at least
5 at this moment I think I'm entitled to
6 know the scope of Mr. Clark's activities
7 in terms of what he was doing.
8 MR. KLEIN: Let me take a two-minute
10 MR. WOOD: Okay. Sure.
11 MR. KLEIN: Let's talk about that.
12 Obviously I don't want to have him come
13 back here and redo this.
14 MR. WOOD: Not unless the weather is
15 better than it is right now.
16 VIDEOGRAPHER: Off the record at
18 (Thereupon, there was an
19 interruption in the proceedings.)
20 VIDEOGRAPHER: The time is
21 approximately 10:35. We're back on video
22 record. You may continue.
23 Q. (By Mr. Wood) My question,
24 Mr. O'Quinn, is whether there were any
25 investigative activities undertaken at your
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 67 of 207
1 direction within the state of Florida by Don
2 Clark related to the cause of the death of
3 Anna Nicole Smith?
4 A. I believe an issue in the case,
5 legal issue, could be whether Mr. Stern had
6 anything to do with her death, and so in that
7 regard, Mr. Clark did some investigation.
8 Now, whether he did it in Florida or
9 otherwise, I'm not sure.
10 Q. Well, do you believe that he did it
11 in Florida? You know the death occurred in
12 Florida; true?
13 A. True. That's true. Well, actually
14 it involved the death occurred on Indian land.
15 Q. Inside the state of Florida?
16 A. Yes, that's right.
17 Q. And you know that it was
18 investigated in part by members of the
19 Seminole law enforcement agencies and also in
20 conjunction with the medical examiner's office
21 of Broward County; true?
22 A. I've heard that.
23 Q. You don't know that to be true?
24 A. No. I've never talked to those
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 68 of 207
1 Q. You've never familiarized yourself
2 with Mr. Perper's investigative findings?
3 A. No, but I understand Mr. Perper is
4 not the Seminole Indian.
5 Q. No, sir. He's the medical examiner
6 in Broward County.
7 Are you familiar with his findings
8 with respect to his investigation into the
9 death of Anna Nicole Smith?
10 A. Some of them. He's expressed some
11 of them.
12 Q. Well, are you telling me you're
13 familiar with some but not all?
14 A. I don't know all of them. I never
15 took his deposition.
16 Q. Yeah, but what he publicly stated
17 and what was publicly released, are you
18 familiar with that information?
19 A. I'm familiar with some things he
20 publicly released. I may be familiar with
21 everything, but I don't know everything that
22 he publicly released. I can't certify that I
23 know everything that he publicly released.
24 Q. Do you believe that it is likely,
25 given that her death occurred in the state of
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 69 of 207
1 Florida, that Mr. Clark's efforts in some part
2 involved investigative activity in the state
3 of Florida?
4 A. May have.
5 Q. Do you think it's likely that it
6 did, sir? I mean, you've been investigating
7 incidents almost 40 years of law practice.
8 This is a death that occurred in the state of
10 You're telling me that the scope of
11 your engagement included some aspect of the
12 cause of Anna Nicole Smith's death and you
13 tell me that you had an investigator that you
14 were paying to be in Florida that you believe
15 investigated aspects of the cause of her
16 death. Do you believe that it is likely, sir,
17 that he did conduct some investigative
18 activity in the state of Florida at your
19 direction into the cause of her death?
20 A. I don't know.
21 Q. You don't deny that he did, do you?
22 A. Deny he did what?
23 Q. Conducted investigative activity in
24 the state of Florida into the cause of Anna
25 Nicole Smith's death?
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 70 of 207
1 A. I neither admit or deny. I don't
3 Q. Did you ever bother to find out what
4 his investigation involved and his findings?
5 A. Well, that goes back to the
6 attorney-client work product.
7 Q. I'm asking you did you ever bother
8 to find out what he had done and what his
9 investigation had revealed or concluded?
10 MR. KLEIN: You can do that.
11 THE WITNESS: Without getting into
12 the -- what he may have said or the
13 details, the answer to your question is
15 Q. (By Mr. Wood) Did you then learn,
16 not the details, that, in fact, part of what
17 he had done, involved investigative efforts,
18 including interviewing witness, in the state
19 of Florida?
20 MR. KLEIN: Now we're getting
21 specific. You know, I'm trying very hard
22 to avoid --
23 MR. WOOD: And I appreciate that and
24 I'm trying hard not to go into who and
25 what they said.
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 71 of 207
1 MR. KLEIN: Yeah.
2 MR. WOOD: But I think that it is
3 relevant to the jurisdictional issues
4 raised in terms of knowing whether or not
5 Mr. Clark was paid by Mr. O'Quinn to be
6 in Florida and was directed by
7 Mr. O'Quinn while in Florida to conduct
8 investigative activities in Florida on
9 the question of the cause of Anna Nicole
10 Smith's death.
11 MR. KLEIN: Which you've asked and
12 he's answered.
13 MR. WOOD: Well, I don't think I've
14 gotten an answer to whether he's
15 acknowledged that Mr. Clark did, in fact,
16 engage in investigative activities in
17 Florida. That's the question I'm trying
18 to get an answer to on the issue of Anna
19 Nicole Smith's death.
20 MR. KLEIN: And he's told you he
21 doesn't know what he did in Florida.
22 Q. (By Mr. Wood) And you've never
23 learned what Mr. O'Quinn -- I mean, Mr. Clark
24 did in Florida in terms of his investigation
25 is that your testimony?
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 72 of 207
1 A. Never learned includes up to the
2 present time. I would say I think I have, to
3 some extent, been told.
4 Q. Well, did you -- have you ever
5 learned that, in fact, he did engage in
6 investigative activities in the state of
7 Florida on the issue of the cause of Anna
8 Nicole Smith's death?
9 MR. KLEIN: Regardless of whether or
10 not he was in Florida at the time?
11 MR. WOOD: No.
12 Q. (By Mr. Wood) Specifically whether
13 Mr. Clark was in Florida at the time, did he
14 engage in any investigative activities?
15 MR. KLEIN: You're missing my point.
16 MR. WOOD: I probably am.
17 MR. KLEIN: And it was probably
18 obscure. If the question is whether he
19 learned while he was performing services
20 in Florida?
21 MR. WOOD: No.
22 MR. KLEIN: All right.
23 MR. WOOD: No. I'm just -- my
24 question is probably unartfully worded.
25 MR. KLEIN: Okay.
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 73 of 207
1 Q. (By Mr. Wood) Let me try to make it
3 You've got Don Clark in Florida on
4 your dime; right?
5 A. Don Clark works for this law firm.
6 Q. You're paying his expenses to be in
7 Florida working for your law firm in
8 connection --
9 A. Me personally, no.
10 Q. -- with your representation of
11 Vergie Arthur; right?
12 A. Me personally, no. The law firm
13 pays his expenses.
14 Q. I understand that.
15 But the point is, sir -- the simple
16 question is did he, in fact, to your knowledge
17 engage in any investigative activities in the
18 state of Florida as it would relate to the
19 issue of the cause of Anna Nicole Smith's
21 A. While I was in Florida representing
22 Ms. Arthur, I don't know. I don't know
23 whether he was investigating Florida,
24 investigating elsewhere.
25 Q. I'm not asking you, though, -- I
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 74 of 207
1 don't care when you learned it or where you
2 were when you learned it. I just simply want
3 to know as you sit here today, did he do it?
4 Did Mr. Clark engage in investigative
5 activities in the state of Florida into the
6 issue of the cause of Anna Nicole Smith's
8 A. I think he may have after things had
9 switched to the Bahamas. After the legal
10 proceedings switched to the Bahamas.
11 Q. Is it -- is it your best testimony,
12 sir, under oath today that he did, in fact,
13 whatever time that he did it --
14 A. I think time is important.
15 Q. Well, somebody else will have to
16 decide that.
17 I just want an answer to the
18 question now, whether you think it's important
19 or not, did he engage in investigative
20 activities in the state of Florida on behalf
21 of your representation of Vergie Arthur into
22 the cause of the death of Anna Nicole Smith?
23 A. At some point in time, I believe so.
24 Q. When did you meet with Mr. Klein
25 initially to discuss handling the appeal of
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 75 of 207
1 Judge Seidlin's order?
2 A. I don't recall the date.
3 Q. Was it a meeting that took place
4 face to face in Florida --
5 A. Yes.
6 Q. -- at Mr. Klein's law office?
7 A. Yes.
8 Q. And who was present at that meeting?
9 A. A woman named Roberta who's like his
10 appellate lawyer.
11 Q. Handel or Mandel?
12 MR. KLEIN: Mandel.
13 Q. (By Mr. Wood) Mandel, excuse me.
14 Ms. Mandel, Mr. Klein, John
15 O'Quinn --
16 A. True.
17 Q. -- anyone else?
18 MR. WOOD: You can help him out on
19 that one.
20 MR. KLEIN: You weren't there.
21 THE WITNESS: I wasn't there.
22 Mr. McCabe did it.
23 Q. (By Mr. Wood) Mr. McCabe was there
24 for you.
25 A. Because I'm busy in Judge Seidlin's
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 76 of 207
2 Q. Well, did you have discussions
3 yourself with Mr. Klein about that
5 A. No.
6 Q. Do you know how much you paid for
7 that appeal to be handled?
8 A. No.
9 Q. You knew it was going to be an
10 appeal to be undertaken by the Florida
11 appellate courts?
12 A. Yes.
13 Q. By a lawyer that you engaged on
14 behalf of Vergie Arthur?
15 A. My law firm did.
16 Q. And that you paid for?
17 A. My law firm did.
18 Q. Well, while you were out giving
19 media interviews, were you out, in your role
20 as media spokesman, you were acting on behalf
21 your law firm? Is that your testimony?
22 A. Everything I did was -- I was acting
23 on behalf of my law firm which was acting on
24 behalf of Ms. Arthur.
25 Q. And did you have the authority to
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 77 of 207
1 speak for Ms. Arthur? Did your law firm give
2 you authority to comment publicly about this
3 case in the media?
4 A. Yes. Only because she gave my law
5 firm authority to do it.
6 Q. And when it came time to decide what
7 you would say or what you wouldn't say, you
8 had the authority on behalf of your law firm
9 to make that decision, did you not?
10 A. Yes. To a certain extent, though, I
11 might confer with her about how she felt I
12 should be responding.
13 Q. Right. But other than conferring
14 with Ms. Arthur --
15 A. Right.
16 Q. -- in terms of what you, John
17 O'Quinn, decided to say or not say in the
18 media as part of your representation --
19 A. Right.
20 Q. -- you had the ultimate authority to
21 make that decision on behalf of your law firm;
23 A. The ultimate authority comes from
24 the client.
25 Q. Yes, sir. But in terms of acting on
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 78 of 207
1 behalf of the law firm in accordance with the
2 client's direction, you had the authority to
3 make the decision on what you would say or not
4 say on behalf of the client acting for the law
6 A. If the client had authorized the
7 firm to do it, then the rest of your statement
8 is true.
9 Q. Right. And the client did authorize
10 it and you did it; right?
11 A. Did authorize what was said to be
12 said and I did say what was said.
13 Q. And did you have the discussions
14 with Ms. Arthur about what you were going to
15 say while y'all were in the state of Florida?
16 A. Well, now I think we're getting into
17 attorney-client privilege.
18 MR. KLEIN: We are.
19 THE WITNESS: Probably already
20 stepped all over it in answering the
21 other questions.
22 Q. (By Mr. Wood) Well, with all due
23 respect, I don't think that the location of
24 the discussions is attorney-client privilege.
25 I'm asking you, because you're the
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 79 of 207
1 one that said you were authorized by
2 Ms. Arthur to make these statements to the
3 media, and I'm asking whether you had those
4 discussions about your authority and what you
5 were going to go out and say with Ms. Arthur
6 while you-all were together in the state of
7 Florida. That's my question.
8 MR. KLEIN: You can answer that.
9 THE WITNESS: Sometimes.
10 Q. (By Mr. Wood) Okay. I think you
11 told me earlier that you think you gave two
12 interviews while you were actually physically
13 in Florida?
14 A. I believe I said that.
15 Q. Tell me about those interviews.
16 A. One was with Greta Van Susteren and
17 the other was with a -- a woman I do not
18 recall the name of.
19 Q. Rita Cosby? Does that ring a bell?
20 A. Could be.
21 Q. But that doesn't ring a bell to say
22 it is?
23 A. The name is kind of in my memory
24 bank. I don't know why it's in my memory
25 bank. It could be but I really don't know for
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 80 of 207
1 sure. The only reason I say it could be is
2 because I remember the name Rita Cosby.
3 Q. Prior to -- do you know the date of
4 the interview you gave with Greta Van
6 A. No, sir.
7 Q. Where were you?
8 A. I was in Fort Lauderdale.
9 Q. Had you ever spoken to Greta Van
10 Susteren before that interview took place?
11 A. I talked to Greta about other
12 matters, I know. I told you I knew her, not
13 well but I knew her. And about this
14 particular matter, I don't recall.
15 Q. How were you first contacted to --
16 about giving an interview on this particular
18 A. I believe a member of her staff
19 contacted probably my secretary.
20 Q. And who did you first speak with
21 about it, yourself?
22 A. Probably my secretary.
23 Q. While you were in Florida she called
25 A. Correct.
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 81 of 207
1 Q. And then who did you first speak
2 with with Fox News or Greta's folks in terms
3 of setting up or conducting the interview?
4 A. I don't recall that person's name.
5 Q. But the conversation took place on
6 the phone or in person?
7 A. On the phone.
8 Q. While you were in Florida?
9 A. No, I don't recall that either.
10 Q. Well, you gave the interview in
12 A. True. I do recall that.
13 Q. Was Greta present?
14 A. Yes.
15 Q. Was it taped or live?
16 A. I believe it was live.
17 Q. And y'all were sitting where?
18 A. Near the courthouse.
19 Q. Where?
20 A. In Fort Lauderdale.
21 Q. We can do better than that. Can't
22 we? Were you out on the street? Were you at
23 the local Fox affiliate's offices?
24 Physically where were you sitting
25 when you were talking to Greta Van Susteren
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 82 of 207
1 about this matter and gave the interview?
2 A. My memory is I was not in the
4 Q. Okay. We're narrowing it down now.
5 MR. KLEIN: That's a start.
6 THE WITNESS: My memory is that it
7 was on some paved something and my memory
8 is it was not far from the courthouse.
9 Q. (By Mr. Wood) So you were talking
10 to Greta face to face; right?
11 A. Correct.
12 Q. Cameraman, one or two, or camera
14 A. One, I believe.
15 Q. There was a -- was it a man?
16 A. I can't recall. I think it was a
18 Q. Camera on you? Camera on both of
19 y'all? Or two cameras, one on her and one on
21 A. I don't recall.
22 Q. How many other people were present
23 besides Greta Van Susteren and the cameraman?
24 A. Ten or so.
25 Q. Ten or so in the direct proximity of
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 83 of 207
1 the interview?
2 A. In the area.
3 Q. So there would have been a number of
4 people that would have heard what you said to
5 Greta Van Susteren there in Fort Lauderdale;
7 A. I don't know.
8 Q. Well, you know Greta heard it;
10 A. I believe so.
11 Q. And you certainly made the comments
12 in the interview in the presence of other
13 third parties, including a camera person;
15 A. Well, the camera person was in the
16 immediate vicinity of me and Greta.
17 Q. But the comments you uttered in that
18 interview were, in fact, heard directly and
19 made directly to Greta Van Susteren face to
20 face; true?
21 A. True.
22 Q. In Florida?
23 A. True.
24 Q. Have you had an opportunity,
25 Mr. O'Quinn, to look at the lawsuit that was
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 84 of 207
1 filed against you by Mr. Stern?
2 A. Yes, sir.
3 MR. WOOD: Let me mark this as
4 Exhibit No. 2.
5 (Plaintiff's Exhibit-2 was marked
6 for identification.)
7 Q. (By Mr. Wood) Let me hand you
8 what's been marked for purposes of
9 identification to your deposition,
10 Mr. O'Quinn, as Exhibit No. 2 and ask you if
11 you recognize that as being a true and correct
12 copy of the lawsuit filed by Mr. Stern against
13 you in the United States District Court for
14 the Southern District of Florida, West Palm
15 Beach Division?
16 A. To be honest with you, it's very
17 long. It appears to be. From the first page,
18 it appears to be.
19 Q. You would accept my representation
20 that it is, would you not?
21 A. Subject to being verified, but right
22 now --
23 Q. That sounds like a no.
24 A. No, no. I don't know what's in this
25 total document. Let me just say for the
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 85 of 207
1 purposes of right now, I accept your
2 assertion. If it turns out it's not true,
3 then we'll deal with it.
4 Q. Look at page 8.
5 A. Okay.
6 Q. There's a subtitle, "Defendant
7 O'Quinn slanderous February 21, 2007,
8 Fort Lauderdale interview with Fox News," and
9 then it goes on in paragraph 37 to reference
10 an interview in Fort Lauderdale, Florida on
11 February 21, 2007, with Greta Van Susteren.
12 Do you see that?
13 A. Yes.
14 Q. Is that the interview that you've
15 been describing for me that you gave to Greta
16 face to face in Fort Lauderdale?
17 A. Sounds like it.
18 Q. Do you have any reason to believe it
19 is not the interview that you gave with Greta
20 in Fort Lauderdale?
21 MR. KLEIN: Hold on, John. That
22 references to a partial transcript.
23 You're not asking him to comment on the
24 veracity of the transcript itself?
25 MR. WOOD: I'm not asking him to
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 86 of 207
1 comment on that. I'm asking -- as I
2 recall, he said he gave one interview to
4 MR. KLEIN: I understand.
5 MR. WOOD: And apparently the
6 interview was on February 21, 2007.
7 Q. (By Mr. Wood) Which would have been
8 one of the dates that you were present in
9 Florida for the Judge Seidlin hearing; right?
10 A. You know, I don't know the dates for
11 sure, but I think that was during that time.
12 February the 21st was during the time I was in
14 Q. Well, and you know that the
15 proceedings before Judge Seidlin were still
16 ongoing at the time you gave the interview to
17 Greta Van Susteren?
18 A. I believe that's true.
19 Q. Yes, sir. And that's the only
20 interview you gave from Fort Lauderdale with
21 Greta Van Susteren; right?
22 A. That is true.
23 Q. And --
24 A. What I don't know yet is whether it
25 happened on the 21st day of February or some
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 87 of 207
1 other day.
2 Q. Now, had you spoken with Greta about
3 what you were going to discuss with her in the
4 interview before you actually started it?
5 A. No.
6 Q. Had you discussed with anyone
7 connected in any way with Greta Van Susteren's
8 production, her show, about what you would be
9 discussing in the interview before you
10 actually started participating in the
11 interview with Greta?
12 A. Nothing more than Greta wanted to do
13 a show about the events of the day in the
15 Q. And no one discussed any details
16 with you --
17 A. No.
18 Q. -- prior to the actual interview
20 A. True.
21 Q. And you knew it was going to be for
22 her show, On the Record?
23 A. Yeah, if that's the name of the show
24 that's produced out of New York City, that's
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 88 of 207
1 Q. Her show?
2 A. Her show.
3 Q. Fox News?
4 A. You normally see her on the screen.
5 She's in New York City doing a show.
6 Q. Broadcast to the nation on the Fox
7 News network; right?
8 A. That's my understanding.
9 Q. It was your understanding before you
10 gave the interview that you were going to be
11 doing a live interview for Greta Van
12 Susteren's show that would be broadcast
13 nationally; true?
14 A. From New York City.
15 Q. Regardless of where from, but to an
16 audience on a national basis; true?
17 A. I didn't know for sure, but I
18 suspected that was true.
19 Q. Well, sir, you knew Greta before,
20 didn't you, sir?
21 A. Yes.
22 Q. You're familiar with her show?
23 A. Not really.
24 Q. You didn't know it was a national
25 television show?
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 89 of 207
1 A. I really hadn't focused on it, but
2 probably if -- if somebody asked me that
3 question before this case was even happening,
4 I would probably have said I believed Greta's
5 got a national show.
6 Q. That you were appearing on live;
8 A. That's what I believe, yeah.
9 Q. And you keep making reference to the
10 fact that it was broadcast from New York.
11 A. Right.
12 Q. How do you know that?
13 A. That's where her show gets broadcast
15 Q. But she was in Florida with you?
16 A. Well, I think we've covered the fact
17 that she was in Florida but that's different
18 than where the show is broadcast. She could
19 take a feed and send it to New York and it
20 gets broadcast out of New York.
21 Q. Could, sure, I understand that. But
22 the fact of the matter is the interview was
23 conducted and your comments were, in fact,
24 uttered to Greta Van Susteren in the close
25 proximity of other third persons other than
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 90 of 207
1 Greta in Fort Lauderdale Florida true?
2 A. No, not in the close proximity.
3 There were other people in the area, but they
4 were busy doing things.
5 Q. Well, Greta was a third party;
7 A. Greta was a party. She was doing
8 the interview.
9 Q. Yeah. And you had a conversation
10 with her somewhat similar, in a different
11 setting --
12 A. Right.
13 Q. -- to what we're doing here today;
15 A. Right.
16 Q. She's asking you questions and
17 you're giving her answers?
18 A. Right.
19 MR. KLEIN: Are you broadcasting?
20 Are you broadcasting?
21 MR. WOOD: Not nationally.
22 Q. (By Mr. Wood) And do you recall in
23 that interview telling Greta Van Susteren or
24 discussing with Greta Van Susteren information
25 about the cause of Anna Nicole Smith's death?
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 91 of 207
1 A. I'm not sure word for word what I
2 said in the interview.
3 Q. I didn't ask you what you said word
4 for word.
5 I asked you if you recall in that
6 interview discussing with Greta Van Susteren
7 information about the cause of Anna Nicole
8 Smith's death?
9 A. I believe so.
10 Q. You had an opportunity to look at
11 the -- what's been referred to as a partial
12 transcript that was attached to the complaint,
13 have you not?
14 A. Yes.
15 Q. In reviewing that transcript in
16 terms of the comments that were made or
17 uttered by you to Greta during that interview,
18 do you have any reason to question the
19 accuracy of those comments?
20 A. As an --
21 Q. The transcript, I should say.
22 A. As an ex -- as a part of the
23 transcript, or an excerpt from the transcript,
24 I believe it's probably accurate.
25 Q. Have you ever gone back and looked
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 92 of 207
1 at the video?
2 A. Yes.
3 Q. When did you do that?
4 A. Last night, I believe.
5 Q. It may be a good time to ask you
6 this question: What did you do in preparation
7 for your deposition testimony today,
8 Mr. O'Quinn?
9 I know you met Mr. Klein but I don't
10 want to go into what you-all discussed, but
11 the fact that you met with him --
12 A. That's it. That's it.
13 Q. Well, you reviewed a video; right?
14 A. Yes.
15 Q. Did you review more than one video?
16 A. No.
17 Q. Just the Greta Van Susteren video?
18 A. Right.
19 Q. Did you review any other documents
20 in preparation for your deposition?
21 A. The complaint.
22 Q. Anything other than the complaint?
23 MR. KLEIN: You don't need to tell
24 him what. You can just tell him --
25 THE WITNESS: Oh, the answer is yes.
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 93 of 207
1 Q. (By Mr. Wood) What other documents
2 did you review in preparation for your
3 deposition other than the complaint?
4 MR. KLEIN: We're not going discuss
5 what our preparation was.
6 Q. (By Mr. Wood) But you're telling me
7 clearly on the record that you did review
8 other records in preparation for this
9 deposition today; true?
10 A. That's my answer.
11 Q. Okay.
12 MR. WOOD: And I believe counsel
13 will instruct you or is instructing you
14 not to answer any question that would
15 seek to identify on this record today the
16 identity or description of those
17 documents; is that right?
18 MR. KLEIN: That would violate
19 the --
20 MR. WOOD: Other than the complaint.
21 MR. KLEIN: Correct.
22 Q. (By Mr. Wood) And we know you
23 reviewed the one video of the Greta Van
24 Susteren interview; right?
25 A. Uh-huh (affirmative).
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 94 of 207
1 Q. Did your review of that interview
2 cause you to recognize that the partial
3 transcript, in terms at least of what it says
4 you said, was, in fact, accurate?
5 A. I believe so.
6 Q. The partial transcript attached to
7 your complaint -- to the complaint; right?
8 A. I think -- if I understand what
9 you're saying, I believe the answer is yes.
10 Q. Now, was that the only time you
11 spoke with Greta Van Susteren face to face in
13 A. Yes.
14 Q. Did you have any telephone
15 conversations with her while you were in
17 A. No.
18 Q. And give me, if you would, your best
19 recollection of how many telephone
20 conversations you had with members of her
21 staff or Fox News about this case, Anna Nicole
22 Smith, while you were in Florida.
23 A. I don't recall any.
24 Q. And is it your testimony that at the
25 time you gave the interview to Greta Van
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 95 of 207
1 Susteren in Florida that you take the position
2 that you were acting within the scope of your
3 engagement with Vergie Arthur, in that part of
4 the engagement you described, in effect being
5 a media spokesperson for her?
6 A. Yes.
7 Q. You had told me earlier that you
8 thought -- we both struggled with it --
9 Mr. Tunstall?
10 A. Right.
11 Q. Yeah, I got it, didn't I?
12 A. My Florida counsel or I was working
13 with him.
14 Q. You believe that he filed papers to
15 have you admitted pro hac vice in Florida?
16 A. You know, I just assume it to be
17 true. I don't know it to be true or not.
18 Q. Well, you're not stranger of being
19 admitted pro hac vice in other states in terms
20 of litigation?
21 A. That's why I assume it. Nobody ever
22 in the courtroom said, including the judge,
23 "Mr. O'Quinn, you can't speak because you've
24 not been yada, yada," so I assume he must have
25 done it. But did I see him do it, no.
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 96 of 207
1 Q. So you -- to this day, do you know
2 whether it was actually done, that being an
3 order entered --
4 A. As a fact?
5 Q. Yes.
6 A. I don't know.
7 Q. So as you sit here today, you're
8 assuming this Mr. Ton --
9 MR. KLEIN: Tunstall.
10 MR. WOOD: Tunstall. Thank you.
11 Q. (By Mr. Wood) -- that Mr. Tunstall
12 took the appropriate steps to have you
13 admitted pro hac vice to appear before of
14 Judge Seidlin?
15 A. I am.
16 Q. And you have been, as you say, on
17 many occasions admitted pro hac vice in other
18 courts in other states around the country?
19 A. On a number of occasions.
20 Q. Yes, sir. I mean, your law practice
21 is one that I think you would describe as a
22 national law practice, is it not?
23 A. Actually, it's primarily a Texas law
25 Q. It is?
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 97 of 207
1 A. Over 90 percent of my cases are in
3 Q. 10 percent of outside of the Texas?
4 A. I doubt even 10 percent are outside
6 Q. Where are the other 10 percent if
7 they're not in Texas?
8 A. Mainly New Orleans.
9 Q. So Louisiana and Texas?
10 A. Yeah.
11 Q. You've had litigation in Florida,
12 have you not, other than Vergie Arthur's case?
13 A. Yes.
14 Q. I mean, did you send out any
15 solicitation tapes or information to Florida
16 residents in connection with the ValuJet
18 A. No.
19 Q. Did you engage -- were you engaged
20 by any of the family members with respect to
21 that crash in Florida, the Everglades?
22 A. No, sir.
23 Q. How many other cases have you
24 handled in Florida other than this
25 representation for Vergie Arthur?
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 98 of 207
1 MR. KLEIN: You're talking about him
3 MR. WOOD: Yes.
4 THE WITNESS: My law firm has had I
5 believe one other.
6 Q. (By Mr. Wood) Were you involved in
7 that case in any way?
8 A. No, I've not appeared in any court
9 or any proceeding in that case in Florida.
10 Q. You have never been admitted pro hac
11 vice in any state or federal court in Florida
12 other than Vergie Arthur's case where you
13 assumed you were admitted?
14 A. To my knowledge, the answer is no.
15 Perhaps somebody may have had me admitted on
16 this case I've mentioned on the theory that
17 some day when it goes to trial, I might
18 participate in the trial. But I don't know if
19 it's true or not.
20 (Plaintiff's Exhibit-3 was marked
21 for identification.)
22 Q. (By Mr. Wood) Let me hand you
23 what's been marked for purposes of
24 identification as Exhibit 3, Mr. O'Quinn. You
25 and Mr. Klein take a moment to look at that
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 99 of 207
1 document for me.
2 MR. KLEIN: There's a whole lot of
3 lawyers. We're not in there. I'll feel
4 left out if I'm not.
5 THE WITNESS: If Lin Wood's in there
6 you'll really feel left out.
7 MR. KLEIN: Okay.
8 Q. (By Mr. Wood) Do you recognize
9 Exhibit No. 3?
10 A. No, sir.
11 Q. On the second page of Exhibit No. 3,
12 is that, in fact, your signature, John M.
14 A. It is not my signature.
15 Q. Who signed that for you?
16 A. I have no idea.
17 Q. Were you aware that someone signed
18 your name to have you appear pro hac vice in
19 this lawsuit against American Airlines, Inc.,
20 and others?
21 A. No, sir.
22 Q. It does, in fact, appear to be a
23 motion for you to appear pro hac vice, John M.
24 O'Quinn, in that litigation in Florida; true?
25 A. Let me tell you something. Things
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 100 of 207
1 refresh my memory. I've now looked at the
2 service list, I see Erin Pottharst's name on
3 there. And I can't recall the name of the air
4 crash, but I did do an airplane case with Erin
5 Pottharst in Miami.
6 Q. Yes, sir. But you read the motion,
7 Exhibit No. 3. The motion is for you, John M.
8 O'Quinn, to be admitted pro hac vice in that
9 Florida litigation, is it not, sir?
10 A. That's what it says.
11 Q. And you don't have any recollection
12 that would deny that, in fact, you did make
13 that motion and were allowed to appear pro hac
14 vice in that case, do?
15 A. Well, I never appeared in court.
16 Q. But you don't deny, sir, that your
17 motion was granted and you were granted pro
18 hac vice privileges in that litigation,
19 whether you appeared in that court or not?
20 A. I don't know whether I was admitted
21 or not. The case was settled without any
22 trial. Without any trial.
23 Q. What is your understanding, sir,
24 from your experience of when you are admitted
25 pro hac vice, for example in the state of
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 101 of 207
1 Florida, what does that, in effect, confer on
2 the Florida court system with respect to you
3 appearing in that system to practice law?
4 A. What does that confer on the court
6 Q. On the state of Florida's judicial
7 system or court system?
8 A. I don't know everything it confers
9 but I think it confers -- first you have to
10 have a local counsel. I can't just walk in
11 there alone. And second, I've got to, to the
12 best I can, to follow the rules of Florida.
13 Q. And what about if you do something
14 that in some fashion is in violation of those
15 rules, what is your understanding as to the
16 jurisdiction that Florida has over you after
17 you have been admitted pro hac vice?
18 A. If I violated a rule of Florida,
19 ethical rule let's say, that automatically is
20 a violation of the Texas canons of ethics and
21 I'm subject to discipline in Texas for sure.
22 I don't know what happens in Florida.
23 Q. Are you subject to being
24 investigated in Florida and potentially having
25 your pro hac vice privileges revoked?
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 102 of 207
1 A. I believe the court can revoke my
2 pro hac vice privileges for good cause,
3 whatever that good cause may be.
4 Q. So you recognize that when you
5 submit yourself into another jurisdiction pro
6 hac vice that to some extent you are
7 submitting yourself to the jurisdiction and
8 regulation of that state's judicial system?
9 A. That's a fair statement.
10 Q. And it's an accurate statement,
12 A. As far as I know.
13 Q. You said there was a second
14 interview and I believe -- you didn't recall,
15 I suggested Rita Cosby. What is your -- give
16 me your best recollection, Mr. O'Quinn, as to
17 the second interview you did while you were in
18 Florida in connection with your representation
19 of Vergie Arthur.
20 A. It was at the courthouse.
21 Q. Inside the courthouse?
22 A. I'm not sure. It was on the
23 courthouse property.
24 Q. Well, do you think you were inside
25 or outside?
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 103 of 207
1 A. I'm not sure.
2 Q. Who was present?
3 A. I was and if it was Rita Crosby
4 (sic), or whatever the name of the person who
5 did the interview, they were present. Beyond
6 that, I don't know the name of anyone else
8 Q. Now, was that a live interview?
9 A. I don't know.
10 Q. So you don't know whether it was
11 live or whether it was being videotaped?
12 A. Correct.
13 Q. Did you ever conduct a press
14 conference outside the courthouse proper but
15 on the courthouse property?
16 A. No.
17 Q. Did you ever participate in any
18 press conference outside the courthouse proper
19 but on the courthouse property?
20 A. Well, yes and no. I do have a
21 memory that Judge Seidlin asked that the
22 parties -- are you nodding about the weather?
23 Q. I'm looking at Mr. Klein and he's
24 got to be in court tomorrow, and I'm shaking
25 my head. I'm not shaking at you. I'll let
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 104 of 207
1 you know if I'm shaking at you. Don't worry.
2 There won't be any doubt about it.
3 A. Let me start over again.
4 My memory is, Judge Seidlin, once he
5 announced his ruling, said, "I'm sure the
6 press wants to talk to y'all about it. I
7 would ask if you'll consider speaking together
8 to the press, and I hope y'all can get along
9 with each other." He said things of that
11 So we were leaving the courthouse,
12 we -- at least I, me, I tell the press, I
13 said, "You may not have heard Judge Seidlin,
14 but I don't want to say anything until we all
15 are together, all the parties and the lead
16 lawyers, and that may have been best done once
17 we get outside the courthouse."
18 That would be my statement.
19 Probably other lawyers are saying the same
20 thing, more or less. Whatever got said, what
21 happened was we all left the courthouse, we're
22 still on the courthouse property, and now the
23 media's all lined up with all their
24 microphones, et cetera, and they asked
25 questions I think of everybody.
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 105 of 207
1 Now, was that a press conference? I
2 don't think that was a press conference, but I
3 have to acknowledge it was at least -- because
4 of what Judge Seidlin said, it was kind of
6 Q. Something akin to a press
7 conference? Would that be a fair statement?
8 A. Yeah. It wasn't like we said we
9 were going to hold a press conference.
10 MR. KLEIN: Could we take a break?
11 He's apparently got an urgent phone call.
12 MR. WOOD: Absolutely.
13 VIDEOGRAPHER: Going off the record
14 at 11:15. This concludes Tape No. 2.
15 (Thereupon, there was an
16 interruption in the proceedings.)
17 VIDEOGRAPHER: The time is
18 approximately 11:31. This marks the
19 beginning of Tape No. 3. We're back on
20 video record. You may continue.
21 Q. (By Mr. Wood) Do you -- when you
22 recall the media frenzy, they basically set up
23 what we call a camp out in front of the
24 courthouse where they've got their little
25 areas where the people are broadcasting from
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 106 of 207
1 and then you've got all sorts of huge
2 satellite trucks, did they have those down in
3 Florida during the Seidlin proceedings?
4 A. Some.
5 Q. With respect to your interview on
6 Fox with Greta Van Susteren that we talked
7 about earlier, and I appreciate what you told
8 me, that you weren't knowledgeable on the
9 technical aspects of --
10 A. The broadcast industry, yeah.
11 Q. -- how a broadcast works, and I want
12 to make sure that it's clear. You said
13 earlier that you thought that show was
14 broadcast from New York, right?
15 A. Yes.
16 Q. But as a matter of fact, you do not
17 know whether the satellite feed went out
18 nationally from Florida or whether it was fed
19 into New York to be sent out nationally? As a
20 matter of fact, you don't know, do you, sir?
21 A. I think I do.
22 Q. How?
23 A. Because I've seen a tape of it, of
24 the show.
25 Q. The tape's not going to tell you
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 107 of 207
1 where the satellite feed was sent out from, is
3 A. I think so.
4 Q. How? What is it about the --
5 A. It's on the -- it's on the regular
6 channel for her show and it's at the regular
7 time for her show. You shake your head no.
8 Q. No, I don't mean to shake my head
9 "no." I understand you saw a videotape and
10 it's a video of the broadcast interview. And
11 I'm trying to figure out how that tells you as
12 a matter of fact that the interview was sent
13 out -- the satellite feed nationally went out
14 from New York as opposed to that satellite
15 truck sitting down there in Florida. And the
16 fact is you don't know as a matter of fact.
17 You're just assuming that it went out of New
18 York, isn't that the truth, Mr. O'Quinn?
19 A. It's not true.
20 Q. Tell me as a matter of fact how you
21 know that satellite feed went out of New York
22 and not out of that satellite dish down in
24 A. Because it went out on the Fox
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 108 of 207
1 Q. You don't think they can send out a
2 satellite feed nationally on the Fox channel
3 from Florida with a satellite truck?
4 A. No. The satellite truck sends the
5 feed to New York City.
6 Q. How do you know that?
7 A. Because the satellite truck sends
8 whatever's being done to the satellite and the
9 satellite sends it to New York, Fox in New
11 Q. And how do you know that? And I'm
12 not -- I hear you telling me that. But I also
13 heard you tell me you didn't know the
14 technical aspects of certain --
15 A. I know that part of it.
16 Q. You don't think that satellite feed
17 goes directly out to the Fox affiliates via
18 satellite, sir, from Florida? You don't think
19 they have that capability?
20 A. I think it goes out from the -- on
21 the Fox channel through the New York
23 Q. You ever see --
24 A. It's not a local broadcast.
25 Q. I understand that.
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 109 of 207
1 A. It was not a local broadcast.
2 Q. It was a national broadcast. You
3 know that, don't you?
4 A. Yeah. Because people in other
5 places saw it.
6 Q. Yes, sir.
7 A. They turned their TV on and they saw
9 Q. Have you ever turned your TV on and
10 watching a live interview and all the sudden
11 they lose the feed? You've seen that happen,
12 haven't you?
13 A. If I understand what -- lose the
15 Q. Yeah, they lose the satellite feed.
16 You've seen that happen, haven't you?
17 A. I'm not sure I have.
18 Q. What do you think those satellite
19 trucks are doing down there? You don't think
20 those satellite trucks have the ability to
21 send out a live feed from Florida to the
22 national network, from Florida? You don't
23 think they have that capability?
24 A. The trucks do not have the
25 capability to send that, as far as I
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 110 of 207
1 understand, to send whatever is being done in
2 Fort Lauderdale. That truck did not have the
3 ability to send that to the TVs in New York
4 City, LA, Seattle, Houston, Texas, yada, yada.
5 Q. Have you spoken with anyone at Fox
6 News that would affirm the correctness of your
7 view of how that satellite feed gets out from
8 Florida to the national Fox affiliates?
9 A. No.
10 Q. Would you concede, sir, that it
11 could be, in fact, a satellite feed nationally
12 out of Florida?
13 A. No.
14 Q. Now, does it go by telephone wire at
15 some point? Does a telephone have anything do
16 with it?
17 A. No, I don't believe so.
18 Q. So it's purely a line to a
19 satellite, and you say a satellite goes up to
20 a satellite, down to a satellite in New York
21 and then it's sent out nationally from a
22 satellite in New York? I don't understand.
23 Explain to me your knowledge of that process,
24 please, sir.
25 A. Fox has through the use of the
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 111 of 207
1 satellite, they have ability to send a show to
2 stations in other cities who are probably
3 wired in to that satellite themselves. I
4 don't think it goes over the telephone lines.
5 It probably goes from Fox broadcasting to a
6 satellite and from the satellite to each of
7 the other cities to get the -- to get the
9 Q. Do you know that as a fact, sir, or
10 is that just what you assume in terms of how
11 it works?
12 A. That's what I believe happened, sir.
13 Q. Do you know it as a fact? Do you
14 know the difference between a fact and
16 Do you have firsthand personal
17 knowledge of how that broadcast feed is
18 distributed to the national television
20 A. I strongly believe that's how it
22 Q. I didn't ask you about your strong
24 I'm asking if you have personal
25 knowledge as a matter of fact as to how that
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 112 of 207
1 broadcast feed of your interview with Greta
2 Van Susteren is distributed to the national
3 Fox television network stations.
4 A. I don't know how to better answer it
5 than I've answered it.
6 Q. Do you know the difference, sir, in
7 practicing law between a fact and a belief,
8 don't you?
9 A. There's a difference. Yes, sir.
10 Q. You keep telling me you believe it
11 goes through New York. But as a matter of
12 fact, you don't know that from a personal
13 knowledge standpoint, do you, sir?
14 A. My knowledge is it goes to a
15 satellite that's under the jurisdiction of Fox
16 News and that satellite, if Fox News wants to
17 do it, that satellite sends the -- sends the
18 show to the cities that have stations that
19 carry Fox.
20 Q. But you keep telling me it's
21 broadcast out of New York.
22 A. Well, I meant the people in New York
23 are in control of whether it gets broadcast or
25 Q. Well, the people in New York may
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 113 of 207
1 very well be in control in terms of
2 controlling the satellite feed out of Florida
3 and allowing it to go out to all of their
4 affiliate stations; true?
5 A. They are in control.
6 Q. But you don't know whether it
7 actually bounces off a satellite to New York
8 and goes out from New York or whether it goes
9 directly off that satellite feed to the
10 national network from Florida, do you?
11 A. Sir, a guy sitting in a truck in
12 Fort Lauderdale does not have the authority to
13 feed that show to every other city in the
15 Q. I'm not talking about the authority,
16 sir. I'm talking about how it actually works.
17 Whoever authorizes it. They set up a
18 satellite feed live from Florida, and you're
19 telling me that the only way that satellite
20 live feed can get to the national viewing
21 audience is for it to go first to New York.
22 And I'm suggesting that you do not know that
23 as a matter of fact, but I do accept that you
24 believe it, even strongly believe it; am I
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 114 of 207
1 A. You're not right.
2 Q. So it is a matter of fact that you
3 tell me that it goes to New York?
4 A. Goes under the control of the New
5 York people. They may not be in a building in
6 New York City.
7 MR. KLEIN: Why are we arguing about
9 MR. WOOD: Because y'all made --
10 you're making a point --
11 MR. KLEIN: And if we're wrong --
12 MR. WOOD: Well, but you make the
13 point on a motion, and I don't think that
14 you have factual authority for it, for
15 the judge to consider it, and that's why
16 I think it's important.
17 MR. KLEIN: Are you contesting it?
18 MR. WOOD: In terms of New York?
19 MR. KLEIN: Right.
20 MR. WOOD: You know, as a practical
21 matter --
22 MR. KLEIN: Right.
23 MR. WOOD: -- on the law of libel,
24 it's not relevant in my view.
25 MR. KLEIN: That's my question.
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 115 of 207
1 MR. WOOD: Well, but I think it's
2 important to make the record about what
3 the evidence is of this New York
5 MR. KLEIN: That's why I asked if
6 you're contesting it.
7 MR. WOOD: I -- I -- I believe --
8 sure. I believe that the satellite feed
9 goes out nationally from Florida on a
10 live broadcast.
11 MR. KLEIN: Without being run
12 through the national --
13 MR. WOOD: I'm not suggesting they
14 don't monitor and edit and make decisions
15 on it.
16 MR. KLEIN: I'll stipulate with you
17 that it's a live satellite feed out of
19 MR. WOOD: To a national network --
20 MR. KLEIN: It's a live satellite
21 field that has to go through a national
22 process. No sound truck can beam on
23 their own to an affiliate without routing
24 through --
25 MR. WOOD: You and I -- our state of
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 116 of 207
1 knowledge is not really relevant. I
2 disagree with you. I think they can send
3 it directly to the national Fox
4 network --
5 MR. KLEIN: I agree with that.
6 MR. WOOD: -- and somebody in New
7 York is watching it as it's beamed out of
8 there and they have a time window to beam
9 it out and they can edit it if they want
10 to, but it goes directly from Florida to
11 that national audience.
12 MR. KLEIN: And you don't think that
13 national controls whether the feed --
14 MR. WOOD: Control is irrelevant.
15 The home office doesn't control anything.
16 But the question of whether it
17 physically, as it suggests in your
18 pleadings, has to go from the satellite
19 to New York to then go out to the country
20 I think is just dead wrong.
21 But it really doesn't matter. I
22 think it's a fair question and I want to
23 get it on the record whether Mr. O'Quinn
24 is professing firsthand factual knowledge
25 as to how that broadcast is transmitted
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 117 of 207
1 to the national television audience or
2 whether he's simply telling me his
3 belief. And I think as a clear question.
4 I think I know the answer, but if we can
5 get it on the record, then I think we can
6 move on to another area.
7 THE WITNESS: I've already answered
8 it three times.
9 MR. KLEIN: Well, you understand
10 what his question is? Can I make a
12 MR. WOOD: Sure.
13 MR. KLEIN: Just ask him the basis
14 of his belief and we'll go from there.
15 MR. WOOD: Well, I think --
16 Q. (By Mr. Wood) Let's make it clear.
17 Is it a belief or do you have personal
18 knowledge as a matter of fact of how that
19 broadcast is transmitted to the nation?
20 A. I believe it's more than a belief.
21 Q. What is it more than a belief?
22 A. It's common sense also. There's no
23 way that a guy sitting in a truck is going to
24 be able to control that broadcast going to
25 other cities unless it gets into the Fox
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 118 of 207
1 broadcast system and the Fox broadcast system
2 is under the control of people much higher up
3 than that guy sitting in that truck.
4 Q. So you are telling me that's your
5 belief based on your view of common sense;
7 A. A, common sense.
8 Q. Anything else?
9 A. B, conversations.
10 Q. Conversations with who?
11 A. Guys that work on those trucks.
12 Q. When?
13 A. Ball games.
14 Q. Did you have any conversations with
15 the people that worked in those trucks when
16 you were down in Florida about how that
17 broadcast was being transmitted?
18 A. No.
19 Q. So with respect to the Fox broadcast
20 at issue, February 21, 2007, the only thing
21 that you have upon which you can base your
22 belief that somehow that -- that was
23 transmitted through New York to be distributed
24 to the national Fox audience or to be
25 broadcast to the national Fox audience is what
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 119 of 207
1 you describe as your view of common sense;
3 A. In part.
4 Q. Any other thing besides common
5 sense, Mr. O'Quinn?
6 A. The guys who told me who are
7 operating satellite trucks at ball games.
8 Q. Baseball games? Football games?
9 A. Yeah.
10 Q. But not this particular broadcast?
11 A. That's true.
12 Q. And were those Fox people or were
13 they other networks?
14 A. Network people. I can't recall
15 which network.
16 Q. So do you think that there's a delay
17 in the transmission of the -- you know, if
18 you're sitting there talking to Greta, do you
19 think there's a delay, for whatever reason,
20 before that interview is actually seen by the
21 public, common sense?
22 A. On a common sense level, I think --
23 I never thought -- there may be a delay.
24 Q. Well, doesn't there have to be?
25 A. Yeah, because suppose if something
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 120 of 207
1 like a naughty thing is said, they're supposed
2 to clip it out. If one of the guys starts
3 using "MF," words like that, I think there's a
4 way that the guy can -- they can sensor
5 themselves. There's a way they can say we
6 gotta bleep that or cut it off or something.
7 Because if it doesn't happen, then they've got
8 the FCCC -- FCC that I think has the power,
9 from what I understand, to climb all over the
10 network and say how could you have your guy,
11 let's say, Greta Van Susteren, your person,
12 your lady, say, "What do you think about the
13 MF guy?"
14 Q. So common sense tells you there's
15 some delay, however --
16 A. Yeah.
17 Q. -- brief?
18 A. There's another reason common sense.
19 I don't think the guy in the truck can send
20 that feed all by himself.
21 Q. So that you would admit that the
22 first person that heard your statements in
23 that interview would have been Greta Van
24 Susteren; true?
25 A. Probably.
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 121 of 207
1 Q. They were first published to Greta
2 Van Susteren; true?
3 A. Probably.
4 Q. In Florida; true?
5 A. Yes.
6 Q. Now, did you ever give an interview
7 sitting inside of a sound truck?
8 A. No.
9 Q. Are you sure about that?
10 A. I don't recall doing it.
11 Q. Can you explain why you make that
12 representation in your pleadings in this case?
13 A. I think there was a -- I did not
14 write the pleading.
15 Q. So a misunderstanding, perhaps?
16 A. I think it's a misunderstanding.
17 Q. Okay. You've given me your
18 recollection. It's clear that it was
19 somewhere outside the courthouse sitting with
20 Greta, not in a sound truck?
21 A. Correct. Near a sound truck.
22 Q. Near one?
23 A. But not in the sound truck.
24 Q. All right. So that for the purposes
25 of the -- of a clear record and corrected
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 122 of 207
1 record, you did not -- you do not have any
2 recollection of ever giving and interview in
3 Florida while sitting inside of a sound truck;
5 A. True.
6 Q. You recall the interview with Greta
7 and you recall giving an interview, answering
8 questions to Rita Cosby, I believe you said as
9 you were going up the courthouse steps or in
10 front of the court how?
11 A. My memory is I told you I couldn't
12 tell you whether it was inside the courthouse
13 or outside the courthouse, but I do recall it
14 was on the courthouse property.
15 Q. Did you actually stop and speak with
16 her and she had that mike and put it in front
17 of you to talk after she asked the questions?
18 A. I think -- boy, this is a real
19 stretch here. My memory's not really solid.
20 So I'm really speculating now; okay? But I
21 think because of the way things generally
22 happen, she wanted to interview me while I was
23 getting to court, but I always wanted to
24 get -- first get in the courtroom, get Vergie,
25 my client, in the courtroom in her chair, and
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 123 of 207
1 to find out from the staff when the judge was
2 going to be walking out there because I don't
3 like to walk in the courtroom late. I'm sure
4 you don't either. And so then the staff told
5 me, "Yeah, the judge probably won't be out
6 here for 15 minutes." I said, okay. Then --
7 this -- I'm just guessing, okay? And I would
8 have told the staff, "Well, look, I'm going to
9 go down the hall here and answer some
10 reporters' questions. If for some bizarre
11 reason the judge walks in in two minutes,
12 let's say, would you please tell him that I'm
13 not -- not here because I'm being insultive to
14 him, and send one of my colleagues out to find
15 me so I get myself back here immediately."
16 I think that's the way it went.
17 Now, it may -- it may have gone she wanted to
18 interview me and I said, "Look, I'll see you
19 at the end of the day or when we go to a lunch
20 break. I'll do it then. But I want it get to
21 court right now." And it may have been that
22 we were now leaving court for lunch and/or to
23 go back to the hotel and she's over --
24 remember, remember me, and, you know, and I
25 did tell you.
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 124 of 207
1 Q. Rita Cosby's not going to have a
2 reputation for being less than persistent?
3 A. Yes, and she was persistent. So it
4 may have happened that way, okay. Then that
5 could have well been outside the courthouse.
6 Q. Your best recollection is that it
7 was outside the courthouse?
8 A. I really don't have a best
10 Q. Were they allowing interviews inside
11 the courthouse?
12 A. Yeah, I think so.
13 Q. Not in the courtroom?
14 A. Oh, no.
15 Q. But in the hallways?
16 A. Yeah. The media -- the media owned
17 the courthouse. The judge had them all over
18 the courtroom. They weren't there to
19 interview people. They were there to listen
20 to him.
21 Q. Have you looked at a video of that
22 interview with Rita Cosby?
23 A. I've never seen it.
24 Q. Have you looked at the partial
25 excerpt of your comments that appear in the
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 125 of 207
1 complaint, of the transcript?
2 A. No. I probably did when I read the
3 complaint but not recently.
4 Q. Do you recall, in reviewing it,
5 believing that that portion of the transcript
6 that was recited in the complaint was
7 inaccurate in terms of what you said to Rita
9 A. Look, I don't know whether it's
10 accurate or not.
11 Q. You don't have any basis, as you sit
12 here today at least, to tell me it was
13 inaccurate, do?
14 A. Or tell you it was accurate.
15 Q. But what -- and you can't tell me
16 whether that interview was live or something
17 that was videoed and taped for later
18 broadcast? Didn't you tell me earlier you
19 didn't know whether it was live or not?
20 A. True.
21 Q. But in either event, if it was live
22 or certainly if it was taped for later
23 broadcast, the first person who heard you
24 utter the words in that interview would have
25 been Rita Cosby; true?
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 126 of 207
1 A. Probably.
2 Q. Published first to Rita Cosby in the
3 state of Florida; true?
4 A. Probably. I don't know for sure
5 because I don't know if it was an instant live
6 deal or not.
7 Q. But your best belief and
8 recollection is that it would be true, first
9 heard by Rita Cosby in Florida?
10 A. I'd say probably true.
11 (Plaintiff's Exhibit-4 was marked
12 for identification.)
13 Q. (By Mr. Wood) The court reporter is
14 going to hand you what's been marked for
15 purposes of identification, Mr. O'Quinn, as
16 Exhibit No. 4. Let you and Mr. Klein take a
17 look at that, Mr. McCabe.
18 Are you familiar with Exhibit 4,
19 Mr. O'Quinn?
20 A. And your question is?
21 Q. Are you familiar with that document?
22 A. I believe I've seen it before.
23 Q. And that's Don Clark who was -- he
24 he's a former FBI agent?
25 A. He is.
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 127 of 207
1 Q. And he was the investigator working
2 with you that we've talked about earlier, Don
3 K. Clark; true?
4 A. Yes.
5 Q. And were you aware that he sent this
6 letter to M. Krista Barth as part of your
7 representation of Vergie Arthur?
8 A. I am aware that he sent this letter.
9 Q. Now, he's not a lawyer, is he?
10 A. No, sir.
11 Q. Doesn't have a law degree, does he?
12 A. No, sir.
13 Q. What was the purpose of this letter,
14 as you understood it?
15 A. I assume the purpose is what's in
16 the letter.
17 Q. What did you understand that he was
18 saying to Ms. Barth on behalf your client,
19 Vergie Arthur?
20 A. He was saying what's in this letter.
21 Other than that, the words are pretty plain
22 English words and you can pretty well tell
23 what he's saying.
24 Q. Well, can we agree that it appears
25 that he is telling Ms. Barth that she has made
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 128 of 207
1 comments to the media in interviews about
2 Vergie Arthur and that The O'Quinn Law Firm is
3 considering filing a lawsuit against her for
4 defamation and potentially filing some action
5 with the Florida Bar with respect to ethics?
6 A. He says that.
7 Q. And you've read the letter. Is
8 there anything in that letter that you
9 disagree with as the attorney for Vergie
11 A. Your question again?
12 Q. Is there anything in that letter
13 that you disagree with, understanding that you
14 are the attorney for Vergie Arthur?
15 MR. KLEIN: That's a yes-or-no
16 question, John, because after that I'm
17 going to start asserting some objections.
18 THE WITNESS: No.
19 Q. (By Mr. Wood) Were you aware that
20 that letter was going to be sent to Ms. Barth
21 in Florida?
22 A. No.
23 Q. Do you see where it was apparently
24 sent to the Florida Bar in Tallahassee,
25 Florida, and the Office of Attorney General
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 129 of 207
1 Bill McCollum in Tallahassee, Florida?
2 A. I see that at the bottom of the
3 letter. I don't know whether it was sent or
5 Q. Well, based on your firm's ordinary
6 practices, would it be your belief that, in
7 fact, showing cc's to the Florida Bar in
8 Tallahassee and the Office of Attorney General
9 Bill McCollum in Tallahassee that in
10 likelihood that it was sent to those
12 A. I would believe that.
13 Q. And did you ever see the letter that
14 was written back by Ms. Barth to Mr. Clark?
15 A. I don't recall it. May I see it?
16 Q. Sure. Exhibit No. 5.
17 (Plaintiff's Exhibit-5 was marked
18 for identification.)
19 Q. (By Mr. Wood) Are you familiar
20 Exhibit No. 5?
21 A. Let me read it, please. Please
22 repeat your question.
23 Q. Are you familiar with Exhibit No. 5?
24 A. I don't recall it.
25 Q. You don't recall ever seeing that
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 130 of 207
1 before today?
2 A. No, sir.
3 Q. You see the first sentence, "I am in
4 receipt of your letter sent via e-mail to me
5 today"? The date of Ms. Barth's letter is
6 March 20, 2007. Are you with me so far?
7 A. I am with you.
8 Q. Exhibit 4 is undated. My question
9 is do you have any reason to dispute,
10 factually, that Mr. Clark sent Ms. Barth
11 Exhibit No. 4 on March the 20th, 2007, via
13 A. I have no reason factually to agree
14 or disagree with what you just said.
15 Q. And then back to Exhibit No. 4,
16 please, sir.
17 MR. KLEIN: Can we take a moment,
19 MR. WOOD: You want to take a break?
20 MR. KLEIN: Yes.
21 VIDEOGRAPHER: Off the record at
23 (Thereupon, there was an
24 interruption in the proceedings.)
25 VIDEOGRAPHER: The time is
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 131 of 207
1 approximately 12:06. We're back on video
2 record. You may continue.
3 Q. (By Mr. Wood) On Exhibit No. 4, the
4 third paragraph, sir, if you'll read with me,
5 "I am sure you are aware that the Florida
6 Rules of Professional Conduct and the Lawyer's
7 Creed would not sanction your conduct in the
8 very matter where the cause of the deaths of
9 two family members has yet to be determined."
10 Have I read that correctly?
11 A. I believe so.
12 Q. And do you have any reason to
13 disagree with the accuracy of that statement
14 in this letter as of its date, March 20, 2007?
15 MR. KLEIN: This is where we're
16 drawing the line. I've let him answer
17 the questions. I've given you the
18 benefit of the doubt that this is somehow
19 related to the -- the jurisdictional
20 issue as to what services were or were
21 not performed by John. I'm not going to
22 have him commenting on the merits of
23 statements that are written in letters,
24 anything that goes to the liability
25 issues in the case. The letter speaks
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 132 of 207
1 for itself, and I don't believe it's
2 appropriate for a jurisdictional
4 MR. WOOD: Well, just for the
5 record, and, again, I don't want to get
6 into too much colloquy here --
7 MR. KLEIN: Sure.
8 MR. WOOD: -- but this seems to me
9 to be at least susceptible to the Court
10 drawing the reasonable inference from it
11 that making statements to the media in a
12 matter where the cause of the death of
13 two family members has not yet to be
14 determined has been admitted by The
15 O'Quinn Law Firm's agent as being a
16 matter that would not be sanctioned by
17 the Florida Rules of Professional Conduct
18 and the Lawyer's Creed and Mr. O'Quinn
19 having been admitted pro hac vice to
20 Florida, and at least being alleged to
21 have done at least a similar act with his
22 comments about Mr. Stern in the media,
23 would go to the issue of jurisdiction of
24 Florida to deal with this situation.
25 And I think I'm right. And I think
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 133 of 207
1 I'm entitled to get the answer yes or no
2 whether he believes there's anything
3 inaccurate about that because it relates
4 to the Florida Rules of Professional
6 MR. KLEIN: And I certainly don't
7 want to interrupt you. Were you done?
8 MR. WOOD: Yeah.
9 MR. KLEIN: I certainly expect that
10 you'll make that argument. I certainly
11 expect you'll append this to your
12 responses, and we can join issue at some
13 point as a matter of law and fact whether
14 or not that's accurate or even relevant
15 to the jurisdictional issues. His
16 personal opinions and beliefs at this
17 point don't bear on that issue. And
18 that's why I've said that I want to avoid
19 turning this into a deposition on the
20 merits of the case.
21 MR. WOOD: I understand. And that's
22 why I'm limiting this to that portion of
23 the -- this letter, in part, if not in
24 its entirety, threatens action in Florida
25 by Mr. O'Quinn and his law firm against
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 134 of 207
1 Ms. Barth.
2 MR. KLEIN: Well, we can agree to
4 MR. WOOD: Well, "take whatever
5 legal actions necessary through the
6 Florida courts and the Florida Bar
8 MR. KLEIN: And, Lin, I don't want
9 to argue.
10 MR. WOOD: But one of the issues is
11 whether or not there are any contacts
12 that might cumulatively lead the Court to
13 conclude that Mr. O'Quinn should
14 reasonably understand that he may be held
15 himself to a Florida court.
16 MR. KLEIN: And the reason I said
17 I've already given you latitude is this
18 letter is not by Mr. O'Quinn. This
19 letter is by somebody employed by the
20 O'Quinn firm. The O'Quinn firm is not a
21 defendant here.
22 The question is whether Mr. O'Quinn
23 personally conducted activities that
24 would justify haling him into court. You
25 can certainly make the argument, which is
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 135 of 207
1 why I allowed the latitude, that to the
2 extent this was done under the auspices
3 of his firm or Mr. O'Quinn himself or
4 whether he had or did not have knowledge
5 of it, that's why I allowed that much
6 latitude, but to go beyond that into the
7 merits of what's said in the record, I
8 don't think it either necessary or
9 appropriate for jurisdictional.
10 MR. WOOD: Understanding that we
11 disagree, I believe it is a
12 jurisdictional question. And you
14 MR. KLEIN: I do.
15 MR. WOOD: The federal laws do not
16 allow you to make an instruction to a
17 witness to not answer a question.
18 MR. KLEIN: I fully understand that.
19 We can adjourn the deposition. I don't
20 want --
21 MR. WOOD: Or we can get an answer
22 and then if you believe it's beyond the
23 scope the judge won't let me use it,
24 which seems to me to be the more
25 sensible, economic way to do it.
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 136 of 207
1 MR. KLEIN: The third option is to
2 adjourn the deposition --
3 MR. WOOD: Which would make no sense
4 to any of us.
5 MR. KLEIN: If you move on to
6 another area. This is a very limited
7 area of questioning. We can get a ruling
8 from the Court as to whether or not this
9 is an area that is appropriate
10 questioning at this point. Because I
11 don't intend to let John sit here when
12 I've not prepared --
13 MR. WOOD: I don't mean to be rude.
14 I think I already have, if I -- it just
15 dawned on me that I have probably asked a
16 question to him just a few questions back
17 that covers the very specific but more
18 general area that I'm asking about. Hold
20 I'm going to withdraw the question.
21 We'll move on. I think I got it in
22 another question in the deposition.
23 Q. (By Mr. Wood) Do you have any
24 knowledge -- first-, second-, third-hand --
25 any knowledge whatsoever, Mr. O'Quinn, has as
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 137 of 207
1 to how Exhibit No. 4, the letter that
2 Mr. Clark sent on your law firm's letterhead
3 in connection with its client, Vergie Arthur,
4 as to how that letter got posted on an
5 Internet website?
6 A. No.
7 Q. Have you or your firm had any
8 involvement whatsoever in creating or
9 providing information to any website that
10 discusses the Anna Nicole Smith case?
11 A. Not to my knowledge.
12 Q. Is HowardSternamurderer.com, (sic)
13 have you ever seen that website?
14 A. No, sir.
15 Q. Or heard about it --
16 A. No.
17 Q. -- or heard about that address?
18 A. No.
19 Q. And you would have no knowledge
20 whatsoever as to how that letter got posted on
21 this website? Is that your testimony?
22 A. I don't even know it's posted.
23 Q. But assuming that I'm right or
24 assuming it's true it was posted --
25 A. I don't even know if it was posted.
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 138 of 207
1 Q. So you have no knowledge?
2 A. So obviously I have no knowledge.
3 MR. WOOD: Why don't we take a break
4 now and let him go ahead and switch
5 tapes. Let's take a break and we'll stay
6 on the same tape.
7 VIDEOGRAPHER: Off the record at
9 (Thereupon, there was an
10 interruption in the proceedings.)
11 VIDEOGRAPHER: The time is
12 approximately 12:31. This concludes Tape
13 No. 3. Off the video record.
14 (Thereupon, there was an
15 interruption in the proceedings.)
16 VIDEOGRAPHER: The time is
17 approximately 12:36. This marks the
18 beginning of Tape No. 4. We're back on
19 video record. You may continue.
20 Q. (By Mr. Wood) I apologize. I meant
21 to look while we were on break, I thought you
22 had told me earlier in the deposition,
23 Mr. O'Quinn, that you thought you had given
24 one print interview while you were in Florida?
25 A. I probably said that.
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 139 of 207
1 Q. Do you recall giving a print
2 interview while you were in Florida?
3 A. I think I gave one.
4 Q. And who do you believe that was
5 given to?
6 A. Don't -- don't recall.
7 Q. Where was it conducted?
8 A. In the courthouse or on the
9 courthouse property -- or on the courthouse
11 Q. Local newspaper?
12 A. No.
13 Q. Was it a newspaper?
14 A. Not sure.
15 Q. What was the subject matter of that
16 print interview?
17 A. The events of the day, how the case
18 was going.
19 Q. I'm assuming, but perhaps I'm
20 assuming incorrectly, but I'm assuming that
21 Vergie Arthur would have been besieged with
22 efforts by the members of the media to gain
23 access to her or to get her to give
25 A. I would assume the same.
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 140 of 207
1 Q. How many members of the media do you
2 believe you spoke with, even if only to say
3 that you were not going to comment or she had
4 no comment or you weren't going to do an
5 interview, while you were in Florida?
6 A. Many.
7 Q. In trying to calculate "many," I'm
8 sure you received numerous requests from the
9 same entities or individuals; right?
10 A. As you said earlier, some of them
11 are very persistent.
12 Q. I know Rita Cosby is.
13 A. They don't understand the word "no."
14 Q. Over the course of the two weeks you
15 were in Florida, would it be fair to say that
16 you probably had to field media inquiries, and
17 I'm not talking about giving interviews, print
18 or broadcast, but just fielding and handling
19 media inquiries, that that would number at
20 least in the hundreds?
21 A. It would be a total guess on my
22 part. If you include, which I think you're
23 including, where somebody in the media tried
24 to get me to do an interview --
25 Q. Yes.
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 141 of 207
1 A. -- and I said, "No comment," if
2 you're including that event.
3 Q. Yes. I'm talking about the number
4 of times somebody -- you had to speak to
5 somebody in the media about their -- its
6 request for an interview, his or her request
7 for an interview, or a comment or a statement.
8 A. Okay. There would be many times.
9 How many would be a complete guess on my part.
10 Q. Would they call you on the -- at the
12 A. That wasn't the main way. Maybe a
13 few times.
14 Q. What was the main way they would
15 call you?
16 A. See me at the courthouse or going to
17 the courthouse or coming from the courthouse.
18 Q. All in Florida?
19 A. Yeah.
20 Q. So given the crush that you
21 described, would it be fair, you believe, to
22 say that it was at least over a hundred?
23 A. I can't say it was over a hundred.
24 I would say it's over 50.
25 Q. Where -- what office -- where were
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 142 of 207
1 you working out of in terms of physical
2 location while you were here?
3 A. Generally, I worked out of the
4 hotel, worked in the hotel. Sometimes I'd be
5 at Mr. Tunstall's office. It was more or less
7 Q. Would it be fair to say that you
8 made numerous telephone calls from Florida
9 that related to your representation of Vergie
11 A. No.
12 Q. Did you make any phone calls from
13 Florida in connection with your representation
14 of Vergie Arthur?
15 A. Well, in connection with. For
16 example, I would call my secretary to do
17 things like tell her whether I was planning to
18 come in on the weekend or not and for numerous
19 other reasons, like who's phoned me today,
20 what's urgent going on in Houston that I need
21 to maybe find some way to take care of. There
22 were those kinds of phone calls.
23 As far as calling somebody other
24 than my secretary, I might, like, call
25 Mr. McCabe if he wasn't in Florida, either
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 143 of 207
1 look something up or go see Mr. Klein about
2 being our appellate lawyer, stuff like that.
3 Q. Was Mr. McCabe in Florida at various
4 times during the Seidlin proceedings?
5 A. Yes.
6 Q. I know you were there, Don Clark was
7 there, Mr. McCabe was there. Anyone else from
8 The O'Quinn Law Firm that was present
9 physically in the state of Florida in
10 connection with the firm's representation of
11 Vergie Arthur?
12 A. I don't believe so.
13 Q. I asked you earlier on but I need to
14 get a precise answer now, The O'Quinn Law
15 Firm, how is it set up as a legal entity?
16 A. This is what I've already told you.
17 Q. Yeah. And let me just -- this is
18 what I need to find out and I don't mean to
19 make it sound like a threat, it's an inquiry.
20 If someone were going to sue The
21 O'Quinn Law Firm, what would be the proper
22 entity to be sued?
23 A. An entity that has my name in it and
24 I think it also has the letters "LLP" or "LLC"
25 in it.
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 144 of 207
1 Q. So it would be The O'Quinn Law Firm,
2 LLP or The O'Quinn Law Firm, LLP (sic)?
3 A. John O'Quinn.
4 Q. John O'Quinn, LLP or John O'Quinn,
5 LLC, it's one of the two?
6 A. I believe so.
7 Q. So it would really be John O'Quinn,
8 either LLP or LLC, doing business as The
9 O'Quinn Law Firm? Does that sound right?
10 A. Yes. Also the part about John
11 O'Quinn LLP, I believe it's John O'Quinn &
13 Q. John O'Quinn & Associates, LLP,
14 doing business as The O'Quinn Law Firm?
15 A. That's not the way it's listed, I
16 don't think.
17 Q. I'm just looking -- you do business
18 as The O'Quinn Law Firm? I see that's what's
19 on your reception area and that's what's on
20 your letterhead.
21 A. This law firm does business under
22 the name of The O'Quinn Law Firm.
23 Q. What's the entity -- the legal
25 A. The one I just described to you.
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 145 of 207
1 Q. John O'Quinn & Associates, LLP?
2 A. Or.
3 Q. Or LLC, you're not sure which?
4 A. Correct.
5 Q. Okay. But that would be registered
6 with the State of Texas?
7 A. Yes.
8 Q. Who is Tom Pirtle?
9 A. He's a lawyer.
10 Q. Was he out there in Florida at any
11 time working with you?
12 A. Yes.
13 Q. Who was -- what law firm was he
15 A. Laminack, Pirtle & Martinez.
16 Q. Why was he involved in the Vergie
17 Arthur case, since he was no longer working
18 for The O'Quinn Law Firm, I take it?
19 A. Because he wanted to be involved.
20 Q. Why did he want to be involved?
21 A. Because he cared very much about
22 Ms. Arthur and her position in the case.
23 Q. But you didn't know Vergie Arthur
24 before you were approached by the FBI agent;
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 146 of 207
1 A. True.
2 Q. And you don't recall the FBI agent's
4 A. No, except he was the son of
5 Ms. Arthur.
6 Q. Did you know him prior to his
7 approach to you about representing Ms. Arthur?
8 A. I don't believe so. I may have met
9 him incidentally, but I don't believe so.
10 Q. How far into the process did
11 Mr. Pirtle get involved?
12 A. At times he actually participated in
13 the proceedings.
14 Q. On his own or on behalf of the
15 O'Quinn law firm?
16 A. On behalf of Vergie Arthur.
17 Q. Yeah. But I'm talking about in
18 terms of his -- was he working -- was he
19 associated by you, your law firm, to work on
20 the case?
21 A. He was associated by Mrs. Arthur.
22 Q. So he would have an engagement
23 directly with Ms. Arthur?
24 A. I don't know the details of that.
25 Let me say that he and I, we're in the same
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 147 of 207
1 building as you've already noticed; correct?
2 Q. Sure.
3 A. And we, from time to time, talked
4 and from time to times talked about what we're
5 working on, which is natural. I may say,
6 "Tom, what interesting cases are you working
7 on right now?" He said, "John, what
8 interesting case are you working on?"
9 "Tom it's a very unusual case for
10 me," and I started describing it to him. And
11 after I described it to him, he said I'd like
12 to work on that case too. I said, well, you
13 need to meet Ms. Arthur and get her okay.
14 Q. And did you arrange for them to
16 A. Yes.
17 Q. And where did they first meet, Texas
18 or Florida?
19 A. Texas.
20 Q. Did they ever meet -- well, they
21 obviously met in Florida?
22 A. Yeah.
23 Q. So that would have been before the
24 Seidlin hearings began?
25 A. No. During the Seidlin -- no, that
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 148 of 207
1 could have been before. I'm not sure.
2 Q. Is it possible that he flew out to
3 Florida and met with you and Ms. Arthur in
4 terms of being engaged to assist in the case?
5 A. I think it was otherwise.
6 Q. You think it was in Texas?
7 A. Yeah.
8 Q. Did you ever talk with a gentleman
9 while you were in Florida by the name of David
10 Lee with Splash?
11 A. What did you say?
12 Q. Did you ever speak, while you were
13 in Florida, with a gentleman by the name of
14 David Lee --
15 A. You said something else.
16 Q. -- associated with Splash?
17 A. Well, here's my problem. Many
18 people tried to speak to me. Even if I said,
19 "No Comment," I guess I've spoken to them. I
20 don't know.
21 Q. How about with any representatives
22 of American Media, Inc., that would be the
23 corporate entity that owns National Enquirer,
24 Globe, National Examiner, Star?
25 A. Same answer. A lot of people tried
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 149 of 207
1 to speak to me.
2 (Mr. Pirtle entered the deposition
4 MR. PIRTLE: I brought you two ham
5 sandwiches and a tuna salad.
6 THE WITNESS: There's Mr. Tom
7 Pirtle. How you doing, Tom? This is
8 Mr. Klein, remember him?
9 MR. KLEIN: Hey, Tom.
10 MR. PIRTLE: I know Rob Klein.
11 THE WITNESS: That's Mr. Lin Wood.
12 MR. PIRTLE: Hi.
13 MR. WOOD: How are you, sir?
14 MR. PIRTLE: I'm Tom Pirtle.
15 MS. BARTH: Hi, Tom. You know me.
16 MR. PIRTLE: I do know you.
17 MS. BARTH: You do know me.
18 MR. PIRTLE: I didn't think anybody
19 here would know me. I'm going to sit
20 here and watch. I'm of record.
21 MR. WOOD: Okay. Of record doing
22 what? I didn't catch your name. I
24 MR. KLEIN: This is the Tom Pirtle
25 you were talking about.
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 150 of 207
1 MR. WOOD: Oh, you're Tom Pirtle.
2 THE WITNESS: The last question
3 concerns you.
4 MR. PIRTLE: You should have said my
5 name three times --
6 MR. WOOD: Three times anywhere.
7 I'm going to be in my office in Atlanta
8 and say Tom Pirtle three times and see if
9 you appear.
10 THE WITNESS: I'm going to ask
11 somebody to read back the last question
12 and last answer where I said something
13 real nice about you.
14 MR. WOOD: Well, we were trying to
15 figure out where you first met
16 Ms. Arthur, whether it was flying out to
17 Florida and met her the first time there
18 or whether it was in Texas.
19 MR. KLEIN: Don't start testifying.
20 MR. WOOD: That was what we were
21 asking about.
22 THE WITNESS: Be quiet.
23 MR. PIRTLE: Okay.
24 MR. WOOD: It was a good try.
25 THE WITNESS: Your deposition is not
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 151 of 207
1 being taken.
2 MR. WOOD: Not today. I think I had
3 a question on the floor. Let's see if we
4 got it.
5 MR. KLEIN: You do, about the
6 American --
7 THE WITNESS: Right. It's the same
8 answer, Mr. Wood. I can't swear that I
9 didn't speak at least briefly to that
10 person. I don't have any memory of doing
11 something with the National Enquirer. I
12 think if -- if I had given an interview
13 to National Enquirer, I'd remember that
14 because it's such a famous name, you know
15 what I mean. And, frankly, because it's
16 not somebody I would probably want to
17 give an interview to because, without
18 trying to comment on everybody, I just
19 don't have much respect for that
20 publication. That's just me talking. I
21 know a lot of people read that
23 Q. (By Mr. Wood) Did you ever fax out
24 a copy of the wills, Anna Nicole Smith's
25 wills, to any entity from Florida?
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 152 of 207
1 A. No.
2 Q. You're positive of that?
3 A. Yes.
4 Q. And did anybody at your direction or
5 request fax out the will to anyone from
7 A. No.
8 THE WITNESS: How you doing, Tom.
9 MR. PIRTLE: I'm doing good.
10 THE WITNESS: Isn't this stinking
12 MR. PIRTLE: I'm thinking Pebble
14 THE WITNESS: Hey, you going?
15 MR. PIRTLE: I'll come out later.
16 THE WITNESS: Good, we'll have a
17 good time. We're going to have a good
19 Q. (By Mr. Wood) Do you have any
20 recollection of being in an automobile with
21 David Lee and Ms. Arthur going over to the
22 medical examiner's office?
23 A. Me?
24 Q. Yes, sir.
25 A. No.
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 153 of 207
1 Q. Let me look and see if I got an
2 answer to this. I was trying to make sure I
3 covered everybody from the law firm that was
4 over there.
5 A. You did.
6 Q. It was Mr. McCabe, you and your
7 investigator; right?
8 A. Right.
9 Q. No one else?
10 A. Not to my memory. If y'all can
11 describe it in some way, I might help you, but
12 that's my memory.
13 Q. Did Don Clark associate anyone to
14 help out in his investigation?
15 A. Not to my knowledge.
16 Q. You never met anyone by the name of
18 A. One more time? What?
19 Q. Did you ever meet anyone by the name
20 of Wilma that was in any way assisting
21 Mr. Clark?
22 A. No. Is that a female name?
23 Q. It sounds like it to me.
24 A. But no.
25 Q. Just reading my note.
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 154 of 207
1 A. No.
2 Q. You've given me the print interview,
3 everything you remembered about it; right? It
4 candidly wasn't much but you know you gave a
5 print interview in Florida?
6 A. No. I never said -- see, this is
7 what's bothering me about this deposition.
8 Q. Tell me what that is.
9 A. You ask me a question, I give you an
10 answer, and then ten minutes later you ask me
11 the same question, you load it up with a
12 different answer than I gave you.
13 Q. You don't think I tried to load it
14 up to be anything inaccurate?
15 A. Some lawyers like to see if they can
16 get an answer they want.
17 The answer, sir, for the third time
18 on this subject is I think I may have given an
19 interview to print media. I'm not sure.
20 Q. Well, let's just see, because I just
21 want to find out, sir, how many interviews you
22 gave in your role as media spokesman for
23 Vergie Arthur while you were in Florida.
24 You told me for sure you gave one to
25 Rita Cosby. You told me for sure you gave one
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 155 of 207
1 to Greta Van Susteren. You tell me now you
2 may have given one to some member of the print
3 media; right?
4 A. Right.
5 Q. Now, I don't want to load this up
6 for you, please, sir. I just want an answer.
7 A. I gave you the answer.
8 Q. Let me ask you. Did you give any
9 other interviews or participate in any other
10 interviews in Florida other than the two you
11 say you remember and the one you say you may
12 have given?
13 A. No.
14 Q. How is it that you are -- that you
15 are confident to say no?
16 A. That's my memory.
17 Q. Is there any chance that you gave
18 other interviews that you may not recall, as
19 you sit here today, while you were in Florida?
20 A. Possible, yes. I guess it's
22 Q. I mean, do you recall ever giving
23 any interviews to Court TV while you were in
25 A. No.
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 156 of 207
1 Q. I think you've told me that you
2 had -- you and your law firm had no role in
3 negotiating any types of deals for Vergie
4 Arthur with any member of the media?
5 A. I've already said that.
6 Q. I think you told me you did not;
8 A. Yeah.
9 MR. KLEIN: He did. Just about two
10 hours ago.
11 MR. WOOD: I thought I remembered it
12 correctly. I just wanted to make sure.
13 MR. KLEIN: Am I missing something
14 or do you not have those transcripts
15 coming up on your computer screen?
16 MR. WOOD: I have the transcript but
17 I didn't -- in trying to move it along, I
18 didn't want to take the time to go back
19 and scroll and find it.
20 MR. KLEIN: I may not be as accurate
21 as your computer, but my recollection is
22 you did.
23 THE WITNESS: You did.
24 MR. WOOD: It's mine too.
25 Just so I've made this record, Rob,
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 157 of 207
1 would you identify for me the names and,
2 if known, the addresses of any witness
3 interviewed by Mr. Clark in Florida in
4 connection with your firm's
5 representation of Vergie Arthur?
6 MR. KLEIN: And we've said that's
7 part of privilege, although I believe he
8 already answered that he didn't have any
9 knowledge as to who he may have
10 interviewed. In other words, I don't
11 want to make a record on something that's
12 going to be academic --
13 THE WITNESS: I thought we just had
14 a conversation he could ask about the
15 scope of certain things but not about who
16 he interviewed.
17 MR. KLEIN: Right. And all I'm
18 suggesting is if you didn't know, I don't
19 want to make a federal case, literally --
20 MR. WOOD: Of who he interviewed in
21 a federal case.
22 MR. KLEIN: Right.
23 Q. (By Mr. Wood) Do you know who he
25 A. No.
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 158 of 207
1 MR. KLEIN: That's -- that's my
3 Q. (By Mr. Wood) Did you ever meet --
4 did you ever meet with Ford Shelly?
5 A. Name came up in the proceedings. I
6 never met with him in any sense of the word
7 "meet" with the guy. If he showed up in the
8 courtroom and said hello to me, I may have
9 said hello to him, but I don't remember that
10 happening. I do remember his name came up in
11 the course of the proceedings. I don't know
12 whether it came up because he was a witness or
13 it came up because somebody said that he had
14 done something. That's about all I remember
15 about that.
16 Q. Did you ever meet in Florida with
17 Debra Opri, the attorney for Mr. Birkhead,
18 outside of being in the courtroom with her?
19 A. No.
20 Q. Did you send or receive any e-mails
21 while you were in Florida that related to your
22 representation of Vergie Arthur?
23 A. I sent none.
24 Q. Did you receive any?
25 A. I doubt it.
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 159 of 207
1 Q. Why do you doubt it?
2 A. Because I am e-mail ignorant. I'm
3 under oath, am I not?
4 Q. I'm sorry?
5 A. I'm under oath. I am e-mail
6 ignorant. I'm not proud of that fact, but I
7 grew up in a different generation. We didn't
8 even have handheld calculators when I grew up.
9 Q. Let me suggest to you --
10 A. We used slide rules.
11 Q. You're not that much older than I
12 am. How would are you?
13 A. Don't worry about it. I'm old
14 enough to be able to make that statement.
15 It's the truth.
16 Q. That may be a virtue of the e-mail.
17 So the answer is you didn't have --
18 do you have an e-mail address?
19 A. No.
20 Q. That probably says that you didn't
21 receive or send any, period.
22 A. Right.
23 Q. Okay. Do you know whether any
24 member of your firm, Mr. McCabe or Mr. Clark,
25 received any e-mails or sent any e-mails?
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 160 of 207
1 A. No, sir.
2 Q. You don't know one way or the other;
4 A. Right.
5 THE WITNESS: You're laughing,
6 aren't you?
7 MR. PIRTLE: I am laughing.
8 THE WITNESS: You're having fun,
9 aren't you?
10 MR. PIRTLE: That question was fun.
11 MR. WOOD: Which one?
12 MR. PIRTLE: Knowing him like I know
14 THE WITNESS: That's what he's
15 laughing about.
16 MR. KLEIN: That's why we were both
18 Q. (By Mr. Wood) Other than in
19 connection with your attendance at the
20 proceedings before Judge Seidlin and your
21 appearance at the appellate argument, have you
22 made any other trips to Florida in connection
23 with your representation of Vergie Arthur?
24 A. I don't believe so. I will say
25 this: If you go to the Bahamas and you try to
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 161 of 207
1 come back to the United States, you have to
2 stop in Florida to clear customs. So that did
3 happen on occasions.
4 Q. And in any of those stops in
5 Florida, did you take the opportunity to have
6 any meetings or conduct any business other --
7 other than just a stop and take back off
9 A. And clear customs.
10 Q. And clear customs?
11 A. No, sir.
12 Q. Did your -- did your plane stay in
13 Florida while you were there?
14 A. Sometimes yes; sometimes no.
15 Q. And the pilots too?
16 A. Uh-huh (affirmative).
17 Q. They stay with the plane, don't
19 A. Oh, yeah.
20 Q. And, in fact, they stay in Florida
21 and then you pay the expenses for them to stay
22 in the hotels in Florida while they're there?
23 A. Correct. Well, actually, I don't
24 pay them.
25 Q. Who pays them?
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 162 of 207
1 A. Excellent Aviation.
2 Q. Do you have some sort of agreement
3 with that firm?
4 A. Yeah.
5 Q. So you pay -- what's the name of the
7 A. Excellent Aviation.
8 Q. Located where?
9 A. Houston, Texas.
10 Q. Is that part of the $400,000, the
11 cost of the plane and the pilots?
12 A. Yeah, I believe so.
13 Q. And is that arrangement with The
14 O'Quinn Law Firm or is it with you, John
16 A. With the O'Quinn Law Firm.
17 Q. What was the name of the -- you may
18 not know this, but tell me who could tell me
19 the name of the limousine service that you
20 used for ground transportation in Florida?
21 A. I don't know.
22 Q. Somebody in your office would know
23 that or it would be in the receipts?
24 A. True.
25 Q. You were in Florida for the time
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 163 of 207
1 period that you've described, engaged in the
2 practice of law on behalf Vergie Arthur; true?
3 A. I was in from Florida, and for the
4 period of time we've discussed, representing
5 Vergie Arthur in one lawsuit and that's what I
6 was doing.
7 Q. Right. In connection with the
8 matter that you were in Florida with, you
9 acknowledge that you were, in fact, practicing
10 law in Florida with respect to that case;
12 A. I was acting as her lawyer.
13 Q. Practicing law. You know what that
14 means, don't you?
15 A. Well, practicing law sounds a lot
16 more extensive than just representing one
17 person on a pro hac vice basis in one case.
18 Q. You couldn't be doing anything other
19 than practicing law in that one case, could
20 you? Isn't that what you were doing in
21 Florida for her, practicing your profession?
22 A. It's a quibble without importance
23 unless --
24 Q. Would you answer my question,
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 164 of 207
1 A. The answer is the answer I gave you.
3 Q. Is the answer, yes, Mr. Wood I was,
4 in fact, practicing law in Florida in
5 connection with this case for Vergie Arthur?
6 A. The answer, sir, is yes, Mr. Wood --
7 Q. Thank you.
8 A. -- I was representing Vergie Arthur
9 as her attorney in a court in Florida on a pro
10 hac vice basis only.
11 Q. Do you have any arrangements with
12 any entity to repay you this $400,000 that you
13 spent in an effort to assist this FBI agent
14 and Ms. Arthur?
15 A. No, sir.
16 Q. In any of your class action
17 lawsuits, Mr. O'Quinn, have you had occasion
18 to have involved Florida residents as members
19 of the class of plaintiffs?
20 A. My law firm and the Florida counsel
21 had occasion to represent some Florida
22 citizens as the named plaintiffs in a class
23 action in Florida.
24 Q. Just one?
25 A. True.
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 165 of 207
1 Q. What class -- what case was that?
2 What did it involve?
3 A. The case is the named plaintiffs and
4 the class against Wal-Mart.
5 Q. Do you know -- are you aware of any
6 witnesses with respect to the circumstances
7 surrounding the deaths of either Anna Nicole
8 Smith or Daniel Smith, her son?
9 MR. KLEIN: Why is that relevant to
10 the jurisdiction?
11 MR. WOOD: I hadn't gotten finished
13 MR. KLEIN: I'm sorry.
14 MR. WOOD: That's all right. Let me
15 go back. And I can -- I can help you
16 because I understand where you're going.
17 This -- this goes to the issue of foreign
18 non-convenience which is, I interpret, to
19 be part of the jurisdictional deposition.
20 Let me go back.
21 Q. (By Mr. Wood) Can you identify for
22 me, sir -- strike that.
23 Are you aware of any witnesses to
24 the circumstances surrounding the deaths of
25 either Anna Nicole Smith or Daniel Smith who
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 166 of 207
1 reside in the state of Texas?
2 MR. KLEIN: We're not going to talk
3 about who, when or where. You understand
4 what the question is?
5 THE WITNESS: On that limited basis?
6 MR. KLEIN: Uh-huh (affirmative).
7 THE WITNESS: The answer is no.
8 Q. (By Mr. Wood) Do you recall giving
9 an interview the night before the funeral of
10 Anna Nicole Smith to Nancy Grace?
11 A. Not particularly.
12 Q. You gave a number of interviews that
13 we've described, at least attempted to
14 describe, in part in our complaint. You're
15 aware of that?
16 A. I gave some interviews. Nancy Grace
17 asked me to be interviewed on her show several
19 Q. Where did you do the interviews
21 A. Houston.
22 Q. Where in Houston?
23 A. At a studio here that they picked,
24 her TV show, whatever it is, you know.
25 Q. National television show?
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 167 of 207
1 A. Yeah.
2 Q. Do you know where she was physically
3 located at the time she did the interview?
4 A. Yeah.
5 Q. Where was she?
6 A. New York City.
7 Q. And did you ever give any
8 interviews -- remote interviews -- do you know
9 what that is?
10 A. I gather that's what I'm talking
11 about now where I'm in Houston and she's in
12 New York City.
13 Q. You're somewhere else and the person
14 who's interviewing is somewhere else?
15 A. Right.
16 Q. Do you know whether you ever gave
17 any remote interviews with respect to your
18 representation of Vergie Arthur where the
19 interviewer was in Florida at the time that
20 you participated in the interview?
21 A. To my knowledge, there are none.
22 Q. The interviews that you gave --
23 A. Time out. Time out.
24 Q. Sure.
25 VIDEOGRAPHER: Off the record?
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 168 of 207
1 THE WITNESS: No. I want to stay on
2 the record. We've talked about that Matt
3 Lowery interviewed me.
4 Q. (By Mr. Wood) Yes.
5 A. I think Matt Lowery was in New York
6 City when he interviewed me.
7 Q. And where were you?
8 A. I think I was at the hotel in Fort
10 Q. Okay. Would that interview have
11 taken place during the time period where you
12 were there for the Seidlin hearings?
13 A. I believe so.
14 Q. And how did it -- how did it come
15 to -- you say you were at the hotel. Did they
16 set up a conference room and bring in their
17 camera people and set it all up?
18 A. It wasn't that fancy.
19 Q. How fancy was it?
20 A. It was in the lobby.
21 Q. They got you in the lobby?
22 A. Yeah. They had a camera.
23 Q. Camera in the lobby and you had an
24 earpiece listening to Matt from New York
25 interviewing you?
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 169 of 207
1 A. Right.
2 Q. Was that a live interview on The
3 Today Show?
4 A. I don't know.
5 Q. What did you think?
6 A. Well, how live is The Today Show? I
7 mean, when I see the first hour of The Today
8 Show in Houston, Texas, it's really the second
9 hour of The Today Show. And when I watch the
10 second hour of The Today Show in Houston,
11 Texas, it's the first hour that somebody taped
12 and now they're showing it to me.
13 Q. What was your understanding when you
14 did the interview of whether it was being
15 broadcast live at the time of the interview?
16 A. I didn't have an understanding.
17 Q. You just new it was going to be an
18 interview that would be broadcast to the
19 nation on the NBC Today Show?
20 A. That's what I believed.
21 Q. Right. You knew that all of these
22 interviews were going to be broadcast
23 nationally, didn't you, sir?
24 MR. KLEIN: You've asked him that.
25 THE WITNESS: Yeah, I've answered it
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 170 of 207
1 four times.
2 MR. WOOD: I don't think I've asked
3 him about all these interviews.
4 MR. KLEIN: Yeah, you did.
5 MR. WOOD: I'll go through them
6 individually to be clear on the record.
7 THE WITNESS: I believe --
8 Q. (By Mr. Wood) Let's do it
9 individually on the record to be clear.
10 March 1, 2007, interview with Nancy
11 Grace on CNN Headline News, Nancy Grace Show.
12 You recall doing an interview with
13 Nancy Grace, I believe you told me.
14 MR. KLEIN: Yes, he did.
15 THE WITNESS: Wait a second. What
16 was the -- what was the question he
18 Q. (By Mr. Wood) I think you told me
19 you did an interview with Nancy Grace.
20 MR. KLEIN: He did.
21 Q. (By Mr. Wood) And I'm now asking
22 you more specifically.
23 An interview done on March 1, 2007,
24 with Nancy Grace CNN Headline News, The Nancy
25 Grace Show.
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 171 of 207
1 Do you recall doing that interview?
2 A. I recall doing interviews with her
3 but I don't recall the dates.
4 Q. You knew that interview would be
5 broadcast nationally, including being
6 broadcast in the state of Florida; true?
7 A. I believe so.
8 Q. You did an interview on or about
9 March 15, 2007, with Greta Van Susteren.
10 Do you recall that interview?
11 A. Is that the one we've already talked
13 Q. No. This is another one. You did
14 more than one interview with Greta Van
15 Susteren, didn't you?
16 A. I've already acknowledged that.
17 Q. Can we maybe just draw a circle
18 around any interview you gave to Greta Van
19 Susteren for her show On The Record with Greta
20 Van Susteren broadcast on Fox News you knew
21 would be a national broadcast that would be
22 broadcast in the state of Florida; true?
23 A. I believe that.
24 Q. You believe that to be true?
25 A. I believe that that would be the
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 172 of 207
2 Q. And the same would be true with any
3 interview you did -- you did more than one
4 interview with Nancy Grace, didn't you?
5 A. Correct.
6 Q. And, again, the same thing would be
7 true with Nancy that was true with Greta --
8 A. Correct.
9 Q. -- that the interviews you
10 participated in you knew would be broadcast
11 nationally including the state of Florida,
13 A. I believe that would be the
15 MR. WOOD: All right. Let's take a
16 break. See what else I've got, if
18 VIDEOGRAPHER: Off the record at
19 1:14. This concludes Tape No. 4.
20 (Thereupon, there was an
21 interruption in the proceedings.)
22 (Plaintiff's Exhibit-6 was marked
23 for identification.)
24 VIDEOGRAPHER: The time is
25 approximately 1:28. This marks the
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 173 of 207
1 beginning of Tape No. 5. We're back on
2 video record. You may continue.
3 Q. (By Mr. Wood) I hand you what's
4 been marked for purposes of identification to
5 your deposition as Exhibit 6, and I'll
6 represent to you it is a copy of a decision
7 from Westlaw, Brown & Bain, PA versus O'Quinn,
8 John M. O'Quinn an individual and John M.
9 O'Quinn & Associates, LLP and others.
10 Are you familiar with that
11 litigation, sir?
12 A. Yes.
13 Q. Does this help figure out the entity
14 that is the law firm that you practice law
15 with? It talks about John M. O'Quinn &
16 Associates, LLP, and then it's got John M.
17 O'Quinn, PC.
18 Does that PC still exist?
19 MR. KLEIN: Well, we haven't
20 answered the first question yet.
21 MR. WOOD: No, we haven't.
22 THE WITNESS: In part.
23 MR. KLEIN: Can I make a suggestion
24 since --
25 MR. WOOD: I'm going to do it
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 174 of 207
1 quicker, if I can.
2 Q. (By Mr. Wood) In terms of your
3 representation of Vergie Arthur, I think you
4 told me you were representing her on behalf of
5 John M. O'Quinn & Associates, LLP, and I guess
6 what I --
7 A. Right.
8 Q. -- want to make sure of is whether
9 any of your representation of Ms. Arthur also
10 involved John M. O'Quinn, PC, or John M.
11 O'Quinn Law Firm, PLLC or --
12 A. You want the other name?
13 Q. You told me O'Quinn, Kerensky --
14 A. Don't worry about that one.
15 Q. That was already done before Vergie
16 Arthur; right?
17 A. That was over with.
18 Q. I just need the other ones.
19 A. Look, the LLP. The professional,
20 no. I'm not certain about Law Firm, PLLC.
21 This is only a guesstimate now, only a guess,
22 because I'm not a transaction lawyer. But I
23 believe that under Texas law when you have an
24 LLP, you have to have something called a
25 managing member. It's like a limited
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 175 of 207
2 Have you ever been in a limited
3 partnership where you've got in name called
4 the LP, the limited partnership, and then it
5 will have a general partner? That general
6 partner may not be any of the investors. It
7 might be some entity that has a similar name
8 as the limited partnership and it functions as
9 the general partner, whereas the investors
10 function as limited partner.
11 I think in doing the LLP, the same
12 type of thinking applies. There has to be
13 something that says, in effect, like a general
14 partner. I think a general partner is the
15 John M. O'Quinn Law Firm, PLLC.
16 Are you following me, sir?
17 Q. I am.
18 A. Okay. Those two names would be
19 relevant to my representation of Mrs. Arthur.
20 The other name would not be relevant. Do you
21 understand what I'm saying?
22 Q. Yeah. John M. O'Quinn, PC, you do
23 not think would be relevant?
24 A. True.
25 Q. But you think John M. O'Quinn &
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 176 of 207
1 Associates, LLP, and John M. O'Quinn Law Firm,
2 PLLC would be?
3 A. True. And I think also O'Quinn,
4 Kerensky & McAnnich is not relevant.
5 Q. Correct. I understand that.
6 A. And Jane Doe is not relevant.
7 Q. I don't know Jane Doe O'Quinn. You
8 don't know her, do you?
9 You litigated that case
10 individually, and obviously your law firm did,
11 in the state of Arizona; true?
12 A. True.
13 Q. Federal court in Arizona.
14 And were you able to do so without
15 any undue burdens?
16 A. No.
17 Q. What was burdensome about you
18 defending that lawsuit in Arizona?
19 MR. KLEIN: Why is that relevant to
21 MR. WOOD: Well, I think I'm
22 entitled to find out if it's burdensome
23 to litigate the case in Florida and it's
24 a question about the fact he's
25 litigated -- defended himself in other
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 177 of 207
1 states and was able to do so.
2 MR. KLEIN: Can we agree that's
3 argumentative? It's not a question.
4 MR. WOOD: Let's do it this way. My
5 theory of putting it together may be
6 argumentative, but I think my question
7 was okay.
8 Q. (By Mr. Wood) I mean, do you --
9 what is -- was the burden that you can
10 describe for me as having to defend this
11 lawsuit on your behalf in the state of
13 A. It's not where I live. It is not
14 where I work. It's not where I am at.
15 Q. I'm sorry not where you're what?
16 A. Florida is not where I'm at for any
17 reason. I don't have a ranch there. I don't
18 have a condo there. I've got nothing to do
20 Q. Nothing named after you there?
21 A. That's also true, but that's not the
22 reason why it's a burden.
23 Q. Well, it's not a financial burden,
24 is it, sir?
25 A. Well, we're not finished yet. So
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 178 of 207
1 now, with all due respect to this gentleman
2 who I have great respect for, if this case
3 were in Houston, I'd have a Houston lawyer to
4 represent me.
5 Q. Well, do you have Mr. McCabe of
7 A. Well, I'd have a --
8 Q. True?
9 A. Mr. McCabe is not going to try this
10 case. I don't know what his role is. It's up
11 to Mr. Klein to explain what his role is.
12 But I'd have a Houston law firm --
13 pardon me -- and when it came time to take my
14 deposition, my lawyer wouldn't have to fly on
15 an airplane. Just this trip, I expect there's
16 going to be a lot of extra hours because it
17 wasn't just a normal flight. This has become
18 a very unnormal flight. It's been a burden to
19 him too. And if I had a Houston law firm here
20 and I wanted talk to them or they wanted to
21 talk to me, I could just -- they're probably
22 downtown, I'm downtown. I could probably get
23 over there in ten minutes, be sitting in an
24 office. It's certainly a heck of a lot more
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 179 of 207
1 Q. For you?
2 A. Yeah.
3 Q. It wouldn't be financial burden on
4 you, though, in terms of if you -- in terms of
5 paying for Mr. Klein or paying to have the
6 case defended and investigated and handled.
7 You can afford that, can't you, sir?
8 A. That's not the issue.
9 Q. That's my question. It's not a
10 financial burden on you?
11 A. It is a financial burden.
12 Q. Well, it's a financial cost that you
13 would prefer not to incur, but what's the
14 financial burden? Is it too expensive to
15 litigate in Florida for your pocketbook? Is
16 that what you're telling me?
17 A. It's a lot more expensive.
18 Q. Can you afford it?
19 A. Based on how the stock market's
20 doing today, I'm not sure.
21 Q. Well, based on the historical record
22 of the stock market, what goes up usually goes
23 down and what goes down, usually goes back up.
24 My question is?
25 A. He's not going to want to wait for
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 180 of 207
1 his bills to be paid until it goes back up,
2 probably. Can I have a deal --
3 MR. KLEIN: That I don't get paid
4 until the market goes up? I think my
5 partners would be thrilled.
6 Q. (By Mr. Wood) So what's the answer
7 to the question? Yes, Mr. Wood, I can afford
8 it or no, Mr. Wood, I cannot?
9 A. As whether I can pay for it?
10 Q. To defend the case in Florida?
11 A. Even if it was a lot more than
13 Q. Yes.
14 A. Probably.
15 Q. Okay. Other than you, when you say
16 it's not convenient, who else do you believe
17 it would be inconvenient for to be in Florida?
18 Certainly -- you admit there are a lot of
19 witnesses who reside in the state of Florida
20 on the question of the circumstances
21 surrounding Anna Nicole Smith's death? You
22 recognize and acknowledge that, do you not?
23 A. No, I don't recognize and
24 acknowledge that.
25 Q. You don't?
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 181 of 207
1 A. Not the way you phrased it.
2 Q. You told me there were no
3 witnesses --
4 A. I didn't say that.
5 Q. -- surrounding her death in Texas --
6 MR. KLEIN: Let him finish.
7 Q. (By Mr. Wood) You told me there
8 were no witnesses to the circumstances
9 sounding her death who reside in Texas, to
10 your knowledge; true?
11 A. No eyewitnesses.
12 Q. Well, witnesses to the circumstances
13 surrounding --
14 A. Mr. Clark may be a witness.
15 Q. Who?
16 A. Mr. Clark may be a witness.
17 Q. All right.
18 A. Possibly. It would be Mr. Klein's
19 decision, but, I mean, he knows things. He's
20 investigated things. It might be that
21 Mr. Pirtle might be a witness.
22 Q. Mr. Pirtle?
23 A. Yeah.
24 Q. Who's of record in the case as one
25 of your lawyers?
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 182 of 207
1 A. No. Yes. Is he?
2 Q. I mean, he said he's of record. I
3 didn't question it.
4 A. I didn't know that.
5 Q. You've got two Houston lawyers
6 representing you in this case: Mr. McCabe and
7 Mr. Pirtle.
8 A. You know he was there when I was
9 there, at least part of the time.
10 Q. I'm not talking about -- I'm talking
11 about the circumstances that go to -- to the
12 alleged false and defamatory statements about
13 Mr. Stern.
14 Any eye -- you told me there were no
15 eyewitnesses in Texas; right?
16 A. Sir?
17 Q. And no eyewitnesses in California;
18 right? There are no eyewitnesses in New York;
20 A. What is eyewitnesses? On the
21 various subjects?
22 Q. I'm sorry.
23 A. On various subjects there are
25 Q. What subjects?
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 183 of 207
1 A. Well, your client's a public figure.
2 The burden is it has to be shown that I acted
3 out of malice. In effect, I had no -- it's
4 not negligence. It's a lot worse than
5 negligence. That man right down there,
6 Mr. Pirtle, he had his own judgment about some
7 of these issues.
8 Q. Well, I appreciate --
9 A. He might well be a witness. Based
10 on what I know, that was a reasonable
12 Q. Well, he's --
13 A. I haven't interviewed him --
14 Q. I'm assuming he can be in Florida.
15 A. Mr. McCabe might have to be a
17 Q. I appreciate your understanding of
18 the law of libel, I understand it.
19 Now, let me ask you the question:
20 Are you aware of any eyewitnesses to the
21 circumstances surrounding the death of Anna
22 Nicole Smith who reside in any state, to your
23 knowledge, other than the state of Florida?
24 A. The Bahamas.
25 Q. Anywhere else?
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 184 of 207
1 A. The pharmacists, druggists, and
2 doctors that prescribed certain medications
3 who, as I understand, are not in Florida.
4 Q. Not in Texas?
5 A. Not in Florida.
6 Q. Do you know where they are?
7 A. I think they're in -- in other
8 states but I'm not sure.
9 Q. Is that it?
10 A. Let's see. I haven't thought about
11 it. I don't know. I'm not a trial lawyer. I
12 don't know what set of witnesses Mr. Klein is
13 going to put together. He probably doesn't
14 know himself. He possibly hasn't finished his
15 study of what you guys would call a trial on
16 the merits.
17 And I understand there are people
18 in -- what about Mrs. Arthur? She might need
19 to be a witness in this matter. She lives in
20 Houston. What about her husband, James
21 Arthur? He lives in Houston. They might well
22 be witnesses on something that Mr. Klein wants
23 to present.
24 And for me to sit here and say on
25 that subject all the possible witnesses, I
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 185 of 207
1 can't say that, not until at least Mr. Klein
2 finishes his analysis and tells me who there
3 might be around that could testify about A, B,
4 C, or D. I honestly believe there are
5 witnesses in Texas. There are people that
6 will need to be at this trial, either as a
7 witness or otherwise, who are in Texas,
8 because they were at the proceedings that
9 happened in Florida.
10 Q. Well, the proceedings and what
11 happened in Florida, sir, I was asking about
12 eyewitnesses to the circumstances surrounding
13 the death of Anna Nicole Smith. Did you
14 understand my question? Not eyewitnesses to
15 the proceedings in Florida.
16 A. Okay. If you're just talking about
17 that one subject --
18 Q. Yes.
19 A. Eyewitness, to my knowledge, there
20 are no eyewitnesses in Florida or in Texas.
21 Q. To the circumstances surrounding her
23 A. That's my understanding. She was an
24 eyewitness, but she's dead. Stern was an
25 eyewitness, but I understand he's in
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 186 of 207
1 California or the Bahamas.
2 Q. How about Moe?
3 A. And then Moe, some man named Moe.
4 Q. Moe's wife?
5 A. An Moe's wife.
6 Q. Where are they?
7 A. I don't know.
8 Q. Are you aware of anyone that
9 provided information to the authorities in
10 connection with the law enforcement
11 investigation and the medical examiner's
12 investigation into her death who reside
13 outside of the state of Florida?
14 A. I don't know. I mean, I know -- one
15 of the issues was where did all these drugs
16 come from and why did she have multiple, why
17 are there multiple prescriptions of the same
18 drug from different doctors. My understanding
19 are that as far as those issues are concerned,
20 which do have something to do, in my judgment,
21 with the cause of her death, these people do
22 not live in Florida. They live other places.
23 That's what I've been told.
24 Q. Anything else you want to add to
25 that answer?
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 187 of 207
1 A. I don't believe so.
2 Q. Okay. Did you receive information
3 from anyone in Florida that would indicate
4 that there was a life insurance policy, or
5 more, on the life of Anna Nicole Smith?
6 A. Yes.
7 Q. Who was that individual?
8 MR. KLEIN: Let me -- let me back up
9 a second. You don't have to give him
10 names, dates and places. From the venue
11 standpoint, you got your answer. So
12 you've got --
13 MR. WOOD: Probably. Let's put it
14 this way. I'm going to ask it for the
16 MR. KLEIN: Ask it.
17 MR. WOOD: Because I think I have
18 11th Circuit authority that I am entitled
19 to the names of witnesses and that that
20 is not protected by work product
21 privilege. So I think I'm entitled to
22 it. I'm not going to fight over it. But
23 I'll make a record on it. I'd like to
24 get an answer to that question or a
25 position taken on the record.
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 188 of 207
1 MR. KLEIN: And at an appropriate
2 time, based on the Court's disclosure,
3 you're going to get the names. We're in
4 a jurisdictional deposition at this
5 point. We can join issue as to what
6 extent he's got to identify those people
7 at a later date. I think the relevant
8 inquiry you've already got the answer to.
9 Q. (By Mr. Wood) Did you receive
10 information from anyone in Florida -- when you
11 said information -- let me make sure I'm
12 looking at my screen here. I want to make
13 sure I ask the question clear.
14 MR. KLEIN: I thought it was
16 MR. WOOD: I thought it was pretty
17 good, but looking at it, I want to make
18 sure it's -- I have to justify paying for
19 this real time, so I have to use it
21 MR. KLEIN: Whatever happened to
22 relying on your recollection?
23 Q. (By Mr. Wood) Did you receive
24 information from anyone that resided in the
25 state of Florida that would indicate that
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 189 of 207
1 there was a life insurance policy or more on
2 the life of Anna Nicole Smith?
3 MR. KLEIN: He's answered that
5 Q. (By Mr. Wood) And the answer is
6 yes; is that right?
7 A. No.
8 MR. KLEIN: I'm sorry.
9 THE WITNESS: The answer to that
10 question is no. I think he just said did
11 anybody that resides in Florida.
12 Q. (By Mr. Wood) I thought there might
13 be a distinction and there is.
14 But what you're telling me is that
15 you were in Florida and someone while you were
16 in Florida gave you information that would
17 indicate that there was a life insurance
18 policy or policies on the life of Anna Nicole
19 Smith; is that right?
20 A. Yes.
21 Q. Was that person in Florida when you
22 received that information from him or her?
23 A. Yes.
24 Q. And who is that person?
25 MR. KLEIN: That's where we're not
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 190 of 207
2 Q. (By Mr. Wood) Where does that
3 person reside?
4 MR. KLEIN: There we are.
5 THE WITNESS: Outside of Florida.
6 Q. (By Mr. Wood) Where?
7 MR. KLEIN: You can tell him.
8 THE WITNESS: Huh?
9 MR. KLEIN: You can tell him. We're
10 not disclosing identities at this point.
11 THE WITNESS: I believe New York
13 Q. (By Mr. Wood) And did you ever
14 receive information while you were in Florida
15 that Howard Stern had requested a facsimile or
16 a copy of Anna Nicole Smith's will several
17 days prior to her death?
18 A. Was I in Florida when I got that
20 Q. Yes.
21 A. Yes.
22 Q. And did the individual who provided
23 you with that information, was that
24 provided -- was that person in Florida also?
25 A. Yes.
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 191 of 207
1 Q. Was that information provided to you
2 outside of the evidence presented in Judge
3 Seidlin's proceedings?
4 A. I think I got that information as
5 part of the proceedings.
6 Q. Not independent from the proceedings
7 from any source? Is that what you're telling
9 A. No. It was -- somebody told me, but
10 I think it was while the proceedings were
11 going on.
12 Q. As part of testimony in the
13 proceedings or somebody pulled you off to the
14 side and said, "Let me tell you something"?
15 A. More of the latter.
16 Q. Who was that person?
17 A. I'm not sure.
18 Q. Male? Female?
19 A. I think it was a male but I'm not
21 Q. I guess if you're not sure who it
22 was, you couldn't give me information on where
23 that person might reside; true?
24 A. That's also true. I'll try to
25 figure that one out. But I didn't come here
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 192 of 207
1 prepared to try to figure all that out.
2 Q. Did you receive information from any
3 other individuals about the case, outside of
4 the proceedings themselves, while you were in
5 Florida, other than what you've told me about
6 in terms of the will being faxed or requested
7 and in terms of the insurance policy or
9 A. Please say that question one more
11 Q. Other than the information that you
12 tell me you received while you were in Florida
13 about the will being requested and the
14 existence of a policy or policies of life
15 insurance, did you receive any information
16 from any other individuals about the case
17 while you were in Florida, outside of the
18 actual proceedings themselves before Judge
20 A. About the case or about those two
22 Q. About the case, other than those two
23 issues. You've already told me about those
24 two. I want to see if there are any others.
25 MR. KLEIN: The question is just
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 193 of 207
1 whether they're outside the state of
2 Florida, whether that information
3 involved people outside the state of
4 Florida, as I understand the question.
5 THE WITNESS: Other than Mr. Clark.
6 MR. KLEIN: Just say other than
7 Mr. Clark, then.
8 MR. PIRTLE: Mr. Wood, I'd like to
9 make sure -- I'm unsure as to whether or
10 not I have been subbed in.
11 THE WITNESS: Are we talking about
12 just Mr. Clark?
13 MR. WOOD: Are you talking about --
14 MR. PIRTLE: I'm unsure whether I'm
15 a counsel of record in this case, so I
16 may take my leave here in a second.
17 MR. WOOD: Since you're now unsure,
18 I'll ask you to take your leave. Thank
19 you. Thanks for bringing sandwiches in.
20 MR. PIRTLE: I'm unsure whether I've
21 been subbed into this case.
22 MS. BARTH: I don't recall seeing
23 his name.
24 MR. KLEIN: We sent a pro hac motion
25 to you.
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 194 of 207
1 MS. BARTH: I just wanted him to be
2 careful because I hadn't seen it and I've
3 been watching the docket --
4 MR. PIRTLE: Totally off the record
5 but --
6 MR. WOOD: Nice to meet you.
7 THE WITNESS: Where you going to be?
8 MR. PIRTLE: I'm going to be around.
9 THE WITNESS: Then I'll call you.
10 MR. WOOD: He can't e-mail you,
11 because --
12 MR. KLEIN: We know that.
13 MR. WOOD: -- I just saw you waive
14 the BlackBerry.
15 MR. PIRTLE: I'll be in the
17 THE WITNESS: I'll find you.
18 (Mr. Pirtle left the deposition
20 MR. KLEIN: Lin, while your people
21 are talking, let me just make a
23 MR. WOOD: Okay.
24 MR. KLEIN: Because I don't want
25 anything -- we've already agreed on the
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 195 of 207
1 record that I can't just instruct him not
2 to answer something. We've gotten into a
3 kind of shorthand, you and I here, with
4 stuff I don't think he should answer. I
5 do believe that I can instruct him on
6 privilege answers, so what I'd like to do
7 so there's no misunderstanding is just
8 preserve whatever areas you feel he needs
9 to answer and handle it by way of motion
10 with the Court. I don't care whether
11 you're the initiating party or we file a
12 motion for a protective order.
13 Ordinarily what I would do in a federal
14 court deposition is adjourn it, ask the
15 Court to rule on the issues. Obviously
16 we've been able to go through the most of
17 this without going through that process.
18 MR. WOOD: I'll look at the
19 transcript but I'm not sure that for
20 jurisdictional purposes we have a fight
21 that needs to be fought. We have a
23 MR. KLEIN: Yeah.
24 MR. WOOD: But we may not have it
25 such that we need to fight the battle at
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 196 of 207
1 this juncture. I don't know that. I'll
2 look at the record and then you and I
3 will talk.
4 MR. KLEIN: That was my only point.
5 Federal court judges can be a bit intense
6 about the way you assert objections. I
7 just want to make sure that we're
8 reserving them in ways that will be -- we
9 can raise them if necessary.
10 Q. (By Mr. Wood) Do you know where we
12 A. No, sir.
13 Q. I was asking you about whether you
14 received any information about the case.
15 MR. KLEIN: And he answered?
16 MR. WOOD: I'm sorry.
17 MR. KLEIN: He answered that. Did
18 that get stepped over?
19 MR. WOOD: I think he conferred with
21 MR. KLEIN: Yeah. Then he answered.
22 Did you pick up his answer?
23 Q. (By Mr. Wood) I think you said
24 other than Mr. Clark?
25 MR. KLEIN: I thought he said other
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 197 of 207
1 than Mr. Clark, no.
2 MR. WOOD: He did. And then you
3 said just say other than Mr. Clark.
4 Q. (By Mr. Wood) All right. Other
5 than Mr. Clark and whoever gave you the
6 information about the will being requested or
7 the information about the policies, did anyone
8 else provide you with information while you
9 were in Florida about the case?
10 A. The people that I was working with,
11 like Mr. Pirtle and Mr. Tunstall.
12 Q. The two lawyers, Mr. Pirtle from
13 Houston --
14 A. Right.
15 Q. -- and Mr. Tunstall from Florida?
16 A. Right.
17 Q. Anyone else?
18 A. I don't recall.
19 Q. You introduced into evidence what's
20 been shorthand referred to as the clown video.
21 Do you recall that video of
22 Ms. Smith?
23 A. Me?
24 Q. Vergie Arthur.
25 A. I introduced into evidence what?
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 198 of 207
1 Q. It's my understanding that on behalf
2 of Vergie Arthur a video which has been
3 referred to as the clown video was introduced
4 into evidence during the proceeding with Judge
6 Do you recall the video?
7 A. I don't recall that.
8 Q. Do you have information about how
9 that video was obtained?
10 A. No.
11 Q. In terms of your business-related
12 activities in Florida, you've told me
13 everything that you've done with respect to
14 this case for Ms. Arthur?
15 A. Right.
16 Q. The business-related activities
17 consistent with representing her in court;
18 examining witnesses; making argument; being a
19 media spokesperson and a shield to her to take
20 inquiries; investigation, as you've described
21 it; ground transportation; physically trying
22 to get her to and from the courthouse.
23 Any other business-related
24 activities that you engaged in in the state of
25 Florida other than those on behalf of Vergie
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 199 of 207
2 A. I don't --
3 Q. And also engaging Mr. Klein.
4 A. I don't recall any others.
5 MR. WOOD: Let me take a moment and
6 then we'll see if we're done. I think we
8 VIDEOGRAPHER: Off the record at
10 (Thereupon, there was an
11 interruption in the proceedings.)
12 VIDEOGRAPHER: The time is
13 approximately 1:59. Back on video
14 record. You may continue.
15 MR. WOOD: That concludes the
16 examination on the jurisdictional
17 deposition of Mr. O'Quinn. We have no
18 further questions at this time.
19 Do you have any questions?
20 MR. KLEIN: I do not.
21 MR. WOOD: Then the deposition is
22 concluded. Thank you for the hospitality
23 in your office today.
24 THE WITNESS: You're welcome.
25 VIDEOGRAPHER: The time is
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 200 of 207
1 approximately 1:59. This concludes Tape
2 No. 5.
3 (Deposition concluded at 1:59 p.m.)
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 201 of 207
1 DESCRIPTION OF EXHIBITS
3 EXHIBIT IDENTIFICATION
5 1 Notice of Deposition
6 2 Copy of Lawsuit Filed by Mr.
7 Stern against you in the
8 United States District Court
9 for the Southern District of
10 Florida, West Palm Beach
12 3 Motion for John M. O'Quinn to
13 be admitted pro hac vice in
15 4 Letter from Don Clark to M.
16 Krista Barth
17 5 Letter from Ms. Barth to Mr.
19 6 Document from Westlaw
22 (Original exhibits attached to the
23 Original transcript.)
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 202 of 207
1 STATE OF GEORGIA:
2 COUNTY OF FULTON:
3 I hereby certify that the foregoing
4 transcript was reported, as stated in the
5 caption, and the questions and answers
6 thereto were reduced to typewriting under my
7 direction; that the foregoing pages represent
8 a true, complete, and correct transcript of
9 the evidence given upon said hearing, and I
10 further certify that I am not of kin or
11 counsel to the parties in the case; am not
12 in the employ of counsel for any of said
13 parties; nor am I in any way interested in
14 the result of said case.
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 203 of 207
1 Disclosure Pursuant to Article
2 8(B) of the Rules and Regulations of the
3 Board of Court Reporting of the Judicial
4 Council of Georgia, I make the following
6 I am a Georgia Certified Court
7 Reporter, here as a representative of
8 Brown & Gallo, L.L.C., to report the
9 foregoing matter. Brown & Gallo, L.L.C.,
10 is not taking this deposition under any
11 contract that is prohibited by O.C.G.A.
12 5-14-37 (a) and (b).
13 Brown & Gallo, L.L.C., will be
14 charging its usual and customary rates
15 for this transcript.
20 LEE ANN BARNES, RPR.
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 204 of 207
2 The Deposition of JOHN O'QUINN,
3 taken in the matter, on the date, and at the time and
4 place set out on the title page hereof.
5 It was requested that the deposition be taken
6 by the reporter and that same be reduced to
7 typewritten form.
8 It was agreed by and between counsel and the
9 parties that the Deponent will read and sign the
10 transcript of said deposition.
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 205 of 207
2 STATE OF :
3 COUNTY/CITY OF :
4 Before me, this day, personally appeared,
5 JOHN O'QUINN, who, being duly sworn, states that the
6 foregoing transcript of his/her Deposition, taken in the
7 matter, on the date, and at the time and place set out
8 on the title page hereof, constitutes a true and accurate
9 transcript of said deposition.
11 JOHN O'QUINN
13 SUBSCRIBED and SWORN to before me this
14 _______day of_________________, 20___ in the
15 jurisdiction aforesaid.
17 _____________________ ________________________
18 My Commission Expires Notary Public
20 *If no changes need to be made on the following two pages,
21 place a check here ____, and return only this signed page.*
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 206 of 207
1 DEPOSITION ERRATA SHEET
2 RE: Brown & Gallo, L.L.C.
3 File No. 20458
4 Case Caption: HOWARD K. STERN
5 vs. JOHN O'QUINN
6 Deponent: JOHN O'QUINN
7 Deposition Date: August 16, 2007
8 To the Reporter:
9 I have read the entire transcript of my Deposition taken
10 in the captioned matter or the same has been read to me.
11 I request that the following changes be entered upon the
12 record for the reasons indicated. I have signed my name to
13 the Errata Sheet and the appropriate Certificate and
14 authorize you to attach both to the original transcript.
16 Page No._____Line No._____Change to:________________________
18 Reason for change:__________________________________________
19 Page No._____Line No._____Change to:________________________
21 Reason for change:__________________________________________
22 Page No._____Line No._____Change to:________________________
24 Reason for change:__________________________________________
Case 0:07-cv-60534-WPD Document 41 Entered on FLSD Docket 08/20/2007 Page 207 of 207
1 Deposition of JOHN O'QUINN
3 Page No._____Line No._____Change to:________________________
5 Reason for change:__________________________________________
6 Page No._____Line No._____Change to:________________________
8 Reason for change:__________________________________________
9 Page No._____Line No._____Change to:________________________
11 Reason for change:__________________________________________
12 Page No._____Line No._____Change to:________________________
14 Reason for change:__________________________________________
15 Page No._____Line No._____Change to:________________________
17 Reason for change:__________________________________________
18 Page No._____Line No._____Change to:________________________
20 Reason for change:__________________________________________
24 JOHN O'QUINN